What is Space?



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Topic: Science > Physics
User: "analog57"
Date: 01 Feb 2004 03:00:19 AM
Object: What is Space?
x^n + y^n = z^n
x^3 + y^3 = (x+y)[x^2-xy+y^2]
A more general identity for primes p, and numbers, n:
A*B means A times B
A/B means A divided by B
+ and - , we all know...
follow the order of operations:
x^p + y^p
equals
(x+y)*[(x+y)^(p-1) + [{(x^p+y^p)/(x+y)} - (x+y)^(p-1)] ]
for all p and n >= 1
Question:
Let T be a metric space with distance function r(x,y) expressing the
definitive predication that involves T with the real numbers, R.
Therefore the juxtaposition of left and right hemispheres resonates
in perfect accordance with the proposition that T and R are embedded
simultaneously in the full structure of manifold M. Ergo we pass on
to an enlargement *M of M, whereby the non-standard metric space is
diffeomorphism invariant.
So if f(x) is a homeomorphism from T onto S, then for every point p in
T, does f(u(p) = u(f(p)) ?
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User: "Michael Varney"

Title: Re: What is Space? 01 Feb 2004 08:02:37 AM
"analog57" <analog57@yahoo-dot-com.no-spam.invalid> wrote in message
news:401cc023$1_1@127.0.0.1...

x^n + y^n = z^n

<SNIP Blah blah blah>
Go away.
.

User: "analog57"

Title: Re: What is Space? 01 Feb 2004 02:00:07 PM

Michael Varneywrote:

"analog57" <analog57@yahoo-dot-com.no-spam.invalid> wrote in
message

news:401cc023$1_1@127.0.0.1...
x^n + y^n = z^n
SNIP Blah blah blah

Go away.[/quote:2ee50e3052]
:lol: :lol: :lol:
If the universe cannot be expanding in any absolute sense, then it
cannot be shrinking in an absolute sense, because there is no
external frame of reference. All relations would be intrinsic to the
universe. There would be no extrinsic perspective. So the question
becomes, What exactly is space? Does separation between objects exist
in an absolute sense?
A metric space is a set of points such that for every pair of points,
there is a nonnegative real number called their distance that is
symmetric, and satisfies the triangle inequality, which states that
the sum of the measures of any two sides of any triangle is greater
than the measure of the third side. Space is then a
tranformation. Two objects with relative velocity will
have a relative measure that transforms into the other. In effect,
the separation does not exist in an extrinsic sense. ABC = BCA = CAB
We then realize that an absolute spatial separation cannot exist,
therefore, the EPR paradox cannot actually exist. Space[distance
interval] is a type of dynamic relation. So, relativity is really a
theory of invariants. Space is a set of invariance principles which,
has a boundary that is zero. Yet, with the self embedding
manifold, information[structure-complexity] is increasing
as a function of time. Information is also a type of relation, in
that certain invariants must hold..
So to describe tautologies of logic e.g. X or ~X , as absolute truths
would not be a complete definition. A tautology is an invariance
principle. A rule that transforms according to a choice of truth
value, which is an invariant, in that it is always true.
Yes, the force called gravity is actually "geometry" , non-Euclidean
geometry, where spacetime becomes anisotropic and inhomogeneous in
the presence of mass-energy.
Then the question becomes "what is space?" "What is time?"
Space is relational. Time is change.
Heisenberg Uncertainty:
DxDp >= hbar/2
The relation becomes totally "chaotic" below the Planck length. So
yes, you are correct, space could be described as a self similar
relation which is generated by the quantum foam, and forms Penrose's
"spin networks".
The curvature of spacetime could be represented as a Gaussian
distribution? If mathematics only is an approximation of reality,
then the mathematics of probability corresponds "exactly" with
reality.
The Riemann tensor explains how a tangent vector, parallel translated
around a tiny parallellogram is changed. So, to say that spacetime is
"curved" means how much a tangent vector changes during parallel
transport around a loop. Parallel transport is the translation of an
infinitesimal tangent vector along a geodesic. So the probability
distribution should agree exactly with Einstein's relativity.
Is the universe a closed system? The million dollar question
Russell E. Rierson
analog57@yahoo.com
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User: "Uncle Al"

Title: Re: What is Space? 02 Feb 2004 05:34:15 PM
analog57 wrote:
[snip]

If the universe cannot be expanding in any absolute sense,

[snip]
New moron on board.
--
Uncle Al
http://www.mazepath.com/uncleal/
(Toxic URL! Unsafe for children and most mammals)
"Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?" The Net!
.
User: "Russell E. Rierson"

Title: Re: What is Space? 05 Feb 2004 03:31:21 AM
Uncle Al <UncleAl0@hate.spam.net> wrote in message news:<401EDE77.B63425BB@hate.spam.net>...

analog57 wrote:

[snip]

If the universe cannot be expanding in any absolute sense,

[snip]

New moron on board.

...draob no norom weN
The metric space has distance function r(x,y), definitively
characterized by involvement with the real numbers, R, such that the
metric space and R are embedded simultaneously in the full structure
of manifold M. A topological space consists of sets of points which
are defined[in this case] to be the intersections of cotangent
bundles.
We move on to functions of a complex variable in the 2-D Euclidean
space Z, utilizing the algebraic structure of complex numbers, where
points of Z may be regarded as pairs of real numbers, R. Formal
statements concerning Z, are also expressable as statements about R.
Complex-valued functions e.g. w = f(z), can also be represented as
binary, or quaternary relations, these sets of complex valued
polynomials then have elements that map Z into Z. Every complex valued
polynomial subset p(z), has natural number coefficients a_k, or the
"kth" coefficient of p(z)..
So, for non-zero polynomials, we take into account the number of zeros
OF the polynomial O[p(z)] with O ranging over the natural numbers such
that
O[p(z), R ] = v, where v is a finite natural number.
Thus if G is a metric group and E is a topological group, such, that
an open neighborhood U, of the identity is a metric space, with a
compliant metric, specifiable to the topology of U, then the distance
r(a,b) between any two points (a,b) in U, then in terms of the
distance u(E) = J, consists of the points a of U with the fact that
r(a,E) is an infinitesimal.
f(x) is a homeomorphism from T onto S, then for every point p in T,
f(u(p) = u(f(p))
If f(u(v)) = u(f(v)) the physics for a circle of radius R, is
equivalent to the physics for a circle of radius 1/R.
.



