Science > Physics > Question about conditions required for DNA based life to form and evolve.
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Science > Physics |
| User: |
"Jan Panteltje" |
| Date: |
16 Feb 2005 07:06:39 AM |
| Object: |
Question about conditions required for DNA based life to form and evolve. |
Have not done a crack post to thsee groups for a while, so be prepared.
I keep reading in places that 'water' and some sort of 'energy' source,
be it heat or sunlight, or whatever is a requirement for 'life' on
other planets,
Long time ago I did read up on polymerase chain reaction, they use that
process to multiply existing DNA.
For what I understand it involves cycling the temperature (above and below
a specific value).
Here my hypothesis:
For strands of DNA to multiply these oscillation in temperature would be
needed, or IF those changes exists in an environment there would be many
copies created (and if you are into that perhaps mutations?).
Note the process is exponential.
So is it a bad idea to think that when looking for life we need:
water, energy source, and CYCLIC temperature changes?
This could be caused by a rotation (sun - day/night), or some periodic
vulcanism (geyser), and the temperature should ALSO vary around a specific
fixed point (rather small range).
So that would lead to specific places to look for life, and exclude a lot.
<flames: No Smoking Please>
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| User: "Hotepbubba" |
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| Title: Re: Question about conditions required for DNA based life to form and evolve. |
16 Feb 2005 09:03:27 AM |
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"Jan Panteltje" <pNaonStpealmtje@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1108559198.b0bdbe141610370038cd34c586843729@teranews...
Have not done a crack post to thsee groups for a while, so be prepared.
I keep reading in places that 'water' and some sort of 'energy' source,
be it heat or sunlight, or whatever is a requirement for 'life' on
other planets,
Long time ago I did read up on polymerase chain reaction, they use that
process to multiply existing DNA.
For what I understand it involves cycling the temperature (above and below
a specific value).
Here my hypothesis:
For strands of DNA to multiply these oscillation in temperature would be
needed, or IF those changes exists in an environment there would be many
copies created (and if you are into that perhaps mutations?).
Note the process is exponential.
So is it a bad idea to think that when looking for life we need:
water, energy source, and CYCLIC temperature changes?
This could be caused by a rotation (sun - day/night), or some periodic
vulcanism (geyser), and the temperature should ALSO vary around a specific
fixed point (rather small range).
So that would lead to specific places to look for life, and exclude a lot.
<flames: No Smoking Please>
Liquid Water, so temp range must be in the 32 to 200 F .
The water vapor pressure would require most of the planet to be in this
range as well.
Which places it in a certain distance range from a sun, requires it to be in
a size range as well.
Water needs not to be contaminated with a lot of hydrocarbons etc, so the
planet size cannot be too big either.
Also, planet needs some protection from ionizing radiation, i.e. magnetic
field, as that will kill off life, by cutting DNA strands all the time.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Question about conditions required for DNA based life to form and evolve. |
16 Feb 2005 11:33:30 PM |
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Jan Panteltje wrote:
Have not done a crack post to thsee groups for a while, so be
prepared.
I keep reading in places that 'water' and some sort of 'energy'
source,
be it heat or sunlight, or whatever is a requirement for 'life' on
other planets,
Not many people ever claimed that.
The claim is that you need water to start anything.
Be it life or a galaxy.
And you need energy to start everything.
Be it a telescope, or an evo-dweeb with
a mircoscope.
Since water is the only molecule that
is self-replicating without DNA, and
doesn't a planet.
And energy is not really a requirement for and
anything. It's just a mathematician's
mistake waiting to be erased.
So it's dualistic.
It a drunken ruler leading a stoned clock
from Egypt to Jeruselum carrying a basket of eggs,
that are too rancid to eat, too deadly to drop,
and too gay to be a surviving population.
Long time ago I did read up on polymerase chain reaction, they use
that
process to multiply existing DNA.
For what I understand it involves cycling the temperature (above and
below
a specific value).
Here my hypothesis:
For strands of DNA to multiply these oscillation in temperature would
be
needed, or IF those changes exists in an environment there would be
many
copies created (and if you are into that perhaps mutations?).
Note the process is exponential.
So is it a bad idea to think that when looking for life we need:
water, energy source, and CYCLIC temperature changes?
This could be caused by a rotation (sun - day/night), or some
periodic
vulcanism (geyser), and the temperature should ALSO vary around a
specific
fixed point (rather small range).
