Science > Physics > [OT] What are the characteristics of 13 amp mains flex?
| Topic: |
Science > Physics |
| User: |
"Urman" |
| Date: |
31 Oct 2006 01:53:42 PM |
| Object: |
[OT] What are the characteristics of 13 amp mains flex? |
I am in the UK and have an old portable electric heater.
The mains flex to the heater is like that to a domestic iron: woven
fabric outer overlaying a rubber (?) outer sheath. With each of the
three leads covered in rubber insulation and three cords running
alongside the three leads.
(1) Is the fabric outer to make the flex resistent to KINKING? Or is
it there for HEAT PROTECTION?
(2) Is the RUBBER used in this sort of flex especially resistent to
TEMPERATURE?
(3) Are the alternative materials (such as silicone rubber) used in
modern equivalents to this type of lead SUPERIOR IN ALL RESPECTS to the
sort of flex I have described?
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| User: "Andrew Mawson" |
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| Title: Re: [OT] What are the characteristics of 13 amp mains flex? |
31 Oct 2006 02:11:17 PM |
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"Urman" <no.no.no@com.com> wrote in message
news:Xns986DCA62581A8835A1B@127.0.0.1...
I am in the UK and have an old portable electric heater.
The mains flex to the heater is like that to a domestic iron: woven
fabric outer overlaying a rubber (?) outer sheath. With each of the
three leads covered in rubber insulation and three cords running
alongside the three leads.
(1) Is the fabric outer to make the flex resistent to KINKING? Or
is
it there for HEAT PROTECTION?
(2) Is the RUBBER used in this sort of flex especially resistent to
TEMPERATURE?
(3) Are the alternative materials (such as silicone rubber) used in
modern equivalents to this type of lead SUPERIOR IN ALL RESPECTS to
the
sort of flex I have described?
I have found that the silicone rubber modern ones tend to split rather
easily if frequently flexed. Examples : a/ Weller bench mounted
soldering iron - lasts about a year before cable needing replacing. b/
My dentists magic camera that he pokes in my mouth - silicone rubber
sheath cable split within 6 months
AWEM
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| User: "gort" |
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| Title: Re: [OT] What are the characteristics of 13 amp mains flex? |
31 Oct 2006 11:27:07 PM |
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I have found that the silicone rubber modern ones tend to split rather
easily if frequently flexed. Examples : a/ Weller bench mounted
soldering iron - lasts about a year before cable needing replacing. b/
My dentists magic camera that he pokes in my mouth - silicone rubber
sheath cable split within 6 months
AWEM
Never really saw that with all the production Wellers we had in the
factory, must have had 20-30 going 8 hours a day, 5 days a week.
Dave
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| User: "Dave Plowman News" |
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| Title: Re: [OT] What are the characteristics of 13 amp mains flex? |
31 Oct 2006 04:30:32 PM |
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In article <fqydnaPzl-p0MNrYRVnyjw@bt.com>,
Andrew Mawson <andrew@no_spam_please_mawson.org.uk> wrote:
Examples : a/ Weller bench mounted
soldering iron - lasts about a year before cable needing replacing.
Hmm. My oldest Antex must be something like 15 years old. I do have
several and swop them to the PS rather than change bits, but of course one
gets the most use and I've not had any problems. Is your Weller in heavy
use?
--
*Organized Crime Is Alive And Well; It's Called Auto Insurance.
Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.
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| User: "Rod Speed" |
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| Title: Re: [OT] What are the characteristics of 13 amp mains flex? |
31 Oct 2006 08:25:23 PM |
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Dave Plowman (News) <dave@davenoise.co.uk> wrote
Andrew Mawson <andrew@no_spam_please_mawson.org.uk> wrote
I have found that the silicone rubber modern
ones tend to split rather easily if frequently flexed.
Examples : a/ Weller bench mounted soldering iron
- lasts about a year before cable needing replacing.
Hmm. My oldest Antex must be something like 15 years old.
I do have several and swop them to the PS rather than change
bits, but of course one gets the most use and I've not had any
problems. Is your Weller in heavy use?
My Wellers are much older than that and havent split.
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| User: "Owain" |
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| Title: Re: [OT] What are the characteristics of 13 amp mains flex? |
31 Oct 2006 04:57:58 PM |
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Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Examples : a/ Weller bench mounted
soldering iron - lasts about a year before cable needing replacing.
Hmm. My oldest Antex must be something like 15 years old.
My Antex must be over 20 years old and still on its first flex, been
used for everything from soldering to pyrography to, erm, well quite a
lot of things.
IIRC the stand had to get glued back together where it got dropped and
the coily wire would no longer stay in.
