Re: Why Fear and Detest the Atheist?

Science > Philosophy > Re: Why Fear and Detest the Atheist?

LINK TO THIS PAGE

rating : 0 | 0

Page 1 of 9

Topic:	Science > Philosophy
User:	"V"
Date:	19 Jan 2008 06:22:13 PM
Object:	Re: Why Fear and Detest the Atheist?

On Jan 19, 9:42 am, "Greywolf" <greyw...@cybrzn.com> wrote:

Due to my dreadful circumstances out here I pulled out an old favorite I'm
rather proud of to help illustrate a profound truth to a local minister.

The following is a hypothetical, it is a 'thought' experiment that would
allow each and every participant to understand just how much of the 'truth'
about the existence of a 'God' they *really* want to know.

Hypothetical scenario #1:

Greywolf is given a DVD which, as it turns out, contains proof positive --
and I mean 'no-doubt-about-it', undeniably *conclusive* proof -- and
remember, this is a hypothetical scenario: that DVD has indisputable proof
that there really and truly is a 'God'!

What would one assume Greywolf would do with it? Hmm?

Of COURSE I'd pop it into a DVD player and watch it! After that I'd slap
myself upside the head (but not *too* strenuously) and mutter, 'How in the
hell did I miss *that*?!)

Hypothetical scenario #2:

Greywolf has in his possession a DVD, which, make no mistake about it,
contains proof positive -- and I mean 'no-doubt-about-it', undeniably
*conclusive* proof that indisputably proves that there really and truly is
NO 'God' (or *any* sort of deity) and then hands it to a Christian to view.

What do you all think that Christian going to do with that DVD?

Judging from the comments I've received in the past, he or she will either
destroy it or simply refuse to look at it on the grounds that they are
absolutely certain that there is a 'God'. (Without bothering to examine the
'proof' here in this hypothetically 'real' scenario that that is not true.)

Point here is that the overwhelming number of Christians confronted with
such a choice would refuse to watch that DVD and thus render their hatred
and contempt for the atheist hatred and contempt for its own sake -- not
because we're 'evil' or anything of the sort. And seeing that this was a
thought experiment that only the participant would know the honest answer
to, the would be able to discern *just* how close-minded they are. It would
also demonstrate that the 'I refuse to watch the DVD' type of Christian has
no business being allowed standing room in any debate with non-believers.
They will have proven to themselves that they are not really interested in
the truth but, in effect, have prostituted their intellect in exchange for
that warm and fuzzy feeling they enjoy through their completely
unsubstantiated belief in deity.

If one won't even look at the 'facts', how is one to debate them. Worse, how
could one then turn around and treat another human being in the manner I've
been treated (or *any* other human being for that matter!) for over three
years now and continue to call oneself a 'Christian'?

In the preceding thought experiment it really came down to whether or not
the individual was willing to examine the truth. And *that* is the principal
problem we face when dealing with our 'God believing', Holier than Thou,
hateful opponents.

