| Topic: |
Science > Philosophy |
| User: |
"ta" |
| Date: |
07 Aug 2005 04:15:51 PM |
| Object: |
The Ideal School |
If you could design/build your ideal school, what would it be like? Where
would it be located? What would be taught? How would it be taught? How would
it be structured? etc.
(let's assume your school must comply with U.S. laws, and money is no
object)
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| User: "tooly" |
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| Title: Re: The Ideal School |
07 Aug 2005 06:05:44 PM |
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"ta" <padlrnc@nc.rr.com> wrote in message
news:bSuJe.110331$Kp2.7821078@twister.southeast.rr.com...
If you could design/build your ideal school, what would it be like? Where
would it be located? What would be taught? How would it be taught? How
would
it be structured? etc.
(let's assume your school must comply with U.S. laws, and money is no
object)
A classroom with Socrates as the instructor.
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| User: "Stu" |
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| Title: Re: The Ideal School |
07 Aug 2005 07:33:20 PM |
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On 2005-08-07 16:05:44 -0700, "tooly" <rdh11@bellsouth.net> said:
"ta" <padlrnc@nc.rr.com> wrote in message
news:bSuJe.110331$Kp2.7821078@twister.southeast.rr.com...
If you could design/build your ideal school, what would it be like? Where
would it be located? What would be taught? How would it be taught? How would
it be structured? etc.
(let's assume your school must comply with U.S. laws, and money is no
object)
A classroom with Socrates as the instructor.
Yes!
--
~Stu
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| User: "tg" |
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| Title: Re: The Ideal School |
07 Aug 2005 06:14:50 PM |
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It would teach parents. They would have to make the time. Give me
parents like that, and I will produce wonderful kids.
-tg
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| User: "zinnic" |
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| Title: Re: The Ideal School |
08 Aug 2005 11:24:27 AM |
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"...I will produce wonderful kids." An unfortunate choice of words for
a teacher!
Do you really believe that school should be a production line?
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| User: "Robert Cohen" |
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| Title: Re: The Ideal School |
08 Aug 2005 12:22:00 PM |
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re: here's why I am having difficulty formulating ideals:
Take: TEACHING AS A SUBVERSIVE ACTIVITY by Postman etal
This is the major ideal of the 1960s. It's about utilizing the Socratic
method. The students are not overly-trained/drilled to
recite/regurgitate basic facts, as in my student days. Success was
claimed utilizing it in the inner city. My candid perception: It takes
an exceptionally sharp/intelligent/risk-oriented teacher to do it, and
....uh...sorry, but I can't visualize it generally working well enough,
but I couldn't totally discard/discount such. The Socratic-method
oriented teachers whom are able to successfully conduct the "inquiry"
&/or "open" method could only meet together at a sizable Grand Central
Station(?)...or actually in a closet/phone booth(?).
Take: WHOLE LANGUAGE vs PHONICS:
According to my Wife, a primary school teacher who is not on the Rght
"politically," "whole language" is a failure which has set-back
reading/education substantially. She tells me it's generally been
thrown-out; but that lasting damage was done.
So, pardon-moi if you're not expecting realistic ideals.
Curriculum relevance to the student's interest/reality, and motivating
of continuous self-learning by the student are great ideals.
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| User: "tooly" |
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| Title: Re: The Ideal School |
09 Aug 2005 06:16:32 AM |
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Curriculum relevance to the student's interest/reality, and motivating
of continuous self-learning by the student are great ideals.
Now this [your quote above] is what sounds 'unrealistic' if you ask me
[which no one has of course]. I once learned that if my parents had
continued serving my every wish and want as a baby, I'd never have gotten
out of that crib.
Life is about incentives. I think it is unobservant of real life to suggest
that human beings are 'born' with 'motivations' that just need to be 'freed'
up [such as allowing a student to fuel their study with personal interest
and relevance, or to sustain continuous self-learning]. Incentives need to
be created by the instructor...and both carrots and whips are necessary to
obtain the conversion of our fullest potentials into 'real' learning.
Simply letting loose children in the candy store is just recipe for flailing
adults who have no compass in later years. Structure is just as much about
the instructor in fact, as it is the instruction. For this, we need to see
the example of real leadership in those we trust as our authorities.
Unless of course, you might think that video gaming is 'real' learning?
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| User: "Robert Cohen" |
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| Title: Re: The Ideal School |
08 Aug 2005 11:01:52 AM |
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re: my ideal schooling ?
a good challenge, and very difficult indeed, as beaucoup billions are
expended on public education, and our social culture is its the sum
total result
reality of my (private, 6 blocks from house) kindergarten: tomato
juice, head on desk, finger-paint, go outside, tomato juice, head on
desk
my ideal: ?
the reality of my primary grades 1--3: lunchroom (no chocolate milk but
plenty of 3 cent a pint white milk surplus they apparently wanted to
get rid of), go outside, alphabet, print, write, add, subtract, line-up
for everything, permission/wood shingle to go to the bathroom, fire
drill, vomit on linseed floors,
my ideal ?
my reality in elementary, grades 4-6: multiplication tables, longgggg
division, memorize states/capitals and countries/capitala, mammals,
amphibians, reptiles, birds, write letter to president eisenhower get
well from heart attack, pack red cross boxes, sell magazine
subscriptions, dodge-ball, folk-dancing in gym class
my ideal?
