=?iso-8859-1?q?Henri_Poincar=E9_Discovered_Special_Relativity,_not_Albert_Einstein?=

Science > Physics > =?iso-8859-1?q?Henri_Poincar=E9_Discovered_Special_Relativity,_not_Albert_Einstein?=

LINK TO THIS PAGE

rating : 0 | 0

Page 1 of 5

Topic:	Science > Physics
User:	"Perspicacious"
Date:	06 Aug 2005 10:35:21 AM
Object:	=?iso-8859-1?q?Henri_Poincar=E9_Discovered_Special_Relativity,_not_Albert_Einstein?=

The mathematician Henri Poincar=E9 set up all the basic
concepts of special relativity several years before
Einstein published On the Electrodynamics of Moving
Bodies (Annalen der Physik vol XVII 1905 p 891-921).
Here is the short version of the story:
http://www-cosmosaf.iap.fr/Poincare-RR3A.htm
For a 254 page commentary discussing the substantial
contributions made to relativity theory by Henri
Poincar=E9, see http://arxiv.org/abs/physics/0408077
A few insights on the physics community's shameful
exaggeration of Einstein's abilities and originality,
and the creation of Einstein's superhero status, are
mentioned here:
http://www.nexusmagazine.com/articles/einstein.html
Have you ever noticed how many books, articles and
science programs (Nova, PBS) are devoted to instilling
a sense of worship for characters like Einstein and
Steven Hawking rather than explaining modern physics?
For a modern, easy-to-understand introduction to
special relativity (written by a mathematician) see
http://www.everythingimportant.org/relativity/
.

User: "Bilge"
Title: Re: =?iso-8859-1?q?Henri_Poincar=E9_Discovered_Special_Relativity,_not_Albert_Einstein?=	07 Aug 2005 07:25:28 PM

Perspicacious:

And despite having the basic concepts, poincare did not put
all of the pieces together into a physical theory. Einstein
did, which is why einstein is credited with the theory.
.

User: "Harry"
Title: Re: Henri Poincaré Discovered Special Relativity, not Albert Einstein	08 Aug 2005 04:46:18 AM

"Bilge" <dubious@radioactivex.lebesque-al.net> wrote in message
news:slrndfdcle.gr.dubious@radioactivex.lebesque-al.net...

Perspicacious:

And despite having the basic concepts, poincare did not put
all of the pieces together into a physical theory.

Poincare claimed that he didn't have to do so, as in his eyes already
Lorentz had done so. However, Lorentz did at that time not have the full
understanding of his own theory that Poincare demonstrated to have. Einstein
indeed put all pieces nicely together in his paper...

Einstein did, which is why einstein is credited with the theory.

That's why Lorentz, Poincare and Einstein are credited for SRT.
Harald
.

User: "Perspicacious"
Title: =?iso-8859-1?q?Re:_Henri_Poincar=E9_Discovered_Special_Relativity,_not_Albert_Einstein?=	07 Aug 2005 07:54:51 PM

Rage Bilge wrote:

And despite having the basic concepts, poincare did
not put all of the pieces together into a physical theory.

You mean that the first person to compile or summarize
Poincare's published articles on relativity is the creator
of relativity. You are an idiot.

Einstein did, which is why einstein is credited with
the theory.

You are simply ignorant of the actual circumstances
surrounding Einstein's success. Here's an excellent summary:
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/sci.physics.research/msg/398700efdcfa3ccc
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/sci.physics.research/msg/af718d896054763f
.

User: ""
Title: =?iso-8859-1?q?Re:_Henri_Poincar=E9_Discovered_Special_Relativity,_not_Albert_Einstein?=	07 Aug 2005 11:58:58 PM

Perspicacious wrote:

Rage Bilge wrote:

And despite having the basic concepts, poincare did
not put all of the pieces together into a physical theory.

You mean that the first person to compile or summarize
Poincare's published articles on relativity is the creator
of relativity. You are an idiot.

Einstein did, which is why einstein is credited with
the theory.

You are simply ignorant of the actual circumstances
surrounding Einstein's success. Here's an excellent summary:

http://groups-beta.google.com/group/sci.physics.research/msg/398700efdcfa3ccc
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/sci.physics.research/msg/af718d896054763f

What Bilge said is correct for Poincare, Lorentz, and Larmor. They
waffled. Clearly Shubert is the idiot with respect to this subject.
.

User: "Koobee Wublee"
Title: Re: Henri Poincaré Discovered Special Relativity, not Albert Einstein	08 Aug 2005 12:44:47 AM

<vanep@cox.net> wrote in message
news:1123477138.702923.238130@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...

What Bilge said is correct for Poincare, Lorentz, and Larmor. They
waffled. Clearly Shubert is the idiot with respect to this subject.

Bilge the janitor is a troll. So is Death Threat moortel.
Arguing among the verbage of special relativity is like arguing if a glass
filled with half of its capacity is half full or half empty. The only way
is to examine how Lorentz Transforms were derived by these men.
Larmor stumbled upon the complete reciporcal Lorentz Transforms by luck.
Poincare's derivation dictates the constant associated must be the
observer's own speed of light in vacuum. Einstein's so called elegant
dribbling does not require this constant to be so. If you accept
Einstein's, you must also accept Dr. Cahill's re-interpretation of the data
from Michelson-Morley Experiment. That is another chapter of discussion
which you and Dr. Cahill have trouble in defending. So, if you call Dr.
Cahill a crackpot, you also are calling Einstein one as well. You cannot
have both ways. You cannot have double standards. If so, this is not
physics or science.
.

User: "Perspicacious"
Title: =?iso-8859-1?q?Re:_Henri_Poincar=E9_Discovered_Special_Relativity,_not_Albert_Einstein?=	08 Aug 2005 01:27:01 AM

v=2E..@cox.net wrote:

What Bilge said is correct for Poincare, Lorentz, and Larmor.
They waffled.

To a mathematician, physics is merely the mathematical study
of all conceivable universes. "A universe is a mathematical
model that describes spacetime, matter, energy and their
interactions." http://www.everythingimportant.org/relativity/
Poincar=E9 wrote:
"This impossibility of revealing experimentally the
Earth's motion seems to represent a general law of
Nature; we naturally come to accept this law, which
we shall term the relativity postulate, and to accept
it without reservations. It is irrelevant, whether
this postulate, that till now is consistent with
experiments, will or will not later be confirmed
by more precise measurements, at present, at any
rate, it is interesting to see, what consequences
can be deduced from it."
http://arxiv.org/abs/physics/0408077 p. 26.
Physicists are deeply religious. Mathematicians are
dispassionate. Physicists today have every right to
require of themselves that originators of new physical
theories have religious faith that their constructed
mathematical models represent our actual universe.
For mathematicians, having religious faith is not
a criterion for discovery.
Poincar=E9 never expressed a word or a thought that
his relativistic equations formed an inconsistent
mathematical model. Poincar=E9 never repudiated even
one of the many relativistic equations he created.
.