So that would lead to specific places to look for life, and exclude a
lot.
<flames: No Smoking Please>
.
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| User: "Q-on" |
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| Title: Re: Question about conditions required for DNA based life to form and evolve. |
16 Feb 2005 11:56:55 PM |
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To continue with the above. If living organism needs qi or as
implied by Subquantum Kinetics that all things need qi. What
would happen if one would project extra qi to objects or
living system. Would there be alterations in the objects properties?
Yes. The following china qi experiments shows exactly that.
http://www.accessv.com/~yuan/yansci/time/2002_YanXin_Qigong_JSE.pdf
Now need to add something important. The qi or ether of
the Earth is colored by our planet unique nature. Hence
the qi from the moon and the qi from the earth is different.
So in searching for planets that can support life, you must
take into consideration the unique qi of the planet as colored
by the unique planetary ether. The MMX showed null result
because the ether is attracted by gravity to the planet or
maybe a Lorentz Aether Theory connection as hinted by
La Violette himself. His model at:
http://www.etheric.com/LaVioletteBooks/ether.html
..
Q-on
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| User: "Uncle Al" |
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| Title: Re: Question about conditions required for DNA based life to form andevolve. |
17 Feb 2005 09:06:32 AM |
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Q-on wrote:
To continue with the above. If living organism needs qi or as
implied by Subquantum Kinetics that all things need qi.
[snip crap]
Idiot.
Physics Today 57(7) 40 (2004)
http://physicstoday.org/vol-57/iss-7/p40.shtml
No aether
http://fsweb.berry.edu/academic/mans/clane/
http://physicsweb.org/articles/world/17/3/7
No Lorentz violation
Michelson-Morley in 1887, then
Phys. Rev. Lett. 88(1) 010401 (2002)
Phys. Rev. Lett. 90 060403 (2003)
Phys. Rev. Lett. 42(9) 549 (1979)
Phys. Bull. 21 255 (1970)
Europhysics Lett. 56(2) 170 (2001)
Gen. Rel. Grav. 34(9) 1371 (2002)
Kennedy-Thorndike experiments
Ives-Stilwell experiments
Hughes-Drever experiments
Weak field
<http://tycho.usno.navy.mil/ptti/ptti2002/paper20.pdf>
Nature 425 374 (2003)
http://www.eftaylor.com/pub/projecta.pdf
<http://www.public.asu.edu/~rjjacob/Lecture16.pdf>
<http://relativity.livingreviews.org/Articles/lrr-2003-1/index.html>
Relativity in the GPS system
and strong field,
Science 303(5661) 1143;1153 (2004)
http://arXiv.org/abs/astro-ph/0401086
http://arxiv.org/abs/astro-ph/0312071
<http://relativity.livingreviews.org/Articles/lrr-2003-5/index.html>
Deeply relativistic neutron star binaries
If your opinions veer otherwise you are an empirical *****.
--
Uncle Al
http://www.mazepath.com/uncleal/
(Toxic URL! Unsafe for children and most mammals)
http://www.mazepath.com/uncleal/qz.pdf
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| User: "Q-on" |
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| Title: Re: Question about conditions required for DNA based life to form and evolve. |
16 Feb 2005 10:56:13 PM |
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Jan Panteltje wrote:
Have not done a crack post to thsee groups for a while, so be
prepared.
I keep reading in places that 'water' and some sort of 'energy'
source,
be it heat or sunlight, or whatever is a requirement for 'life' on
other planets,
You need qi. Without qi. DNA can't develope. In normal
material such as iron. It doesn't need much qi. But in
living matrix such as DNA, bacteria, they need qi to
function at all. Qi is some kind of spectrum of energy
from the vacuum and this is vital in metabolism. etc.
See this for possible physics of it.
http://www.etheric.com/LaVioletteBooks/ether.html
I'm still zeroing in on the details. Will let you
know in days, or months of the exact details of it
all.
Qion
Long time ago I did read up on polymerase chain reaction, they use
that
process to multiply existing DNA.
For what I understand it involves cycling the temperature (above and
below
a specific value).
Here my hypothesis:
For strands of DNA to multiply these oscillation in temperature would
be
needed, or IF those changes exists in an environment there would be
many
copies created (and if you are into that perhaps mutations?).
Note the process is exponential.
So is it a bad idea to think that when looking for life we need:
water, energy source, and CYCLIC temperature changes?
