| Topic: |
Science > Physics |
| User: |
"Mike" |
| Date: |
23 Oct 2005 07:36:16 AM |
| Object: |
Cracking the Code of Pre-Earthquake Signals |
http://www.space.com/searchforlife/seti_freund_quakes_051020.html
"In figure 1, a 1.2-meter long slab of granite which, together with my
coworkers Dr. Akihiro Takeuchi and Dr. Bobby Lau, I had fitted with
copper electrodes at both ends to measure currents and with a capacitor
plate on the top surface to measure potentials. We inserted one end of
the slab into a powerful press, but insulated it from the pistons.
Then, we started to squeeze. We squeezed the rock many times and
recorded the currents that started to flow out of both ends.
The experiment showed that the stressed volume of rock becomes a source
of electronic charge carriers, p-holes and electrons. Since p-holes and
electrons flow out in opposite directions, something important must
happen at the boundary between the stressed and unstressed rock. The
boundary allows p-holes to pass but blocks electrons. It therefore acts
like a diode in a transistor. Obviously the unstressed granite is
capable of conducting p-holes, meaning that it behaves like a p-type
semiconductor. The electrons can flow out of the stressed rock volume
only if there is an n-type connection - in our case the copper
electrode.
Next we may wonder how long such currents can flow if we keep the load
constant. We did a similar stress test with gabbro, another igneous
rock. Upon keeping the load constant for 30 minutes, the two currents
flow with barely any loss in their intensities. Even keeping the load
constant for 12 hours leads to not more than a 15-20% reduction of the
currents. This shows that, once activated, the p-holes and electrons in
the stressed rock volume have a very long lifetime.
Use for earthquake prediction" (See link)
http://www.space.com/searchforlife/seti_freund_quakes_051020.html
--Mike Jr.
.
|
|
| User: "Mike" |
|
| Title: Re: Cracking the Code of Pre-Earthquake Signals |
23 Oct 2005 09:48:25 AM |
|
|
Mike wrote:
http://www.space.com/searchforlife/seti_freund_quakes_051020.html
"In figure 1, a 1.2-meter long slab of granite which, together with my
coworkers Dr. Akihiro Takeuchi and Dr. Bobby Lau, I had fitted with
copper electrodes at both ends to measure currents and with a capacitor
plate on the top surface to measure potentials. We inserted one end of
the slab into a powerful press, but insulated it from the pistons.
Then, we started to squeeze. We squeezed the rock many times and
recorded the currents that started to flow out of both ends.
The experiment showed that the stressed volume of rock becomes a source
of electronic charge carriers, p-holes and electrons. Since p-holes and
electrons flow out in opposite directions, something important must
happen at the boundary between the stressed and unstressed rock. The
boundary allows p-holes to pass but blocks electrons. It therefore acts
like a diode in a transistor. Obviously the unstressed granite is
capable of conducting p-holes, meaning that it behaves like a p-type
semiconductor. The electrons can flow out of the stressed rock volume
only if there is an n-type connection - in our case the copper
electrode.
Next we may wonder how long such currents can flow if we keep the load
constant. We did a similar stress test with gabbro, another igneous
rock. Upon keeping the load constant for 30 minutes, the two currents
flow with barely any loss in their intensities. Even keeping the load
constant for 12 hours leads to not more than a 15-20% reduction of the
currents. This shows that, once activated, the p-holes and electrons in
the stressed rock volume have a very long lifetime.
Use for earthquake prediction" (See link)
http://www.space.com/searchforlife/seti_freund_quakes_051020.html
--Mike Jr.
The linked article also states,
"For instance, taking the currents flowing out of the squeezed end of
the granite slab in our experiment, we may ask what would be the
current flowing out of a cubic kilometer of granite or gabbro in the
crust, all other conditions being the same. The answer is a
surprisingly large value, somewhere between 100,000 and 1,000,000
amperes. Since huge volumes of rocks - tens of thousands of cubic
kilometers - come under increasing stress during the build-up of
large earthquakes, the ground currents could indeed be enormous.
Looking at it from a different perspective, we can say that, even if
most of the currents generated in the ground are short-circuited or
annihilated by other factors, those that remain might still reach
impressively large values."
It occurred to me after I posted this link that the average lightning
strike carries from 30 to 300 kiloamperes, if only briefly. That is,
one cubic kilometer of stressed granite generates 100 to 1,000
kiloamperes over a sustained period of time. There are many cubic
kilometers of stressed rock in California so that is a lot of current.
Does anybody know what kind of voltage would be backing that current?
I wonder if all that current could be practically tapped for electric
power....
--Mike Jr.
.
|
|
|
| User: "hanson" |
|
| Title: Re: Cracking the Code of Pre-Earthquake Signals |
23 Oct 2005 10:05:42 AM |
|
|
Mike, this info is certainly interesting, but I must have missed in
the article the common observation that the night sky begins to
glow quite brightly over stressed area a few minutes before the
quake hits... kinda like a vast, piezo electrically powered LED...
505,000 hits for === earthquake glow === ....
ahahaha... ahahahahanson
"Mike" <n00spam@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:1130078905.809725.239300@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
& in http://www.space.com/searchforlife/seti_freund_quakes_051020.html
"In figure 1, a 1.2-meter long slab of granite which, together with my
coworkers Dr. Akihiro Takeuchi and Dr. Bobby Lau, I had fitted with
copper electrodes at both ends to measure currents and with a capacitor
plate on the top surface to measure potentials. We inserted one end of
the slab into a powerful press, but insulated it from the pistons.