User: "hanson"
Title: Re: Henri Poincaré Discovered Special Relativity, not Albert Einstein	10 Aug 2005 09:01:58 PM

"Perspicacious" <iperspicacious@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1123342521.239056.20500@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
The mathematician Henri Poincaré set up all the basic
concepts of special relativity several years before
Einstein published On the Electrodynamics of Moving
Bodies (Annalen der Physik vol XVII 1905 p 891-921).
http://www-cosmosaf.iap.fr/Poincare-RR3A.htm
.....contributions made to relativity theory by Henri
Poincaré, see http://arxiv.org/abs/physics/0408077
the physics community's shameful exaggeration of
Einstein's abilities and originality, are entioned here:
http://www.nexusmagazine.com/articles/einstein.html

"Gregory L. Hansen" <glhansen@steel.ucs.indiana.edu> wrote in message
news:ddd87c$r5a$4@rainier.uits.indiana.edu...

"Tom Roberts" <tjroberts@lucent.com> wrote in message
news:oPcKe.484$fk6.142@newssvr19.news.prodigy.com...

Einstein's papers and thesis on Brownian motion. IMHO this was truly his
major contribution in 1905, because atomic theory underlies so much of
modern physics and Einstein was a major contributor to its acceptance by
the entire community.

In article <MVgKe.79213$ro.1430@fed1read02>,
Koobee Wublee <kublai@cox.net> wrote:

Please explain how this particular study of lots of atoms can give insight
into the modern atomic thoery? To me, Einstein (or his 1st wife) [***]
was just explaining a statistical study not much different from what Browne
and/or Boltzmann had already characterized. Statiscal analysis of thermal
physics is hardly a sophisticated atomic theory to me.

[Hansen]

It kicked off the modern atomic theory by showing that atoms existed to be
theorized about! Or molecules, anyway. A hundred years ago a smallest
component of matter was not universally accepted.

[hanson]
Yes, this' really astonishing. It was only 1929, some 75 years ago, that
atoms/molecules became officially accepted when Perrin received the
Nobel and declared Avogadro's N_A as being a fundamental constant.
Yet still 3/4 century later, now, N_A is only considered for use as the mol in
"the # of C12s in 12 gr of C12" & perhaps as R(gas) = N_A * k (Boltzmann)
or as F (Faraday const) = N_A * e (charge). But very few take N_A as the
corner stone, in a much vaster context, to describe nature in a discrete
and SELF-SIMILAR construct/story/theory that will get us out of the cul
de sac of relativity... It is astonishing that only very few can see the that
1 mole (N_A) of electron masses yield the Planck mass, that 1 mole
of Plank lengths yields the Hydrogen atom's radius, and that 1 mole of
Planck time endures for 1 atomic time unit: ([a] = Sommerfeld below)
[Old Man] news:OOudnXoJ7_pRNa7cRVn-uA@prairiewave.com... &
news:SwLYc.2925$w%6.145@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net.
::: *** tau / t_pl = a^(-1) * (N_A*pi*sqrt3) ****
1 mole of Planck time units = 1 atomic time unit
::: *** r_H / l_pl = a^(0) * (N_A*pi*sqrt3) ****
1 mole of Planck length units = 1 H-Bohr radius
::: *** m_pl / m_e = a^(1) * (N_A*pi*sqrt3) ****
1 mole of electron masses = 1 Planck mass
::: *** r_e / l_pl = a ^(2) * (N_A*pi*sqrt3)
1 mole of Plank length units = 1 classical el-radius
Can you see the self similar domain spans emerging in these
4 equations, suggesting that all our well know laws of physics
are working the same in any domain?
Can you see, after substituting the Plank units by the more
"fundamental" constants ( as m_pl = sqrt(hbar*c/G), t_pl = l_pl/c
l_pl=sqrt(hbar*G/c^3) that gravitation can be described in a very
new and different way?
Can you see why its is so hard to get the same experimental
accuracy for F, N_A and G, that we are used to with/from other
fundamental constants?... Can you see how and why all 3 are
interlinked and that another quite different relation and experiment
has to be found/done to get out of that cursed F, N_A and G inter
dependence?... It will require a paradigm shift... ahahaha...
As posted in the above refs Dirac was one of the few with his LNH,
who did delve into these domain issues. But back then, the steam
roller of relativity quenched and flattened any and all developments
of alternative stories/theories of/about Physics. Hell, Einstein and
his ilk would have killed off QM if they had the chance to do so...
ahahaha....Now, slowly them times is changin'... relatively... AHAHA..
Reason: Physics is a social enterprise in the final analysis, no matter
how hard that is for some to swallow ... ahahahaha....
ahahaha... ahahanson
PS: [***] Koobee Wublee must have seen or picked up this one:
<><><><><>
PBS/Discovery channel aired in 2003 a full 1 hr show asking a whole
slew of academician physicists about the origin of the 1905 paper.
The issue was that it was Einstein's Christian wife, Mileva Maric, who
had the ideas and performed the math in the manuscript. She urged
her hubby, Albert, to publish HER work under his name, (given the
status women had back then) which he apparently reluctantly did ....
and in the process did not include any citations, etc. ... ahahaha...
But, the moment the paper made a splash, their marriage soured
and he dumped her.... One can wonder why Einstein acquiesced to
her divorce demands for him to give her all the money that he got
from his Nobel price... Hush money?........ ahahahaha... AHAHAHA...
The vast number of the interviewed professionals subscribed to the
scenario that it was Maric who was the creator and inventor of SR,
and not Einstein who cashed in on the laurels.
<><><><><>
.

User: "Helmut Wabnig EmailAddress"
Title: Re: Henri Poincaré Discovered Special Relativity, not Albert Einstein	11 Aug 2005 11:22:08 AM

On Thu, 11 Aug 2005 02:01:58 GMT, "hanson" <hanson@quick.net> wrote:

Number games?
numerical coincidences?
Circular definitions?
Not necessarily linked to something more fundamental.
Remember Eddington and his use of numbers to explain stuff?
Nice try, interesting, though.
w.
.

User: "Dirk Van de moortel"
Title: Re: Henri Poincaré Discovered Special Relativity, not Albert Einstein	06 Aug 2005 11:45:41 AM

"Perspicacious" <iperspicacious@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:1123342521.239056.20500@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
So first you go to sci.physics.research to ask the question
| "Why isn't the mathematician Henri Poincaré acknowledged
| as the true discoverer of special relativity?"
where you get the answer from Martin Ouweland:
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.physics.research/msg/a9bf9ff7169756f8
Then you ignore that answer entirely and come here and
fart like an Androcles.
What a pathetic little piece of ***** you are :-)
Dirk Vdm
.

User: "Paul Stowe"
Title: Re: Henri Poincaré Discovered Special Relativity, not Albert Einstein	06 Aug 2005 11:58:47 AM

On Sat, 06 Aug 2005 16:45:41 GMT, "Dirk Van de moortel"
<dirkvandemoortel@ThankS-NO-SperM.hotmail.com> wrote:

"Perspicacious" <iperspicacious@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:1123342521.239056.20500@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...

So first you go to sci.physics.research to ask the question
| "Why isn't the mathematician Henri Poincaré acknowledged
| as the true discoverer of special relativity?"
where you get the answer from Martin Ouweland:
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.physics.research/msg/a9bf9ff7169756f8
Then you ignore that answer entirely and come here and
fart like an Androcles.
What a pathetic little piece of ***** you are :-)

Yet you ignore response like,
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/sci.physics.research/msg/398700efdcfa3ccc?dmode=source&hl=en
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/sci.physics.research/msg/af718d896054763f?dmode=source&hl=en
So, it would seem that you're just as much a "pathetic little piece of *****"!
Paul Stowe
.