User: "analog57"

Title: Re: What is Space? 01 Feb 2004 02:00:08 PM

Michael Varneywrote:

"analog57" <analog57@yahoo-dot-com.no-spam.invalid> wrote in
message

news:401cc023$1_1@127.0.0.1...
x^n + y^n = z^n
SNIP Blah blah blah

Go away.[/quote:c16204daf0]
:lol: :lol: :lol:
If the universe cannot be expanding in any absolute sense, then it
cannot be shrinking in an absolute sense, because there is no
external frame of reference. All relations would be intrinsic to the
universe. There would be no extrinsic perspective. So the question
becomes, What exactly is space? Does separation between objects exist
in an absolute sense?
A metric space is a set of points such that for every pair of points,
there is a nonnegative real number called their distance that is
symmetric, and satisfies the triangle inequality, which states that
the sum of the measures of any two sides of any triangle is greater
than the measure of the third side. Space is then a
tranformation. Two objects with relative velocity will
have a relative measure that transforms into the other. In effect,
the separation does not exist in an extrinsic sense. ABC = BCA = CAB
We then realize that an absolute spatial separation cannot exist,
therefore, the EPR paradox cannot actually exist. Space[distance
interval] is a type of dynamic relation. So, relativity is really a
theory of invariants. Space is a set of invariance principles which,
has a boundary that is zero. Yet, with the self embedding
manifold, information[structure-complexity] is increasing
as a function of time. Information is also a type of relation, in
that certain invariants must hold..
So to describe tautologies of logic e.g. X or ~X , as absolute truths
would not be a complete definition. A tautology is an invariance
principle. A rule that transforms according to a choice of truth
value, which is an invariant, in that it is always true.
Yes, the force called gravity is actually "geometry" , non-Euclidean
geometry, where spacetime becomes anisotropic and inhomogeneous in
the presence of mass-energy.
Then the question becomes "what is space?" "What is time?"
Space is relational. Time is change.
Heisenberg Uncertainty:
DxDp >= hbar/2
The relation becomes totally "chaotic" below the Planck length. So
yes, you are correct, space could be described as a self similar
relation which is generated by the quantum foam, and forms Penrose's
"spin networks".
The curvature of spacetime could be represented as a Gaussian
distribution? If mathematics only is an approximation of reality,
then the mathematics of probability corresponds "exactly" with
reality.
The Riemann tensor explains how a tangent vector, parallel translated
around a tiny parallellogram is changed. So, to say that spacetime is
"curved" means how much a tangent vector changes during parallel
transport around a loop. Parallel transport is the translation of an
infinitesimal tangent vector along a geodesic. So the probability
distribution should agree exactly with Einstein's relativity.
Is the universe a closed system? The million dollar question
Russell E. Rierson
analog57@yahoo.com
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http://www.newsfeed.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! >100,000 Newsgroups
---= 19 East/West-Coast Specialized Servers - Total Privacy via Encryption =---
.

User: "analog57"

Title: re:What is Space? 01 Feb 2004 02:00:08 PM
A point without another "reference" does not exist; the opposite of a
thing distinguishes it from the thing itself. What is the dynamic of
space-time? Is it a ratio?
When space is taken as a measure of length, space/time is the speed of
light in vacuum for a photon of light:
space/time = c
Where, length = perception of separation between two reference points.
E = mc^2
E/momentum = E/p = c
energy/momentum = space/time
What is the EPR "superluminal?" connection? A shortcut through
configuration space? Phase space?
A point can be defined as an "infinitesimal". The Topological spaces
are defined as being diffeomorphism invariant. Intersecting cotangent
bundles[manifolds] are the set of all possible configurations of a
system, i.e. they describe the phase space of the system.
Potential infinity is defined as a limit via Newton's calculus, while
actual infinity is a Cantorian Cardinal number, which is a Platonic
form, which is also a type of potential.
[abstract representation]--->[semantic mapping]--->[represented
system]
[axiomatic]--->[Isomorphism]<---[Induction]
An abstract representation is exactly that, "abstract". It is not a
space, or time, but is instead a product of consciousness, or a
mental construct; topologically it is equivalent to a "point". The
abstract description contains the concrete topology. Likewise, the
concrete contains the abstract.
A duality?
A point contains an infinite expanse of space and time?
Could it be, that the "absolute" infinity, is actually a dimensionless
point?
[point]/[set of points] = point ?
0/N = 0
Since it is possible for a "computation" to be self aware, there must
be platonic forms that are types of self aware algorithms:
The description of any entity inside the real universe can only be
with reference to other things in the universe. Space is then
relational, and the universe, self referential. For example, if an
object has a momentum, that momentum can only be explained with
respect to another object within the universe. Space then becomes an
aspect of the relationships between things in reality. It becomes
analogous to a sentence, and it is absurd to say that a sentence has
no words in it. So the grammatical structure of each sentence[space]
is defined by the relationships that hold between the words in it.
For example, relationships like object-subject or adjective-noun. So
there are many different grammatical structures composed of different
arrangements of words, and the varied relationships between them.
Language describes the universe, because the universe is isomorphic to
a description on some level, and reality can only refer to itself,
because, there is nothing outside of ..."total existence" which
becomes equivalent to a self referential system, which must be a self
aware system. Since descriptions make distinctions, or references to
other entities, and distinctions are tautologically logical, [A or
~A], reality is logical, in that its contents can be described by a
language. The contents within reality are distinctive entities,
individually different from the others, yet consisting of the same
foundational substance.
[<-[->[<-[U]->]<-]->]
Universe = Zero
On one level of stratification, two photons are separate. On another
level, of stratification, the photons have zero separation.
Instantaneous communication between two objects, separated by a
distance interval, is equivalent to zero separation[zero boundary]
between the two objects.
According to the book "Gravitation", chapter 15, geometry of spacetime
gives instructions to matter telling matter to follow the straightest
path, which is a geodesic. Matter in turn, tells spacetime geometry
how to curve in such a way, as to guarantee the conservation of
momentum and energy. The Einstein tensor[geometric
feature-description] is also conserved in this relationship between
matter and the spacetime geometry. Eli Cartan's "boundary of a
boundary equals zero."
Einstein's equation basically says
Einstein Tensor [G] = Stress-Energy Tensor [T]
[spacetime geometry] determines [matter-energy's path] = geodesic.
[Matter-energy] determines [spacetime geometry] = non-Euclidean
geometry.
.