Greywolf

I don't fear or detest my atheist friends Greywolf. I learn much from
them...they minister to me better than many of the priests used to
when I was a Catholic.
Someone once questioned a statement I had made when I wrote: "I am
grateful for my friends at alt.atheism. And if I can't study Buddhism
with Buddhists after they ban me from their forums, then I study
Buddhism with atheists."
They asked how I can study Buddhism this way.
Well, this is not problem at all.
A Buddhist practice in not in books or limited to any one sangha...a
successful Buddhist practice lies within our hearts.
(ooops...the atheists tell me that the heart is only a blood
pump...and they are right...so let's say the successful Buddhist
practice emanates from the fabric of our very being...but I guess the
atheists will argue we are not made of fabric either!)
Not only are the atheists excellent teachers at Buddhism, they are
also equally excellent teachers of the principles of Christianity.
Let me give you a couple of examples my atheist friends helped me
with, better than any church service I had ever attended in my prior
life when I was Catholic. The atheists were lecturing me on Charity
that day. (If you want the lesson in Buddhism then just substitute
compassion or metta for the word charitable.)
The atheists were not talking about donating money or giving food to
the poor, although such actions also fall under the title of being
charitable. The type of charity I am talking about is that of showing
simple kindness and courtesy to others.
We were discussing logic at alt.atheism and one of the participants
brought up the subject of being more charitable with kindness and
leniency when his feelings got hurt by some abusive words sent his
way.
Being charitable towards others is something we all seem to forget
when our ego gets injected into the equation, and this is especially
prone to happen on the net. When we communicate with emails we
sometimes write things we would never say in person. In addition, when
we write it uses a different part of our brain than when speaking. I
find the truth about 'who a person really is' comes out best when they
write as opposed to speaking. And to top it all off, we see no person
that we are hurting with our words, we only see a screen. If we can
slow down and review or writing for 'humility' and 'reciprocity' we
can sometimes avoid dispensing pain.
When we invest excessive time and energies in acquiring or building
attachments these attachments become veritable extensions of our being
and come to define us for ourselves as well as define who we are for
others. When these attachments take on this role we become susceptible
to pain via these extensions. If the person, place, thing or idea we
are attached to gets rebuked it is a personal rebuke on us, if they
get damaged or defaced so goes the defacement and damage to our very
being.
It is hard to become full detached to ideas, for if we did we would be
like a feather floating wherever the wind blew us and would pick up
any old idea with no firm grounding of what we perceive as right or
wrong. But, we can practice being open minded and look at ideas
without prejudice that we instinctively hit ideas with that does not
emanate from within our mind. We can take that first step in the
opposite direction that we have been heading in for so long by
learning to judge other less.
We especially do this with everyone we meet...they get categorized
with better or lesser than me type of thinking. When we limit
prejudice we can open our minds to truth and peace. And realize that
"All deities reside within the human breast," as Blake wrote and try
to show kindness and leniency towards others just as we would like it
bestowed on us by our judges.
Here is some background material on this topic of charity from the
alt.atheism discussion group.
V:
"How do you use logic to guide your life? I am not specifically
referring to logic in atheism, but logic in everyday life. Is logic
all that is needed in life? Or something else?"
J responds to V:
It's useful for thinking, not as a guide but a tool. Try thinking
without consciously or unconsciously using logic, and see if any
conclusions are justified. To deny logic is self-stultifying. A hammer
without a nail is useless. Logic without thought is useless. Nails
without a project are useless. Thoughts without a project* are
useless. * "project" in this case as used at: http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/existentialism/
and other writings on existentialism.
G responds to J:
"You appear to be under the impression that the only use for a hammer
is for striking nails. And you expect everyone to follow the link and
dig through that enormous pile of crap, just to figure out what the
***** you mean? Idiot. If you want people to understand what
definition of a word you're using, there are these things called
"dictionaries"....a number of which are online, even."
J responds to G:
"Of course, analogies are never perfect. I used a hammer two days ago
to help a neighbor get his garage door realigned. Do you think I'm an
idiot? But the analogy serves, for those who are more charitable than
you. Differences of opinion need not include calling people idiots.
<plonk>"
'J' brought up an important reminder to the tool of charitable
reciprocity that we can all apply in our lives to develop inner peace.
Reciprocity of charity is welcome by almost all people. who does not
like kindness bestowed on them? Yes, there are those individuals that
are of a sick mental nature that are hell bend for destruction. But if
we look at examples of flourishing human specimens, then they do not
gravitate towards having hatred and ill will being dished up to them.
When the subject turns to reciprocity, I am reminded of a religious
discussion I attended a few years ago where the group was composed of
a wide spectrum of theist to atheist. The atheists were lecturing on
prejudice and the golden rule that day. When the subject turned
towards morals and ethics, one atheist said he ran his life by the
golden rule. A theist piped up that the golden rule came from the
bible, which made the atheist wince. The atheist seemed to take pride
in his self sufficiency and did not like to run his life by anything
that came out of the bible. When another atheist said the concept of
golden rule came from an earlier source than the bible, then atheist
was relieved.
This was a good reminder to me to examine where my guiding light
resides?
Is it ego based or truth based?
When the guiding light of this atheist was not grounded in the bible
he was happy. But when it came from an area that he did not like, he
was upset. How can the same material be used to build a palace by one
man, yet only build a hovel for another?
By one spiritual practitioner seeing truth and applying it to live a
life at peace. And the other person only seeing prejudice and problems
and doing nothing.
Every religion was made by man and as such every religion is imperfect
as it is run by man. Despite these imperfections, each religion also
has many "perfection's" within it as well. We can still be open to
peace generating tools from any of the religions and spiritual
traditions that are available to us if we are serious about being at
