| Topic: |
Science > Physics |
| User: |
"Ian Stirling" |
| Date: |
13 Oct 2003 10:24:37 AM |
| Object: |
Do windows get heavier during the day? |
As light passes through an object of refractive index >1, some
energy is stored in the object, due to the lower speed of light.
In principle, would this make the object heavier?
--
http://inquisitor.i.am/ | mailto:inquisitor@i.am | Ian Stirling.
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Acting is merely the art of stopping a large number of people from coughing
- Sir Ralph Richardson
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| User: "Richard Henry" |
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| Title: Re: Do windows get heavier during the day? |
13 Oct 2003 10:35:01 AM |
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"Ian Stirling" <root@mauve.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:bmeg3l$c0v$1$8300dec7@news.demon.co.uk...
As light passes through an object of refractive index >1, some
energy is stored in the object, due to the lower speed of light.
I did not know that!
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| User: "Constantine" |
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| Title: Re: Do windows get heavier during the day? |
14 Oct 2003 12:03:31 PM |
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"Ian Stirling" <root@mauve.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:bmeg3l$c0v$1$8300dec7@news.demon.co.uk...
As light passes through an object of refractive index >1, some
energy is stored in the object, due to the lower speed of light.
In principle, would this make the object heavier?
The speed of light is irrelevant. Some energy is absorbed, increasing the
temperature of the object. Since energy gravitates, you can say that the
mass of the object has increased. But try to work out the numbers for a
realistic example. The change will be so small, that you need a very
sophisticated experiment to observe it.
Kostas.
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| User: "Bruce D. Scott" |
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| Title: Re: Do windows get heavier during the day? |
14 Oct 2003 05:01:42 AM |
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Ian Stirling wrote:
|> As light passes through an object of refractive index >1, some
|> energy is stored in the object, due to the lower speed of light.
|> In principle, would this make the object heavier?
It usually occurs via scattering, which doesn't transfer energy in the
usual low energy limit. So the reflected plus transmitted light equals
the incident light...
--
cu,
Bruce
drift wave turbulence: http://www.rzg.mpg.de/~bds/
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| User: "Richard Tobin" |
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| Title: Re: Do windows get heavier during the day? |
13 Oct 2003 10:56:35 AM |
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In article <bmeg3l$c0v$1$8300dec7@news.demon.co.uk>,
Ian Stirling <root@mauve.demon.co.uk> wrote:
As light passes through an object of refractive index >1, some
energy is stored in the object, due to the lower speed of light.
In principle, would this make the object heavier?
What happens when the light passes out of the object?
-- Richard
--
Spam filter: to mail me from a .com/.net site, put my surname in the headers.
FreeBSD rules!
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Do windows get heavier during the day? |
13 Oct 2003 03:26:39 PM |
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In article <bmeg3l$c0v$1$8300dec7@news.demon.co.uk>, Ian Stirling <root@mauve.demon.co.uk> writes:
As light passes through an object of refractive index >1, some
energy is stored in the object, due to the lower speed of light.
No, why do you think so?
Mati Meron | "When you argue with a fool,
meron@cars.uchicago.edu | chances are he is doing just the same"
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| User: "Ian Stirling" |
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| Title: Re: Do windows get heavier during the day? |
13 Oct 2003 04:24:46 PM |
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wrote:
In article <bmeg3l$c0v$1$8300dec7@news.demon.co.uk>, Ian Stirling <root@mauve.demon.co.uk> writes:
As light passes through an object of refractive index >1, some
energy is stored in the object, due to the lower speed of light.
No, why do you think so?
Ok, stored is perhaps the wrong word.
Delayed?
--
http://inquisitor.i.am/ | mailto:inquisitor@i.am | Ian Stirling.
---------------------------+-------------------------+--------------------------
Two parrots sitting on a perch. One asks the other, "Can you smell fish?"
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| User: "tj Frazir" |
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| Title: Re: Do windows get heavier during the day? |
13 Oct 2003 06:56:20 PM |
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Conducted threw the window.
Only if it heats the window.
Theres not much energy exchanged in the window.
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| User: "MorituriMax" |
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| Title: Re: Do windows get heavier during the day? |
13 Oct 2003 09:28:09 PM |
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"tj Frazir" <GravityPhysics@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:24395-3F8B3BA4-335@storefull-2158.public.lawson.webtv.net...
Conducted.. .. ..
