| Topic: |
Science > Physics |
| User: |
"Nanoworld" |
| Date: |
07 Apr 2006 05:49:55 PM |
| Object: |
Beryllium copper |
Hi,
I am working on ultra-high vacuum system in a university. We are
looking for a block of "Beryllium-Copper". This material is found to
be used for various UHV components, e.g. connectors. The dimension of
the block should be around 1"x1"x0.5".
I searched through some companies we usually use, e.g. MDC, K-J Lesker,
etc, but cannot find the materials. Does anyone know good companies,
that sells high quality materials for ultrahigh vacuum environment?
Thank you for your support in advance.
Nano-
.
|
|
| User: "tadchem" |
|
| Title: Re: Beryllium copper |
08 Apr 2006 09:27:09 AM |
|
|
Google "bulk BeCu alloy" gets you
http://www.freedomalloysusa.com/be_co_w_p.shtml
I am sure there are others as well.
I used a cascade electron multiplier with 17 stages (IIRC) of
multiplication in a high vacuum mass spectrometer system. The main
consideration in working on it was to wear disposable gloves to protect
against accidental exposire to Be - *very* toxic. That, and to make
sure the 4KV power supply was *OFF* and the unit discharged before
starting to service it <grin>.
Tom Davidson
Richmond, VA
.
|
|
|
| User: "hanson" |
|
| Title: Re: Beryllium copper |
08 Apr 2006 09:43:35 PM |
|
|
"tadchem" <tadchem@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:1144506429.541832.297660@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
I used a cascade electron multiplier .... in a high vacuum
mass spectrometer system. The main consideration in
working on it was to wear disposable gloves to protect
against accidental exposire to Be - *very* toxic. That,
and to make sure the 4KV power supply was *OFF*
and the unit discharged before starting to service it <grin>.
Tom Davidson
Richmond, VA
[hanson]
ahahaha... I presume that your <grin> has to do with the
wearing the gloves to protect yourself against the potential
of electric shock. But, if you "protected" yourself against the
dangers of touching Beryllium in the BeCu then you have
fallen victim to severe green paranoia or you are, I am sorry
to say, an extraordinarily tormented wuss.... ahahaha...
Consider,
(1) many connectors from/on/in normal electrical household
items can and do have BeCu prongs and sockets.
(2) Machinists and Stampers do cut, shave, draw, grind
and polish BeCu routinely,
(3) Platers etch (dissolve) and plate BeCu routinely...
and nobody has gotten sick from handling BeCu under
these circumstances, .... barring the phony fuckers who
took advantage of the situation (workers, Drs & lawyers)
by perverting and looting the Workers Comp Program.
You probably got your paranoia instilled by people like
this one below, back from 1949 during the cold war,
where the real reason was to scare/warn people who
were casting, machining and grinding nuke-components
that were made from pure Beryllium
http://www.physicstoday.org/vol-2/iss-6/vol2no6p14_17.pdf
But I have never seen anybody, in any metal working
shop, who handles BeCu equipment to take special
precautions, (n)or have gotten sick from it.
http://www.busbymetals.com/pdf/guide_to_be_cu.pdf
does not mention to use any special caution procedures
for working with BeCu stating:
=== "Handling copper beryllium in solid form poses no
special health risk. Like many industrial materials, beryllium
containing materials may pose a health risk if recommended
safe handling practices are not followed. Inhalation of
airborne beryllium may cause a serious lung disorder in
susceptible individuals". ===
Naturally OSHA weighs in with typical bureaucratic paranoia &
== "has set mandatory limits on occupational respiratory exposures.
Read and follow the guidance in the Material Safety Data Sheet
(MSDS) before working with this material". ===
The MSDS says nothing extraordinary about BeCu:
http://www.southerncopper.com/pdfs/MSDS%20III.pdf
http://physchem.ox.ac.uk/MSDS/CO/copper_beryllium.html
and say nowhere that touching or handling BeCu mandates
the caution of only approaching it only with a gloved hand....
All these caution notes are provided for people who work
with large quantities of dust or solutions of BeCu, and
who are exposed to metal dust/spray... but then if you
have ever been in any kind of metal dust containing
environment, you will be coughing and choking from it
on the very first whiff and will vacate the premises at once,
voluntarily... However, if you don't and you insist to stay
and play macho, well, then you deserve what's coming....
ahahaha....
I wonder whether <dbohara@mindspring.com> who posted
news:1144465327.298424.8440@v46g2000cwv.googlegroups.com...
in which he said: "I buy BeCu sheets" does handle them
with protective gloves out of fear from the Be in BeCu?