User: "Dirk Van de moortel"
Title: Re: Henri Poincaré Discovered Special Relativity, not Albert Einstein	06 Aug 2005 12:10:31 PM

"Paul Stowe" <ps@acompletelyjunkaddress.net> wrote in message news:9up9f1ln1e0gnbios3h6b54h7e1kh61lu4@4ax.com...

On Sat, 06 Aug 2005 16:45:41 GMT, "Dirk Van de moortel"
<dirkvandemoortel@ThankS-NO-SperM.hotmail.com> wrote:

"Perspicacious" <iperspicacious@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:1123342521.239056.20500@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...

So first you go to sci.physics.research to ask the question
| "Why isn't the mathematician Henri Poincaré acknowledged
| as the true discoverer of special relativity?"
where you get the answer from Martin Ouweland:
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.physics.research/msg/a9bf9ff7169756f8
Then you ignore that answer entirely and come here and
fart like an Androcles.
What a pathetic little piece of ***** you are :-)

Yet you ignore response like,

http://groups-beta.google.com/group/sci.physics.research/msg/398700efdcfa3ccc?dmode=source&hl=en

Yes, Harald Ether Van Lintel :-)

http://groups-beta.google.com/group/sci.physics.research/msg/af718d896054763f?dmode=source&hl=en

So, it would seem that you're just as much a "pathetic little piece of *****"!

Paul Stowe

Ha, Paul Ether Stowe :-)
The only ones we're missing in this dog ***** thread, are
Mingst and Bjerknes...
Have you contacted Barry and Christopher?
What is keeping them?
Dirk Vdm
.

User: "Perspicacious"
Title: =?iso-8859-1?q?Re:_Henri_Poincar=E9_Discovered_Special_Relativity,_not_Albert_Einstein?=	06 Aug 2005 12:30:44 PM

Paul Stowe wrote:

Yet you ignore response like,
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/sci.physics.research/msg/398700efdcfa3ccc
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/sci.physics.research/msg/af718d896054763f

Those are both terrific responses. I say those remarks
support a revolutionary thesis:
http://www.everythingimportant.org/viewtopic.php?t=1094
.

User: "hanson"
Title: Re: Henri Poincaré Discovered Special Relativity, not Albert Einstein	06 Aug 2005 01:59:28 PM

"Perspicacious" <iperspicacious@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1123349444.498680.311410@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...

Paul Stowe wrote:

Yet you ignore response like,
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/sci.physics.research/msg/398700efdcfa3ccc
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/sci.physics.research/msg/af718d896054763f

[Perspirator]

Those are both terrific responses. I say those remarks
support a revolutionary thesis:
http://www.everythingimportant.org/viewtopic.php?t=1094

[hanson]
ahahaha... all this bellyaching over theories, which are nothing
more than stories, like SR/GR, is effectively a non issue because:
Anybody who works in mil/indust. Eng, R&D "does not need SR *****"
Anybody who works in *.edu & for R-grants "does need SR, - No *****"
Anybody who works in Promo, Sales & Movies "loves SR by the shitload"
Any Jew protects it as his cultural heritage whether "SR is ***** or not".
..... ahahaha... or have you guys never noticed that in these NGs
the controversy over SR/GR is always pretty much along the
lines/camps of Yidds pro / Goys con.... ahahaha... So, have at each
other... Let me watch the fun of you guys churning and arguing in
the cul de sac of relativity... that had its time and date... and is
leading to nowhere from here, relatively or absolutely.... AHAHAHA..
ahahaha... ahahahanson
PS: I am missing the poster, that JPL janitor, who was a such a
virulent Albi fan that he screamed "Anti-Semitism" on the drop of
hat against anybody who did not suck Einstein's *****.... ahahaha....
These were great threads, not civilized like this one here... ahaha..
.

User: "Bill Hobba"
Title: Re: Henri Poincaré Discovered Special Relativity, not Albert Einstein	06 Aug 2005 08:29:00 PM

"hanson" <hanson@quick.net> wrote in message
news:kM7Je.2201$WD.1114@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...

"Perspicacious" <iperspicacious@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1123349444.498680.311410@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...

Paul Stowe wrote:

Yet you ignore response like,
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/sci.physics.research/msg/398700efdcfa3ccc
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/sci.physics.research/msg/af718d896054763f

[Perspirator]

Those are both terrific responses. I say those remarks
support a revolutionary thesis:
http://www.everythingimportant.org/viewtopic.php?t=1094

Yea right - try and design a CRT without SR and see how far you get.
Bill

Anybody who works in *.edu & for R-grants "does need SR, - No *****"
Anybody who works in Promo, Sales & Movies "loves SR by the shitload"
Any Jew protects it as his cultural heritage whether "SR is ***** or not".

.... ahahaha... or have you guys never noticed that in these NGs
the controversy over SR/GR is always pretty much along the
lines/camps of Yidds pro / Goys con.... ahahaha... So, have at each
other... Let me watch the fun of you guys churning and arguing in
the cul de sac of relativity... that had its time and date... and is
leading to nowhere from here, relatively or absolutely.... AHAHAHA..
ahahaha... ahahahanson

PS: I am missing the poster, that JPL janitor, who was a such a
virulent Albi fan that he screamed "Anti-Semitism" on the drop of
hat against anybody who did not suck Einstein's *****.... ahahaha....
These were great threads, not civilized like this one here... ahaha..

User: "June R Harton"
Title: Re: Henri Poincaré Discovered Special Relativity, not Albert Einstein	07 Aug 2005 03:00:21 AM

"Bill Hobba" <rubbish@junk.com> wrote in message
news:wtdJe.73773$oJ.30932@news-server.bigpond.net.au..
You are all missing the point that ''time'' does not slow down because
of the velocity of a system...it is CHANGE that occurs at a slower
rate BECAUSE of the longer trajectory of the elemental particals
........AND what a heresy...Einstein and NO ONE ELSE back then
realized it!
from: Spirit of Truth
(using June's e-mail to communicate to you)!
.

User: "Bill Hobba"
Title: Re: Henri Poincaré Discovered Special Relativity, not Albert Einstein	07 Aug 2005 04:07:49 AM

"June R Harton" <JUNEHARTON@prodigy.net> wrote in message
news:pcjJe.208$512.13@newssvr19.news.prodigy.com...

Nor does SR say that time slows down due to the velocity of a system as an
observer staionary wrt to a clock will readily verify. Time is measured
differently in different coordinate systems due to space-time geometry.

CHANGE that occurs at a slower
rate BECAUSE of the longer trajectory of the elemental particals
.......AND what a heresy...Einstein and NO ONE ELSE back then
realized it!

The above is gibberish.
Bill

from: Spirit of Truth

(using June's e-mail to communicate to you)!

User: "June R Harton"
Title: Re: Henri Poincaré Discovered Special Relativity, not Albert Einstein	18 Aug 2005 11:50:38 PM

"Bill Hobba" <rubbish@junk.com> wrote in message
news:FbkJe.74273$oJ.43873@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
Perhaps this will help you understand:
http://members.tripod.com/conduit9SR/SR6.html
from: Spirit of Truth
(using June's e-mail to communicate to you)!
.

User: "Paul Stowe"
Title: Re: Henri Poincaré Discovered Special Relativity, not Albert Einstein	07 Aug 2005 10:23:10 AM

On Sun, 07 Aug 2005 09:07:49 GMT, "Bill Hobba" <rubbish@junk.com> wrote:

"June R Harton" <JUNEHARTON@prodigy.net> wrote in message
news:pcjJe.208$512.13@newssvr19.news.prodigy.com...