User: "analog57"

Title: re:What is Space? 01 Feb 2004 02:00:09 PM
A point without another "reference" does not exist; the opposite of a
thing distinguishes it from the thing itself. What is the dynamic of
space-time? Is it a ratio?
When space is taken as a measure of length, space/time is the speed of
light in vacuum for a photon of light:
space/time = c
Where, length = perception of separation between two reference points.
E = mc^2
E/momentum = E/p = c
energy/momentum = space/time
What is the EPR "superluminal?" connection? A shortcut through
configuration space? Phase space?
A point can be defined as an "infinitesimal". The Topological spaces
are defined as being diffeomorphism invariant. Intersecting cotangent
bundles[manifolds] are the set of all possible configurations of a
system, i.e. they describe the phase space of the system.
Potential infinity is defined as a limit via Newton's calculus, while
actual infinity is a Cantorian Cardinal number, which is a Platonic
form, which is also a type of potential.
[abstract representation]--->[semantic mapping]--->[represented
system]
[axiomatic]--->[Isomorphism]<---[Induction]
An abstract representation is exactly that, "abstract". It is not a
space, or time, but is instead a product of consciousness, or a
mental construct; topologically it is equivalent to a "point". The
abstract description contains the concrete topology. Likewise, the
concrete contains the abstract.
A duality?
A point contains an infinite expanse of space and time?
Could it be, that the "absolute" infinity, is actually a dimensionless
point?
[point]/[set of points] = point ?
0/N = 0
Since it is possible for a "computation" to be self aware, there must
be platonic forms that are types of self aware algorithms:
The description of any entity inside the real universe can only be
with reference to other things in the universe. Space is then
relational, and the universe, self referential. For example, if an
object has a momentum, that momentum can only be explained with
respect to another object within the universe. Space then becomes an
aspect of the relationships between things in reality. It becomes
analogous to a sentence, and it is absurd to say that a sentence has
no words in it. So the grammatical structure of each sentence[space]
is defined by the relationships that hold between the words in it.
For example, relationships like object-subject or adjective-noun. So
there are many different grammatical structures composed of different
arrangements of words, and the varied relationships between them.
Language describes the universe, because the universe is isomorphic to
a description on some level, and reality can only refer to itself,
because, there is nothing outside of ..."total existence" which
becomes equivalent to a self referential system, which must be a self
aware system. Since descriptions make distinctions, or references to
other entities, and distinctions are tautologically logical, [A or
~A], reality is logical, in that its contents can be described by a
language. The contents within reality are distinctive entities,
individually different from the others, yet consisting of the same
foundational substance.
[<-[->[<-[U]->]<-]->]
Universe = Zero
On one level of stratification, two photons are separate. On another
level, of stratification, the photons have zero separation.
Instantaneous communication between two objects, separated by a
distance interval, is equivalent to zero separation[zero boundary]
between the two objects.
According to the book "Gravitation", chapter 15, geometry of spacetime
gives instructions to matter telling matter to follow the straightest
path, which is a geodesic. Matter in turn, tells spacetime geometry
how to curve in such a way, as to guarantee the conservation of
momentum and energy. The Einstein tensor[geometric
feature-description] is also conserved in this relationship between
matter and the spacetime geometry. Eli Cartan's "boundary of a
boundary equals zero."
Einstein's equation basically says
Einstein Tensor [G] = Stress-Energy Tensor [T]
[spacetime geometry] determines [matter-energy's path] = geodesic.
[Matter-energy] determines [spacetime geometry] = non-Euclidean
geometry.
.
User: "Tom Potter"

Title: Re: re:What is Space? 02 Feb 2004 04:49:13 AM
Time and space arise from the hard wiring of humans,
primarily the hippocampus in the brain,
which performs cross correlations
Man perceives multiple events
and correlates this bulk data in the hippocampus
with incoming data and bulk memory data.
High correlations with bulk hardwired memory (Instinct)
immediately activates hardwired responses like fight or flight.
The output of the hippocampus stimulates
glandular activations associated with pleasure and pain,
and data associated with high levels of pleasure and pain
are fixed chemically in the brains memory.
When little sensory stimuli is present,
the hippocampus performs cross-correlations
between low level sensory input and bulk memory,
and when no significant sensory stimuli is present
it performs correlations between bulk memory
and other bulk memory.
In other words, the hippocampus sits there,
correlating away, on data, from the senses,
and the data that is stored in memory,
and when it hits high correlations,
glandular secretions fix that condition.
When there are low levels of sensory input,
the hippocampus searches the brain memory,
much as the arcs in the novelty
plasma lamps seem to randomly search.
Of course, recently active branches are followed by
the hippocampus searches.
Time is the autocorrelation of events
associated with single body.
Space is the cross-correlation of events
associated with two bodies.
In other words, one body correlations are times,
and two body correlations are spaces.
An entity with a triple branched correlator (Hippocampus)
would have a different concept of reality.
--
Tom Potter http://tompotter.us
.
User: "hanson"

Title: Re: re:What is Space? 02 Feb 2004 09:36:44 AM
"Tom Potter" <tdp@hotsheet.com> wrote in message
news:bvl9sj$thb02$1@ID-188019.news.uni-berlin.de...

