| Topic: |
Science > Philosophy |
| User: |
"gljiva" |
| Date: |
23 Jun 2005 09:40:09 AM |
| Object: |
hegel's time |
what is hegel's account of time?
please, dont send me to google, i'm just comming from there, and among all
the texts, his etexts and stuff... i spent an hour today, as i did few days
ago... i cannot find nor grasp what exactly he says about time! too much
choice:))
can u, please, help me?:))
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| User: "Tron" |
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| Title: Re: hegel's time |
23 Jun 2005 06:31:54 PM |
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"gljiva" <iva@next.TOCKAhr> skrev i melding
news:d9ehkv$hdk$1@sunce.iskon.hr...
what is hegel's account of time?
please, dont send me to google, i'm just comming from there, and among
all
the texts, his etexts and stuff... i spent an hour today, as i did few
days
ago... i cannot find nor grasp what exactly he says about time! too
much
choice:))
can u, please, help me?:))
Time is the form of the perception of Becoming:
Die Zeit ist die für sich seiende »Negativität«, das Dasein
des »beständigen Sich-aufhebens«, das »an sich selbst Negative«,
die »sich auf sich selbst beziehende Negation« (Naturphilos. S.
52). »Die Zeit, als die negative Einheit des Außer-sich-seins, ist...
ein schlechthin Abstraktes, Ideelles: sie ist das Sein, das, indem es
ist, nicht ist, und indem es nicht ist, ist, - das angeschaute Werden.
d. i. daß die zwar schlechthin momentanen, d. i. unmittelbar sich
aufhebenden Unterschiede als äußerliche, d. i. jedoch sich selbst
äußerliche, bestimmt sind.« »Die Zeit ist, wie der Raum, eine reine Form
der Sinnlichkeit oder des Anschauens, das unsinnlich Sinnliche.« »Die
Zeit ist ebenso kontinuierlich, wie der Raum« (l. c. S. 54). »Nicht in
der Zeit entsteht und vergeht alles, sondern die Zeit selbst ist dies
Werden, Entstehen und Vergehen, das seiende Abstrahieren.« »Der Begriff
aber, in seiner frei für sich existierenden Identität mit sich, als Ich
= Ich, ist an und für sich die absolute Negativität und Freiheit, die
Zeit daher nicht seine Macht, noch ist er in der Zeit und ein
Zeitliches. sondern er ist vielmehr die Macht der Zeit... Nur das
Natürliche ist darum der Zeit untertan, insofern es endlich ist. das
Wahre dagegen, die Idee, der Geist ist ewig« (l. c. S. 54). »Die Zeit
ist nicht gleichsam ein Behälter, worin alles wie in einen Strom
gestellt ist, der fließt, und von dem es fortgerissen und
hinuntergerissen wird. Die Zeit ist nur diese Abstraktion des
Verzehrens. Weil die Dinge endlich sind, darum sind sie in der Zeit:
nicht weil sie in der Zeit sind, darum gehen sie unter. sondern die
Dinge selbst sind das Zeitliche, so zu sein ist ihre objektive
Bedeutung. Der Prozess der wirklichen Dinge selbst macht also die Zeit,
und wenn die Zeit das Mächtigste genannt wird, so ist sie auch das
Ohnmächtigste« (l. c. S. 54 f.. vgl. Encykl. § 258, 448. vgl. K.
ROSENKRANZ, Syst. d. Wissensch. § 338 ff.. G. BIEDERMANN, Philos. als
Begriffswissensch. II, 240 ff., u. a.).
HTH
T
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| User: "Tron" |
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| Title: Re: hegel's time |
23 Jun 2005 07:36:05 PM |
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Hi,
I thought of attempting a translation, but Google, as luck would have
it, came up with an online English version (don't let the name scare
you):
http://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/hegel/works/na/nature1.htm:
Googling for "Hegel Time Space" will give you other pearls, such as
"There are two kinds (/of time/): Continuity (quantitative difference)
and Discontinuity (qualitative difference). For Hegel the Idea of Spirit
and Nature has to be grasped as a discontinous process. Hegel says in
ENC, § 249, Addition ...:
"It turns out to be a hopeless task to attempt to arrange the planets,
metals or chemical bodies in general, as plants, and animals, into a
series (Continuity), and to look for a law governing such a series,
because nature does not distribute its formations into series and
member, and the Notion distinguishes according to qualitative
determinateness, making leaps in the process. The old saying, or law as
it is called, 'non datur saltus innatura' is by no means adequate to the
diremption of the Notion. The continuity of the Notion with itself is of
an entirely different nature."
Quoting Hegel is much easier than explaining him. I hope - sincerely -
that you have enough background to make sense of the quotes. A few
poiners from my own encounters:
The words "form of perception" should indicate how dependent Hegel is on
Kant; although Hegel attributed more functions to time than just a form
of perception: Time is also the medium of the Becoming of Spirit.