Then, we started to squeeze. We squeezed the rock many times and
recorded the currents that started to flow out of both ends.
The experiment showed that the stressed volume of rock becomes a source
of electronic charge carriers, p-holes and electrons. Since p-holes and
electrons flow out in opposite directions, something important must
happen at the boundary between the stressed and unstressed rock. The
boundary allows p-holes to pass but blocks electrons. It therefore acts
like a diode in a transistor. Obviously the unstressed granite is
capable of conducting p-holes, meaning that it behaves like a p-type
semiconductor. The electrons can flow out of the stressed rock volume
only if there is an n-type connection - in our case the copper
electrode.
Next we may wonder how long such currents can flow if we keep the load
constant. We did a similar stress test with gabbro, another igneous
rock. Upon keeping the load constant for 30 minutes, the two currents
flow with barely any loss in their intensities. Even keeping the load
constant for 12 hours leads to not more than a 15-20% reduction of the
currents. This shows that, once activated, the p-holes and electrons in
the stressed rock volume have a very long lifetime.
Use for earthquake prediction" (See link)
http://www.space.com/searchforlife/seti_freund_quakes_051020.html
--Mike Jr.
The linked article also states,
"For instance, taking the currents flowing out of the squeezed end of
the granite slab in our experiment, we may ask what would be the
current flowing out of a cubic kilometer of granite or gabbro in the
crust, all other conditions being the same. The answer is a
surprisingly large value, somewhere between 100,000 and 1,000,000
amperes. Since huge volumes of rocks - tens of thousands of cubic
kilometers - come under increasing stress during the build-up of
large earthquakes, the ground currents could indeed be enormous.
Looking at it from a different perspective, we can say that, even if
most of the currents generated in the ground are short-circuited or
annihilated by other factors, those that remain might still reach
impressively large values."
It occurred to me after I posted this link that the average lightning
strike carries from 30 to 300 kiloamperes, if only briefly. That is,
one cubic kilometer of stressed granite generates 100 to 1,000
kiloamperes over a sustained period of time. There are many cubic
kilometers of stressed rock in California so that is a lot of current.
Does anybody know what kind of voltage would be backing that current?
I wonder if all that current could be practically tapped for electric
power....
--Mike Jr.
.
|
|
|
| User: "paul v birke" |
|
| Title: Re: Cracking the Code of Pre-Earthquake Signals |
23 Oct 2005 10:19:56 AM |
|
|
Dear Hanson
Dr Persinger and others have been looking at his for years
see
http://www.keelynet.com/ufo/earthlgt.txt
Paul (EE)
hanson wrote:
Mike, this info is certainly interesting, but I must have missed in
the article the common observation that the night sky begins to
glow quite brightly over stressed area a few minutes before the
quake hits... kinda like a vast, piezo electrically powered LED...
505,000 hits for === earthquake glow === ....
ahahaha... ahahahahanson
"Mike" <n00spam@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:1130078905.809725.239300@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
& in http://www.space.com/searchforlife/seti_freund_quakes_051020.html
"In figure 1, a 1.2-meter long slab of granite which, together with my
coworkers Dr. Akihiro Takeuchi and Dr. Bobby Lau, I had fitted with
copper electrodes at both ends to measure currents and with a capacitor
plate on the top surface to measure potentials. We inserted one end of
the slab into a powerful press, but insulated it from the pistons.
Then, we started to squeeze. We squeezed the rock many times and
recorded the currents that started to flow out of both ends.
The experiment showed that the stressed volume of rock becomes a source
of electronic charge carriers, p-holes and electrons. Since p-holes and
electrons flow out in opposite directions, something important must
happen at the boundary between the stressed and unstressed rock. The
boundary allows p-holes to pass but blocks electrons. It therefore acts
like a diode in a transistor. Obviously the unstressed granite is
capable of conducting p-holes, meaning that it behaves like a p-type
semiconductor. The electrons can flow out of the stressed rock volume
only if there is an n-type connection - in our case the copper
electrode.
Next we may wonder how long such currents can flow if we keep the load
constant. We did a similar stress test with gabbro, another igneous
rock. Upon keeping the load constant for 30 minutes, the two currents
flow with barely any loss in their intensities. Even keeping the load
constant for 12 hours leads to not more than a 15-20% reduction of the
currents. This shows that, once activated, the p-holes and electrons in
the stressed rock volume have a very long lifetime.
Use for earthquake prediction" (See link)
http://www.space.com/searchforlife/seti_freund_quakes_051020.html
--Mike Jr.
The linked article also states,
"For instance, taking the currents flowing out of the squeezed end of
the granite slab in our experiment, we may ask what would be the
current flowing out of a cubic kilometer of granite or gabbro in the
crust, all other conditions being the same. The answer is a
surprisingly large value, somewhere between 100,000 and 1,000,000
amperes. Since huge volumes of rocks - tens of thousands of cubic
kilometers - come under increasing stress during the build-up of
large earthquakes, the ground currents could indeed be enormous.
Looking at it from a different perspective, we can say that, even if
most of the currents generated in the ground are short-circuited or
annihilated by other factors, those that remain might still reach
impressively large values."