Time and space arise from the hard wiring of humans,
Tom Potter

Tom, please, at least be a bit more humble and say:
"Time and space arise from the hard wiring of Potter"
For you, in your universe, this may very well be true.
I have snipped the rest of your post as you have it,
like your line above, as usual, all ***** backwards.
But you are an endless source of fun and laughter.
You should take pride in that, Tom.
ahahahaha........hahahahahanson
.
User: "Tom Potter"

Title: Re: What is Space? 02 Feb 2004 09:01:19 PM
"hanson" <hanson@quick.net> wrote in message news:<g8uTb.8582$F23.3970@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net>...

"Tom Potter" <tdp@hotsheet.com> wrote in message
news:bvl9sj$thb02$1@ID-188019.news.uni-berlin.de...

Time and space arise from the hard wiring of humans,
Tom Potter

Tom, please, at least be a bit more humble and say:
"Time and space arise from the hard wiring of Potter"
For you, in your universe, this may very well be true.
I have snipped the rest of your post as you have it,
like your line above, as usual, all ***** backwards.
But you are an endless source of fun and laughter.
You should take pride in that, Tom.
ahahahaha........hahahahahanson

It is interesting to see that Harry Hyena hanson
asserts that he does not have a hippocampus,
and is hardwired "***** backwards" for the rest of humanity,
which the sciences clearly show to be hardwired
essentially the same as I am. One head, one heart, two eyes,
two ears, a double-branch hippocampus, etc.
Considering the style and content of his post,
and the agendas he desparately tries to promote,
perhaps he is hardwired different from the rest of humanity.
I repeat my post,
for the benefit of rational, intelligent,
folks, hardwired with a double-branched hippocampus,
who wish to discuss the subject in more detail.
===========
Time and space arise from the hard wiring of humans,
primarily the hippocampus in the brain,
which performs cross correlations
Man perceives multiple events
and correlates this bulk data in the hippocampus
with incoming data and bulk memory data.
High correlations with bulk hardwired memory (Instinct)
immediately activates hardwired responses like fight or flight.
The output of the hippocampus stimulates
glandular activations associated with pleasure and pain,
and data associated with high levels of pleasure and pain
are fixed chemically in the brains memory.
When little sensory stimuli is present,
the hippocampus performs cross-correlations
between low level sensory input and bulk memory,
and when no significant sensory stimuli is present
it performs correlations between bulk memory
and other bulk memory.
In other words, the hippocampus sits there,
correlating away, on data, from the senses,
and the data that is stored in memory,
and when it hits high correlations,
glandular secretions fix that condition.
When there are low levels of sensory input,
the hippocampus searches the brain memory,
much as the arcs in the novelty
plasma lamps seem to randomly search.
Of course, recently active branches are followed by
the hippocampus searches.
Time is the autocorrelation of events
associated with single body.
Space is the cross-correlation of events
associated with two bodies.
In other words, one body correlations are times,
and two body correlations are spaces.
An entity with a triple branched correlator (Hippocampus)
would have a different concept of reality.
--
Tom Potter http://tompotter.us
.
User: "hanson"

Title: Re: What is Space? 02 Feb 2004 10:15:01 PM
"Tom Potter" <tdp@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:f76e0bb3.0402021901.60f4265d@posting.google.com...

"hanson" <hanson@quick.net> wrote in message

news:<g8uTb.8582$F23.3970@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net>...

"Tom Potter" <tdp@hotsheet.com> wrote in message
news:bvl9sj$thb02$1@ID-188019.news.uni-berlin.de...

Time and space arise from the hard wiring of humans,
Tom Potter

Tom, please, at least be a bit more humble and say:
"Time and space arise from the hard wiring of Potter"
For you, in your universe, this may very well be true.
I have snipped the rest of your post as you have it,
like your line above, as usual, all ***** backwards.
But you are an endless source of fun and laughter.
You should take pride in that, Tom.
ahahahaha........hahahahahanson


It is interesting to see that Harry Hyena hanson
asserts......

............NOT what you think, I said, Tom.
Your sermon, that I have snipped, is ***** backwards again.
As usual. Also, I haven't seen anyone agreeing with your
***** backwards theory. So be humble, Tom, HUMBLE....
ahahahahaha...........
.
User: "Tom Potter"

Title: Re: What is Space? 03 Feb 2004 04:38:07 AM
"hanson" <hanson@quick.net> wrote in message
news:9fFTb.9628$F23.7712@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net...

"Tom Potter" <tdp@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:f76e0bb3.0402021901.60f4265d@posting.google.com...

"hanson" <hanson@quick.net> wrote in message

news:<g8uTb.8582$F23.3970@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net>...

"Tom Potter" <tdp@hotsheet.com> wrote in message
news:bvl9sj$thb02$1@ID-188019.news.uni-berlin.de...

Time and space arise from the hard wiring of humans,
Tom Potter

Tom, please, at least be a bit more humble and say:
"Time and space arise from the hard wiring of Potter"
For you, in your universe, this may very well be true.
I have snipped the rest of your post as you have it,
like your line above, as usual, all ***** backwards.
But you are an endless source of fun and laughter.
You should take pride in that, Tom.
ahahahaha........hahahahahanson


It is interesting to see that Harry Hyena hanson
asserts......


...........NOT what you think, I said, Tom.
Your sermon, that I have snipped, is ***** backwards again.
As usual. Also, I haven't seen anyone agreeing with your
***** backwards theory. So be humble, Tom, HUMBLE....
ahahahahaha...........

I am pleased to see that Harry Hyena hanson,
continues to read my "sermons" religiously,
and although he is having an emotional conflict about
"agreeing" with truths that run counter to his conditioning,
he is like a bug,
that hovers about a light,
in search of illumination.
--
Tom Potter http://tompotter.us
.
User: "hanson"

Title: Re: What is Space? 03 Feb 2004 11:29:18 AM
"Tom Potter" <tdp@hotsheet.com> wrote in message
news:bvntjr$ubbkq$1@ID-188019.news.uni-berlin.de...