Hey Davidson, if you are such a sweet, cautious and careful
dude, then let me make you even more paranoid by pointing
out to you a far more ubiquitous and catastrophic scenario:
.... Make sure that whenever you handle or touch, at home
or at work any brass tacks, yellow door knobs, golden looking
picture frames with pix of your grandkids kids in it, or when
you change a light bulb with that yellow screw base, actually
anything metallic that looks lemon like in color... BEWARE
it could be LEADED brass, a Zinc copper alloy that contains
LEAD, the debilitating and deadly lead... a heavy metal so
bad that congress at one time debated whether it should
be against the law to mine it.... ahahaha... I'm not kidding.
So, be sure to never walk too far away from your box of
protective latex gloves... ahahaha.... who, to make matters
worse, could cause on/in you a latex allergy that is even
more devastating then the lead contact which could make
you to become demented... ahahaha... by which time you
will no longer be able to read nor remember the edicts of
the green bible that says:
= "A lot of environmental [sci/soc/pol] messages are simply not
= accurate. We use hype." -- Jerry Franklin, Ecologist, UoW, and...
= "It doesn't matter what is true ... it only matters what people
= believe is true ... -- Paul Watson, Greenpeace, and ......
= "We make simplified, dramatic statements, and make little
= mention of any doubts we may have [about] being honest."
= -- Stephen Schneider (Stanford prof. who first sought fame as
= a global cooler, but has now hit the big time as a global warmer)
.... ahahahaha.... take care, Tom,... ahahahaha.....
ahaha... ahahahanson
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "Jan Panteltje" |
|
| Title: Re: Beryllium copper |
08 Apr 2006 01:00:52 PM |
|
|
On a sunny day (8 Apr 2006 07:27:09 -0700) it happened "tadchem"
<tadchem@comcast.net> wrote in
<1144506429.541832.297660@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>:
Google "bulk BeCu alloy" gets you
http://www.freedomalloysusa.com/be_co_w_p.shtml
I am sure there are others as well.
I used a cascade electron multiplier with 17 stages (IIRC) of
multiplication in a high vacuum mass spectrometer system. The main
consideration in working on it was to wear disposable gloves to protect
against accidental exposire to Be - *very* toxic.
You mean I should stop chewing those old transistor isolation whashers?
That, and to make
sure the 4KV power supply was *OFF* and the unit discharged before
starting to service it <grin>.
mm, good advice.
.
|
|
|
| User: "hanson" |
|
| Title: Re: Beryllium copper |
08 Apr 2006 03:07:27 PM |
|
|
"Jan Panteltje" <pNaonStpealmtje@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:e18tor$u5$1@news.datemas.de...
"tadchem" <tadchem@comcast.net> wrote in
<1144506429.541832.297660@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>:
I used a cascade electron multiplier... The main consideration
in working on it was to wear disposable gloves to protect
against accidental exposire to Be - *very* toxic.
[Jan]
You mean I should stop chewing
those old transistor isolation whashers?
[hanson]
.... ahahaha... Jan, No... because and since you have comitted
this environmentally unspeakable sin and crime, your question
is mute.... for you now live on borrowed time according to
the Green Bible that says:
= "A lot of environmental [sci/soc/pol] messages are simply not
= accurate. We use hype." -- Jerry Franklin, Ecologist, UoW, and...
= "It doesn't matter what is true ... it only matters what people
= believe is true ... -- Paul Watson, Greenpeace, and ......
= "We make simplified, dramatic statements, and make little
= mention of any doubts we may have [about] being honest."
= -- Stephen Schneider (Stanford prof. who first sought fame as
= a global cooler, but has now hit the big time as a global warmer)
.... Therefore and however, as long as you keep chewing, Jan,
you will be living proof that environmentalism is the biggest lie
and the vilest, most gigantic jerkoff that was perpetrated onto
humankind since Earthday in the latter part of the last century...
Cherish Science... but ***** enviros!
ahyahaha.... ahahahanson
.
|
|
|
| User: "Jan Panteltje" |
|
| Title: Re: Beryllium copper |
08 Apr 2006 03:40:54 PM |
|
|
On a sunny day (Sat, 08 Apr 2006 20:07:27 GMT) it happened "hanson"
<hanson@quick.net> wrote in <3KUZf.831$8g3.178@trnddc02>:
"Jan Panteltje" <pNaonStpealmtje@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:e18tor$u5$1@news.datemas.de...