peace. This requires us to run our life by truth and not by prejudice.
In the Sermon on the Mount, Jesus said: "Therefore, whatever you want
men to do to you, do also to them" (Matthew 7:12). Nowadays this verse
is commonly referred to as "The Golden Rule," and is more commonly
quoted as: "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you." Here
are some of the earliest sources for this concept of reciprocity
~1970-1640 BCE "Do for one who may do for you, / That you may cause
him thus to do." - The Tale of the Eloquent Peasant 109-110, Ancient
Egypt, tr. R.B. Parkinson.
* ~700 BCE "That nature only is good when it shall not do unto another
whatever is not good for its own self." - Dadistan-i-Dinik 94:5,
Zoroastrianism.
* ? BCE "Whatever is disagreeable to yourself do not do unto others."
- Shayast-na-Shayast 13:29, Zoroastrianism.
* ~550 BCE "You shall not take vengeance or bear a grudge against your
countrymen. Love your fellow as yourself: I am the LORD." - Tanakh,
new JPS translation, Leviticus 19:18, Judaism.
* ~500 BCE "Hurt not others in ways that you yourself would find
hurtful." - Udana-Varga 5:18, Buddhism.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethic_of_reciprocity
Now, whether you believe in God or believe in Jesus or are an atheist
or Buddhist does this wisdom not apply to you? This truth is universal
in nature as it is based not on being of a certain religion, other
than that of the religion of humanity. In this case, you can adopt a
peace generating tool and apply it to your life irrespective of your
religious beliefs or lack thereof. I had to chuckle one time when an
atheists argued that the golden rule is not perfect, so he said he
does not follow it. When I questioned him about what he does follow as
well as the state of perfection that applied to his life, all he could
do was reply with ad hominem attacks.
If we are waiting for perfection when it comes to spiritual studies we
will always be disappointed. Before applying perfection to anything
outside of us, we should examine the perfection within us. The nature
of humans is that of imperfection, so we must always look towards
direction and forget perfection. I heard a story one time in a Yoga
lecture that illustrates this point. "Range is of the ego - Form is of
the soul." The only thing we need to be concerned with is how is our
form when it comes to our spiritual practice and our life.
Regarding the golden rule? It is more perfect than imperfect, so it is
a most useful tool to live a life at peace by. And when we combine it
with other tools such as universality, natural law, contrast the
greater good with the greater right, etc the synergistic effect is
close to perfection as humans can get with this subject. But it takes
some thinking and one will not see it without an open mind.
Wisdom for living a life at peace is all around us for the taking. I
have no trouble at all studying Christian or Buddhist concepts
wherever I find myself...even when the audience is 100% atheists. Many
of us get blinded with labels and personal prejudices. Whenever we
take it upon ourselves to beat down, we are headed in a direction of
destroying peace. We destroy our own peace as well as others peace. As
such, I practice from many religious and spiritual traditions without
problems or prejudices and readily look for such gifts irrespective of
what label they come under - on the contrary I am most grateful
wherever I find them. If I am not able to use a concept, I leave it
alone, but do not spend my time or energies to beat others down. Do we
like to be beaten down?
I saw some paintings in a Japanese museum that showed a cousin of the
Buddha being of great power and to show his strength he went up to a
baby elephant and pushed it down to the ground. A second painting
showed the Buddha helping this baby elephant back up to his feet and
the Buddha lifted the elephant high up over his head and said, "It is
much better to uplift - than to tear down." Whether this is a true
story or not I do not know. But we can all benefit from uplifting
rather than destroying.
I see this predisposition to destruction many times in responses I
receive from my posts. The critiques offer much in the line of 'no
goods' but they seldom do they offer any substantive tools to finding
peace. Maybe I do not have it '100% right' but I have it 'right
enough' to be able to be at peace if I apply these principles. If I
waited for perfection, I would never act. I use the tools at hand.
Aristotle ~ "It is the mark of an educated mind to rest satisfied with
the degree of precision which the nature of the subject admits and not
to seek exactness where only an approximation is possible."
This being able to 'rest satisfied' is something the perfectionists
lack and why they will never be at peace until they stop collecting
concepts and start using the concepts of peace generations. The
atheist I mentioned above demonstrated this with his blanket dismissal
of the golden rule since it is not 100% perfect. He could offer no
substitutes for the golden rule, all he could do was succumb to
personal attacks on me.
We can examine our writing to see what useful tools for finding peace
we offer to others it also says a lot about our own practice of
generating inner peace. When you practice peace promotion with others
you will reap inner peace promotion. When you practice destroying
others peace, you will reap self destruction of inner peace.
We should always he interested in finding truth and peace. If our way
is not working then some other way may help. It is good to test and
see the results. The bible reminds us of this "Test everything; hold
fast to what is good; abstain from every form of evil," (1 Thess.
5:21) Even if you are an atheist, this concept of testing can be of
help to you. For with such tests, 'the proof of the pudding will be in
the eating' and decisions on how to live will not be left only to your
ego, but will be grounded in peace.
What benefits do we derive by being charitable to others?
As James Allen writes...when we hurt others we also hurt ourselves.
"Every thought seed sown or allowed to fall into the mind, and to take
root there, produces its own, blossoming sooner or later into act, and
bearing its own fruitage of opportunity and circumstance. Good
thoughts bear good fruit, bad thoughts bad fruit....Good thoughts and
actions can never produce bad results. Bad thoughts and actions can
never produce good results. This is but saying that nothing can come
from corn but corn, nothing from nettles but nettles. Men understand
this law in the natural world, and work with it. But few understand it
in the mental and moral world."
When you practice peace promotion with others you will reap inner
peace promotion...when you practice destroying others peace, you will
reap self destruction of inner peace...nothing can come from corn but
corn, nothing from nettles but nettles.
I hope you make it a point to practice charity in your life by not
forgetting to be charitable to others as you would appreciate charity
being bestowed on you.
Take care,
V (Male)
Agnostic Freethinker
Practical Philosopher
Futurist
Urban Homesteader
Agnostic minister of secular humanism to the mind manacled,
spiritually sick, defiance based atheist.
AA#2
.