Owain
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| User: "Dave Plowman News" |
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| Title: Re: [OT] What are the characteristics of 13 amp mains flex? |
01 Nov 2006 07:29:49 AM |
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In article <1162384364.4422.0@proxy02.news.clara.net>,
Owain <owain47125@stirlingcity.coo.uk> wrote:
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Examples : a/ Weller bench mounted
soldering iron - lasts about a year before cable needing replacing.
Hmm. My oldest Antex must be something like 15 years old.
My Antex must be over 20 years old and still on its first flex, been
used for everything from soldering to pyrography to, erm, well quite a
lot of things.
Indeed - but of course not all Antex irons use silicone flex.
IIRC the stand had to get glued back together where it got dropped and
the coily wire would no longer stay in.
Mine is screwed to the bench. ;-)
Owain
--
*If at first you don't succeed, redefine success.
Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.
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| User: "Owain" |
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| Title: Re: [OT] What are the characteristics of 13 amp mains flex? |
01 Nov 2006 11:30:05 AM |
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Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
IIRC the stand had to get glued back together where it got dropped and
the coily wire would no longer stay in.
Mine is screwed to the bench. ;-)
I wasn't carrying a bench down six flights of stairs and halfway across
campus every time something fell apart in the student radio station.
Anyway, anything screwed down would probably have got nicked. I
hardwired everything in without fuses so if someone tried to walk off
with owt they'd have got some sparks for their trouble.
Owain
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| User: "Squibbly" |
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| Title: Re: [OT] What are the characteristics of 13 amp mains flex? |
03 Nov 2006 02:10:20 AM |
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"Urman" <no.no.no@com.com> wrote in message
news:Xns986DCA62581A8835A1B@127.0.0.1...
I am in the UK and have an old portable electric heater.
The mains flex to the heater is like that to a domestic iron: woven
fabric outer overlaying a rubber (?) outer sheath. With each of the
three leads covered in rubber insulation and three cords running
alongside the three leads.
(1) Is the fabric outer to make the flex resistent to KINKING? Or is
it there for HEAT PROTECTION?
(2) Is the RUBBER used in this sort of flex especially resistent to
TEMPERATURE?
(3) Are the alternative materials (such as silicone rubber) used in
modern equivalents to this type of lead SUPERIOR IN ALL RESPECTS to the
sort of flex I have described?
they dont do that anymore
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| User: "Androcles" |
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| Title: Re: [OT] What are the characteristics of 13 amp mains flex? |
31 Oct 2006 03:18:26 PM |
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"Urman" <no.no.no@com.com> wrote in message
news:Xns986DCA62581A8835A1B@127.0.0.1...
|I am in the UK and have an old portable electric heater.
So donate it to a museum or scrap yard.
| The mains flex to the heater is like that to a domestic iron: woven
| fabric outer overlaying a rubber (?) outer sheath.
Yes, it is vulcanized latex, better known as "rubber".
| With each of the
| three leads covered in rubber insulation and three cords running
| alongside the three leads.
The string is to prevent stretching.
| (1) Is the fabric outer to make the flex resistent to KINKING?
Yes. But it frays with excessive twisting/bending, usually where it
enters the appliance. No need to shout.
| Or is
| it there for HEAT PROTECTION?
No. Cotton is flammable.
| (2) Is the RUBBER used in this sort of flex especially resistent to
| TEMPERATURE?
No. The cord or flex should be kept away from direct heat.
After entering the appliance (iron, toaster, heater) the rubber sheath
and fabric is stripped away and the conductors sheathed in a heat
resistant material that also insulates, such as fibreglass.
| (3) Are the alternative materials (such as silicone rubber) used in
| modern equivalents to this type of lead SUPERIOR IN ALL RESPECTS to the
| sort of flex I have described?
In general, yes, material science has made improvements over
older technology, although the techniques of insulation have changed little.
A neighbour of mine recently asked me if I knew of anyone interested
in a Betamax VCR. I told him he had to be joking and found one
on e-bay to show him, £0.99.
If you want to use old technology, go the whole hog and light a
coal fire, clean out the ashes each day and hire a chimney sweep
on a regular basis - if you can find one - see Mary Poppins.
Get a wooden clothes horse and dry your knickers in front of
the fire.
Otherwise find an empty space in a bin or scrap yard before
you incinerate yourself and your family accidentally.
Androcles
(Note to Dork Van de merde: it's ok for *you* to use old appliances.)
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| User: "Andrew Gabriel" |
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| Title: Re: [OT] What are the characteristics of 13 amp mains flex? |
31 Oct 2006 03:09:29 PM |
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In article <Xns986DCA62581A8835A1B@127.0.0.1>,
Urman <no.no.no@com.com> writes:
I am in the UK and have an old portable electric heater.