It occurred to me after I posted this link that the average lightning
strike carries from 30 to 300 kiloamperes, if only briefly. That is,
one cubic kilometer of stressed granite generates 100 to 1,000
kiloamperes over a sustained period of time. There are many cubic
kilometers of stressed rock in California so that is a lot of current.
Does anybody know what kind of voltage would be backing that current?
I wonder if all that current could be practically tapped for electric
power....
--Mike Jr.
.
|
|
|
| User: "hanson" |
|
| Title: Re: Cracking the Code of Pre-Earthquake Signals |
23 Oct 2005 11:21:34 AM |
|
|
ahahaha... yeah, but I don't think that very many of these
505'000 websites are into UFOs, nor do they interpret that
earthquakes are the results of UFO actions... but then
who knows, mystics, religious folks and environmentalists
do see such and believe in stuff like that all the time....
Thanks for the laughs, Paul.... ahahaha....hahahahanson
"paul v birke" <nonlinear@rogers.com> wrote in message
news:hOydnZ91EPiKN8benZ2dnUVZ_tKdnZ2d@rogers.com...
Dear Hanson
Dr Persinger and others have been looking at his for years
see http://www.keelynet.com/ufo/earthlgt.txt
Paul (EE)
hanson wrote:
Mike, this info is certainly interesting, but I must have missed in
the article the common observation that the night sky begins to
glow quite brightly over stressed area a few minutes before the
quake hits... kinda like a vast, piezo electrically powered LED...
505,000 hits for === earthquake glow === ....
ahahaha... ahahahahanson
"Mike" <n00spam@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:1130078905.809725.239300@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
& in http://www.space.com/searchforlife/seti_freund_quakes_051020.html
"In figure 1, a 1.2-meter long slab of granite which, together with my
coworkers Dr. Akihiro Takeuchi and Dr. Bobby Lau, I had fitted with
copper electrodes at both ends to measure currents and with a capacitor
plate on the top surface to measure potentials. We inserted one end of
the slab into a powerful press, but insulated it from the pistons.
Then, we started to squeeze. We squeezed the rock many times and
recorded the currents that started to flow out of both ends.
The experiment showed that the stressed volume of rock becomes a source
of electronic charge carriers, p-holes and electrons. Since p-holes and
electrons flow out in opposite directions, something important must
happen at the boundary between the stressed and unstressed rock. The
boundary allows p-holes to pass but blocks electrons. It therefore acts
like a diode in a transistor. Obviously the unstressed granite is
capable of conducting p-holes, meaning that it behaves like a p-type
semiconductor. The electrons can flow out of the stressed rock volume
only if there is an n-type connection - in our case the copper
electrode.
Next we may wonder how long such currents can flow if we keep the load
constant. We did a similar stress test with gabbro, another igneous
rock. Upon keeping the load constant for 30 minutes, the two currents
flow with barely any loss in their intensities. Even keeping the load
constant for 12 hours leads to not more than a 15-20% reduction of the
currents. This shows that, once activated, the p-holes and electrons in
the stressed rock volume have a very long lifetime.
Use for earthquake prediction" (See link)
http://www.space.com/searchforlife/seti_freund_quakes_051020.html
--Mike Jr.
The linked article also states,
"For instance, taking the currents flowing out of the squeezed end of
the granite slab in our experiment, we may ask what would be the
current flowing out of a cubic kilometer of granite or gabbro in the
crust, all other conditions being the same. The answer is a
surprisingly large value, somewhere between 100,000 and 1,000,000
amperes. Since huge volumes of rocks - tens of thousands of cubic
kilometers - come under increasing stress during the build-up of
large earthquakes, the ground currents could indeed be enormous.
Looking at it from a different perspective, we can say that, even if
most of the currents generated in the ground are short-circuited or
annihilated by other factors, those that remain might still reach
impressively large values."
It occurred to me after I posted this link that the average lightning
strike carries from 30 to 300 kiloamperes, if only briefly. That is,
one cubic kilometer of stressed granite generates 100 to 1,000
kiloamperes over a sustained period of time. There are many cubic
kilometers of stressed rock in California so that is a lot of current.
Does anybody know what kind of voltage would be backing that current?
I wonder if all that current could be practically tapped for electric
power....
--Mike Jr.
.
|
|
|
| User: "paul v birke" |
|
| Title: Re: Cracking the Code of Pre-Earthquake Signals |
23 Oct 2005 02:44:54 PM |
|
|
H
In fact it was the reverse, the lights from the dyanmic E field above
the stressed rocks were being confused as UFOs --especially in the good
Dr.'s mind!
P
hanson wrote:
ahahaha... yeah, but I don't think that very many of these
505'000 websites are into UFOs, nor do they interpret that
earthquakes are the results of UFO actions... but then
who knows, mystics, religious folks and environmentalists
do see such and believe in stuff like that all the time....
Thanks for the laughs, Paul.... ahahaha....hahahahanson
"paul v birke" <nonlinear@rogers.com> wrote in message
news:hOydnZ91EPiKN8benZ2dnUVZ_tKdnZ2d@rogers.com...
Dear Hanson
Dr Persinger and others have been looking at his for years
see http://www.keelynet.com/ufo/earthlgt.txt
Paul (EE)
hanson wrote:
Mike, this info is certainly interesting, but I must have missed in
the article the common observation that the night sky begins to
glow quite brightly over stressed area a few minutes before the
quake hits... kinda like a vast, piezo electrically powered LED...