"tadchem" <tadchem@comcast.net> wrote in
<1144506429.541832.297660@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>:
I used a cascade electron multiplier... The main consideration
in working on it was to wear disposable gloves to protect
against accidental exposire to Be - *very* toxic.
[Jan]
You mean I should stop chewing
those old transistor isolation whashers?
[hanson]
... ahahaha... Jan, No... because and since you have comitted
this environmentally unspeakable sin and crime, your question
is mute.... for you now live on borrowed time according to
the Green Bible that says:
= "A lot of environmental [sci/soc/pol] messages are simply not
= accurate. We use hype." -- Jerry Franklin, Ecologist, UoW, and...
= "It doesn't matter what is true ... it only matters what people
= believe is true ... -- Paul Watson, Greenpeace, and ......
= "We make simplified, dramatic statements, and make little
= mention of any doubts we may have [about] being honest."
= -- Stephen Schneider (Stanford prof. who first sought fame as
= a global cooler, but has now hit the big time as a global warmer)
... Therefore and however, as long as you keep chewing, Jan,
you will be living proof that environmentalism is the biggest lie
and the vilest, most gigantic jerkoff that was perpetrated onto
humankind since Earthday in the latter part of the last century...
Cherish Science... but ***** enviros!
ahyahaha.... ahahahanson
Well of course I ain't that daft to really chew berylium washers....
We used these, and these are (berylium oxide?) brittle, and were warned
not to break that stuff.
Washed my hands after using these... Not sure .....
Do not remember if the danger was inhalation of the dust or just skin contact.
Hell lead is poisenous too, have handled solder for almost 60 years
(started as a kid actually), they removed it from car fuel, now they use
something that you really should not breathe.....
Now we get lead-free solder in electronics...
It is all big business, and sure somebody will prove the replacement more dangerous
then the original some day.
And, after WW3 all will be radiating anyways, so who cares.
Jack its April, how about it?
.
|
|
|
| User: "" |
|
| Title: Re: Beryllium copper |
09 Apr 2006 07:09:29 AM |
|
|
Jan Panteltje schreef:
It is all big business, and sure somebody will prove the replacement more dangerous
then the original some day.
And, after WW3 all will be radiating anyways, so who cares.
Jack its April, how about it?
And it apepared
http://edition.cnn.com/2006/US/04/09/hersh.iran.reut/index.html
Thank Jack, for the quick response.
Y'old warper!
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "tadchem" |
|
| Title: Re: Beryllium copper |
09 Apr 2006 09:31:20 AM |
|
|
Jan Panteltje wrote:
<snip>
Well of course I ain't that daft to really chew berylium washers....
We used these, and these are (berylium oxide?) brittle, and were warned
not to break that stuff.
Washed my hands after using these... Not sure .....
Do not remember if the danger was inhalation of the dust or just skin contact.
From
http://risk.lsd.ornl.gov/tox/profiles/beryllium.shtml
3.3.1. Acute Toxicity
3.3.1.1. Human
Beryllium is a direct irritant and may cause edema and inflammation of
any contacted tissue (Kriebel et al., 1988b). The eyes and skin are
common targets of the acute irritant effects of beryllium (Kriebel et
al., 1988b). Cutaneous injuries from beryllium metal, alloys, or oxide
may require surgical excision of the foreign substance to promote
healing (Zorn et al., 1988). In addition to primary dermatitis,
beryllium may sensitize the skin to subsequent contact with the metal.
Dermatitis usually abates after exposure stops, but ulceration can
result from particles retained in the skin (Kriebel et al., 1988b).
Hell lead is poisenous too, have handled solder for almost 60 years
Lead is not as bad as beryllium:
http://risk.lsd.ornl.gov/tox/profiles/lead.shtml
no risk of 'contact dermatitis' is mentioned.
IIRC, most human deaths related to lead exposure are actually due to
hemorrhaging as a consequence of the *method* of exposure.
(started as a kid actually), they removed it from car fuel, now they use
something that you really should not breathe.....
Now we get lead-free solder in electronics...
An old chemist / ham radio guy I know worries more about inhaling the
fumes from the flux...
It is all big business, and sure somebody will prove the replacement more dangerous
then the original some day.
The ban* on DDT results in literally millions of human deaths annually
from preventable mararia, but the fish-eating birds are feeling better.
And, after WW3 all will be radiating anyways, so who cares.
"At Closest Range" - Isaac Asimov (F&SF, May, 1974)
The most prolific carcinogen we face is naturally occurring carbon-14;
it has been since life evolved.