The mains flex to the heater is like that to a domestic iron: woven
fabric outer overlaying a rubber (?) outer sheath. With each of the
three leads covered in rubber insulation and three cords running
alongside the three leads.
(1) Is the fabric outer to make the flex resistent to KINKING? Or is
it there for HEAT PROTECTION?
(2) Is the RUBBER used in this sort of flex especially resistent to
TEMPERATURE?
(3) Are the alternative materials (such as silicone rubber) used in
modern equivalents to this type of lead SUPERIOR IN ALL RESPECTS to the
sort of flex I have described?
The answers to these questions have completely changed over time.
Back when your heater was bought, the cotten cover improved the
heat resistance of the cord against coming in contact with hot
surfaces. Nowadays, various types of man-made rubber can survive
higher temperatures than cotten so it's no longer used for this
purpose.
However, you'll still find cotten covering on iron cords. The
reason for this is that rubber cords catch on the fabric you are
trying to iron and move it on the ironing board, whereas the
cotten covering helps reduce the effect as it slides easier
against fabrics.
--
Andrew Gabriel
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| User: "Andrew Gabriel" |
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| Title: Re: [OT] What are the characteristics of 13 amp mains flex? |
01 Nov 2006 02:02:54 AM |
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In article <4547bb89$0$626$5a6aecb4@news.aaisp.net.uk>,
andrew@cucumber.demon.co.uk (Andrew Gabriel) writes:
In article <Xns986DCA62581A8835A1B@127.0.0.1>,
Urman <no.no.no@com.com> writes:
I am in the UK and have an old portable electric heater.
The mains flex to the heater is like that to a domestic iron: woven
fabric outer overlaying a rubber (?) outer sheath. With each of the
three leads covered in rubber insulation and three cords running
alongside the three leads.
(1) Is the fabric outer to make the flex resistent to KINKING? Or is
it there for HEAT PROTECTION?
(2) Is the RUBBER used in this sort of flex especially resistent to
TEMPERATURE?
(3) Are the alternative materials (such as silicone rubber) used in
modern equivalents to this type of lead SUPERIOR IN ALL RESPECTS to the
sort of flex I have described?
The answers to these questions have completely changed over time.
Back when your heater was bought, the cotten cover improved the
heat resistance of the cord against coming in contact with hot
By "cord" here, I mean the whole cable, and not the three pieces of
string (which are just fillers to keep the outer shape circular,
which helps avoid kinking).
surfaces. Nowadays, various types of man-made rubber can survive
higher temperatures than cotten so it's no longer used for this
purpose.
However, you'll still find cotten covering on iron cords. The
reason for this is that rubber cords catch on the fabric you are
trying to iron and move it on the ironing board, whereas the
cotten covering helps reduce the effect as it slides easier
against fabrics.
--
Andrew Gabriel
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| User: "Alex Coleman" |
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| Title: Re: [OT] What are the characteristics of 13 amp mains flex? |
03 Nov 2006 03:22:27 PM |
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On 31 Oct 2006, Andrew Gabriel <andrew@cucumber.demon.co.uk> wrote:
In article <Xns986DCA62581A8835A1B@127.0.0.1>,
Urman <no.no.no@com.com> writes:
I am in the UK and have an old portable electric heater.
The mains flex to the heater is like that to a domestic iron:
woven fabric outer overlaying a rubber (?) outer sheath. With
each of the three leads covered in rubber insulation and three
cords running alongside the three leads.
(1) Is the fabric outer to make the flex resistent to KINKING?
Or is it there for HEAT PROTECTION?
(2) Is the RUBBER used in this sort of flex especially resistent
to TEMPERATURE?
(3) Are the alternative materials (such as silicone rubber) used
in modern equivalents to this type of lead SUPERIOR IN ALL
RESPECTS to the sort of flex I have described?
The answers to these questions have completely changed over time.
Back when your heater was bought, the cotten cover improved the
heat resistance of the cord against coming in contact with hot
surfaces. Nowadays, various types of man-made rubber can survive
higher temperatures than cotten so it's no longer used for this
purpose.
However, you'll still find cotten covering on iron cords. The
reason for this is that rubber cords catch on the fabric you are
trying to iron and move it on the ironing board, whereas the
cotten covering helps reduce the effect as it slides easier
against fabrics.
Is Butyl Rubber better than silicone rubber for heat resistance?
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| User: "Ben Newsam" |
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| Title: Re: [OT] What are the characteristics of 13 amp mains flex? |
03 Nov 2006 06:21:13 PM |
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On Fri, 03 Nov 2006 21:22:27 GMT, Alex Coleman <no@no-email.com>
wrote:
Is Butyl Rubber better than silicone rubber for heat resistance?
