| Topic: |
Science > Physics |
| User: |
"Nick" |
| Date: |
14 Jun 2005 11:19:24 PM |
| Object: |
If Time Ends At The Event Horizon* |
....then what is the time rate in a black hole?
Proper time cannot go any faster than the slowdown of time
in gravity.
If time ends it ends.
How then would time end and magically(!) restart? You can't have it
both ways you know.
Mitch Raemsch
-- Time moves forward: in all directions --
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| User: "*** rD" |
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| Title: Re: If Time Ends At The Event Horizon* |
15 Jun 2005 01:09:10 AM |
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"Nick" <macromitch@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1118809164.509785.191850@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
| ...then what is the time rate in a black hole?
Very slow I would guess
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| Proper time
Depends on your defintion and understanding of proper time.
| cannot go any faster than the slowdown of time
| in gravity.
Proper time might be defined as the average rates of a given area.
| If time ends it ends.
The longest wavelength is infinity and by defition this never ends.
| How then would time end and magically(!) restart?
Sub harmonics of infinity are one of its characteristics so short
wavelengths, fast frequencies, faster time rates appear from infinity just
as wavelets appear in waves in the sea.
--
D & R *** E-field = Electric field, M-field =Magnetic field, two unbound
field effects
http://home.freeuk.com/paulps/
Maybe updates. The spuds, beans and onions are coming up nicely. Ooh
ah.{:-)
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| User: "Nick" |
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| Title: Re: If Time Ends At The Event Horizon* |
15 Jun 2005 01:56:37 AM |
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rD, GR predicts that time ends; not just once but twice;
first at the event horizon and second at the singularity.
There are no ends to time and GR predicts its own downfall.
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| User: "*** rD" |
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| Title: Re: If Time Ends At The Event Horizon* |
15 Jun 2005 02:29:37 AM |
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"Nick" <macromitch@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1118818597.410186.221030@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
| rD, GR predicts that time ends; not just once but twice;
| first at the event horizon and second at the singularity.
|
| There are no ends to time and GR predicts its own downfall.
|
I think that possibly a misinterpretation of GR by you or the priests of
that religion. My interpretation might be "out of data error"
--
D & R *** E-field = Electric field, M-field =Magnetic field, two unbound
field effects
http://home.freeuk.com/paulps/
Maybe updates. The spuds, beans and onions are coming up nicely. Ooh
ah.{:-)
.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: If Time Ends At The Event Horizon* |
16 Jun 2005 10:05:05 PM |
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Nick wrote:
rD, GR predicts that time ends; not just once but twice;
first at the event horizon and second at the singularity.
There are no ends to time and GR predicts its own downfall.
I'm sure there are some undiscovered laws of physics preventing the
existence of singularities- A. McIntire
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| User: "Nick" |
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| Title: Re: If Time Ends At The Event Horizon* |
16 Jun 2005 10:31:54 PM |
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No horizons or singularities.
There are no black holes but there is an extreme of gravity.
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| User: "T Wake" |
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| Title: Re: If Time Ends At The Event Horizon* |
17 Jun 2005 08:03:53 AM |
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"Nick" <macromitch@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1118979114.336237.269190@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
No horizons or singularities.
Prove it. Show me the mathematics you have worked out to show they can't
exist.
You have told me a number of times the universe started as a singularity.
There are no black holes but there is an extreme of gravity.
Again, show me the mathematics and explain the difference.
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| User: "T Wake" |
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| Title: Re: If Time Ends At The Event Horizon* |
15 Jun 2005 03:24:21 PM |
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"Nick" <macromitch@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1118809164.509785.191850@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
...then what is the time rate in a black hole?
Proper time cannot go any faster than the slowdown of time
in gravity.
Is there really any point in people responding to your posts in anything but
a rude and patronising manner?
If time ends it ends.
Does it end everywhere at once?
How then would time end and magically(!) restart? You can't have it
both ways you know.
Why not? Why does it have to "magically" restart. Maybe your creator presses
the "go" button again. Easy enough. If you are (as I often suspect) a
software program, your "time" stops and starts magically everytime I reboot
my pc...........
Mitch Raemsch
-- Time moves forward: in all directions --
If it moves forward in all directions where is it moving from?
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| User: "Sue..." |
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| Title: Re: If Time Ends At The Event Horizon* |
18 Jun 2005 05:38:55 PM |
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If time ends at the event horizon, send in a SUMO clock aboard a rescue
capsule quickly so the intrepid explorers will know when to draw their
next breath. :o)
<< In the SCSO measurements, earth tides were easily observable at the
10-14 frequency variation level, in agreement with model calculations.
The sensitivity of the cavity frequency to variations in acceleration
can be reduced significantly by supporting the cavity from its center,
therefore compensating any change in the length of the top half with an
opposite change in the bottom half. >>
http://bigben.stanford.edu/sumo/status.htm
Sue...
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| User: "Nick" |
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| Title: If Time Ends At The Singularity |
19 Jun 2005 12:53:14 AM |
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Let's say a photon is drawn into a singularity.
What would its energy be?
It would not be moving as the singularity is an end to
space-time. But you cannot bring light to a stop without
robbing it of its energy.
Singularities predict energyless light violating energy conservation.