"Tom Potter" <tdp@hotsheet.com> wrote in message
news:bvl9sj$thb02$1@ID-188019.news.uni-berlin.de...

Time and space arise from the hard wiring of humans,
Tom Potter

Tom, please, at least be a bit more humble and say:
"Time and space arise from the hard wiring of Potter"
For you, in your universe, this may very well be true.
I have snipped the rest of your post as you have it,
like your line above, as usual, all ***** backwards.
But you are an endless source of fun and laughter.
You should take pride in that, Tom.
ahahahaha........hahahahahanson


It is interesting to see that Harry Hyena hanson
asserts......


...........NOT what you think, I said, Tom.
Your sermon, that I have snipped, is ***** backwards again.
As usual. Also, I haven't seen anyone agreeing with your
***** backwards theory. So be humble, Tom, HUMBLE....
ahahahahaha...........


I am pleased to see that Harry Hyena hanson,
continues to read my "sermons" religiously,
and although he is having an emotional conflict about
"agreeing" with truths that run counter to his conditioning,
he is like a bug, that hovers about a light,
in search of illumination.
-- Tom Potter

ahahahahaha........ahahahaha.....AHAHAHHA......
Ok, ok, Tom, let me massage your morbidly obese ego a bit:
Not bad, CrackPotter, not bad.....you crack me up!...ahahaha..
You and your "truths"....ahahahaha......none in your philosophy...
none in your politics....none in your tutorial.......so, turn on your
"illumination".......it's high time for it......AHAHAHHAHahahaha.....
As I said: you are an endless source for roasting, fun & laughs.
You should take pride in THAT, Tom.
ahahahaha.........ahahahahanson
PS: Can't help it, Tom-Tom, whenever I see your handle
you remind me of the bumper sticker that reads:
"Hire the handicapped, they are fun to watch".
.
User: "Tom Potter"

Title: Re: What is Space? 03 Feb 2004 09:37:59 PM
"hanson" <hanson@quick.net> wrote in message news:<OTQTb.10682$F23.7284@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net>...

"Tom Potter" <tdp@hotsheet.com> wrote in message
news:bvntjr$ubbkq$1@ID-188019.news.uni-berlin.de...

"Tom Potter" <tdp@hotsheet.com> wrote in message
news:bvl9sj$thb02$1@ID-188019.news.uni-berlin.de...

Time and space arise from the hard wiring of humans,
Tom Potter

Tom, please, at least be a bit more humble and say:
"Time and space arise from the hard wiring of Potter"
For you, in your universe, this may very well be true.
I have snipped the rest of your post as you have it,
like your line above, as usual, all ***** backwards.
But you are an endless source of fun and laughter.
You should take pride in that, Tom.
ahahahaha........hahahahahanson


It is interesting to see that Harry Hyena hanson
asserts......


...........NOT what you think, I said, Tom.
Your sermon, that I have snipped, is ***** backwards again.
As usual. Also, I haven't seen anyone agreeing with your
***** backwards theory. So be humble, Tom, HUMBLE....
ahahahahaha...........


I am pleased to see that Harry Hyena hanson,
continues to read my "sermons" religiously,
and although he is having an emotional conflict about
"agreeing" with truths that run counter to his conditioning,
he is like a bug, that hovers about a light,
in search of illumination.
-- Tom Potter

ahahahahaha........ahahahaha.....AHAHAHHA......
Ok, ok, Tom, let me massage your morbidly obese ego a bit:
Not bad, CrackPotter, not bad.....you crack me up!...ahahaha..
You and your "truths"....ahahahaha......none in your philosophy...
none in your politics....none in your tutorial.......so, turn on your
"illumination".......it's high time for it......AHAHAHHAHahahaha.....
As I said: you are an endless source for roasting, fun & laughs.
You should take pride in THAT, Tom.
ahahahaha.........ahahahahanson

PS: Can't help it, Tom-Tom, whenever I see your handle
you remind me of the bumper sticker that reads:
"Hire the handicapped, they are fun to watch".

It is interesting to see that Harry Hyena hanson,
not only hates a sustainable environment,
peace between all peoples,
but he also hates "handicapped" folks.
The question arises in my mind,
about who are the handicapped?
Ego-centric, paranoids who laugh hysterically,
and put the interests of race and religion and foreign nations
above those of America and humanity,
or happy people who make a positive contribution
to society every day, in whatever way they can,
but fall below some arbitrary standard in terms of
mobility, athletic ability, health, the functioning
of all body parts, physical strength, size,
the size of their penis' or breasts, etc?
I wonder if Harry Hyena hanson is "handicapped"
in any of these ways, and if he would be "fun to watch"
trying to ovecome his "handicap"?
--
Tom Potter
.
User: "hanson"

Title: Re: What is Space? 03 Feb 2004 10:26:00 PM
"Tom Potter" <tdp@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:f76e0bb3.0402031937.425b0802@posting.google.com...

"hanson" <hanson@quick.net> wrote in message

"Tom Potter" <tdp@hotsheet.com> wrote in message
news:bvl9sj$thb02$1@ID-188019.news.uni-berlin.de...

Time and space arise from the hard wiring of humans,
Tom Potter

Tom, please, at least be a bit more humble and say:
"Time and space arise from the hard wiring of Potter"
ahahahaha........hahahahahanson


It is interesting to see that Harry Hyena hanson
asserts:


I haven't seen anyone agreeing with your
***** backwards theory. So be humble, Tom, HUMBLE....
ahahahahaha...........hahahanson


I am .....in search of illumination.
-- Tom Potter

ahahahahaha........ahahahaha.....AHAHAHHA......
Ok, ok, Tom, let me massage your morbidly obese ego a bit:
....you are an endless source for roasting, fun & laughs.
You should take pride in THAT, Tom.
ahahahaha.........ahahahahanson

It is interesting to see that ....

