| Topic: |
Science > Physics |
| User: |
"Pentcho Valev" |
| Date: |
11 Aug 2005 01:26:09 AM |
| Object: |
Why Einstein tested his zombis' loyalty and love |
Pentcho Valev wrote:
Consider the rotating disk experiment described by Einstein in Chapter
23 in his "Relativity". Assume that, prior to rotating (the disk is
still immobile in the non-rotating Galileian system K), the periphery
of the disk is covered by exactly 1000 standard measuring-rods so that
the length of the periphery is measured to be 1000. Then, with the rods
still fixed on its periphery, the disk starts rotating. While it is
rotating, Einstein says:
"If the observer applies his standard measuring-rod.... tangentially to
the edge of the disc, then, as judged from the Galileian system, the
length of the rod will be less than 1..."
This implies that, as judged from the Galileian system, the length of
both the 1000 rods and the periphery they cover will be measured to be
less than 1000, e.g. 999. At this very moment however Einstein forces
the zombi to immediately forget the implication and accept, with
enthusiasm and love, the opposite assertion. From now on the zombi
should repeat with Einstein that, as judged from the Galileian system,
the length of the periphery is GREATER than 1000. The manifestation of
love is essential. Loving zombis will become professors. The
indifferent may not become professors.
Einstein paid some attention to this problem since he (unlike his
zombis) knew quite well what was at stake. So he made the rotating disk
bend and curve in such a way as to confuse the picture and make
impossible any verification of the idiotic claim that, judging from the
non-rotating system, the circumference of the rotating disk was longer
than that of a non-rotating disk. What was at stake? Of course,
Einstein discovery in his 1905 paper that confused additionally the
contradictory theory of Lorentz-Poincare: THE ASYMMETRICAL TIME
CONTRACTION. A clock at rest should run FASTER by a factor of 1/gamma
relative to a clock moving with a constant speed in a closed curve.
Einstein feared that some zombi might decide to divide the length of
the circumference by the period and if the rotating circomference were
not longer, the result would be tragic and the zombi's faith might be
undermined. The zombi may also decide to replace the rotating disk with
a rotating ring which would not bend and curve - another awful idea.
On the other hand, the idiotic time contraction introduced by Einstein
in his 1905 paper is the real basis of the theory of relativity - see:
http://www.wbabin.net/valev/valev6.htm
Pentcho Valev
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| User: "Harry" |
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| Title: Re: Why Einstein tested his zombis' loyalty and love |
11 Aug 2005 02:43:25 AM |
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"Pentcho Valev" <pvalev@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1123741569.586688.274460@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Pentcho Valev wrote:
Consider the rotating disk experiment described by Einstein in Chapter
23 in his "Relativity". Assume that, prior to rotating (the disk is
still immobile in the non-rotating Galileian system K), the periphery
of the disk is covered by exactly 1000 standard measuring-rods so that
the length of the periphery is measured to be 1000. Then, with the rods
still fixed on its periphery, the disk starts rotating. While it is
rotating, Einstein says:
"If the observer applies his standard measuring-rod.... tangentially to
the edge of the disc, then, as judged from the Galileian system, the
length of the rod will be less than 1..."
This implies that, as judged from the Galileian system, the length of
both the 1000 rods and the periphery they cover will be measured to be
less than 1000, e.g. 999. At this very moment however Einstein forces
the zombi to immediately forget the implication and accept, with
enthusiasm and love, the opposite assertion. From now on the zombi
should repeat with Einstein that, as judged from the Galileian system,
the length of the periphery is GREATER than 1000. The manifestation of
love is essential. Loving zombis will become professors. The
indifferent may not become professors.
Einstein paid some attention to this problem since he (unlike his
zombis) knew quite well what was at stake. So he made the rotating disk
bend and curve in such a way as to confuse the picture and make
impossible any verification of the idiotic claim that, judging from the
non-rotating system, the circumference of the rotating disk was longer
than that of a non-rotating disk. What was at stake? Of course,
Einstein discovery in his 1905 paper that confused additionally the
contradictory theory of Lorentz-Poincare: THE ASYMMETRICAL TIME
CONTRACTION. A clock at rest should run FASTER by a factor of 1/gamma
relative to a clock moving with a constant speed in a closed curve.
Einstein feared that some zombi might decide to divide the length of
the circumference by the period and if the rotating circomference were
not longer, the result would be tragic and the zombi's faith might be
undermined. The zombi may also decide to replace the rotating disk with
a rotating ring which would not bend and curve - another awful idea.
On the other hand, the idiotic time contraction introduced by Einstein
in his 1905 paper is the real basis of the theory of relativity - see:
http://www.wbabin.net/valev/valev6.htm
Pentcho Valev
Dear Pentcho,
I didn't see any reply by you to the rebuttals in your last thread - nor in
the ones before!! Thus I think that you have degraded yourself to the level
of a spammer. Please stop starting new threads without giving proper
attention and recognition to the replies.
