| Topic: |
Science > Physics |
| User: |
"Spaceman" |
| Date: |
10 Jan 2006 09:38:57 AM |
| Object: |
A reflection's motion can move FTL |
Start with a laser beam on a spinning motor,
start spinning the laser beam at 1 rev per second.
If the laser can reach 186,000 miles away and it spins once
around along that path every second that is that far away.
How fast did the reflection move around the circle.
:)
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| User: "PD" |
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| Title: Re: A reflection's motion can move FTL |
12 Jan 2006 10:02:17 AM |
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Spaceman wrote:
Start with a laser beam on a spinning motor,
start spinning the laser beam at 1 rev per second.
If the laser can reach 186,000 miles away and it spins once
around along that path every second that is that far away.
How fast did the reflection move around the circle.
:)
It's a common mistake to think that c represents an absolute velocity
for absolutely anything. This is not, nor never has been, the case.
PD
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| User: "Spaceman" |
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| Title: Re: A reflection's motion can move FTL |
12 Jan 2006 10:08:15 AM |
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"PD" <TheDraperFamily@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1137081737.434849.252490@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Spaceman wrote:
Start with a laser beam on a spinning motor,
start spinning the laser beam at 1 rev per second.
If the laser can reach 186,000 miles away and it spins once
around along that path every second that is that far away.
How fast did the reflection move around the circle.
:)
It's a common mistake to think that c represents an absolute velocity
for absolutely anything. This is not, nor never has been, the case.
Yup, I know that.
But apparently people like you don't see others saying such to me.
:(
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| User: "PD" |
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| Title: Re: A reflection's motion can move FTL |
12 Jan 2006 10:14:08 AM |
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Spaceman wrote:
"PD" <TheDraperFamily@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1137081737.434849.252490@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Spaceman wrote:
Start with a laser beam on a spinning motor,
start spinning the laser beam at 1 rev per second.
If the laser can reach 186,000 miles away and it spins once
around along that path every second that is that far away.
How fast did the reflection move around the circle.
:)
It's a common mistake to think that c represents an absolute velocity
for absolutely anything. This is not, nor never has been, the case.
Yup, I know that.
But apparently people like you don't see others saying such to me.
:(
Then you're obvously talking with the wrong people. Take a class.
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| User: "Spaceman" |
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| Title: Re: A reflection's motion can move FTL |
12 Jan 2006 10:18:13 AM |
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"PD" <TheDraperFamily@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1137082448.612572.175920@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Then you're obvously talking with the wrong people. Take a class.
Yes, I agree, you are the wrong person to talk to.
Why don't you take a class so you would be more able to
answer things instead of just "blah blah" to people.
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| User: "PD" |
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| Title: Re: A reflection's motion can move FTL |
12 Jan 2006 01:02:29 PM |
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Spaceman wrote:
"PD" <TheDraperFamily@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1137082448.612572.175920@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Then you're obvously talking with the wrong people. Take a class.
Yes, I agree, you are the wrong person to talk to.
Why don't you take a class so you would be more able to
answer things instead of just "blah blah" to people.
Oh, I'm hurt!
What part of my answer did you not find satisfactory?
PD
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: A reflection's motion can move FTL |
12 Jan 2006 07:21:07 PM |
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PD wrote:
Spaceman wrote:
Start with a laser beam on a spinning motor,
start spinning the laser beam at 1 rev per second.
If the laser can reach 186,000 miles away and it spins once
around along that path every second that is that far away.
How fast did the reflection move around the circle.
:)
It's a common mistake to think that c represents an absolute velocity
for absolutely anything. This is not, nor never has been, the case.
PD
_Especially_ photons (emr)
Jim G
c'=c+v
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: A reflection's motion can move FTL |
10 Jan 2006 11:40:41 PM |
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Spaceman wrote:
Start with a laser beam on a spinning motor,
start spinning the laser beam at 1 rev per second.
If the laser can reach 186,000 miles away and it spins once
around along that path every second that is that far away.
How fast did the reflection move around the circle.
:)
Spaceman, this is not convincing.
Imagine the beam is a strip of tape running out of the laser.
Aren't you just creating a spiral? The reflection coming back is going
to increasingly lag the tape being emitted. (hitting the
circumference/relector)
The DIRECTION of the beam, does not correspond to the point of
reflection.
This is the type of confusion which I have tried to point out to the
astro community, when they define the directions/distances of their
observations.