BS Filter Activated.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Do windows get heavier during the day? |
13 Oct 2003 04:35:30 PM |
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In article <bmf56t$e7a$2$830fa78d@news.demon.co.uk>, Ian Stirling <root@mauve.demon.co.uk> writes:
mmeron@cars3.uchicago.edu wrote:
In article <bmeg3l$c0v$1$8300dec7@news.demon.co.uk>, Ian Stirling <root@mauve.demon.co.uk> writes:
As light passes through an object of refractive index >1, some
energy is stored in the object, due to the lower speed of light.
No, why do you think so?
Ok, stored is perhaps the wrong word.
Delayed?
Or sped up?
You got a confusion about what is it that is being delayed here. What
we call "the speed of light in matter" is the speed of the
constant-phase surfaces. It has nothing, nada, zip to do with the
speed of photons, energy flow, information flow and the like.
Consider, it is quite common to have refractive index < 1.
So, no, no energy is stored in any place since no energy is taken out
(in steady state). The speed of the constant phase wavefront is
different than in vacuum, that's all.
Mati Meron | "When you argue with a fool,
meron@cars.uchicago.edu | chances are he is doing just the same"
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| User: "tj Frazir" |
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| Title: Re: Do windows get heavier during the day? |
13 Oct 2003 07:07:45 PM |
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Not all the light makes it threw te window.
Part is refelcted ,part is goin threw the turnstyals not reacting to
the electrons.
The photon can be absorbed refected and conducted at the same time .
try an xray ! It will pass threw if enouph energy is applied. But
the glass will get hot.
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| User: "MorituriMax" |
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| Title: Re: Do windows get heavier during the day? |
13 Oct 2003 09:27:51 PM |
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"tj Frazir" <GravityPhysics@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:24395-3F8B3E51-336@storefull-2158.public.lawson.webtv.net...
Not.. .. ..
BS and Uninterested Filter Activated.
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| User: "Timo Nieminen" |
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| Title: Re: Do windows get heavier during the day? |
13 Oct 2003 09:52:35 PM |
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On Mon, 13 Oct 2003, Ian Stirling wrote:
mmeron@cars3.uchicago.edu wrote:
In article <bmeg3l$c0v$1$8300dec7@news.demon.co.uk>, Ian Stirling <root@mauve.demon.co.uk> writes:
As light passes through an object of refractive index >1, some
energy is stored in the object, due to the lower speed of light.
No, why do you think so?
Ok, stored is perhaps the wrong word.
Delayed?
Stored seems a reasonable choice of word, since you're talking about the
energy of the induced polarisation.
But to answer the original question, presumably yes in principle (although
the main effect might be due to temperature increase), but, in practice,
no.
--
Timo Nieminen - Home page: http://www.physics.uq.edu.au/people/nieminen/
Shrine to Spirits: http://www.users.bigpond.com/timo_nieminen/spirits.html
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| User: "student" |
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| Title: Re: Do windows get heavier during the day? |
14 Oct 2003 04:36:43 AM |
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On Mon, 13 Oct 2003 15:24:37 +0000 (UTC), Ian Stirling <root@mauve.demon.co.uk> wrote:
As light passes through an object of refractive index >1, some
energy is stored in the object, due to the lower speed of light.
In principle, would this make the object heavier?
The light is slower because of the effect of polarization of bound charges
in the object -- the polarization takes energy, at least in the first
picosecond or so when the light impinges on the material, before it
reaches steady state...
So yes, I expect a tiny constant amount of energy to be stored in it.
--
http://inquisitor.i.am/ | mailto:inquisitor@i.am | Ian Stirling.
---------------------------+-------------------------+--------------------------
Acting is merely the art of stopping a large number of people from coughing
- Sir Ralph Richardson
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Do windows get heavier during the day? |
14 Oct 2003 11:39:29 AM |
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In article <LsPib.27298$X66.5517@twister.austin.rr.com>, (student) writes:
On Mon, 13 Oct 2003 15:24:37 +0000 (UTC), Ian Stirling <root@mauve.demon.co.uk> wrote:
As light passes through an object of refractive index >1, some
energy is stored in the object, due to the lower speed of light.
In principle, would this make the object heavier?
The light is slower because of the effect of polarization of bound charges
in the object -- the polarization takes energy, at least in the first
picosecond or so when the light impinges on the material, before it
reaches steady state...
So yes, I expect a tiny constant amount of energy to be stored in it.
When you've n < 1, this is also an effect of polarization and you've
also a tiny amount of energy stored till you get steady state.
*Nothing* to do with "slowing of the light".
Mati Meron | "When you argue with a fool,
meron@cars.uchicago.edu | chances are he is doing just the same"
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