Nor does SR say that time slows down due to the velocity ...

"If we assume that the result proved for a polygonal
line is also valid for a continuously curved line,
we arrive at this result: If one of two synchronous
clocks at A is moved in a closed curve with constant
VELOCITY until it returns to A, the journey lasting
t seconds, then by the clock which has remained at
rest the travelled clock on its arrival at A will be
{1/2}tv^2/c^2 second slow. Thence we conclude that a
balance-clock at the equator MUST GO MORE SLOWLY, by
a very small amount, than a precisely similar clock
situated at one of the poles under otherwise identical
conditions."
Ref: http://www.fourmilab.ch/etexts/einstein/specrel/www/
Section 4

... of a system as an observer staionary wrt to a clock will
readily verify.

You do like silly circular arguments, don't you. By this
silly illogical one doesn't need SR to make it.

Time is measured differently in different coordinate systems due
to space-time geometry.

If it was just 'measured' and not an actual effect muons would
never reach Earth's surface.

CHANGE that occurs at a slower rate BECAUSE of the longer trajectory
of the elemental particals .......AND what a heresy...Einstein and
NO ONE ELSE back then realized it!

The above is gibberish.

No more so than much of what you write...
Paul Stowe
.

User: "Bill Hobba"
Title: Re: Henri Poincaré Discovered Special Relativity, not Albert Einstein	07 Aug 2005 04:28:56 PM

"Paul Stowe" <ps@acompletelyjunkaddress.net> wrote in message
news:468cf1lennj8ft5ji01elqlr3v0vjpot89@4ax.com...

On Sun, 07 Aug 2005 09:07:49 GMT, "Bill Hobba" <rubbish@junk.com> wrote:

"June R Harton" <JUNEHARTON@prodigy.net> wrote in message
news:pcjJe.208$512.13@newssvr19.news.prodigy.com...

Nor does SR say that time slows down due to the velocity ...

"If we assume that the result proved for a polygonal
line is also valid for a continuously curved line,
we arrive at this result: If one of two synchronous
clocks at A is moved in a closed curve with constant
VELOCITY until it returns to A, the journey lasting
t seconds, then by the clock which has remained at
rest the travelled clock on its arrival at A will be
{1/2}tv^2/c^2 second slow. Thence we conclude that a
balance-clock at the equator MUST GO MORE SLOWLY, by
a very small amount, than a precisely similar clock
situated at one of the poles under otherwise identical
conditions."

Ref: http://www.fourmilab.ch/etexts/einstein/specrel/www/
Section 4

And Paul do tell us how a clock that is traveling at constant velocity can
ever be bought to together with a clock conserved stationary and still
continue to travel at constant velocity?

... of a system as an observer staionary wrt to a clock will
readily verify.

You do like silly circular arguments, don't you. By this
silly illogical one doesn't need SR to make it.

Sure the above does not prove time does not vary with velocity - eg LET
allows it to. I was however speaking of SR where the POR implies clocks at
rest in an inertial frame behave exactly the same as the same clocks at rest
in any inertial frame. This obviously means that one can not say velocity
changes the rate time passes because regardless of what velocity it is
traveling at it will always be at rest in some frame.

Time is measured differently in different coordinate systems due
to space-time geometry.

If it was just 'measured' and not an actual effect muons would
never reach Earth's surface.

Regardless of how fast they travel and hence what their average decay time
is statistically some will always reach the earth - which his exactly what
is found - and consistent with SR to boot.

CHANGE that occurs at a slower rate BECAUSE of the longer trajectory
of the elemental particals .......AND what a heresy...Einstein and
NO ONE ELSE back then realized it!

The above is gibberish.

No more so than much of what you write...

Right back at you.
Bill

Paul Stowe

User: "Paul Stowe"
Title: Re: Henri Poincaré Discovered Special Relativity, not Albert Einstein	07 Aug 2005 10:49:35 PM

On Sun, 07 Aug 2005 21:28:56 GMT, "Bill Hobba" <rubbish@junk.com> wrote:

"Paul Stowe" <ps@acompletelyjunkaddress.net> wrote in message
news:468cf1lennj8ft5ji01elqlr3v0vjpot89@4ax.com...

On Sun, 07 Aug 2005 09:07:49 GMT, "Bill Hobba" <rubbish@junk.com> wrote:

"June R Harton" <JUNEHARTON@prodigy.net> wrote in message
news:pcjJe.208$512.13@newssvr19.news.prodigy.com...

Nor does SR say that time slows down due to the velocity ...

"If we assume that the result proved for a polygonal
line is also valid for a continuously curved line,
we arrive at this result: If one of two synchronous
clocks at A is moved in a closed curve with constant
VELOCITY until it returns to A, the journey lasting
t seconds, then by the clock which has remained at
rest the travelled clock on its arrival at A will be
{1/2}tv^2/c^2 second slow. Thence we conclude that a
balance-clock at the equator MUST GO MORE SLOWLY, by
a very small amount, than a precisely similar clock
situated at one of the poles under otherwise identical
conditions."

Ref: http://www.fourmilab.ch/etexts/einstein/specrel/www/
Section 4

And Paul do tell us how a clock that is traveling at constant velocity
can ever be bought to together with a clock conserved stationary and
still continue to travel at constant velocity?

And what does this have to do with the price of tea on the moon?
Which, of course, is as logical a question wrt to the prior
comment as yours above. So, just to help your poor memory, it
was, "Nor does SR say that time slows down due to the velocity"
The quote direct from Einstein's paper directly contradicts THAT!
statement.

... of a system as an observer staionary wrt to a clock will
readily verify.

You do like silly circular arguments, don't you. By this
silly illogic one doesn't need SR to make it.

Sure the above does not prove time does not vary with velocity

No, it's more like saying, whereever you go, there you are...

- eg LET allows it to. I was however speaking of SR where the POR
implies clocks at rest in an inertial frame behave exactly the same
as the same clocks at rest in any inertial frame.

Whereever you go, there you are...

This obviously means that one can not say velocity changes the rate
time passes because regardless of what velocity it is traveling at
it will always be at rest in some frame.

By your (flawed) logic, the twin paradox is unresolvable.

Time is measured differently in different coordinate systems due
to space-time geometry.

If it was just 'measured' and not an actual effect muons would
never reach Earth's surface.

Regardless of how fast they travel and hence what their average decay
time is statistically some will always reach the earth - which his
exactly what is found - and consistent with SR to boot.

Really? LOL... The halflife of a muon is what? At c in that amount
of 'time' how far can it go in 'our' FOR?
http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/relativ/muon.html#c3

CHANGE that occurs at a slower rate BECAUSE of the longer trajectory
of the elemental particals .......AND what a heresy...Einstein and
NO ONE ELSE back then realized it!

The above is gibberish.

No more so than much of what you write...

Right back at you.

The point my dear fellow is (and was) as always,
- one man's trash is another man's treature
- opinions are like assholes, everbody has one
etc., etc., etc. ...
Paul Stowe
.

User: "hanson"
Title: Re: Henri Poincaré Discovered Special Relativity, not Albert Einstein	08 Aug 2005 12:05:57 AM

"Bill Hobba" <rubbish@junk.com> wrote relativity related rubbish and
junk in news:wtdJe.73773$oJ.30932@news-server.bigpond.net.au...

