| Topic: |
Science > Physics |
| User: |
"" |
| Date: |
12 Dec 2007 12:52:13 AM |
| Object: |
Stat Physics and Global Warming |
Given that the Earth can vary in temperature over 6 degrees just due
the tilt of the axis I can't see a simple closed form solution to
global temperatures being very effective which doesn't use any
measured paramaters. However, I like the idea because it appeals to
basic physics theory and does not depend on very many measured
parameters.
It's kind of late but I was thinking of something like this. We know
the amount of energy that comes to the earth from the sun. We will use
as constraints the amount of energy that comes from the sun as the
amount of energy the earth has to dissipated from the earths surface.
We will also use the pressure at sea level in order to bound the
particles of the atmosphere somewhere close to the plant.
The idea is simply a maximization of entropy given a set of
constraints. We know the space a particle can occupy is related to the
momentum. The absorption bands of molecules like CO2 would simply be
another state we look at when we attempt to maximize entropy. This way
we don't have to consider the exact dynamics of particle absorption
and emission. Rather we just use the idea that a dynmanic equilibrium
will have entropy maximized.
What the model won't capture is pretty clear. It doesn't capture that
some of the energy of the sun is absorbed before it gets to the earth.
It doesn't capture, reflection off poller ice caps or clouds. It
doesn't capture convection, it doesn't capture the evaporation of
water. Although the model would not be very accurate or realistic for
some reason it intrigues me from a theoretical point of view.
.
|
|
| User: "biggus" |
|
| Title: Re: Stat Physics and Global Warming |
12 Dec 2007 09:53:00 PM |
|
|
<JohnCreighton_@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:03964204-bda9-450f-8667-051c95512953@i29g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
Given that the Earth can vary in temperature over 6 degrees just due
the tilt of the axis I can't see a simple closed form solution to
global temperatures being very effective which doesn't use any
measured paramaters. However, I like the idea because it appeals to
basic physics theory and does not depend on very many measured
parameters.
It's kind of late but I was thinking of something like this. We know
the amount of energy that comes to the earth from the sun. We will use
as constraints the amount of energy that comes from the sun as the
amount of energy the earth has to dissipated from the earths surface.
We will also use the pressure at sea level in order to bound the
particles of the atmosphere somewhere close to the plant.
The idea is simply a maximization of entropy given a set of
constraints. We know the space a particle can occupy is related to the
momentum. The absorption bands of molecules like CO2 would simply be
another state we look at when we attempt to maximize entropy.
forget it, Water Vapor is the main greenhouse gas.
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "" |
|
| Title: Re: Stat Physics and Global Warming |
14 Dec 2007 10:31:29 AM |
|
|
On Dec 11, 11:52 pm, wrote:
Given that the Earth can vary in temperature over 6 degrees just due
the tilt of the axis I can't see a simple closed form solution to
global temperatures being very effective which doesn't use any
measured paramaters. However, I like the idea because it appeals to
basic physics theory and does not depend on very many measured
parameters.
It's kind of late but I was thinking of something like this. We know
the amount of energy that comes to the earth from the sun. We will use
as constraints the amount of energy that comes from the sun as the
amount of energy the earth has to dissipated from the earths surface.
We will also use the pressure at sea level in order to bound the
particles of the atmosphere somewhere close to the plant.
The idea is simply a maximization of entropy given a set of
constraints. We know the space a particle can occupy is related to the
momentum. The absorption bands of molecules like CO2 would simply be
another state we look at when we attempt to maximize entropy. This way
we don't have to consider the exact dynamics of particle absorption
and emission. Rather we just use the idea that a dynmanic equilibrium
will have entropy maximized.
What the model won't capture is pretty clear. It doesn't capture that
some of the energy of the sun is absorbed before it gets to the earth.
It doesn't capture, reflection off poller ice caps or clouds. It
doesn't capture convection, it doesn't capture the evaporation of
water. Although the model would not be very accurate or realistic for
some reason it intrigues me from a theoretical point of view.
The laws of Fluid mechanics are valid when the intrinsic
properties of the fluid change slowly relative to the mean free path
of the particles in the fluid.
In the case of the climate all energy must inevitableness leave
the earth through radiation. Photons effect the intrinsic properties
of a fluid but our ability to measure fluid properties is on much
smaller scales then the distance that light travels before interacting
with the fluid. While we could try to treat the two systems as
separate, photons behave like particles in the sense that they can
collide with molecules and exchange energy trough collisions.
Because the mean free path of photons is much larger then
molecules the distribution of photons my suggest a different
temperature then the distribution of particles. Moreover when the
particles absorb select frequencies of photons the distribution of
photons is no longer a black body distribution and the distribution of
particle is likely no longer a perfect Boltzmann distribution. If the
particle distribution is altered from an idealized distribution by the
photons then what consequence will this have on thermodynamic
properties like, conductivity, viscosity and entropy.
http://fluid-entropy.blogspot.com/2007/12/though-disorder-blog-was-born.html
http://www.climateaudit.org/?p=466#comment-177444
.
|
|
|
|
|
Related Articles |
|
|