They are a violation of the energy conservation law.
Therefore there are no singularities not even in the
begining. The big bang mass was created spread out.
A build up of Dark energy created it.
If there are no singularities there must be a Maximum Mass Density.
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| User: "T Wake" |
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| Title: Re: If Time Ends At The Singularity |
19 Jun 2005 04:37:32 AM |
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"Nick" <macromitch@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1119160394.084782.154030@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Let's say a photon is drawn into a singularity.
What would its energy be?
It would not be moving as the singularity is an end to
space-time. But you cannot bring light to a stop without
robbing it of its energy.
Singularities predict energyless light violating energy conservation.
They are a violation of the energy conservation law.
Therefore there are no singularities not even in the
begining. The big bang mass was created spread out.
A build up of Dark energy created it.
If there are no singularities there must be a Maximum Mass Density.
You have a tendency to confuse yourself by making assumptions, and then
wondering why the theories don't seem consistent in your assumed world view.
Maybe you should ask your creator why things weren't made more simply.
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| User: "Sue..." |
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| Title: Re: If Time Ends At The Singularity |
19 Jun 2005 05:25:57 AM |
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If Time Ends At The Singularity, it is the ideal
condition to make a dash for the loo without loosing
your place in the theatre queue. :o)
Sue...
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| User: "Jim Black" |
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| Title: Re: If Time Ends At The Event Horizon* |
15 Jun 2005 12:17:40 AM |
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Nick wrote:
...then what is the time rate in a black hole?
Proper time cannot go any faster than the slowdown of time
in gravity.
If time ends it ends.
How then would time end and magically(!) restart? You can't have it
both ways you know.
Mitch Raemsch
-- Time moves forward: in all directions --
Why would the answer be any different from the time you posted this a
year ago?
Fusa.
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| User: "Deon Joubert" |
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| Title: Re: If Time Ends At The Event Horizon* |
15 Jun 2005 05:46:12 AM |
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Time is only a relationship between two moving objects nothing more, nothing
less.
"Nick" <macromitch@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1118809164.509785.191850@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
...then what is the time rate in a black hole?
Proper time cannot go any faster than the slowdown of time
in gravity.
If time ends it ends.
How then would time end and magically(!) restart? You can't have it
both ways you know.
Mitch Raemsch
-- Time moves forward: in all directions --
.
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| User: "Nick" |
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| Title: Re: If Time Ends At The Event Horizon* |
15 Jun 2005 03:21:53 PM |
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Deon, time slows down in gravity regardless of motion.
You can fall and time slows down or you can be still
and time is still slow.
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| User: "T Wake" |
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| Title: Re: If Time Ends At The Event Horizon* |
15 Jun 2005 03:29:32 PM |
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"Nick" <macromitch@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1118866913.115918.125040@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Deon, time slows down in gravity regardless of motion.
You can fall and time slows down or you can be still
and time is still slow.
Does a photon experience time?
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| User: "Nick" |
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| Title: Re: If Time Ends At The Event Horizon* |
15 Jun 2005 06:03:10 PM |
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Good question.
The answer is yes.
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| User: "T Wake" |
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| Title: Re: If Time Ends At The Event Horizon* |
16 Jun 2005 07:25:43 AM |
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"Nick" <macromitch@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1118873095.711463.87620@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Good question.
The answer is yes.
Is this opinion or fact?
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| User: "Nick" |
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| Title: Re: If Time Ends At The Event Horizon* |
16 Jun 2005 03:06:00 PM |
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If photons didn't experience time they wouldn't slow
down in gravity.
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| User: "T Wake" |
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| Title: Re: If Time Ends At The Event Horizon* |
16 Jun 2005 05:03:52 PM |
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"Nick" <macromitch@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1118952360.817392.282540@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
If photons didn't experience time they wouldn't slow
down in gravity.
Is this opinion or fact?
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| User: "Deon Joubert" |
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| Title: Re: If Time Ends At The Event Horizon* |
17 Jun 2005 11:27:56 AM |
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I'm not aruging that objects can slow down and speed up. Objects do not
experice time, they move faster or slower in relation to other moving
objects. Time is a measurement of this differential and has no other
meaning. If a flower takes four days to wilt then you have observed the
movement of oxigen molecules moving out of the flower in relation to the
earth's rotation - movement relationships - that's all time is.
"Nick" <macromitch@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1118952360.817392.282540@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
If photons didn't experience time they wouldn't slow
down in gravity.
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| User: "Nick" |
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| Title: Re: If Time Ends At The Event Horizon* |
18 Jun 2005 04:45:45 PM |
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Deon Joubert wrote:
I'm not aruging that objects can slow down and speed up. Objects do not
experice time, they move faster or slower in relation to other moving
objects. Time is a measurement of this differential and has no other
meaning. If a flower takes four days to wilt then you have observed the
movement of oxigen molecules moving out of the flower in relation to the
earth's rotation - movement relationships - that's all time is.
"Nick" <macromitch@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1118952360.817392.282540@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
If photons didn't experience time they wouldn't slow
down in gravity.
Objects are time. In order to measure a property the measuring
device has to have that quality. In other words clocks are time!!!
Every physical object is. Unfication!
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