User: "Mr4701"
Title: Re: Why Fear and Detest the Atheist?	19 Jan 2008 06:26:51 PM

A Godless person is just as bad as an overzealous person. Atheist Stalin had
no more of a beef killing people than Islamofascist Osama Bin Laden.
.

User: "Robibnikoff"
Title: Re: Why Fear and Detest the Atheist?	19 Jan 2008 08:01:33 PM

"Mr4701" <NoExists@Earth.net> wrote in message
news:fzwkj.1268$hk4.498@trnddc03...

A Godless person is just as bad as an overzealous person. Atheist Stalin
had no more of a beef killing people than Islamofascist Osama Bin Laden.

Idiot.
--
Robyn
Resident Witchypoo
BAAWA Knight!
#1557

User: "Roy Jose Lorr"
Title: Re: Why Fear and Detest the Atheist?	20 Jan 2008 08:22:54 AM

Robibnikoff wrote:

"Mr4701" <NoExists@Earth.net> wrote in message
news:fzwkj.1268$hk4.498@trnddc03...

A Godless person is just as bad as an overzealous person. Atheist Stalin
had no more of a beef killing people than Islamofascist Osama Bin Laden.

Idiot.

Moron.
.

User: "Virgil"
Title: Re: Why Fear and Detest the Atheist?	20 Jan 2008 06:10:44 PM

In article <i6CdnQ8ApZelxA7anZ2dnUVZ_tLinZ2d@comcast.com>,
Roy Jose Lorr <Kenthz@comcast.net> wrote:

Robibnikoff wrote:

"Mr4701" <NoExists@Earth.net> wrote in message
news:fzwkj.1268$hk4.498@trnddc03...