505,000 hits for === earthquake glow === ....
ahahaha... ahahahahanson
"Mike" <n00spam@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:1130078905.809725.239300@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
& in http://www.space.com/searchforlife/seti_freund_quakes_051020.html
"In figure 1, a 1.2-meter long slab of granite which, together with my
coworkers Dr. Akihiro Takeuchi and Dr. Bobby Lau, I had fitted with
copper electrodes at both ends to measure currents and with a capacitor
plate on the top surface to measure potentials. We inserted one end of
the slab into a powerful press, but insulated it from the pistons.
Then, we started to squeeze. We squeezed the rock many times and
recorded the currents that started to flow out of both ends.
The experiment showed that the stressed volume of rock becomes a source
of electronic charge carriers, p-holes and electrons. Since p-holes and
electrons flow out in opposite directions, something important must
happen at the boundary between the stressed and unstressed rock. The
boundary allows p-holes to pass but blocks electrons. It therefore acts
like a diode in a transistor. Obviously the unstressed granite is
capable of conducting p-holes, meaning that it behaves like a p-type
semiconductor. The electrons can flow out of the stressed rock volume
only if there is an n-type connection - in our case the copper
electrode.
Next we may wonder how long such currents can flow if we keep the load
constant. We did a similar stress test with gabbro, another igneous
rock. Upon keeping the load constant for 30 minutes, the two currents
flow with barely any loss in their intensities. Even keeping the load
constant for 12 hours leads to not more than a 15-20% reduction of the
currents. This shows that, once activated, the p-holes and electrons in
the stressed rock volume have a very long lifetime.
Use for earthquake prediction" (See link)
http://www.space.com/searchforlife/seti_freund_quakes_051020.html
--Mike Jr.
The linked article also states,
"For instance, taking the currents flowing out of the squeezed end of
the granite slab in our experiment, we may ask what would be the
current flowing out of a cubic kilometer of granite or gabbro in the
crust, all other conditions being the same. The answer is a
surprisingly large value, somewhere between 100,000 and 1,000,000
amperes. Since huge volumes of rocks - tens of thousands of cubic
kilometers - come under increasing stress during the build-up of
large earthquakes, the ground currents could indeed be enormous.
Looking at it from a different perspective, we can say that, even if
most of the currents generated in the ground are short-circuited or
annihilated by other factors, those that remain might still reach
impressively large values."
It occurred to me after I posted this link that the average lightning
strike carries from 30 to 300 kiloamperes, if only briefly. That is,
one cubic kilometer of stressed granite generates 100 to 1,000
kiloamperes over a sustained period of time. There are many cubic
kilometers of stressed rock in California so that is a lot of current.
Does anybody know what kind of voltage would be backing that current?
I wonder if all that current could be practically tapped for electric
power....
--Mike Jr.
.
|
|
|
| User: "hanson" |
|
| Title: Re: Cracking the Code of Pre-Earthquake Signals |
23 Oct 2005 06:20:29 PM |
|
|
"Mike" <n00spam@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:1130078905.809725.239300@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
& in http://www.space.com/searchforlife/seti_freund_quakes_051020.html
[hanson@quick.net]
wrote in news:aFN6f.11058$Io4.1712@trnddc06...
Mike, this info is certainly interesting, but I must have missed in
the article the common observation that the night sky begins to
glow quite brightly over stressed area a few minutes before the
quake hits... kinda like a vast, piezo electrically powered LED...
505,000 hits for === earthquake glow === ....
ahahaha... ahahahahanson
["paul v birke"]
<nonlinear@rogers.com> wrote in message
news:hOydnZ91EPiKN8benZ2dnUVZ_tKdnZ2d@rogers.com...
Dr Persinger and others have been looking at his for years
see http://www.keelynet.com/ufo/earthlgt.txt
Paul (EE)
[hanson]
wrote in: news:iMO6f.6643$hP6.344@trnddc05...
ahahaha... yeah, but I don't think that very many of these
505'000 websites are into UFOs, nor do they interpret that
earthquakes are the results of UFO actions... but then
who knows, mystics, religious folks and environmentalists
do see such and believe in stuff like that all the time....
Thanks for the laughs, Paul.... ahahaha....hahahahanson
["paul v birke"]
wrote in news:435BE836.6090602@rogers.com...
In fact it was the reverse, the lights from the dyanmic E field above
the stressed rocks were being confused as UFOs --especially
in the good Dr.'s mind!
P
[hanson]
OK, Paul if you insist. Never mind the UFO's. I'm not into that.
But you have pointed toward some interesting aspects of the
phenomena of the focused geo-piezo electrically produced
light spots. --- AFAIK it is very difficult to catch & photograph
the regular spread-out piezo night glow events before a quake
advent.
So, the question arises in your scenario:
[1] how does the intensity of the piezo E-field get concentrated/
focused so high above the earth that it shows up as a "spot"?...
What's the mechanism here? Moreover,
[2] if that is actually as you say it could be then how come that
there is not an almost continuous light-spot show going on over
Hollister or Parkfield CA and many other geo-histress locales?
Events like that would certainly have been noted long time ago
and places like that would have become sacred/holy sites.