Jim G
c'=c+v
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| User: "Spaceman" |
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| Title: Re: A reflection's motion can move FTL |
11 Jan 2006 08:22:37 AM |
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"jgreenfield@seol.net.au" <jgreen@seol.net.au> wrote in message
news:1136958041.199996.143330@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
Spaceman wrote:
Start with a laser beam on a spinning motor,
start spinning the laser beam at 1 rev per second.
If the laser can reach 186,000 miles away and it spins once
around along that path every second that is that far away.
How fast did the reflection move around the circle.
:)
Spaceman, this is not convincing.
Imagine the beam is a strip of tape running out of the laser.
Aren't you just creating a spiral? The reflection coming back is going
to increasingly lag the tape being emitted. (hitting the
circumference/relector)
The DIRECTION of the beam, does not correspond to the point of
reflection.
This is the type of confusion which I have tried to point out to the
astro community, when they define the directions/distances of their
observations.
Hi Jim,
Yes, because the laser takes a full second to travel to the reflection
circle,
the actual path it would be taking would be a spiral, once
around for the 1 second revolution also.
:)
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: A reflection's motion can move FTL |
11 Jan 2006 04:37:48 PM |
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Spaceman wrote:
"jgreenfield@seol.net.au" <jgreen@seol.net.au> wrote in message
news:1136958041.199996.143330@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
Spaceman wrote:
Start with a laser beam on a spinning motor,
start spinning the laser beam at 1 rev per second.
If the laser can reach 186,000 miles away and it spins once
around along that path every second that is that far away.
How fast did the reflection move around the circle.
:)
Spaceman, this is not convincing.
Imagine the beam is a strip of tape running out of the laser.
Aren't you just creating a spiral? The reflection coming back is going
to increasingly lag the tape being emitted. (hitting the
circumference/relector)
The DIRECTION of the beam, does not correspond to the point of
reflection.
This is the type of confusion which I have tried to point out to the
astro community, when they define the directions/distances of their
observations.
Hi Jim,
Yes, because the laser takes a full second to travel to the reflection
circle,
the actual path it would be taking would be a spiral, once
around for the 1 second revolution also.
:)
G'day Spacey
So the reflection is NOT travelling >c !????
Jim G
c'=c+v
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| User: "Spaceman" |
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| Title: Re: A reflection's motion can move FTL |
11 Jan 2006 05:46:29 PM |
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"jgreenfield@seol.net.au" <jgreen@seol.net.au> wrote in message
news:1137019068.098102.179400@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
Spaceman wrote:
"jgreenfield@seol.net.au" <jgreen@seol.net.au> wrote in message
news:1136958041.199996.143330@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
Spaceman wrote:
Start with a laser beam on a spinning motor,
start spinning the laser beam at 1 rev per second.
If the laser can reach 186,000 miles away and it spins once
around along that path every second that is that far away.
How fast did the reflection move around the circle.
:)
Spaceman, this is not convincing.
Imagine the beam is a strip of tape running out of the laser.
Aren't you just creating a spiral? The reflection coming back is going
to increasingly lag the tape being emitted. (hitting the
circumference/relector)
The DIRECTION of the beam, does not correspond to the point of
reflection.
This is the type of confusion which I have tried to point out to the
astro community, when they define the directions/distances of their
observations.
Hi Jim,
Yes, because the laser takes a full second to travel to the reflection
circle,
the actual path it would be taking would be a spiral, once
around for the 1 second revolution also.
:)
G'day Spacey
So the reflection is NOT travelling >c !????
Oh, it would be, but like you said.
the actual path the laser would be moving in would look more
like a spiral line spinning around..
(the laser's light would not be a straight line)
the light can not move that fast :)
It would sort of like a one line hypnotizing disk :)
Jim G
c'=c+v
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: A reflection's motion can move FTL |
11 Jan 2006 08:56:43 PM |
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Spaceman wrote:
"jgreenfield@seol.net.au" <jgreen@seol.net.au> wrote in message
news:1137019068.098102.179400@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
Spaceman wrote:
"jgreenfield@seol.net.au" <jgreen@seol.net.au> wrote in message
news:1136958041.199996.143330@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
Spaceman wrote:
Start with a laser beam on a spinning motor,
start spinning the laser beam at 1 rev per second.
If the laser can reach 186,000 miles away and it spins once
around along that path every second that is that far away.
How fast did the reflection move around the circle.
:)
Spaceman, this is not convincing.
Imagine the beam is a strip of tape running out of the laser.
Aren't you just creating a spiral? The reflection coming back is going
to increasingly lag the tape being emitted. (hitting the
circumference/relector)
The DIRECTION of the beam, does not correspond to the point of
reflection.