A Godless person is just as bad as an overzealous person. Atheist Stalin
had no more of a beef killing people than Islamofascist Osama Bin Laden.

Idiot.

Moron.

Morons are much brighter than idiots. So Lorr is admitting his
inadequacy here.
.

User: "DanielSan"
Title: Re: Why Fear and Detest the Atheist?	19 Jan 2008 06:43:24 PM

Mr4701 said the following on 1/19/2008 4:26 PM:

A Godless person is just as bad as an overzealous person. Atheist Stalin had
no more of a beef killing people than Islamofascist Osama Bin Laden.

And both are men. Therefore, men are just as bad as Osama bin Laden.
....right?
--
****************************************************
* DanielSan -- alt.atheism #2226 *
*--------------------------------------------------*
* "I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act *
* of the whole American people which declared that *
* their legislature should make no law respecting *
* an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the *
* free exercise thereof, thus building a wall of *
* separation between church and state." *
* --Thomas Jefferson, 1802 *
****************************************************
.

User: "Mr4701"
Title: Re: Why Fear and Detest the Atheist?	19 Jan 2008 06:42:43 PM

"DanielSan" <danielsan1977@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:HN2dnShCbJMXBQ_anZ2dnUVZ_qTinZ2d@comcast.com...

Mr4701 said the following on 1/19/2008 4:26 PM:

A Godless person is just as bad as an overzealous person. Atheist Stalin
had no more of a beef killing people than Islamofascist Osama Bin Laden.

And both are men. Therefore, men are just as bad as Osama bin Laden.

...right?

The point was it does not matter if they are God believes or Godless...
.

User: "DanielSan"
Title: Re: Why Fear and Detest the Atheist?	19 Jan 2008 06:54:38 PM

Mr4701 said the following on 1/19/2008 4:42 PM:

"DanielSan" <danielsan1977@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:HN2dnShCbJMXBQ_anZ2dnUVZ_qTinZ2d@comcast.com...

Mr4701 said the following on 1/19/2008 4:26 PM:

A Godless person is just as bad as an overzealous person. Atheist Stalin
had no more of a beef killing people than Islamofascist Osama Bin Laden.

And both are men. Therefore, men are just as bad as Osama bin Laden.

...right?

The point was it does not matter if they are God believes or Godless...

Your post belies that conclusion. You were intimating that atheists
were bad people, like Stalin.
I submit to you that it's a worldview of these folks, not their
religion, gender, or whatever. If they're religious, they use their
religion as a weapon and shield. If they're not, they'll find another
excuse to do their evil.
In fact, I submit to you that atheists are more moral than the religious
because they know of the real-world consequences of their actions. I
mean, if you look at the prison population, Christians are vastly
overrepresented in terms of percentages of the population than the
non-incarcerated population.
Atheists/non-believers make up between 4-10% of the US population but
make up less than 1% of the prison population. I wonder why...
--
****************************************************
* DanielSan -- alt.atheism #2226 *
*--------------------------------------------------*
* "I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act *
* of the whole American people which declared that *
* their legislature should make no law respecting *
* an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the *
* free exercise thereof, thus building a wall of *
* separation between church and state." *
* --Thomas Jefferson, 1802 *
****************************************************
.

User: "Mr4701"
Title: Re: Why Fear and Detest the Atheist?	19 Jan 2008 07:32:43 PM

"DanielSan" <danielsan1977@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:r-mdnaDU5YKtBg_anZ2dnUVZ_qqgnZ2d@comcast.com...

Mr4701 said the following on 1/19/2008 4:42 PM:

"DanielSan" <danielsan1977@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:HN2dnShCbJMXBQ_anZ2dnUVZ_qTinZ2d@comcast.com...

Mr4701 said the following on 1/19/2008 4:26 PM:

A Godless person is just as bad as an overzealous person. Atheist
Stalin had no more of a beef killing people than Islamofascist Osama
Bin Laden.

And both are men. Therefore, men are just as bad as Osama bin Laden.

...right?

The point was it does not matter if they are God believes or Godless...

Your post belies that conclusion. You were intimating that atheists were
bad people, like Stalin.