Tom Davidson
Richmond, VA
.
|
|
|
| User: "Hexenmeister" |
|
| Title: Re: Beryllium copper |
09 Apr 2006 12:24:08 PM |
|
|
"tadchem" <tadchem@comcast.net> wrote in message =
news:1144593080.447080.279390@t31g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
|=20
| Jan Panteltje wrote:
|=20
| <snip>
|=20
| > Well of course I ain't that daft to really chew berylium washers....
| > We used these, and these are (berylium oxide?) brittle, and were =
warned
| > not to break that stuff.
| > Washed my hands after using these... Not sure .....
| > Do not remember if the danger was inhalation of the dust or just =
skin contact.
|=20
| From
| http://risk.lsd.ornl.gov/tox/profiles/beryllium.shtml
|=20
| 3.3.1. Acute Toxicity
| 3.3.1.1. Human
|=20
| Beryllium is a direct irritant and may cause edema and inflammation of
| any contacted tissue (Kriebel et al., 1988b). The eyes and skin are
| common targets of the acute irritant effects of beryllium (Kriebel et
| al., 1988b). Cutaneous injuries from beryllium metal, alloys, or oxide
| may require surgical excision of the foreign substance to promote
| healing (Zorn et al., 1988). In addition to primary dermatitis,
| beryllium may sensitize the skin to subsequent contact with the metal.
| Dermatitis usually abates after exposure stops, but ulceration can
| result from particles retained in the skin (Kriebel et al., 1988b).
|=20
| > Hell lead is poisenous too, have handled solder for almost 60 years
|=20
| Lead is not as bad as beryllium:
| http://risk.lsd.ornl.gov/tox/profiles/lead.shtml
| no risk of 'contact dermatitis' is mentioned.
|=20
| IIRC, most human deaths related to lead exposure are actually due to
| hemorrhaging as a consequence of the *method* of exposure.
|=20
| > (started as a kid actually), they removed it from car fuel, now they =
use
| > something that you really should not breathe.....
| > Now we get lead-free solder in electronics...
|=20
| An old chemist / ham radio guy I know worries more about inhaling the
| fumes from the flux...
|=20
| > It is all big business, and sure somebody will prove the replacement =
more dangerous
| > then the original some day.
|=20
| The ban* on DDT results in literally millions of human deaths annually
| from preventable mararia, but the fish-eating birds are feeling =
better.
|=20
| > And, after WW3 all will be radiating anyways, so who cares.
|=20
| "At Closest Range" - Isaac Asimov (F&SF, May, 1974)
| The most prolific carcinogen we face is naturally occurring carbon-14;
| it has been since life evolved.
|=20
| Tom Davidson
| Richmond, VA
And quite possibly the major cause of evolution.
Androcles.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Roy L. Fuchs" |
|
| Title: Re: Beryllium copper |
09 Apr 2006 03:24:52 PM |
|
|
On Sun, 09 Apr 2006 17:24:08 GMT, "Hexenmeister"
<vanquish@broom.Mickey_b> Gave us:
"tadchem" <tadchem@comcast.net> wrote in message news:1144593080.447080.279390@t31g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
|
| Jan Panteltje wrote:
|
| <snip>
|
| > Well of course I ain't that daft to really chew berylium washers....
| > We used these, and these are (berylium oxide?) brittle, and were warned
| > not to break that stuff.
| > Washed my hands after using these... Not sure .....
| > Do not remember if the danger was inhalation of the dust or just skin contact.
|
| From
| http://risk.lsd.ornl.gov/tox/profiles/beryllium.shtml
|
| 3.3.1. Acute Toxicity
| 3.3.1.1. Human
|
| Beryllium is a direct irritant and may cause edema and inflammation of
| any contacted tissue (Kriebel et al., 1988b). The eyes and skin are
| common targets of the acute irritant effects of beryllium (Kriebel et
| al., 1988b). Cutaneous injuries from beryllium metal, alloys, or oxide
| may require surgical excision of the foreign substance to promote
| healing (Zorn et al., 1988). In addition to primary dermatitis,
| beryllium may sensitize the skin to subsequent contact with the metal.
| Dermatitis usually abates after exposure stops, but ulceration can
| result from particles retained in the skin (Kriebel et al., 1988b).
Beryllium is very toxic and a cut on the finger can even cause
death.
| > Hell lead is poisenous too, have handled solder for almost 60 years
|
| Lead is not as bad as beryllium:
| http://risk.lsd.ornl.gov/tox/profiles/lead.shtml
| no risk of 'contact dermatitis' is mentioned.
Metallic form lead is not very toxic at all, and there is no real
need to get it out of electronic assemblies. The whole ROHS crap is
about europeans trying to take control of an industry, thereby
boosting the eurodollar.