This is the type of confusion which I have tried to point out to the
astro community, when they define the directions/distances of their
observations.
Hi Jim,
Yes, because the laser takes a full second to travel to the reflection
circle,
the actual path it would be taking would be a spiral, once
around for the 1 second revolution also.
:)
G'day Spacey
So the reflection is NOT travelling >c !????
Oh, it would be, but like you said.
the actual path the laser would be moving in would look more
like a spiral line spinning around..
(the laser's light would not be a straight line)
the light can not move that fast :)
It would sort of like a one line hypnotizing disk :)
Is the returning emr spiralling opposite?
It won't return on the same path, eh?
And the reflection won't return to the laser (but a later version will)
An animation (graphic) might look cool :-)
Jim G
c'=c+v
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| User: "Spaceman" |
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| Title: Re: A reflection's motion can move FTL |
12 Jan 2006 09:15:59 AM |
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"jgreenfield@seol.net.au" <jgreen@seol.net.au> wrote in message
news:1137034603.245723.242370@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Is the returning emr spiralling opposite?
It won't return on the same path, eh?
And the reflection won't return to the laser (but a later version will)
An animation (graphic) might look cool :-)
An animation might make people fall into a hypnotic state that may
not be breakable :)
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| User: "Mike" |
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| Title: Re: A reflection's motion can move FTL |
10 Jan 2006 10:22:27 AM |
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Spaceman wrote:
Start with a laser beam on a spinning motor,
start spinning the laser beam at 1 rev per second.
If the laser can reach 186,000 miles away and it spins once
around along that path every second that is that far away.
How fast did the reflection move around the circle.
:)
The only problem is that the reflection cannot carry new information
from point A to point B on its path.
Mike
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| User: "Spaceman" |
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| Title: Re: A reflection's motion can move FTL |
10 Jan 2006 10:30:35 AM |
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"Mike" <eleatis@yahoo.gr> wrote in message
news:1136910147.775022.308360@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Spaceman wrote:
Start with a laser beam on a spinning motor,
start spinning the laser beam at 1 rev per second.
If the laser can reach 186,000 miles away and it spins once
around along that path every second that is that far away.
How fast did the reflection move around the circle.
:)
The only problem is that the reflection cannot carry new information
from point A to point B on its path.
Yes, it can not, (or can it) :)
But the speed of the reflection can go above c, therefore when people
say that speeds above c do not exist, they are full of nonsense. :)
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| User: "Mike" |
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| Title: Re: A reflection's motion can move FTL |
10 Jan 2006 06:32:53 PM |
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Spaceman wrote:
"Mike" <eleatis@yahoo.gr> wrote in message
news:1136910147.775022.308360@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Spaceman wrote:
Start with a laser beam on a spinning motor,
start spinning the laser beam at 1 rev per second.
If the laser can reach 186,000 miles away and it spins once
around along that path every second that is that far away.
How fast did the reflection move around the circle.
:)
The only problem is that the reflection cannot carry new information
from point A to point B on its path.
Yes, it can not, (or can it) :)
But the speed of the reflection can go above c, therefore when people
say that speeds above c do not exist, they are full of nonsense. :)
I would say, you don't understand what people say. FTL speeds exist, I
was talking about the facts of the particular example you gave.
In 3-D space+time, changes in gravitational potential propagate at
speeds many orders of magnitude higher than the speed of light. It is
easy to show that, if that was not the case, planer orbits would be
unstable.
In 4-D GR spacetime, it is required that changes in gravitational
potential propagate at the speed of light, max. But this is something
that fails verification, as it is the case with several other
speculations about GR 4-D spacetime. Simply, this sort of spacetime is
unobservable and its effects unverifiable.
It is plausible that the speed limit of matter is c but there are FTL
causal interactions and information propagation. The problem is the
following:
When a paper is submitted describing an FTl experiment, the following
comment is made by the anonymous referee: "the author does not
understand relativity". The paper is rejected. The author naturally
disgusted quits his univ job and joins some financial firm or does
something else. the net resultis nthe folllowing:
University positions are currently held 99.99% by relativity cranks.
Also, about 90% of those people have somethign else in common. Guess
what?
Mike
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| User: "Spaceman" |
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| Title: Re: A reflection's motion can move FTL |
10 Jan 2006 06:39:48 PM |
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"Mike" <eleatis@yahoo.gr> wrote in message
news:1136939573.828408.21990@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
I would say, you don't understand what people say. FTL speeds exist, I
was talking about the facts of the particular example you gave.