No... I know plenty of good atheist... My point was in the eye of politics
or dictators or assholes... which i figure we can all agree is often the
main subject in here....
.

User: "DanielSan"
Title: Re: Why Fear and Detest the Atheist?	19 Jan 2008 07:40:17 PM

Mr4701 said the following on 1/19/2008 5:32 PM:

"DanielSan" <danielsan1977@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:r-mdnaDU5YKtBg_anZ2dnUVZ_qqgnZ2d@comcast.com...

Mr4701 said the following on 1/19/2008 4:42 PM:

"DanielSan" <danielsan1977@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:HN2dnShCbJMXBQ_anZ2dnUVZ_qTinZ2d@comcast.com...

Mr4701 said the following on 1/19/2008 4:26 PM:

A Godless person is just as bad as an overzealous person. Atheist
Stalin had no more of a beef killing people than Islamofascist Osama
Bin Laden.

And both are men. Therefore, men are just as bad as Osama bin Laden.

...right?

The point was it does not matter if they are God believes or Godless...

Your post belies that conclusion. You were intimating that atheists were
bad people, like Stalin.

No... I know plenty of good atheist... My point was in the eye of politics
or dictators or assholes... which i figure we can all agree is often the
main subject in here....

....so....only atheist politicians or leaders are...bad...?
You said "A Godless person is just as bad as an overzealous person." Do
you deny you said that, when it's right here in the thread? You're
comparing atheists with murderous dictatorial totalitarians is very
offensive and reprehensible.
--
****************************************************
* DanielSan -- alt.atheism #2226 *
*--------------------------------------------------*
* "I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act *
* of the whole American people which declared that *
* their legislature should make no law respecting *
* an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the *
* free exercise thereof, thus building a wall of *
* separation between church and state." *
* --Thomas Jefferson, 1802 *
****************************************************
.

User: "Roy Jose Lorr"
Title: Re: Why Fear and Detest the Atheist?	20 Jan 2008 08:22:08 AM

DanielSan wrote:

Mr4701 said the following on 1/19/2008 5:32 PM:

"DanielSan" <danielsan1977@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:r-mdnaDU5YKtBg_anZ2dnUVZ_qqgnZ2d@comcast.com...

Mr4701 said the following on 1/19/2008 4:42 PM:

"DanielSan" <danielsan1977@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:HN2dnShCbJMXBQ_anZ2dnUVZ_qTinZ2d@comcast.com...

Mr4701 said the following on 1/19/2008 4:26 PM:

A Godless person is just as bad as an overzealous person. Atheist
Stalin had no more of a beef killing people than Islamofascist
Osama Bin Laden.

And both are men. Therefore, men are just as bad as Osama bin Laden.

...right?

The point was it does not matter if they are God believes or Godless...

Your post belies that conclusion. You were intimating that atheists
were bad people, like Stalin.

No... I know plenty of good atheist... My point was in the eye of
politics or dictators or assholes... which i figure we can all agree
is often the main subject in here....

...so....only atheist politicians or leaders are...bad...?

You said "A Godless person is just as bad as an overzealous person." Do
you deny you said that, when it's right here in the thread? You're
comparing atheists with murderous dictatorial totalitarians is very
offensive and reprehensible.

The atheist worships self... that behavior is 'overzealous' by definition.
.

User: "Rev. Karl E. Taylor"
Title: Re: Why Fear and Detest the Atheist?	20 Jan 2008 04:10:44 PM

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1
Roy Jose Lorr wrote:

DanielSan wrote:

Mr4701 said the following on 1/19/2008 5:32 PM:

"DanielSan" <danielsan1977@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:r-mdnaDU5YKtBg_anZ2dnUVZ_qqgnZ2d@comcast.com...

Mr4701 said the following on 1/19/2008 4:42 PM:

"DanielSan" <danielsan1977@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:HN2dnShCbJMXBQ_anZ2dnUVZ_qTinZ2d@comcast.com...

Mr4701 said the following on 1/19/2008 4:26 PM:

A Godless person is just as bad as an overzealous person. Atheist
Stalin had no more of a beef killing people than Islamofascist
Osama Bin Laden.