"hanson" <hanson@quick.net> wrote in message
news:kM7Je.2201$WD.1114@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...

"Perspicacious" <iperspicacious@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1123349444.498680.311410@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...

Paul Stowe wrote:

Yet you ignore response like,
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/sci.physics.research/msg/398700efdcfa3ccc
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/sci.physics.research/msg/af718d896054763f

[Perspirator]

Those are both terrific responses. I say those remarks
support a revolutionary thesis:
http://www.everythingimportant.org/viewtopic.php?t=1094

[Hobba, hubba, hubba, hubba]

Yea right - try and design a CRT without SR and see how far you get.
Bill

[hanson]
Bill, you must be feeling lonely, attempting to make idle conversation by
issuing such a rubbish@junk. one liner. T'is how far you get with that:
= Even before 1859 Plucker and others proved that "cathode rays"
can be deflected & controlled by a magnetic field with a scanning
method. There was no Einstein then. The better/worse side of Albi-
to-be had to wait for another 20 years before it roared down his daddy
hard-on.... ahahaha... AHAHAHA...
= Fast forward. Why would you wanna design a CRT, when heuristic
industry moves to Plasma and LCD displays... neither of which
requires relativity. That's how far you get with that... ahahaha.. ahahaha...
Bill, obviously you have never been neither mil/indust. Eng, R&D or
you'd know that a design is just a layout, a roadmap, a scheme to
manufacture a product. The moment the actual hardware assy process
begins, the "design" is changed continuously, it is fiddled around with
by the ancient-modern-update scheme (do step/test/check/next step)x
by trial and error...until the gadget is built and works and nobody even
thinks about any fucking relativity. .....The same goes for your CRT, the
cyclotrons or GPS.
Now, once the gismo is built, THEN and ONLY then will it happen that
"Anybody who works in Promo, Sales & Movies "loves SR by the shitload"
ahahaha... AHAHAHA.... hey, why not... if SR/GR helps to generate
Sales... then all the power to it....
So, Bill, don't start to cry now. Your SR/GR will be around for a long
time... but not and never as a tool/part/component that manufactures
hardware. SR/GR is only a fucking story. At best it's an instrument that
"describes"... "Don't oversell relativity", said poster Meron who has
more reason that most here to say that. Even Franz Heymann
who spent decades at CERN posted that he only "learned" SR/GR
AFTER he retired.... Heed your buddies' advice, Bill...ahahaha...
I think it is hilarious that there are still herds of mooches around who
sheepishly follow and obediently suck greedily Einstein's *****... ahaha...
while the rest of the world moves on...... It is of now wonder that the
Bavarian Higher edu system has dropped "relativity" as a mandatory
requirement. Heymann, Meron and the Bavarians do know that nobody
ever said "Now, that we have SR let us develop a steel/glassn' wire
gismos, based on SR, so that we can see how far we get"...
ahahaha.. thanks for the laughs, Bill, and this is how far you got.
ahahaha... ahahahansom

[hanson]

Anybody who works in mil/indust. Eng, R&D "does not need SR *****"
Anybody who works in *.edu & for R-grants "does need SR, - No *****"
Anybody who works in Promo, Sales & Movies "loves SR by the shitload"
Any Jew protects it as his cultural heritage whether "SR is ***** or not".

.... ahahaha... or have you guys never noticed that in these NGs
the controversy over SR/GR is always pretty much along the
lines/camps of Yidds pro / Goys con.... ahahaha... So, have at each
other... Let me watch the fun of you guys churning and arguing in
the cul de sac of relativity... that had its time and date... and is
leading to nowhere from here, relatively or absolutely.... AHAHAHA..
ahahaha... ahahahanson

PS: I am missing the poster, that JPL janitor, who was a such a
virulent Albi fan that he screamed "Anti-Semitism" on the drop of
hat against anybody who did not suck Einstein's *****.... ahahaha....
These were great threads, not civilized like this one here... ahaha..

[hanson]
PS: PBS/Discovery channel aired in 2003 a full 1 hrs show asking a
whole slew of academician physicists about the origin of the 1905 paper.
The issue was that it was Einstein's Christian wife, Mileva Maric, who
had the ideas and performed the math in the manuscript. She urged
her hubby, Albert, to publish HER work under his name, (given the
status women had back then) which he apparently reluctantly did ....
and in the process did not include any citations, etc. ... ahahaha...
But, the moment the paper made a splash, their marriage soured
and he dumped her.... One can wonder why Einstein acquiesced to
her divorce demands for him to give her all the money that he got
from his Nobel price... Hush money?........ ahahahaha... AHAHAHA...
The vast number of the interviewed professionals subscribed to the
scenario that it was Maric who was the creator and inventor of SR,
and not Einstein who cashed in on the laurels.
Don't whine at me now... I am merely the messenger... but as things
are... I am sure that some fanatical disciples will jump up and down
now, just like the Muslims did who got irate because someone threw a
book called Quran into the toilet... ahahaha... Ever wonder how dull
and boring the world would be without believers and fanatics, be they
of a religious persuasion or a scientific conviction... ahaha... AHAHAHA...
.

User: "Bill Hobba"
Title: Re: Henri Poincaré Discovered Special Relativity, not Albert Einstein	08 Aug 2005 02:00:21 AM

"hanson" <hanson@quick.net> wrote in message
news:VKBJe.2914$WD.1332@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...

"Bill Hobba" <rubbish@junk.com> wrote relativity related rubbish and
junk in news:wtdJe.73773$oJ.30932@news-server.bigpond.net.au...

"hanson" <hanson@quick.net> wrote in message
news:kM7Je.2201$WD.1114@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...

"Perspicacious" <iperspicacious@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1123349444.498680.311410@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...

Paul Stowe wrote:

Yet you ignore response like,
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/sci.physics.research/msg/398700efdcfa3ccc
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/sci.physics.research/msg/af718d896054763f

[Perspirator]

Those are both terrific responses. I say those remarks
support a revolutionary thesis:
http://www.everythingimportant.org/viewtopic.php?t=1094

[Hobba, hubba, hubba, hubba]

Yea right - try and design a CRT without SR and see how far you get.
Bill

I have been assured by engineers that has actually undertaken the exercise
that unless you take into account relativistic mass increase it will not
work properly.

The better/worse side of Albi-
to-be had to wait for another 20 years before it roared down his daddy
hard-on.... ahahaha... AHAHAHA...

Your inane prattle amuses only one person - namely youseself.
AHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHA.
Rest of rubbish snipped.
Bill
.

User: "Schoenfeld"
Title: =?iso-8859-1?q?Re:_Henri_Poincar=E9_Discovered_Special_Relativity,_not_Albert_Einstein?=	08 Aug 2005 09:40:59 AM

Bill Hobba wrote:

"hanson" <hanson@quick.net> wrote in message
news:VKBJe.2914$WD.1332@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...

"Bill Hobba" <rubbish@junk.com> wrote relativity related rubbish and
junk in news:wtdJe.73773$oJ.30932@news-server.bigpond.net.au...

"hanson" <hanson@quick.net> wrote in message
news:kM7Je.2201$WD.1114@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...

"Perspicacious" <iperspicacious@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1123349444.498680.311410@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...