One note on Hegel (and much else of classical german philosophy): Wolff
(somewhere between Leibniz and Kant in time) took it upon himself to
translate the whole terminology of Scholasticism into German. Huge
scandal ... ridicule ... Flame Ragnarok on Alt.Deutsch.Unsage ..... but
then people got used to it. However, re-translating the resulting
material to e.g. English should have gone via latin, since words like
"Werden" and "Aufgehoben" do not have any corresponding "anglicisms",
while perfectly understandable in its peculiar anglified latinisms. So
"Werden" is much easier understood as "development" or "change" or
"process" or "permanent evolution" or whatever; just not "becoming". In
the same way, "Aufgehoben", with its multiplicity of translations, could
well be simply "integrated", which, as it were, integrates the
connotation of "preservation", of "cancellation" (at a lower level, as
an independent element) and of "elevation" (to a higher level). Etc.
As always with GWF, all I can say is
Good Luck
T
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| User: "gljiva" |
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| Title: Re: hegel's time |
23 Jun 2005 09:48:29 PM |
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"Tron" <tronfuru@frisurf.no> je napisao u poruci interesnoj
grupi:ZzIue.13411$ai7.320806@news2.e.nsc.no...
Hi,
I thought of attempting a translation, but Google, as luck would have
it, came up with an online English version (don't let the name scare
you):
http://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/hegel/works/na/nature1.htm:
the name of google or the name of marx?
:)
Quoting Hegel is much easier than explaining him. I hope - sincerely -
that you have enough background to make sense of the quotes. A few
poiners from my own encounters:
yeah, thats why is nicer to read it german - not-understanding is then
ascribed to not knowing words...:)
The words "form of perception" should indicate how dependent Hegel is on
Kant; although Hegel attributed more functions to time than just a form
of perception: Time is also the medium of the Becoming of Spirit.
As always with GWF, all I can say is
Good Luck
T
this was helpful! thnx a lot!! :)
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| User: "1Z" |
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| Title: Re: hegel's time |
23 Jun 2005 09:57:48 AM |
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gljiva wrote:
what is hegel's account of time?
*Becoming* is fundamental for H. -- it is the very first of his
syntheses.
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| User: "gljiva" |
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| Title: Re: hegel's time |
23 Jun 2005 05:21:54 PM |
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"1Z" <peterdjones@yahoo.com> je napisao u poruci interesnoj
grupi:1119538668.222049.109090@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
gljiva wrote:
what is hegel's account of time?
*Becoming* is fundamental for H. -- it is the very first of his
syntheses.
you mean temporal becoming? or "pure" becoming?
but, if i understood properly - becoming is fundamental, and for becoming
time is needed - so time is fundamental?
but what is time for him?
absolute, relative?
i mean, it exists in reality, it is real? or idealistic?
thnx........
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| User: "Wordsmith" |
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| Title: Re: hegel's time |
23 Jun 2005 03:03:45 PM |
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1Z wrote:
gljiva wrote:
what is hegel's account of time?
*Becoming* is fundamental for H. -- it is the very first of his
syntheses.
Hegel was like Heraclitus in that respect. The latter "H," however,
was more concise. I appreciate concision.
W : )
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| User: "Tron" |
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| Title: Re: hegel's time |
23 Jun 2005 06:29:04 PM |
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"Wordsmith" <wordsmith@rocketmail.com> skrev i melding
news:1119557025.530257.218470@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
1Z wrote:
gljiva wrote:
what is hegel's account of time?
*Becoming* is fundamental for H. -- it is the very first of his
syntheses.
Hegel was like Heraclitus in that respect. The latter "H," however,
was more concise. I appreciate concision.
Then you should be more concise.
T
Concision - (Gr. katatome; i.e., "mutilation"), a term used by Paul
contemptuously of those who were zealots for circumcision (Phil. 3:2).
Instead of the warning, "Beware of the circumcision" (peritome) i.e., of
the party who pressed on Gentile converts the necessity of still
observing that ordinance, he says, "Beware of the concision;" as much as
to say, "This circumcision which they vaunt of is in Christ only as the
gashings and mutilations of idolatrous heathen."
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| User: "Wordsmith" |
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| Title: Re: hegel's time |
23 Jun 2005 11:08:53 PM |
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The definition you cite is rather verbose.
W : )
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| User: "Tron" |
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| Title: Re: hegel's time |
24 Jun 2005 04:23:58 AM |
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"Wordsmith" <wordsmith@rocketmail.com> skrev i melding
news:1119586133.056635.311840@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
The definition you cite is rather verbose.
W : )
OT for Hegel, then.
T
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