[3] On your ref to Persinger et. al. I am more inclined to believe
that the light spots/dots in the sky (UFOs) have to do something
with the "sprites" that are of electro-aerial origin.
hanson
.
|
|
|
| User: "paul v birke" |
|
| Title: Re: Cracking the Code of Pre-Earthquake Signals |
23 Oct 2005 07:33:06 PM |
|
|
Dear H
Hey I am no expert here either
The field is active more or less above the surface and not way above if
I remember from some of the Dr's earlier musings.
You need something like quartz type rock so maybe your references to
Califonnia hold no water as this type not directly present below surface.
The spot type activity would show up due to the coincidence of the
quartz type rock constitution and the level of mechanical stress and
perhaps the level of the rate of change of stress, only a guess as to
the mechanizm.
I know nothing of the sprites, only the northerm lights we have way up
north caused more by the magnetic field and the cosmic rays.
btw the changing E field will induce a local B field from Maxwell and
maybe there is also some interaction with the local earth's magnetic
field thereby
P
hanson wrote:
"Mike" <n00spam@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:1130078905.809725.239300@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
& in http://www.space.com/searchforlife/seti_freund_quakes_051020.html
[hanson@quick.net]
wrote in news:aFN6f.11058$Io4.1712@trnddc06...
Mike, this info is certainly interesting, but I must have missed in
the article the common observation that the night sky begins to
glow quite brightly over stressed area a few minutes before the
quake hits... kinda like a vast, piezo electrically powered LED...
505,000 hits for === earthquake glow === ....
ahahaha... ahahahahanson
["paul v birke"]
<nonlinear@rogers.com> wrote in message
news:hOydnZ91EPiKN8benZ2dnUVZ_tKdnZ2d@rogers.com...
Dr Persinger and others have been looking at his for years
see http://www.keelynet.com/ufo/earthlgt.txt
Paul (EE)
[hanson]
wrote in: news:iMO6f.6643$hP6.344@trnddc05...
ahahaha... yeah, but I don't think that very many of these
505'000 websites are into UFOs, nor do they interpret that
earthquakes are the results of UFO actions... but then
who knows, mystics, religious folks and environmentalists
do see such and believe in stuff like that all the time....
Thanks for the laughs, Paul.... ahahaha....hahahahanson
["paul v birke"]
wrote in news:435BE836.6090602@rogers.com...
In fact it was the reverse, the lights from the dyanmic E field above
the stressed rocks were being confused as UFOs --especially
in the good Dr.'s mind!
P
[hanson]
OK, Paul if you insist. Never mind the UFO's. I'm not into that.
But you have pointed toward some interesting aspects of the
phenomena of the focused geo-piezo electrically produced
light spots. --- AFAIK it is very difficult to catch & photograph
the regular spread-out piezo night glow events before a quake
advent.
So, the question arises in your scenario:
[1] how does the intensity of the piezo E-field get concentrated/
focused so high above the earth that it shows up as a "spot"?...
What's the mechanism here? Moreover,
[2] if that is actually as you say it could be then how come that
there is not an almost continuous light-spot show going on over
Hollister or Parkfield CA and many other geo-histress locales?
Events like that would certainly have been noted long time ago
and places like that would have become sacred/holy sites.
[3] On your ref to Persinger et. al. I am more inclined to believe
that the light spots/dots in the sky (UFOs) have to do something
with the "sprites" that are of electro-aerial origin.
hanson
.
|
|
|
| User: "Mike" |
|
| Title: Re: Cracking the Code of Pre-Earthquake Signals |
23 Oct 2005 07:47:16 PM |
|
|
paul v birke wrote:
Dear H
Hey I am no expert here either
The field is active more or less above the surface and not way above if
I remember from some of the Dr's earlier musings.
You need something like quartz type rock
Granite works just fine. Reread the article to understand the
mechanism at work here.
"Electrical rocks
We normally think of rocks as being good insulators, i.e., rocks are
very poor at conducting electrical currents. However, in rocks whose
minerals contain peroxy bonds, a time bomb is ticking. When these rocks
are subjected to stress, the peroxy bonds break and suddenly mobile
electronic charge carriers appear, so-called defect electrons that live
and travel in the valence band of the constituent minerals. These
charge carriers are also called positive holes or p-holes for short."
so maybe your references to
Califonnia hold no water as this type not directly present below surface.
The spot type activity would show up due to the coincidence of the
quartz type rock constitution and the level of mechanical stress and
perhaps the level of the rate of change of stress, only a guess as to
the mechanizm.
I know nothing of the sprites, only the northerm lights we have way up
north caused more by the magnetic field and the cosmic rays.
btw the changing E field will induce a local B field from Maxwell and
maybe there is also some interaction with the local earth's magnetic
field thereby
P
hanson wrote:
"Mike" <n00spam@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:1130078905.809725.239300@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
& in http://www.space.com/searchforlife/seti_freund_quakes_051020.html
[hanson@quick.net]
wrote in news:aFN6f.11058$Io4.1712@trnddc06...
Mike, this info is certainly interesting, but I must have missed in
the article the common observation that the night sky begins to
glow quite brightly over stressed area a few minutes before the
quake hits... kinda like a vast, piezo electrically powered LED...