Paul Stowe wrote:

Yet you ignore response like,
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/sci.physics.research/msg/398700efdcfa3ccc
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/sci.physics.research/msg/af718d896054763f

[Perspirator]

Those are both terrific responses. I say those remarks
support a revolutionary thesis:
http://www.everythingimportant.org/viewtopic.php?t=1094

[Hobba, hubba, hubba, hubba]

Yea right - try and design a CRT without SR and see how far you get.
Bill

I have been assured by engineers that has actually undertaken the exercise
that unless you take into account relativistic mass increase it will not
work properly.

The better/worse side of Albi-
to-be had to wait for another 20 years before it roared down his daddy
hard-on.... ahahaha... AHAHAHA...

Your inane prattle amuses only one person - namely youseself.

Actually it amuses me, but not as much as your statement that "I have
been assured by engineers that has actually undertaken the exercise
that unless you take into account relativistic mass increase it will
not work properly."
LOL

AHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

Rest of rubbish snipped.

Bill

User: "jem"
Title: Re: Henri =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Poincar=E9_Discovered_Special_Rel?==?ISO-8859-1?Q?ativity=2C_not_Albert_Einstein?=	08 Aug 2005 07:35:08 AM

Bill Hobba wrote:

"hanson" <hanson@quick.net> wrote in message
news:VKBJe.2914$WD.1332@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...

"Bill Hobba" <rubbish@junk.com> wrote relativity related rubbish and
junk in news:wtdJe.73773$oJ.30932@news-server.bigpond.net.au...

"hanson" <hanson@quick.net> wrote in message
news:kM7Je.2201$WD.1114@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...

"Perspicacious" <iperspicacious@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1123349444.498680.311410@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...

Paul Stowe wrote:

Yet you ignore response like,
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/sci.physics.research/msg/398700efdcfa3ccc
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/sci.physics.research/msg/af718d896054763f

[Perspirator]

Those are both terrific responses. I say those remarks
support a revolutionary thesis:
http://www.everythingimportant.org/viewtopic.php?t=1094

[Hobba, hubba, hubba, hubba]

Yea right - try and design a CRT without SR and see how far you get.
Bill

I have been assured by engineers that has actually undertaken the exercise
that unless you take into account relativistic mass increase it will not
work properly.

The better/worse side of Albi-
to-be had to wait for another 20 years before it roared down his daddy
hard-on.... ahahaha... AHAHAHA...

Your inane prattle amuses only one person - namely youseself.
AHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

Come on Bill, you're not giving him enough credit. I'm sure there are
others who are amused by his inane prattle.
.

User: "hanson"
Title: Re: Henri Poincaré Discovered Special Relativity, not Albert Einstein	08 Aug 2005 09:25:04 AM

Willy aka "jem" <xxx@xxx.xxx> delivered a somwaht gauche gem
in message news:WiIJe.15953$MO.8715@lakeread04...

"hanson" <hanson@quick.net> wrote in message
news:VKBJe.2914$WD.1332@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...

"Bill Hobba" <rubbish@junk.com> wrote relativity related rubbish and
junk in news:wtdJe.73773$oJ.30932@news-server.bigpond.net.au...

"hanson" <hanson@quick.net> wrote in message
news:kM7Je.2201$WD.1114@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...

[Hobba, hubba, hubba, hubba]

Yea right - try and design a CRT without SR and see how far you get.
Bill

[Hobba, hubba, hubba, hubba]

I have been assured by engineers that has actually undertaken the exercise
that unless you take into account relativistic mass increase it will not work
properly.

[hanson]

The better/worse side of Albi-to-be had to wait for another 20 years
before it roared down his daddy hard-on.... ahahaha... AHAHAHA...

[Hobba, hubba, hubba, hubba]

Your inane prattle amuses only one person - namely youseself.
AHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

[Willy]

Come on Bill, you're not giving him enough credit. I'm sure there
are others who are amused by his inane prattle.

[hanson]
Thanks for you kudos, Willy, despite their gauche chirality... ahahaha..
It is not quite clear whether Bill got mad because he got caught with
his pants down when he admitted that the was not an engineer but
that he has to be assured by them... or whether our uncle Bill got
all shaken (check his 2 liner) because I didn't pay enough reverence
to his Albeit-God and that relative religion of his and he felt that I had
committed Heresy, Blasphemy, Sacrilege, Irreverence and Profanity,
ahahaha.... which is why I had closed my post with:
news:VKBJe.2914$WD.1332@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
" Don't whine at me now, Bill... I am merely the messenger... but as
things are... I am sure that some fanatical disciples will jump up & down
now, just like the Muslims did who got irate because someone threw a
book called Quran into the toilet... ahahaha... Ever wonder how dull
and boring the world would be without believers and fanatics, be they
of a religious persuasion or a scientific conviction... ahaha... AHAHA.."
But, as you have seen, Willy, our uncle Bill jumped up and down.... ahahaha...
So, I am deeply indebted to you for having tried to come to my rescue
by placating Bill and ameliorating his cyber anguish... relatively....
Now, having touched onto chirality... according to another uncle who
spends most of his time in a urinAl, we should experience a very vast
loss in 6 weeks because of his departure from sci. physics. Announced
he from his urinAl: ** "I, looked to sci.physics as a resource to massage
heterodox but empirically allowable ideas. I have no imaginable use for the
toolbox past mid-September" **... ahaha...That is one brilliant exit strategy!
That will be an event to watch, roar, cajole and to AHAHAHAHA over...
ahahaha... ahahanson
.

User: "hanson"
Title: Re: Henri Poincaré Discovered Special Relativity, not Albert Einstein	08 Aug 2005 08:30:08 AM

ahahaha... hubba, hubba, hubba, "Bill Hobba" came back (as predicted)
and whined again in his relativity related rubbish&junk <rubbish@junk.com>
in news:9qDJe.75138$oJ.62724@news-server.bigpond.net.au...

"hanson" <hanson@quick.net> wrote in message
news:VKBJe.2914$WD.1332@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...

"Bill Hobba" <rubbish@junk.com> wrote relativity related rubbish and
junk in news:wtdJe.73773$oJ.30932@news-server.bigpond.net.au...

"hanson" <hanson@quick.net> wrote in message
news:kM7Je.2201$WD.1114@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...

"Perspicacious" <iperspicacious@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1123349444.498680.311410@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...

Paul Stowe wrote:

Yet you ignore response like,
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/sci.physics.research/msg/398700efdcfa3ccc
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/sci.physics.research/msg/af718d896054763f

[Perspirator]

Those are both terrific responses. I say those remarks
support a revolutionary thesis:
http://www.everythingimportant.org/viewtopic.php?t=1094

[hanson]
ahahaha... all this bellyaching over theories, which are nothing
more than stories, like SR/GR, is effectively a non issue because:

Anybody who works in mil/indust. Eng, R&D "does not need SR *****"

[Hobba, hubba, hubba, hubba]

Yea right - try and design a CRT without SR and see how far you get.
Bill

[Hobba, hubba, hubba, hubba]

I have been assured by engineers that has actually undertaken the exercise
that unless you take into account relativistic mass increase it will not work
properly.

[hanson]
.... mmmh... hmmm... AHAHAHAHA.... this is a good one, Bill... ahahaha...
So, you admitt that you are NOT even an engineer, but you claim to
know everything better based on what engineers have assured you of....
Thanks for the laughs, Bill.... ahahaha.... Really!...... ahahahaha...
.....and even more for the next 2 lines that you didn't snip... ahahaha...