Nearly ALL lead poisoning comes from lead compounds. NOT ALLOYS.
Same goes for mercury. In metal form, it is virtually harmless. In
its various compounds, it is one of the most deadly, carcinogenic
substances there is.
|
| IIRC, most human deaths related to lead exposure are actually due to
| hemorrhaging as a consequence of the *method* of exposure.
Not the method. The type of exposure. Metallic form lead, no
problem, unless it is exiting a gun bore at 1200 fps. If it is a lead
compound though, it can poison the body.
| > (started as a kid actually), they removed it from car fuel, now they use
| > something that you really should not breathe.....
| > Now we get lead-free solder in electronics...
|
| An old chemist / ham radio guy I know worries more about inhaling the
| fumes from the flux...
Solder flux fumes are virtually harmless, and there is no lead in
it.
| > It is all big business, and sure somebody will prove the replacement more dangerous
| > then the original some day.
|
| The ban* on DDT results in literally millions of human deaths annually
| from preventable mararia, but the fish-eating birds are feeling better.
What? You're an idiot! The ban on DDT results in literally
millions of humans NOT dying, you retarded *****.
|
| > And, after WW3 all will be radiating anyways, so who cares.
|
| "At Closest Range" - Isaac Asimov (F&SF, May, 1974)
| The most prolific carcinogen we face is naturally occurring carbon-14;
| it has been since life evolved.
And quite possibly the major cause of evolution.
Androcles.
You're an idiot, and Asimov was wrong about carbon-14.
.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| User: "Gregory L. Hansen" |
|
| Title: Re: Beryllium copper |
08 Apr 2006 07:41:06 PM |
|
|
In article <1144450195.613722.253030@t31g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
Nanoworld <murooka@pa.msu.edu> wrote:
Hi,
I am working on ultra-high vacuum system in a university. We are
looking for a block of "Beryllium-Copper". This material is found to
be used for various UHV components, e.g. connectors. The dimension of
the block should be around 1"x1"x0.5".
I searched through some companies we usually use, e.g. MDC, K-J Lesker,
etc, but cannot find the materials. Does anyone know good companies,
that sells high quality materials for ultrahigh vacuum environment?
Thank you for your support in advance.
Nano-
You just want a block of the stuff? Try
www.thomasregister.com
It's the industrialist's best friend.
But why BeCu? Aluminum, stainless steel, and copper are good at low
pressures.
--
"I fart for joy and I laugh more than if I had cast my old age, as a
serpent does its skin." -- Aristophanes, Peace, 421 BC
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "hanson" |
|
| Title: Re: Beryllium copper |
07 Apr 2006 07:46:49 PM |
|
|
Post this into sci. materials, .... because ....
there are mostly only Einstein fanatics here in sp
who live in a world where your BeCu would make
invisible Terrell rotations and be full of wormholes
and to boot, would disappear in its time travels.
BTW, BeCu, bitchen alloy. Call up the owners or the
purchasing/sales departments of your local machine
shops. They machine/stamp BeCu all the time.
You might get lucky and get your little block for free.
BTW 2: Don't tell the enviros that you have any BeCu
or these green shits will whine at you because of the
POTENTIAL danger of the Be and then demand
a permit charge and user fee for you to possess it,
to store it, to handle it, to inspect it, to work it, to
change its form, to produce waste form it, to handle the
BeCu waste, to transport the waste and to dispose of
the waste, ... everytime, for each step a new charge...
So, no wonder that Eric Gisin said in his memorable post
in news:d8j4df01n0o@enews1.newsguy.com... that
**** "Fucking greens should be shot...." ****
But you, an experimentalist, I hail you. Good luck to you.
hanson
"Nanoworld" <murooka@pa.msu.edu> wrote in message
news:1144450195.613722.253030@t31g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Hi,
I am working on ultra-high vacuum system in a university. We are
looking for a block of "Beryllium-Copper". This material is found to
be used for various UHV components, e.g. connectors. The dimension of
the block should be around 1"x1"x0.5".
I searched through some companies we usually use, e.g. MDC, K-J Lesker,
etc, but cannot find the materials. Does anyone know good companies,
that sells high quality materials for ultrahigh vacuum environment?
Thank you for your support in advance.
Nano-
.
|
|
|
| User: "" |
|
| Title: Re: Beryllium copper |
07 Apr 2006 10:02:07 PM |
|
|
Try Goodfellow. I buy BeCu sheets from them and they probably have it
thicker too.
.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Related Articles |
|
|