....Tom-Tom CrackPotter got so intensely irate that he pontificated about
hate, penis' and breast size in an other one of his ***** backward theories
....."in search of his illumination"... which he unfortunately has not found
yet and thus is limited by his own "Potterian hard wiring" to a response
capability output of:
(a) it is interesting to see,(b) I am flattered (c) he makes a good point.
.......Still, that is exactly what makes you so funny, Tom-Tom CraPo.
Do you get it? ...... git it ??? git it ??? git it ???.....ahahahahaha..
ahahahahaha......ahahahahanson
.
User: "Tom Potter"

Title: Re: What is Space? 04 Feb 2004 06:46:56 AM
"hanson" <hanson@quick.net> wrote in message
news:sv_Tb.11345$F23.4960@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net...

"Tom Potter" <tdp@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:f76e0bb3.0402031937.425b0802@posting.google.com...

"hanson" <hanson@quick.net> wrote in message

"Tom Potter" <tdp@hotsheet.com> wrote in message
news:bvl9sj$thb02$1@ID-188019.news.uni-berlin.de...

Time and space arise from the hard wiring of humans,
Tom Potter

Tom, please, at least be a bit more humble and say:
"Time and space arise from the hard wiring of Potter"
ahahahaha........hahahahahanson


It is interesting to see that Harry Hyena hanson
asserts:


I haven't seen anyone agreeing with your
***** backwards theory. So be humble, Tom, HUMBLE....
ahahahahaha...........hahahanson


I am .....in search of illumination.
-- Tom Potter

ahahahahaha........ahahahaha.....AHAHAHHA......
Ok, ok, Tom, let me massage your morbidly obese ego a bit:
....you are an endless source for roasting, fun & laughs.
You should take pride in THAT, Tom.
ahahahaha.........ahahahahanson

It is interesting to see that ....

...Tom-Tom CrackPotter got so intensely irate that he pontificated about
hate, penis' and breast size in an other one of his ***** backward theories
...."in search of his illumination"... which he unfortunately has not

found

yet and thus is limited by his own "Potterian hard wiring" to a response
capability output of:
(a) it is interesting to see,(b) I am flattered (c) he makes a good point.

......Still, that is exactly what makes you so funny, Tom-Tom CraPo.
Do you get it? ...... git it ??? git it ??? git it ???.....ahahahahaha..
ahahahahaha......ahahahahanson

What makes me funny is your medication.
As you seem to enjoy my work,
why don't you have your doctor
increase the dosage?
If I could get everyone on your medication,
I'd make the world forget about Bob Hope.
--
Tom Potter http://tompotter.us
.
User: "hanson"

Title: Re: What is Space? 04 Feb 2004 11:18:07 AM
"Tom Potter" <tdp@hotsheet.com> aka CrackPotter aka CraPo wrote in
news:bvqpi4$v3ebg$1@ID-188019.news.uni-berlin.de...

"Tom Potter" <tdp@hotsheet.com> wrote in message
news:bvl9sj$thb02$1@ID-188019.news.uni-berlin.de...

Time and space arise from the hard wiring of humans,
Tom Potter

Tom, please, at least be a bit more humble and say:
"Time and space arise from the hard wiring of Potter"
ahahahaha........hahahahahanson


It is interesting to see that Harry Hyena hanson
asserts:


I haven't seen anyone agreeing with your
***** backwards theory. So be humble, Tom, HUMBLE....
ahahahahaha...........hahahanson


I am .....in search of illumination.
-- Tom Potter

Ok, ok, Tom, let me massage your morbidly obese ego a bit:
....you are an endless source for roasting, fun & laughs.
You should take pride in THAT, Tom.

It is interesting to see that ....

...Tom-Tom CrackPotter got hate [about] penis and breast size
in his ***** backward theories ...."in search of his illumination"
... limited by his own "Potterian hard wiring" to a response of:
(a) it is interesting to see,(b) I am flattered (c) he makes a good point.
......Still, that is exactly what makes you so funny, Tom-Tom CraPo.
Do you get it? ...... git it ??? git it ??? git it ???.....ahahahahanson


What makes me funny is .....
I'd make the world forget about Bob Hope. -- Tom Potter

See, Tom-Tom, your morbidly obese ego took control of you again.
.....not "that" funny, Tom, try the other one....ahahahahaha...ahahahaha
Be humble, Tom, HUMBLE!
See, again, Tom, you didn't ...git it ... git it ... git it ... did you, CraPO?
That makes you unfortunately now, Tom, a certified, full fledged git!
git it ??? git it ??? git it ??? git it now, Tom??? .....ahahahahanson
.
User: "Tom Potter"

Title: Re: What is Space? 05 Feb 2004 03:27:49 AM
"hanson" <hanson@quick.net> wrote in message news:<jP9Ub.12971$uM2.11486@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net>...

"Tom Potter" <tdp@hotsheet.com> aka CrackPotter aka CraPo wrote in
news:bvqpi4$v3ebg$1@ID-188019.news.uni-berlin.de...

"Tom Potter" <tdp@hotsheet.com> wrote in message
news:bvl9sj$thb02$1@ID-188019.news.uni-berlin.de...

Time and space arise from the hard wiring of humans,
Tom Potter

Tom, please, at least be a bit more humble and say:
"Time and space arise from the hard wiring of Potter"
ahahahaha........hahahahahanson


It is interesting to see that Harry Hyena hanson
asserts:


I haven't seen anyone agreeing with your
***** backwards theory. So be humble, Tom, HUMBLE....
ahahahahaha...........hahahanson


I am .....in search of illumination.
-- Tom Potter

Ok, ok, Tom, let me massage your morbidly obese ego a bit:
....you are an endless source for roasting, fun & laughs.
You should take pride in THAT, Tom.

It is interesting to see that ....