And both are men. Therefore, men are just as bad as Osama bin Laden.

...right?

The point was it does not matter if they are God believes or
Godless...

Your post belies that conclusion. You were intimating that atheists
were bad people, like Stalin.

No... I know plenty of good atheist... My point was in the eye of
politics or dictators or assholes... which i figure we can all agree
is often the main subject in here....

...so....only atheist politicians or leaders are...bad...?

You said "A Godless person is just as bad as an overzealous person."
Do you deny you said that, when it's right here in the thread? You're
comparing atheists with murderous dictatorial totalitarians is very
offensive and reprehensible.

The atheist worships self... that behavior is 'overzealous' by definition.

Atheists don't worship, you empty headed loon.
Atheists simply live. Something you and your ilk just can't stand the
sight of.
- --
There are none more ignorant and useless,
than they that seek answers on their knees,
with their eyes closed.
____________________________________________________________________
Rev. Karl E. Taylor http://www.jesusneverexisted.com/
A.A #1143 http://scienceblogs.com/aardvarchaeology/
Apostle of Dr. Lao EAC: Virgin Conversion Unit Director
____________________________________________________________________
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org
iD8DBQFHk8bkf+wl0F6+jvgRAqbuAJwPRqWshtfSwbvoVLl4aetsCSO6zACeOX4F
XSFI5nsiMGDY8+LWNMZMdXk=
=dD+d
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
.

User: "Virgil"
Title: Re: Why Fear and Detest the Atheist?	20 Jan 2008 06:09:01 PM

In article <i6CdnQwApZeWxA7anZ2dnUVZ_tKinZ2d@comcast.com>,
Roy Jose Lorr <Kenthz@comcast.net> wrote:

The atheist worships self

Even if this were true, it would beat out worshiping something not even
known to exist.
But those, like Lorr, who do worship their myths err in presuming that
everyone has to be like them.
.

User: "DanielSan"
Title: Re: Why Fear and Detest the Atheist?	20 Jan 2008 01:18:55 PM

Roy Jose Lorr said the following on 1/20/2008 6:22 AM:

DanielSan wrote:

Mr4701 said the following on 1/19/2008 5:32 PM:

"DanielSan" <danielsan1977@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:r-mdnaDU5YKtBg_anZ2dnUVZ_qqgnZ2d@comcast.com...

Mr4701 said the following on 1/19/2008 4:42 PM:

"DanielSan" <danielsan1977@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:HN2dnShCbJMXBQ_anZ2dnUVZ_qTinZ2d@comcast.com...

Mr4701 said the following on 1/19/2008 4:26 PM:

A Godless person is just as bad as an overzealous person. Atheist
Stalin had no more of a beef killing people than Islamofascist
Osama Bin Laden.

And both are men. Therefore, men are just as bad as Osama bin Laden.

...right?

The point was it does not matter if they are God believes or
Godless...

Your post belies that conclusion. You were intimating that atheists
were bad people, like Stalin.

No... I know plenty of good atheist... My point was in the eye of
politics or dictators or assholes... which i figure we can all agree
is often the main subject in here....

...so....only atheist politicians or leaders are...bad...?

You said "A Godless person is just as bad as an overzealous person."
Do you deny you said that, when it's right here in the thread? You're
comparing atheists with murderous dictatorial totalitarians is very
offensive and reprehensible.

The atheist worships self... that behavior is 'overzealous' by definition.

And the theist also worships self. They just cowardly do it though a
middleman of their own invention.
--
****************************************************
* DanielSan -- alt.atheism #2226 *
*--------------------------------------------------*
* "I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act *
* of the whole American people which declared that *
* their legislature should make no law respecting *
* an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the *
* free exercise thereof, thus building a wall of *
* separation between church and state." *
* --Thomas Jefferson, 1802 *
****************************************************
.

User: "Roy Jose Lorr"
Title: Re: Why Fear and Detest the Atheist?	20 Jan 2008 04:50:44 PM

DanielSan wrote:

Roy Jose Lorr said the following on 1/20/2008 6:22 AM:

DanielSan wrote:

Mr4701 said the following on 1/19/2008 5:32 PM:

"DanielSan" <danielsan1977@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:r-mdnaDU5YKtBg_anZ2dnUVZ_qqgnZ2d@comcast.com...