505,000 hits for === earthquake glow === ....
ahahaha... ahahahahanson
["paul v birke"]
<nonlinear@rogers.com> wrote in message
news:hOydnZ91EPiKN8benZ2dnUVZ_tKdnZ2d@rogers.com...
Dr Persinger and others have been looking at his for years
see http://www.keelynet.com/ufo/earthlgt.txt
Paul (EE)
[hanson]
wrote in: news:iMO6f.6643$hP6.344@trnddc05...
ahahaha... yeah, but I don't think that very many of these
505'000 websites are into UFOs, nor do they interpret that
earthquakes are the results of UFO actions... but then
who knows, mystics, religious folks and environmentalists
do see such and believe in stuff like that all the time....
Thanks for the laughs, Paul.... ahahaha....hahahahanson
["paul v birke"]
wrote in news:435BE836.6090602@rogers.com...
In fact it was the reverse, the lights from the dyanmic E field above
the stressed rocks were being confused as UFOs --especially
in the good Dr.'s mind!
P
[hanson]
OK, Paul if you insist. Never mind the UFO's. I'm not into that.
But you have pointed toward some interesting aspects of the
phenomena of the focused geo-piezo electrically produced
light spots. --- AFAIK it is very difficult to catch & photograph
the regular spread-out piezo night glow events before a quake
advent.
So, the question arises in your scenario:
[1] how does the intensity of the piezo E-field get concentrated/
focused so high above the earth that it shows up as a "spot"?...
What's the mechanism here? Moreover,
[2] if that is actually as you say it could be then how come that
there is not an almost continuous light-spot show going on over
Hollister or Parkfield CA and many other geo-histress locales?
Events like that would certainly have been noted long time ago
and places like that would have become sacred/holy sites.
[3] On your ref to Persinger et. al. I am more inclined to believe
that the light spots/dots in the sky (UFOs) have to do something
with the "sprites" that are of electro-aerial origin.
hanson
.
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| User: "paul v birke" |
|
| Title: Re: Cracking the Code of Pre-Earthquake Signals |
23 Oct 2005 08:04:02 PM |
|
|
M
Granite contains quartz and it is this that exhibits Piezoelectric
effects. BTW this effect is reversible leading to actuators.
P
Mike wrote:
paul v birke wrote:
Dear H
Hey I am no expert here either
The field is active more or less above the surface and not way above if
I remember from some of the Dr's earlier musings.
You need something like quartz type rock
Granite works just fine. Reread the article to understand the
mechanism at work here.
"Electrical rocks
We normally think of rocks as being good insulators, i.e., rocks are
very poor at conducting electrical currents. However, in rocks whose
minerals contain peroxy bonds, a time bomb is ticking. When these rocks
are subjected to stress, the peroxy bonds break and suddenly mobile
electronic charge carriers appear, so-called defect electrons that live
and travel in the valence band of the constituent minerals. These
charge carriers are also called positive holes or p-holes for short."
so maybe your references to
Califonnia hold no water as this type not directly present below surface.
The spot type activity would show up due to the coincidence of the
quartz type rock constitution and the level of mechanical stress and
perhaps the level of the rate of change of stress, only a guess as to
the mechanizm.
I know nothing of the sprites, only the northerm lights we have way up
north caused more by the magnetic field and the cosmic rays.
btw the changing E field will induce a local B field from Maxwell and
maybe there is also some interaction with the local earth's magnetic
field thereby
P
hanson wrote:
"Mike" <n00spam@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:1130078905.809725.239300@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
& in http://www.space.com/searchforlife/seti_freund_quakes_051020.html
[hanson@quick.net]
wrote in news:aFN6f.11058$Io4.1712@trnddc06...
Mike, this info is certainly interesting, but I must have missed in
the article the common observation that the night sky begins to
glow quite brightly over stressed area a few minutes before the
quake hits... kinda like a vast, piezo electrically powered LED...
505,000 hits for === earthquake glow === ....
ahahaha... ahahahahanson
["paul v birke"]
<nonlinear@rogers.com> wrote in message
news:hOydnZ91EPiKN8benZ2dnUVZ_tKdnZ2d@rogers.com...
Dr Persinger and others have been looking at his for years
see http://www.keelynet.com/ufo/earthlgt.txt
Paul (EE)
[hanson]
wrote in: news:iMO6f.6643$hP6.344@trnddc05...
ahahaha... yeah, but I don't think that very many of these
505'000 websites are into UFOs, nor do they interpret that
earthquakes are the results of UFO actions... but then
who knows, mystics, religious folks and environmentalists
do see such and believe in stuff like that all the time....
Thanks for the laughs, Paul.... ahahaha....hahahahanson
["paul v birke"]
wrote in news:435BE836.6090602@rogers.com...
In fact it was the reverse, the lights from the dyanmic E field above
the stressed rocks were being confused as UFOs --especially
in the good Dr.'s mind!
P
[hanson]
OK, Paul if you insist. Never mind the UFO's. I'm not into that.
But you have pointed toward some interesting aspects of the
phenomena of the focused geo-piezo electrically produced
light spots. --- AFAIK it is very difficult to catch & photograph
the regular spread-out piezo night glow events before a quake
advent.
So, the question arises in your scenario:
[1] how does the intensity of the piezo E-field get concentrated/
focused so high above the earth that it shows up as a "spot"?...