...Tom-Tom CrackPotter got hate [about] penis and breast size
in his ***** backward theories ...."in search of his illumination"
... limited by his own "Potterian hard wiring" to a response of:
(a) it is interesting to see,(b) I am flattered (c) he makes a good point.
......Still, that is exactly what makes you so funny, Tom-Tom CraPo.
Do you get it? ...... git it ??? git it ??? git it ???.....ahahahahanson


What makes me funny is .....
I'd make the world forget about Bob Hope. -- Tom Potter

See, Tom-Tom, your morbidly obese ego took control of you again.
....not "that" funny, Tom, try the other one....ahahahahaha...ahahahaha
Be humble, Tom, HUMBLE!
See, again, Tom, you didn't ...git it ... git it ... git it ... did you, CraPO?
That makes you unfortunately now, Tom, a certified, full fledged git!
git it ??? git it ??? git it ??? git it now, Tom??? .....ahahahahanson

Apparently the war-for-profit "handlers"
of Harry Hyena hanson have him all stressed out
trying to make me the issue, and thus take the
focus off of the people who isntigate conflict and war
for power and riches.
Although, I, with my "obese ego", am flattered
that Harry Hyena hanson, and fellow travellers
of the war-for-profit gang, think that I personally,
am a more important subject, than the
people who instigate conflict and war for profit,
I have to admit that I am "xaio tu dou"
whereas the people who instigate conflict and war,
are the most negative social force on the planet.
--
Tom Potter
.
User: "hanson"

Title: Re: What is Space? 05 Feb 2004 03:08:17 PM
"Tom-Tom CrackPotter" aka CraPo, the Git <tdp@earthlink.net> didn't git it
in his news:f76e0bb3.0402050127.76d11819@posting.google.com...
but says that he is flattered to have a morbidly obese ego and is confused
why he didn't git it ... git it ... git it .....
AHAhahahaha.....ahahahahaha
.












User: "Mitchell"

Title: Re: What is Space? 01 Feb 2004 11:31:43 PM
analog57@yahoo-dot-com.no-spam.invalid (analog57) wrote in message news:<401d5ac9$1_1@127.0.0.1>...

A point without another "reference" does not exist; the opposite of a
thing distinguishes it from the thing itself. What is the dynamic of
space-time? Is it a ratio?

When space is taken as a measure of length, space/time is the speed of
light in vacuum for a photon of light:

space/time = c


Where, length = perception of separation between two reference points.


E = mc^2

E/momentum = E/p = c

energy/momentum = space/time

What is the EPR "superluminal?" connection? A shortcut through
configuration space? Phase space?

A point can be defined as an "infinitesimal". The Topological spaces
are defined as being diffeomorphism invariant. Intersecting cotangent
bundles[manifolds] are the set of all possible configurations of a
system, i.e. they describe the phase space of the system.

Potential infinity is defined as a limit via Newton's calculus, while
actual infinity is a Cantorian Cardinal number, which is a Platonic
form, which is also a type of potential.

[abstract representation]--->[semantic mapping]--->[represented
system]

[axiomatic]--->[Isomorphism]<---[Induction]

An abstract representation is exactly that, "abstract". It is not a
space, or time, but is instead a product of consciousness, or a
mental construct; topologically it is equivalent to a "point". The
abstract description contains the concrete topology. Likewise, the
concrete contains the abstract.

A duality?

A point contains an infinite expanse of space and time?

Could it be, that the "absolute" infinity, is actually a dimensionless
point?

[point]/[set of points] = point ?


0/N = 0


Since it is possible for a "computation" to be self aware, there must
be platonic forms that are types of self aware algorithms:


The description of any entity inside the real universe can only be
with reference to other things in the universe. Space is then
relational, and the universe, self referential. For example, if an
object has a momentum, that momentum can only be explained with
respect to another object within the universe. Space then becomes an
aspect of the relationships between things in reality. It becomes
analogous to a sentence, and it is absurd to say that a sentence has
no words in it. So the grammatical structure of each sentence[space]
is defined by the relationships that hold between the words in it.
For example, relationships like object-subject or adjective-noun. So
there are many different grammatical structures composed of different
arrangements of words, and the varied relationships between them.

Language describes the universe, because the universe is isomorphic to
a description on some level, and reality can only refer to itself,
because, there is nothing outside of ..."total existence" which
becomes equivalent to a self referential system, which must be a self
aware system. Since descriptions make distinctions, or references to
other entities, and distinctions are tautologically logical, [A or
~A], reality is logical, in that its contents can be described by a
language. The contents within reality are distinctive entities,
individually different from the others, yet consisting of the same
foundational substance.


[<-[->[<-[U]->]<-]->]

Universe = Zero



On one level of stratification, two photons are separate. On another
level, of stratification, the photons have zero separation.

Instantaneous communication between two objects, separated by a
distance interval, is equivalent to zero separation[zero boundary]
between the two objects.

According to the book "Gravitation", chapter 15, geometry of spacetime
gives instructions to matter telling matter to follow the straightest
path, which is a geodesic. Matter in turn, tells spacetime geometry
how to curve in such a way, as to guarantee the conservation of
momentum and energy. The Einstein tensor[geometric
feature-description] is also conserved in this relationship between
matter and the spacetime geometry. Eli Cartan's "boundary of a
boundary equals zero."

Einstein's equation basically says

Einstein Tensor [G] = Stress-Energy Tensor [T]

[spacetime geometry] determines [matter-energy's path] = geodesic.

[Matter-energy] determines [spacetime geometry] = non-Euclidean
geometry.

.
Conservation of momentum energy is explained as an automatic
consequence of the zero boundary of a boundary. Where conservation of
energy-momentum means no creation or destruction of energy momentum
in a 4D region of spacetime [4D cube] The integral of "creation
events" i.e. the integral of
d*T for energy momentum, over the 4D region is required to be zero,
and gives the conservation of momentum energy. The mathematical
machinery for identically meeting the conservation laws is the
boundary of a boundary equals zero.

[spacetime tells mass]<===[geodesic path for particle]===>[mass
tells spacetime]

Waves are ripples in a basic medium. Einstein explains that the ether
is unecessary as a medium, so the ripples are vibrations of spacetime
itself, if, mass-energy is a form of condensed space-time.