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| User: "ta" |
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| Title: Re: The Ideal School |
08 Aug 2005 02:36:53 PM |
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tg wrote:
It would teach parents. They would have to make the time. Give me
parents like that, and I will produce wonderful kids.
-tg
What would the parents be taught,and how?
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| User: "Robert Cohen" |
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| Title: Re: The Ideal School |
09 Aug 2005 07:23:14 AM |
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re: motivation by "behavioral conditioning" utilizing incentivization
versus "humanistic self-enlightenment"
In the lower grades utilizing of candy works; while high school
students need/require relevance.
The ground/controversy/phenomenon has been disputed since at least the
1960s, especially by TEACHING AS A SUBVERSIVE ACTIVITY.
Here are the two leading brief reviews of Postman at amazon:
Brilliant, June 8, 2001
Reviewer: Neil Hinrichsen (Knysna South Africa) - See all my reviews
Quite simply one of the most thought-provoking books I have ever read.
However hard it is to get a copy, it is MUST reading for anyone
involved in educating people. Heavily influenced by McLuhan, this book
is devastating in showing what classrooms REALLY teach - that there is
one right answer, that the teacher has it, that memorising facts is
important, that fellow students have nothing to contribute, etc etc -
and how to construct an environment in which REAL learning takes place
- where people learn how to learn themselves. This is one of those
books that shakes one's previously-unexamined foundational assumptions
of education. I cannot recommend it too highly.
The most profound book on education I have ever read., March 25, 1999
Reviewer: Kerry Ponsford (ponsford_kerry@msmail.asd.k12.ak.us)
(Anchorage, Alaska) - See all my reviews
When the first chapter of a book on education is called 'Crap
Detecting', you know you are on to a winner! Postman's provocative look
at the nature of the classroom and how we educate our children is a
must read by anyone who has a real interest in education being about
more than tests and tick boxes. I have read this book many times and
have never failed to be challenged, enthused and uplifted by it. My
classroom and teaching style has been transformed by it - read it!!!
Your teaching will never be the same again!
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| User: "tg" |
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| Title: Re: The Ideal School |
09 Aug 2005 07:15:37 AM |
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ta wrote:
tg wrote:
It would teach parents. They would have to make the time. Give me
parents like that, and I will produce wonderful kids.
-tg
What would the parents be taught,and how?
If parents are participating in the process---whatever it is---they
will provide a model for their children.
If parents are participating in the process---whatever it is---they
will be spending time with their children.
And so on.
The question was, what is an ideal 'school'. That's part of the
problem. First, define the goal, then design the system.
-tg
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| User: "ta" |
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| Title: Re: The Ideal School |
09 Aug 2005 10:05:07 AM |
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tg wrote:
ta wrote:
tg wrote:
It would teach parents. They would have to make the time. Give me
parents like that, and I will produce wonderful kids.
-tg
What would the parents be taught,and how?
If parents are participating in the process---whatever it is---they
will provide a model for their children.
If parents are participating in the process---whatever it is---they
will be spending time with their children.
And so on.
The question was, what is an ideal 'school'. That's part of the
problem. First, define the goal, then design the system.
-tg
Gotcha.
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| User: "Sir Frederick" |
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| Title: Re: The Ideal School |
07 Aug 2005 05:27:13 PM |
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On Sun, 07 Aug 2005 21:15:51 GMT, "ta" <padlrnc@nc.rr.com> wrote:
If you could design/build your ideal school, what would it be like? Where
would it be located? What would be taught? How would it be taught? How would
it be structured? etc.
(let's assume your school must comply with U.S. laws, and money is no
object)
What ages?
I think grades 1-12 in a one room, one teacher, ten student around 1900.
No PC, younger experiences older stuff and older gets
basics reviews. Teacher really gets to know students, and visa-versa.
Before the post WW1 cynicism. You get the picture.
College,
probably a well funded, coed, resident, military school. Max 5,000 students.
Non ideologue genius professors, non urban. No cars or alcohol allowed.
Non PC female president. First class library and bookstore.
--
Best,
Frederick Martin McNeill
Poway, California, United States of America
mmcneill@fuzzysys.com
http://www.fuzzysys.com
http://members.cox.net/fmmcneill/
*************************
Phrase of the week :
"A new scientific truth does not triumph by convincing
its opponents and making them see the light, but rather
because its opponents eventually die, and a new generation
grows up that is familiar with it."
-- Max Planck (1858-1947)
:-))))Snort!)
*************************
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| User: "Day Brown" |
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| Title: Re: The Ideal School |
08 Aug 2005 05:16:07 PM |
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ta wrote:
If you could design/build your ideal school, what would it be like? Where
would it be located? What would be taught? How would it be taught? How would
it be structured? etc.
(let's assume your school must comply with U.S. laws, and money is no
object)
The one room school house is far less likely to have the latest microbe
going around. Infections have been traced to the onset of autism.
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