What's the mechanism here? Moreover,
[2] if that is actually as you say it could be then how come that
there is not an almost continuous light-spot show going on over
Hollister or Parkfield CA and many other geo-histress locales?
Events like that would certainly have been noted long time ago
and places like that would have become sacred/holy sites.
[3] On your ref to Persinger et. al. I am more inclined to believe
that the light spots/dots in the sky (UFOs) have to do something
with the "sprites" that are of electro-aerial origin.
hanson
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "paul v birke" |
|
| Title: Re: Cracking the Code of Pre-Earthquake Signals |
23 Oct 2005 07:51:41 PM |
|
|
Mike we are talking about the projection of the E field above the rocks,
not about charge actually flowing. Think of the rocks as the top edge
of a giant capacitor, so you get a side field from the fringing field
into the vertical space above it. It could extend hundreds of feet above.
P
Mike wrote:
paul v birke wrote:
Dear H
Hey I am no expert here either
The field is active more or less above the surface and not way above if
I remember from some of the Dr's earlier musings.
You need something like quartz type rock
Granite works just fine. Reread the article to understand the
mechanism at work here.
"Electrical rocks
We normally think of rocks as being good insulators, i.e., rocks are
very poor at conducting electrical currents. However, in rocks whose
minerals contain peroxy bonds, a time bomb is ticking. When these rocks
are subjected to stress, the peroxy bonds break and suddenly mobile
electronic charge carriers appear, so-called defect electrons that live
and travel in the valence band of the constituent minerals. These
charge carriers are also called positive holes or p-holes for short."
so maybe your references to
Califonnia hold no water as this type not directly present below surface.
The spot type activity would show up due to the coincidence of the
quartz type rock constitution and the level of mechanical stress and
perhaps the level of the rate of change of stress, only a guess as to
the mechanizm.
I know nothing of the sprites, only the northerm lights we have way up
north caused more by the magnetic field and the cosmic rays.
btw the changing E field will induce a local B field from Maxwell and
maybe there is also some interaction with the local earth's magnetic
field thereby
P
hanson wrote:
"Mike" <n00spam@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:1130078905.809725.239300@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
& in http://www.space.com/searchforlife/seti_freund_quakes_051020.html
[hanson@quick.net]
wrote in news:aFN6f.11058$Io4.1712@trnddc06...
Mike, this info is certainly interesting, but I must have missed in
the article the common observation that the night sky begins to
glow quite brightly over stressed area a few minutes before the
quake hits... kinda like a vast, piezo electrically powered LED...
505,000 hits for === earthquake glow === ....
ahahaha... ahahahahanson
["paul v birke"]
<nonlinear@rogers.com> wrote in message
news:hOydnZ91EPiKN8benZ2dnUVZ_tKdnZ2d@rogers.com...
Dr Persinger and others have been looking at his for years
see http://www.keelynet.com/ufo/earthlgt.txt
Paul (EE)
[hanson]
wrote in: news:iMO6f.6643$hP6.344@trnddc05...
ahahaha... yeah, but I don't think that very many of these
505'000 websites are into UFOs, nor do they interpret that
earthquakes are the results of UFO actions... but then
who knows, mystics, religious folks and environmentalists
do see such and believe in stuff like that all the time....
Thanks for the laughs, Paul.... ahahaha....hahahahanson
["paul v birke"]
wrote in news:435BE836.6090602@rogers.com...
In fact it was the reverse, the lights from the dyanmic E field above
the stressed rocks were being confused as UFOs --especially
in the good Dr.'s mind!
P
[hanson]
OK, Paul if you insist. Never mind the UFO's. I'm not into that.
But you have pointed toward some interesting aspects of the
phenomena of the focused geo-piezo electrically produced
light spots. --- AFAIK it is very difficult to catch & photograph
the regular spread-out piezo night glow events before a quake
advent.
So, the question arises in your scenario:
[1] how does the intensity of the piezo E-field get concentrated/
focused so high above the earth that it shows up as a "spot"?...
What's the mechanism here? Moreover,
[2] if that is actually as you say it could be then how come that
there is not an almost continuous light-spot show going on over
Hollister or Parkfield CA and many other geo-histress locales?
Events like that would certainly have been noted long time ago
and places like that would have become sacred/holy sites.
[3] On your ref to Persinger et. al. I am more inclined to believe
that the light spots/dots in the sky (UFOs) have to do something
with the "sprites" that are of electro-aerial origin.
hanson
.
|
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| User: "Mike" |
|
| Title: Re: Cracking the Code of Pre-Earthquake Signals |
23 Oct 2005 07:41:45 PM |
|
|
hanson wrote:
"Mike" <n00spam@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:1130078905.809725.239300@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
& in http://www.space.com/searchforlife/seti_freund_quakes_051020.html
[hanson@quick.net]
wrote in news:aFN6f.11058$Io4.1712@trnddc06...
Mike, this info is certainly interesting, but I must have missed in
the article the common observation that the night sky begins to
glow quite brightly over stressed area a few minutes before the
quake hits... kinda like a vast, piezo electrically powered LED...
505,000 hits for === earthquake glow === ....
ahahaha... ahahahahanson
["paul v birke"]
<nonlinear@rogers.com> wrote in message
news:hOydnZ91EPiKN8benZ2dnUVZ_tKdnZ2d@rogers.com...