This could be caused by a rotation (sun - day/night), or some
periodic
vulcanism (geyser), and the temperature should ALSO vary around a
specific
fixed point (rather small range).
So that would lead to specific places to look for life, and exclude a
lot.
<flames: No Smoking Please>
.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Question about conditions required for DNA based life to form and evolve. |
17 Feb 2005 08:05:02 AM |
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Q-on wrote:
You need qi. Without qi. DNA can't develope.
http://www.etheric.com/LaVioletteBooks/ether.html
OK I looked at that link, dunno really.
Ying and Yang too he?
Did Qi come from an egg? If so who layed it?
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| User: "Uncle Al" |
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| Title: Re: Question about conditions required for DNA based life to form andevolve. |
17 Feb 2005 09:06:14 AM |
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Q-on wrote:
[snip]
You need qi. Without qi. DNA can't develope.
[snip crap]
Idiot.
Physics Today 57(7) 40 (2004)
http://physicstoday.org/vol-57/iss-7/p40.shtml
No aether
http://fsweb.berry.edu/academic/mans/clane/
http://physicsweb.org/articles/world/17/3/7
No Lorentz violation
Michelson-Morley in 1887, then
Phys. Rev. Lett. 88(1) 010401 (2002)
Phys. Rev. Lett. 90 060403 (2003)
Phys. Rev. Lett. 42(9) 549 (1979)
Phys. Bull. 21 255 (1970)
Europhysics Lett. 56(2) 170 (2001)
Gen. Rel. Grav. 34(9) 1371 (2002)
Kennedy-Thorndike experiments
Ives-Stilwell experiments
Hughes-Drever experiments
Weak field
<http://tycho.usno.navy.mil/ptti/ptti2002/paper20.pdf>
Nature 425 374 (2003)
http://www.eftaylor.com/pub/projecta.pdf
<http://www.public.asu.edu/~rjjacob/Lecture16.pdf>
<http://relativity.livingreviews.org/Articles/lrr-2003-1/index.html>
Relativity in the GPS system
and strong field,
Science 303(5661) 1143;1153 (2004)
http://arXiv.org/abs/astro-ph/0401086
http://arxiv.org/abs/astro-ph/0312071
<http://relativity.livingreviews.org/Articles/lrr-2003-5/index.html>
Deeply relativistic neutron star binaries
If your opinions veer otherwise you are an empirical *****.
--
Uncle Al
http://www.mazepath.com/uncleal/
(Toxic URL! Unsafe for children and most mammals)
http://www.mazepath.com/uncleal/qz.pdf
.
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| User: "Nicholas Sherlock" |
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| Title: Re: Question about conditions required for DNA based life to formand evolve. |
16 Feb 2005 10:24:07 PM |
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Jan Panteltje wrote:
Long time ago I did read up on polymerase chain reaction, they use that
process to multiply existing DNA.
For what I understand it involves cycling the temperature (above and below
a specific value).
So is it a bad idea to think that when looking for life we need:
water, energy source, and CYCLIC temperature changes?
Only if the life you are looking for depends on polymerase reactions!
Cheers,
Nicholas Sherlock
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Question about conditions required for DNA based life to form and evolve. |
17 Feb 2005 08:01:01 AM |
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Nicholas Sherlock wrote:
Jan Panteltje wrote:
Long time ago I did read up on polymerase chain reaction, they use
that
process to multiply existing DNA.
For what I understand it involves cycling the temperature (above
and below
a specific value).
So is it a bad idea to think that when looking for life we need:
water, energy source, and CYCLIC temperature changes?
Only if the life you are looking for depends on polymerase reactions!
When you look at 'explosions' of life in the long ago past on earth,
you'd think some exponential process MUST have happned.
Especially if you think diversity comes only from random mutations (I
do not).
All the way at the beginning, on molecular level an exponential proces
would be required to have that 'one in a trillion' event multiply often
enough to be
immume from destruction by any force.
There have been experiments with some goo in retorts, did they ever
cycle temp?
It seems to me when 'looking for life' on say for example the moon
Europa,
the chances of finding a 'fish' in the sea below the ice are lower then
justify the cost if this CYCLIC temp change would be a requirement.
Same for a lot of other places.
I would personally look on IO, but dunno if there is any water there.
Plenty vulcanism.
Of cause when they find a fish on Europa.. I would be proven wrong.
Ok sorry in case that happens :-)
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