As the ripples intersect with each other, it becomes a domino effect
with the ripples continually increasing in density. Very similar to
taking a penny and doubling it as an iterative sequence.

2, 4, 8, 16, 32, 64, 128, 256, ... 2^n

Since the ripples are increasing in density they are "compressed" . As
spacetime becomes compressed, matter is re-configured as a balancing
effect, so the force of gravity and accelerations are perceived as
they presently are.

[<->[<->[<->[U]<->]<->]<->]

The increasing spacetime density must be background independent.

Actually, spacetime does not really need to be "sliced up" in that it
can proceed in discrete steps, yet, still be continuous.

[density 1]--->[density 2]--->[density 3]---> ...
--->[density n]


A quote from the book "The Expanding Universe" by Sir Arthur
Eddington:



quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



All change is relative. The universe is expanding relatively to our
common standards; our common standards are shrinking relatively to
the size of the universe. The theory of the "expanding universe"
might also be called the theory of the "shrinking atom" .

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------




Quantum mechanics leads us to the realization that all matter-energy
can be explained in terms of "waves". In a confined region(i.e. a
closed universe or a black hole) the waves exists as STANDING WAVES
In a closed system, the entropy never decreases.

The analogy with black holes is an interesting one but if there is
nothing outside the universe, then it cannot be radiating energy
outside itself as black holes are explained to be. So the amount of
information i.e. "quantum states" in the universe is increasing. We
see it as entropy, but to an information processor with huge
computational capabilities, it is compressible information.

Quantum field theory calculations where imaginary time is periodic,
with period 1/T are equivalent to statistical mechanics calculations
where the temperature is T. The periodic waveforms that are opposed
yet "in phase" would be at standing wave resonance, giving the
action.

Periodicity is a symmetry. Rotate into the complex plane and we have
real numbers on the horizonal axis and imaginary numbers on the
vertical axis. So a periodic function could exist with periodicity
along both the imaginary AND the real axis. Such functions would have

amazing symmetries. Functions that remain unchanged, when the complex

variable "z" is changed.

f(z)---->f(az+b/cz+d)

Where the elements a,b,c,d, are arranged as a matrix, forming an
algebraic group. An infinite number of possible variations that
commute with each other as the function f, is invariant under group
transformations. These functions are known as "automorphic forms".

Topologically speaking, the wormhole transformations must be
invariant with regards to time travel. In other words, by traveling
backwards in time, we "complete" the future, and no paradoxes are
created.

So when spacetime tears and a wormhole is created, it must obey
certain transformative rules, which probably appear to be
discontinuities from a "3-D" perspective, but really, these
transformations are continuous?


[v1+v2]/[1+ v1v2/c^2]

c+c = c

aleph_0 + aleph_0 = aleph_0

0 + 0 = 0

Gravity exists because the information density of space-time is
increasing. This creates a "pressure force" where processed space,
compresses mass-energy, and mass-energy reacts by compressing space.
The process is "time", which becomes dilated due to the increased
information density of massive objects.
Stephen Hawking's excellent book, "Universe in a Nutshell", explains
holography as a phenomenon of interference of wave patterns. Light
from a laser is split into two separate beams, one bounces off the
object and gets reflected onto a photo-sensitized plate. The other
beam is reflected into a lens and collides with the reflected light
of the object. When a laser is shone through the developed plate, a
fully three dimensional image of the original object is created.

According to conventional theories, the surface area of the horizon
surrounding a black hole, measures its entropy, where entropy is
defined as a measure of the number of internal states that the black
hole can be in without looking different to an outside observer, who
can only measure mass, rotation and charge. This leads to another
theory which states that the maximum entropy of any closed region of
space can never exceed one quarter of the area of the circumscribing
surface, with the entropy being the measure of the total information
contained by the system. So the theorists came to realize that the
information associated with all phenomena in the three dimensional
world, can be stored on its two dimensional boundary, like a
holographic image.

S' = S_m + A/4

Since entropy can also be defined as the number of states within a
region of space, and the entropy of the universe must always
increase, the next logical step is to realize that the spacetime
density, i.e. the information encoded within a circumscribed region
of space, must be increasing in the thermodynamic direction of time.


The entropy of thermodynamics and entropy of Shannon, are equivalent
concepts, because the number of arrangements that are counted by
Boltzmann entropy reflects the amount of Shannon information needed
to implement any particular combination, or arrangement. The two
entropies also appear to have differences, superficially.
Thermodynamic entropy interpreted in units of energy divided by
temperature, while, the Shannon entropy is interpreted in terms of
bits, being essentially dimensionless. The difference is a matter of
convention.



----== Posted via Newsfeed.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==----
http://www.newsfeed.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! >100,000 Newsgroups
---= 19 East/West-Coast Specialized Servers - Total Privacy via Encryption =---

Mentioned above is discrete steps of space and the continuum coexisting.
This only works if the discrete step is an infinitesimal. I consider
the infinitesimal to be a nonzero quantity. Making it the smallest
of all quantities, not the abscence of any quantity -(0) as others
consider it.
Gravity is a continuum. And any quantizing of space is not
enough. We need to quantize curved space-time.

My shot is we should quantize a curved space-time interval.
--Light Falls--
What is space? It is a metaphysical motion greater than any
motion of a moving object in it. If this 3 dimensional motion
were to stop in any direction there would no longer be any distance to go.
You could no longer move in that retracted dimension.
This is a metaphysical definition of what space actually is.
Mitch Raemsch
.


User: "Uncle Al"

Title: Re: What is Space? 02 Feb 2004 05:33:37 PM
analog57 wrote:


x^n + y^n = z^n

Only has integer solutions for n=2. Dead on Arrival.
[snip]
--
Uncle Al
http://www.mazepath.com/uncleal/
(Toxic URL! Unsafe for children and most mammals)
"Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?" The Net!
.


  Page 1 of 1

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