Dr Persinger and others have been looking at his for years
see http://www.keelynet.com/ufo/earthlgt.txt
Paul (EE)
[hanson]
wrote in: news:iMO6f.6643$hP6.344@trnddc05...
ahahaha... yeah, but I don't think that very many of these
505'000 websites are into UFOs, nor do they interpret that
earthquakes are the results of UFO actions... but then
who knows, mystics, religious folks and environmentalists
do see such and believe in stuff like that all the time....
Thanks for the laughs, Paul.... ahahaha....hahahahanson
["paul v birke"]
wrote in news:435BE836.6090602@rogers.com...
In fact it was the reverse, the lights from the dyanmic E field above
the stressed rocks were being confused as UFOs --especially
in the good Dr.'s mind!
P
[hanson]
OK, Paul if you insist. Never mind the UFO's. I'm not into that.
But you have pointed toward some interesting aspects of the
phenomena of the focused geo-piezo electrically produced
light spots. --- AFAIK it is very difficult to catch & photograph
the regular spread-out piezo night glow events before a quake
advent.
So, the question arises in your scenario:
[1] how does the intensity of the piezo E-field get concentrated/
focused so high above the earth that it shows up as a "spot"?...
What's the mechanism here? Moreover,
[2] if that is actually as you say it could be then how come that
there is not an almost continuous light-spot show going on over
Hollister or Parkfield CA and many other geo-histress locales?
Events like that would certainly have been noted long time ago
and places like that would have become sacred/holy sites.
[3] On your ref to Persinger et. al. I am more inclined to believe
that the light spots/dots in the sky (UFOs) have to do something
with the "sprites" that are of electro-aerial origin.
hanson
Gentlemen,
Don't you think that if there is current flow many orders of magnitude
greater than 1,000 kiloampers that perhaps this current could be
directly measured? Atmospheric effects are interesting in their own
right but why not go directly after the source?
BTW, does the possibility of harnessing this current flow to directly
feed the electric power grid tweak any interest?
--Mike Jr.
.
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| User: "paul v birke" |
|
| Title: Re: Cracking the Code of Pre-Earthquake Signals |
23 Oct 2005 07:48:20 PM |
|
|
Dear M
Mike a glow is a localized phenomenon with no great flow of current
It is more like a state and photons are emitted to indicate the state
It is like a glowing cloud, an island 3D state if you want
what up with the current re this discussion
P
Mike wrote:
hanson wrote:
"Mike" <n00spam@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:1130078905.809725.239300@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
& in http://www.space.com/searchforlife/seti_freund_quakes_051020.html
[hanson@quick.net]
wrote in news:aFN6f.11058$Io4.1712@trnddc06...
Mike, this info is certainly interesting, but I must have missed in
the article the common observation that the night sky begins to
glow quite brightly over stressed area a few minutes before the
quake hits... kinda like a vast, piezo electrically powered LED...
505,000 hits for === earthquake glow === ....
ahahaha... ahahahahanson
["paul v birke"]
<nonlinear@rogers.com> wrote in message
news:hOydnZ91EPiKN8benZ2dnUVZ_tKdnZ2d@rogers.com...
Dr Persinger and others have been looking at his for years
see http://www.keelynet.com/ufo/earthlgt.txt
Paul (EE)
[hanson]
wrote in: news:iMO6f.6643$hP6.344@trnddc05...
ahahaha... yeah, but I don't think that very many of these
505'000 websites are into UFOs, nor do they interpret that
earthquakes are the results of UFO actions... but then
who knows, mystics, religious folks and environmentalists
do see such and believe in stuff like that all the time....
Thanks for the laughs, Paul.... ahahaha....hahahahanson
["paul v birke"]
wrote in news:435BE836.6090602@rogers.com...
In fact it was the reverse, the lights from the dyanmic E field above
the stressed rocks were being confused as UFOs --especially
in the good Dr.'s mind!
P
[hanson]
OK, Paul if you insist. Never mind the UFO's. I'm not into that.
But you have pointed toward some interesting aspects of the
phenomena of the focused geo-piezo electrically produced
light spots. --- AFAIK it is very difficult to catch & photograph
the regular spread-out piezo night glow events before a quake
advent.
So, the question arises in your scenario:
[1] how does the intensity of the piezo E-field get concentrated/
focused so high above the earth that it shows up as a "spot"?...
What's the mechanism here? Moreover,
[2] if that is actually as you say it could be then how come that
there is not an almost continuous light-spot show going on over
Hollister or Parkfield CA and many other geo-histress locales?
Events like that would certainly have been noted long time ago
and places like that would have become sacred/holy sites.
[3] On your ref to Persinger et. al. I am more inclined to believe
that the light spots/dots in the sky (UFOs) have to do something
with the "sprites" that are of electro-aerial origin.
hanson
Gentlemen,
Don't you think that if there is current flow many orders of magnitude
greater than 1,000 kiloampers that perhaps this current could be
directly measured? Atmospheric effects are interesting in their own
right but why not go directly after the source?
BTW, does the possibility of harnessing this current flow to directly
feed the electric power grid tweak any interest?
--Mike Jr.
.
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|
|
|
|
| User: "paul v birke" |
|
| Title: Re: Cracking the Code of Pre-Earthquake Signals |
23 Oct 2005 08:01:53 PM |
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|
http://www.deprem.cs.itu.edu.tr/VAN_METHOD-laboratory.htm
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