"Liar, liar! Tits on fire!"
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| User: "Urman" |
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| Title: [OT] Where is British Standard for mains cables? |
03 Nov 2006 05:57:06 AM |
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On 31 Oct 2006, Andrew Gabriel <andrew@cucumber.demon.co.uk> wrote:
In article <Xns986DCA62581A8835A1B@127.0.0.1>,
Urman <no.no.no@com.com> writes:
I am in the UK and have an old portable electric heater.
The mains flex to the heater is like that to a domestic iron:
woven fabric outer overlaying a rubber (?) outer sheath. With
each of the three leads covered in rubber insulation and three
cords running alongside the three leads.
(1) Is the fabric outer to make the flex resistent to KINKING?
Or is it there for HEAT PROTECTION?
(2) Is the RUBBER used in this sort of flex especially resistent
to TEMPERATURE?
(3) Are the alternative materials (such as silicone rubber) used
in modern equivalents to this type of lead SUPERIOR IN ALL
RESPECTS to the sort of flex I have described?
The answers to these questions have completely changed over time.
Back when your heater was bought, the cotten cover improved the
heat resistance of the cord against coming in contact with hot
surfaces. Nowadays, various types of man-made rubber can survive
higher temperatures than cotten so it's no longer used for this
purpose.
However, you'll still find cotten covering on iron cords. The
reason for this is that rubber cords catch on the fabric you are
trying to iron and move it on the ironing board, whereas the
cotten covering helps reduce the effect as it slides easier
against fabrics.
Is there somewhere on the net where I can see the British Standard
for main cables for free? The sites I try seem to charge for it.
Based on this search http://tinyurl.com/ycnzz8 I think the standard
is BS6500 (1990).
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| User: "Andrew Gabriel" |
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| Title: Re: [OT] Where is British Standard for mains cables? |
03 Nov 2006 05:19:43 PM |
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In article <Xns9870799443D5171F3M4@127.0.0.1>,
Urman <no@no-email.com> writes:
Is there somewhere on the net where I can see the British Standard
for main cables for free? The sites I try seem to charge for it.
That's because British Standards charge for all their standards.
When the standard is a joint one with some other body (as in the
case of the Wiring Regs), it is usually cheaper from the other
body.
Based on this search http://tinyurl.com/ycnzz8 I think the standard
is BS6500 (1990).
"Electric cables. Flexible cords rated at 300/500V, for use
with appliances and equipment intended for domestic, office
and similar environments."
A 1990 version would be out of date (I see a reference to a
2000 version, but I don't know if that's the latest).
--
Andrew Gabriel
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| User: "Rod Speed" |
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| Title: Re: [OT] What are the characteristics of 13 amp mains flex? |
31 Oct 2006 08:25:31 PM |
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Urman <no.no.no@com.com> wrote
I am in the UK and have an old portable electric heater.
The mains flex to the heater is like that to a domestic iron:
woven fabric outer overlaying a rubber (?) outer sheath.
With each of the three leads covered in rubber insulation
and three cords running alongside the three leads.
(1) Is the fabric outer to make the flex resistent to KINKING?
Nope, its just there to keep the 3 inner wires together.
Its a bit more flexible than the more common plastic or rubber outer.
Or is it there for HEAT PROTECTION?
NOpe.
(2) Is the RUBBER used in this sort of flex
especially resistent to TEMPERATURE?
Nope, its what was used before plastic was cheaper.
(3) Are the alternative materials (such as silicone rubber)
used in modern equivalents to this type of lead SUPERIOR
IN ALL RESPECTS to the sort of flex I have described?
Not really, its just cheaper now than rubber.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: What are the characteristics of 13 amp mains flex? |
01 Nov 2006 01:13:13 AM |
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Urman wrote:
I am in the UK and have an old portable electric heater.
The mains flex to the heater is like that to a domestic iron: woven
fabric outer overlaying a rubber (?) outer sheath. With each of the
three leads covered in rubber insulation and three cords running
alongside the three leads.
(1) Is the fabric outer to make the flex resistent to KINKING?
no, they probably kink more than any other type of flex
Or is
it there for HEAT PROTECTION?
sort of, it offers some protection but not a lot. Modern pvc flexes are
nowhere near as heat tolerant as cotton/rubber.
(2) Is the RUBBER used in this sort of flex especially resistent to
TEMPERATURE?
relative to pvc, yes. Relative to any other rubber, no
(3) Are the alternative materials (such as silicone rubber) used in
modern equivalents to this type of lead SUPERIOR IN ALL RESPECTS to the
sort of flex I have described?
butyl rubber
NT
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