[hanson]

The better/worse side of Albi-to-be had to wait for another 20 years
before it roared down his daddy hard-on.... ahahaha...

..... "as can be seen" (to use Potter's lead in #2), you did not snip
the above 2 lines since it apparently impressed you enormously
for some nepharious Freudian reasons. Therefore, for your benefit,
Bill, let me explain to you this same relativistic time travel phenomena
from a diffent frame in a more oblique tanh, within the light cone, without
doing any frame jumping nor any substantial frame dragging, in that:

The better/worse side of Albi-to-be had to wait for another 20 years
before it ran down his mommy's leg..... ahahahaha....

Bill, did you get it, git?... git it, ... git it... git it... ahahAHAHAHA...

[Hobba, hubba, hubba, hubba]

Your inane prattle amuses only one person - namely youseself.
AHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHA.
Rest of rubbish snipped.

[hanson]
.... snipped because the facts in it rattled the core values of your
religion... ahahaha.... Bill, your "AHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHA"
sounds so phony and contrived... ahahaha... Actually, admit it, Bill,
it cranked you and disturbed you... like empirical facts always do
crank and disturb any and all fanatics and disciples that must hang
onto some ideology/religion or cult for their raison d'etre. Hence,
for the relative benefit of your time traveling soul, let me repost
news:VKBJe.2914$WD.1332@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
.... in which it said:
Bill, you must be feeling lonely, attempting to make idle conversation by
issuing such a rubbish@junk. one liner. T'is how far you get with that:
= Even before 1859 Plucker and others proved that "cathode rays"
can be deflected & controlled by a magnetic field with a scanning
method. There was no Einstein then. The better/worse side of Albi-
to-be had to wait for another 20 years before it roared down his daddy
hard-on.... ahahaha... AHAHAHA...
= Fast forward. Why would you wanna design a CRT, when heuristic
industry moves to Plasma and LCD displays... neither of which
requires relativity. That's how far you get with that... ahahaha.. ahahaha...
Bill, obviously you have never been neither mil/indust. Eng, R&D or
you'd know that a design is just a layout, a roadmap, a scheme to
manufacture a product. The moment the actual hardware assy process
begins, the "design" is changed continuously, it is fiddled around with
by the ancient-modern-update scheme (do step/test/check/next step)x
by trial and error...until the gadget is built and works and nobody even
thinks about any fucking relativity. .....The same goes for your CRT, the
cyclotrons or GPS.
Now, once the gismo is built, THEN and ONLY then will it happen that
"Anybody who works in Promo, Sales & Movies "loves SR by the shitload"
ahahaha... AHAHAHA.... hey, why not... if SR/GR helps to generate
Sales... then all the power to it....
So, Bill, don't start to cry now. Your SR/GR will be around for a long
time... but not and never as a tool/part/component that manufactures
hardware. SR/GR is only a fucking story. At best it's an instrument that
"describes"... "Don't oversell relativity", said poster Meron who has
more reason that most here to say that. Even Franz Heymann
who spent decades at CERN posted that he only "learned" SR/GR
AFTER he retired.... Heed your buddies' advice, Bill...ahahaha...
I think it is hilarious that there are still herds of mooches around who
sheepishly follow and obediently suck greedily Einstein's *****... ahaha...
while the rest of the world moves on...... It is of now wonder that the
Bavarian Higher edu system has dropped "relativity" as a mandatory
requirement. Heymann, Meron and the Bavarians do know that nobody
ever said "Now, that we have SR let us develop a steel/glassn' wire
gismos, based on SR, so that we can see how far we get"...
ahahaha.. thanks for the laughs, Bill, and this is how far you got.
ahahaha... ahahahansom

[hanson]

User: "Helmut Wabnig EmailAddress"
Title: Re: Henri Poincaré Discovered Special Relativity, not Albert Einstein	08 Aug 2005 11:10:18 AM

On Mon, 08 Aug 2005 13:30:08 GMT, "hanson" <hanson@quick.net> wrote:

more reason that most here to say that. Even Franz Heymann
who spent decades at CERN posted that he only "learned" SR/GR
AFTER he retired....

he learned.
hanson not.
"zero knowledge hanson" will be your name from now on.
ZERO-KNOWLEDGE-HANSON
w.
.

User: "hanson"
Title: Re: Henri Poincaré Discovered Special Relativity, not Albert Einstein	08 Aug 2005 02:09:21 PM

"Helmut Wabnig" aka "Heil Wut Wabnigger" barked and cajoled
in message news:cr0ff112rt7rgl1lnkdjo02surpm8um7pj@4ax.com...
[hanson]

So, Helmo, don't start to cry now. Your SR/GR will be around for a long
time... but not and never as a tool/part/component that manufactures
hardware. SR/GR is only a fucking story. At best it's an instrument that
"describes"... "Don't oversell relativity", said poster Meron who has
more reason that most here to say that. Even Franz Heymann
who spent decades at CERN posted that he only "learned" SR/GR
AFTER he retired.... Heed your buddies' advice, Helmo...ahahaha...

[Wabnigger in his Heil Wut barks]

he [Franz] learned.
hanson not.
"zero knowledge hanson" will be your name from now on.
ZERO-KNOWLEDGE-HANSON
w. wau... wau... wau.. wau...

[hanson]
ahahaha... but Helmo, you repeat what I sad. The fact that Franz
worked for 30 years as a group leader in CERN and never needed
SR/GR is indicative that theory is not needed in the real world.
AHAHAHA... ahahaha... So, listen Wabniggie, you are barking quite
uncontrollably now and yet the REAL reason for your tantrums is
that you are mad at me because you walked like a cajoling loud-
mouthed Wabnigger into this one here, again:
--------------------->
"hanson" <hanson@quick.net> wrote in message
news:YaVye.1751$BK1.445@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net...

<Helmut Wabnig> cranked himself in message
news:gj2oc1lnkl6g6fdro1n9llvsttqdefcq77@4ax.com...

(I am quite familiar with German obscenities).

[hanson]

ahahaha... yeah, yeah, yeah... you are one of them.
Thanks for the laughs, schmuck!
ahahaha... ahahahanson
<------------------

[hanson]
ahahaha.... my evaluation of you must be a fact, else it wouldn't
have caused you to follow me around with my hook in your mouth....
All you gotta do Helmo/Elmo is to stay away from me and then
the hook will fall out... Give it a try.... but do it without any Hellwut.
You would be one pain less in your ***** to yourself with only the
sad loss of your outsourced job and your pitiful fear of Excel
spreadsheets remaining... But, better 2 torments then 3... isn't it.
ahahaha... ahahahanson
.