Mr4701 said the following on 1/19/2008 4:42 PM:

"DanielSan" <danielsan1977@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:HN2dnShCbJMXBQ_anZ2dnUVZ_qTinZ2d@comcast.com...

Mr4701 said the following on 1/19/2008 4:26 PM:

A Godless person is just as bad as an overzealous person.
Atheist Stalin had no more of a beef killing people than
Islamofascist Osama Bin Laden.

And both are men. Therefore, men are just as bad as Osama bin
Laden.

...right?

The point was it does not matter if they are God believes or
Godless...

Your post belies that conclusion. You were intimating that
atheists were bad people, like Stalin.

No... I know plenty of good atheist... My point was in the eye of
politics or dictators or assholes... which i figure we can all agree
is often the main subject in here....

...so....only atheist politicians or leaders are...bad...?

You said "A Godless person is just as bad as an overzealous person."
Do you deny you said that, when it's right here in the thread?
You're comparing atheists with murderous dictatorial totalitarians is
very offensive and reprehensible.

The atheist worships self... that behavior is 'overzealous' by
definition.

And the theist also worships self. They just cowardly do it though a
middleman of their own invention.

So you pray.
.

User: "Virgil"
Title: Re: Why Fear and Detest the Atheist?	20 Jan 2008 06:18:38 PM

In article <_9SdnQ9qMZ-jTQ7anZ2dnUVZ_g6dnZ2d@comcast.com>,
Roy Jose Lorr <Kenthz@comcast.net> wrote:

And the theist also worships self. They just cowardly do it though a
middleman of their own invention.

So you pray.

Nonsense! It is only those who cannot exist without belief in a god who
need pray.
.

User: "DanielSan"
Title: Re: Why Fear and Detest the Atheist?	20 Jan 2008 04:57:27 PM

Roy Jose Lorr said the following on 1/20/2008 2:50 PM:

DanielSan wrote:

Roy Jose Lorr said the following on 1/20/2008 6:22 AM:

DanielSan wrote:

Mr4701 said the following on 1/19/2008 5:32 PM:

"DanielSan" <danielsan1977@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:r-mdnaDU5YKtBg_anZ2dnUVZ_qqgnZ2d@comcast.com...

Mr4701 said the following on 1/19/2008 4:42 PM:

"DanielSan" <danielsan1977@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:HN2dnShCbJMXBQ_anZ2dnUVZ_qTinZ2d@comcast.com...

Mr4701 said the following on 1/19/2008 4:26 PM:

A Godless person is just as bad as an overzealous person.
Atheist Stalin had no more of a beef killing people than
Islamofascist Osama Bin Laden.

And both are men. Therefore, men are just as bad as Osama bin
Laden.

...right?

The point was it does not matter if they are God believes or
Godless...

Your post belies that conclusion. You were intimating that
atheists were bad people, like Stalin.

No... I know plenty of good atheist... My point was in the eye of
politics or dictators or assholes... which i figure we can all
agree is often the main subject in here....

...so....only atheist politicians or leaders are...bad...?

You said "A Godless person is just as bad as an overzealous
person." Do you deny you said that, when it's right here in the
thread? You're comparing atheists with murderous dictatorial
totalitarians is very offensive and reprehensible.

The atheist worships self... that behavior is 'overzealous' by
definition.

And the theist also worships self. They just cowardly do it though a
middleman of their own invention.

So you pray.

I don't pray. You do. Now, continue to worship yourself and blame it
on your fictional character.
--
****************************************************
* DanielSan -- alt.atheism #2226 *
*--------------------------------------------------*
* "I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act *
* of the whole American people which declared that *
* their legislature should make no law respecting *
* an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the *
* free exercise thereof, thus building a wall of *
* separation between church and state." *
* --Thomas Jefferson, 1802 *
****************************************************
.

User: "Roy Jose Lorr"
Title: Re: Why Fear and Detest the Atheist?	20 Jan 2008 05:08:17 PM