I understand what people say very well.
apparently you have not seen what is said sometimes.
In 3-D space+time, changes in gravitational potential propagate at
speeds many orders of magnitude higher than the speed of light. It is
easy to show that, if that was not the case, planer orbits would be
unstable.
In 4-D GR spacetime, it is required that changes in gravitational
potential propagate at the speed of light, max. But this is something
that fails verification, as it is the case with several other
speculations about GR 4-D spacetime. Simply, this sort of spacetime is
unobservable and its effects unverifiable.
Yes, "spacetime" anything is very unverifiable since it has lost the
actual science when it combines space and time as one thing.
University positions are currently held 99.99% by relativity cranks.
Also, about 90% of those people have somethign else in common. Guess
what?
They have no clue how clocks work and have forgotten what timing (time)
was invented for. (as in non-variable measurement system)
:)
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| User: "Paul Cardinale" |
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| Title: Re: A reflection's motion can move FTL |
10 Jan 2006 11:52:58 AM |
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Spaceman wrote:
"Mike" <eleatis@yahoo.gr> wrote in message
news:1136910147.775022.308360@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Spaceman wrote:
Start with a laser beam on a spinning motor,
start spinning the laser beam at 1 rev per second.
If the laser can reach 186,000 miles away and it spins once
around along that path every second that is that far away.
How fast did the reflection move around the circle.
:)
The only problem is that the reflection cannot carry new information
from point A to point B on its path.
Yes, it can not, (or can it) :)
But the speed of the reflection can go above c, therefore when people
say that speeds above c do not exist, they are full of nonsense. :)
There are a number of things that can be observed to move faster than
c:
projected images, shadows, cuts, interference patterns, also, anything
observed from a non-inertial frame of reference. The speed limit of c
applies to matter, energy and information as observed from an inertial
frame of reference.
Paul Cardinale
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| User: "Spaceman" |
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| Title: Re: A reflection's motion can move FTL |
10 Jan 2006 12:22:43 PM |
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"Paul Cardinale" <pcardinale@volcanomail.com> wrote in message
news:1136915578.549243.313900@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
There are a number of things that can be observed to move faster than
c:
projected images, shadows, cuts, interference patterns, also, anything
observed from a non-inertial frame of reference. The speed limit of c
applies to matter, energy and information as observed from an inertial
frame of reference.
Then why do people say I can not have speeds above c?
If I try to add 1c+1c. I get all sorts of crap about it equaling 1c still.
:)
BTW: what proof do you have that speeds of matter can not pass the speed of
light?
You only have that "lightspeed as the engine" proof crap huh?
your engine is limited to that speed, not matter nor anything else.
you have no proof of such a limitation.
you only have proof that light based exeperiments can not travel faster than
light.
:)
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| User: "Paul Cardinale" |
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| Title: Re: A reflection's motion can move FTL |
10 Jan 2006 01:27:43 PM |
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Spaceman wrote:
"Paul Cardinale" <pcardinale@volcanomail.com> wrote in message
news:1136915578.549243.313900@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
There are a number of things that can be observed to move faster than
c:
projected images, shadows, cuts, interference patterns, also, anything
observed from a non-inertial frame of reference. The speed limit of c
applies to matter, energy and information as observed from an inertial
frame of reference.
Then why do people say I can not have speeds above c?
If I try to add 1c+1c. I get all sorts of crap about it equaling 1c still.
:)
1. Some people don't properly express the applicability of the speed
limit.
2. When people do properly express it, you can't grasp it.
BTW: what proof do you have that speeds of matter can not pass the speed of
light?
You only have that "lightspeed as the engine" proof crap huh?
your engine is limited to that speed, not matter nor anything else.
you have no proof of such a limitation.
you only have proof that light based exeperiments can not travel faster than
light.
:)
Theories aren't proved; but they are validated. Validation of
relativity is easy to find,
but simple tire pump operators can't understand it.
Paul Cardinale
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| User: "Spaceman" |
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| Title: Re: A reflection's motion can move FTL |
10 Jan 2006 01:31:08 PM |
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"Paul Cardinale" <pcardinale@volcanomail.com> wrote in message
news:1136921263.883335.11910@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Theories aren't proved; but they are validated. Validation of
relativity is easy to find,
but simple tire pump operators can't understand it.
Yet another, taken all the way to insults, because they have no
actual brain to use against a simple fact about FTL motion being possible.
You should stop stretching your rubber ruler Paul.
It does not prove anything you think it does.
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