User: "Helmut Wabnig EmailAddress"
Title: Re: Henri Poincaré Discovered Special Relativity, not Albert Einstein	08 Aug 2005 11:49:31 AM

On Mon, 08 Aug 2005 13:30:08 GMT, "hanson" <hanson@quick.net> wrote:

ahahaha... all this bellyaching over theories, which are nothing
more than stories, like SR/GR, is effectively a non issue because:

Anybody who works in mil/indust. Eng, R&D "does not need SR *****"

Not just RT. Any rpt ANY theoretical knowledge.
Have you ever watched how new, fast growing companies
are taken over by the zero.knowledge-hanson-type management?
Knowledge?
WE don't need that, WE just care for throughput, lot count,
numbers of processed items.
Quality?
Ah, what.
Make the customer return departement larger and larger,
until it is larger than the sales departement.
Zero-knowledge-hanson-type managers always find a solution
which saves their ***** FOR THE MOMENT.
1.) Produce more EXCEL sheets. Hire more EXCEL sheet acrobats.
Buy some shredders to get rid of them sheets after presentation, they
contain secret stuff, you know. Trend continues until the company
produces more EXCEL sheets than goods.
2.)The EXCEL sheets unmistakenly document that there are too many
operators and workers in the factory. Fire 50% of the working force
and present an EXCEL sheet to the stock holders.
3.) Excel sheet zero-knowledge-hanson-type managers
discover there are too many janitors in the company.
Fire 50%. Clean the toilets once a week from now on.
Bring your own toilet paper.
4.)production problems of technical kind are handed over
to external companies. Zero-knowledge-hanson-type managers
can handle telephone calls in case a problem surfaces
in the factory. They are proud of it. The external consultants
mangle the company like a Christmas turkey.
5.) The company sells part of it's properties,
"concentrating on the core business", thus the buyout is camouflaged.
6.)The zero-knowledge-hanson-type managers move
production to Asia, fire everybody else except themselves.
Video conferencing with poker face Chinese from home,
sweet home, with two or three beamers in every meeting room.
Ay, hanson, ZERO-KNOWLEDGE-hanson, been there, seen that.
w.
.

User: "hanson"
Title: Re: Henri Poincaré Discovered Special Relativity, not Albert Einstein	08 Aug 2005 02:09:23 PM

"Helmut Wabnig" aka "Heil Wut Wabnigger" is ferociously barking in
his news:kl1ff1l5rhor6e2009hjd7k3k67618gopg@4ax.com...

hanson" <hanson@quick.net> wrote:

ahahaha... all this bellyaching over theories, which are nothing
more than stories, like SR/GR, is effectively a non issue because:
Anybody who works in mil/indust. Eng, R&D "does not need SR *****"
Anybody who works in *.edu & for R-grants "does need SR, - No *****"
Anybody who works in Promo, Sales & Movies "loves SR by the shitload"
Any Jew protects it as his cultural heritage whether "SR is ***** or not".

[hanson]
ahahaha... AHAHAHA... ahahaha..... ahahahaha... ahahahaha...
Now, Helmut the cyber mutt is going out of his mind in his hellen Wut
and conducts a Wabnigger type relative Q&A monolog session with
himself (see below) that centers around his fascination with Excel
spreadsheets which he apparently does not understand.... ahahaha...
and then he brags/bemoans that his job got outsourced... ahahaha..
So, Helmoron, I am so sorry to hear that this sad fate and hard times
fell upon you. But your barking into the Usenet is hardly going to change
your plight and pains. It naturally may have to do a lot with that I must
have pegged you right in the post that bent your mind in/at this here
cyber party. Here it is again, for your benefit, for you not to walk like a
loudmouthed Wabnigger into this one here, again:
"hanson" <hanson@quick.net> wrote in message
news:YaVye.1751$BK1.445@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net...

<Helmut Wabnig> cranked himself in message
news:gj2oc1lnkl6g6fdro1n9llvsttqdefcq77@4ax.com...

(I am quite familiar with German obscenities).

[hanson]

ahahaha... yeah, yeah, yeah... you are one of them.
Thanks for the laughs, schmuck!
ahahaha... ahahahanson

[hanson]
Take my hook out of your mouth, Helmut....
Thanks for the laughs, Oelstreicher.... ahahaha...
ahahaha... ahahanson

[hanson]

Anybody who works in mil/indust. Eng, R&D "does not need SR *****"

[Wabnigger's Q&As show his management talent]

Have you ever watched how new, fast growing companies
are taken over by the zero.knowledge-hanson-type management?

Not just RT. Any rpt ANY theoretical knowledge.

Knowledge?

WE don't need that, WE just care for throughput, lot count,
numbers of processed items.

Quality?

Ah, what.
Make the customer return departement larger and larger,
until it is larger than the sales departement.

Zero-knowledge-hanson-type managers always find a solution
which saves their ***** FOR THE MOMENT.

1.) Produce more EXCEL sheets. Hire more EXCEL sheet acrobats.
Buy some shredders to get rid of them sheets after presentation, they
contain secret stuff, you know. Trend continues until the company
produces more EXCEL sheets than goods.

2.)The EXCEL sheets unmistakenly document that there are too many
operators and workers in the factory. Fire 50% of the working force
and present an EXCEL sheet to the stock holders.

3.) Excel sheet zero-knowledge-hanson-type managers
discover there are too many janitors in the company.
Fire 50%. Clean the toilets once a week from now on.
Bring your own toilet paper.

4.)production problems of technical kind are handed over
to external companies. Zero-knowledge-hanson-type managers
can handle telephone calls in case a problem surfaces
in the factory. They are proud of it. The external consultants
mangle the company like a Christmas turkey.

5.) The company sells part of it's properties,
"concentrating on the core business", thus the buyout is camouflaged.

6.)The zero-knowledge-hanson-type managers move
production to Asia, fire everybody else except themselves.
Video conferencing with poker face Chinese from home,
sweet home, with two or three beamers in every meeting room.

Ay, hanson, ZERO-KNOWLEDGE-hanson, been there, seen that.

w.

[hanson]
..... I will certainly pass your **"been there, seen that" ** outsourcing
pain along to the government. If you receive more unemployment
compensation or food stamps, you then can ascribe it solely to
my humanitarian efforts, which made the upgrade of your living
standard better. I wish luck, Helmut, and I am sorry that your teat
got caught in the wringer....
hanson (see, I am not laughing, now)

but

I can't

suppress it much longer

hahah :-) :-) :-) :-)) wwwhhooooaahh :-)))
hahahah...hahah.....hohhhhhhohho..hahahah....
uuhhhhhaaahhahahah....wohahhh..hahaha.....
wohahhh..hahaha.....hahaha.......hahah.....
hohhhhhhohho..hahahah....wohahhh..hahaha.....
hahaha....hahahah...hahah.....hohhhhhhohho..
hahahaaaa........whoahhhhhhhh........hohohoh.......
uuhhhhhaaahhahahah....wohahhh..hahaha.....
hahaha.......hahah..... :-)) :<) :-))) ;>))
hohhhhhhohho..hahahah....wohahhh..hahaha.....
hahaha....hahahah...hahah.....hohhhhhhohho..
hahahah....wohahhh..hahaha.....hahaha.......
hahah.....hohhhhhhohho..hahahah....wohahhh..
hahahaaaa........whoahhhhhhhh........hohohoh.......
uuhhhhhaaahhahaha.....:-)) :<) :-))) ;>))
hohhhhhhohho..hahahah....wohahhh..hahaha....
hahaha.......hahah.....hohhhhhhohho..hahahah....
......:-)) :<) :-))) ;>)) hahaha....hahahah...hahah.....
hohhhhhhohho..hahahah....wohahhh..hahaha.....
hahahaaaa........whoahhhhhhhh........hohohoh.......
uuhhhhhaaahhahaha.......hahah.....hohhhhhhohho..
wohahhh..hahaha.....hahaha....hahahah...hahah
hohhhhhhohho..hahahah....wohahhh..hahaha.....
hahaha............:-)) :<) :-))) ;>)) hohhhhhhohho..
wohahhh..hahaha.....hahaha....hahahah....
.