Harald
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| User: "Michael Gray" |
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| Title: Re: Why Einstein tested his zombis' loyalty and love |
11 Aug 2005 04:27:54 AM |
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On Thu, 11 Aug 2005 09:43:25 +0200, "Harry" <harald.vanlintel@epfl.ch>
wrote:
:
Dear Pentcho,
I didn't see any reply by you to the rebuttals in your last thread - nor in
the ones before!! Thus I think that you have degraded yourself to the level
of a spammer. Please stop starting new threads without giving proper
attention and recognition to the replies.
Harald
I think that you are now asking the impossible, of the ineducable.
Good luck...
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| User: "Daryl McCullough" |
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| Title: Re: Why Einstein tested his zombis' loyalty and love |
11 Aug 2005 07:57:53 AM |
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Pentcho Valev says...
blah, blah, blah.
What's ironic about such postings is that the people who are
always bringing up Einstein are the *anti-relativists*. They
are positively obsessed with the man.
Mainstream physicists, in contrast, will typically tell you
that it isn't necessary to bring up Einstein in order to
explain relativity. He may have invented it (or maybe
not---see the thread about Poincare) but a scientific
theory must stand on its own. The fame or infamy of its
inventor is completely irrelevant.
So there are no "Einstein's zombies", unless you mean
those zombies who are programmed to attack Einstein at
every chance.
--
Daryl McCullough
Ithaca, NY
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| User: "Harry" |
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| Title: Re: Why Einstein tested his zombis' loyalty and love |
11 Aug 2005 11:42:54 AM |
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"Daryl McCullough" <stevendaryl3016@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:ddfi0h01933@drn.newsguy.com...
Pentcho Valev says...
blah, blah, blah.
What's ironic about such postings is that the people who are
always bringing up Einstein are the *anti-relativists*. They
are positively obsessed with the man.
Mainstream physicists, in contrast, will typically tell you
that it isn't necessary to bring up Einstein in order to
explain relativity. He may have invented it (or maybe
not---see the thread about Poincare) but a scientific
theory must stand on its own. The fame or infamy of its
inventor is completely irrelevant.
Very right.
So there are no "Einstein's zombies", unless you mean
those zombies who are programmed to attack Einstein at
every chance.
Not quite, such "Zombies" are in every "camp": See some fanatic reactions to
the Poincare thread ...
Harald
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| User: "Androcles Androcles@ MyPlace.org" |
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| Title: Re: Why Einstein tested his zombis' loyalty and love |
11 Aug 2005 10:30:15 AM |
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"Daryl McCullough" <stevendaryl3016@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:ddfi0h01933@drn.newsguy.com...
| Pentcho Valev says...
| So there are no "Einstein's zombies", unless you mean
| those zombies
He means "Starting the cuckoo transformations" McCullough because
McCullough cannot derive the cuckoo transforms, Einstein did, and that
makes McCullough an Einstein zombie.
Androcles.
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| User: "Robert Kolker" |
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| Title: Re: Why Einstein tested his zombis' loyalty and love |
11 Aug 2005 08:33:13 AM |
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Daryl McCullough wrote:
Mainstream physicists, in contrast, will typically tell you
that it isn't necessary to bring up Einstein in order to
explain relativity. He may have invented it (or maybe
not---see the thread about Poincare) but a scientific
theory must stand on its own. The fame or infamy of its
inventor is completely irrelevant.
Indeed. That is why Maxwell's theory of the electromagnetic field (and
he did not invent all of that either) has been derived in alternative
and more mathematically sophisticated form. The right home for
Maxwell's theory is the four dimensional space-time manifold where his
equations show up in a more elegant form. In fact, Einstein was directly
inspired by Maxwell's work.
Once anyone's theory is accepted into the arms of the physics community
it is subject to reformulation and improvement. A good thing can always
be made better.
Bob Kolker
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Why Einstein tested his zombis' loyalty and love |
11 Aug 2005 03:02:47 PM |
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To Bob
Albert's source of inspiration could be found in any science fiction
section of a bookstore in 1902,if the guys who call themselves
anti-relativists or non relativists have'nt enough brains to call you
on the fictional narrative of the 'Time Machine' then you deserve each
other.
"There is no difference between time and any of the three dimensions of
space except that our consciousness moves along it. But some foolish
people have got hold of the wrong side of that idea. You have all heard
what they have to say about this Fourth Dimension?'"
http://www.bartleby.com/1000/1.html
Maybe you should start reading ' Journey To The Center Of The Earth'
and revolutionise geology for that is basically what Albert did with
the ' Time Machine' .Like everything else Bobby boy,novelties have a
sell by date besides the thing has crumbled into the rubble it always
was.
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| User: "Harry" |
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| Title: Re: Why Einstein tested his zombis' loyalty and love |
12 Aug 2005 02:38:58 AM |
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<geraldkelleher@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1123790567.634208.212120@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
To Bob
Albert's source of inspiration could be found in any science fiction
section of a bookstore in 1902,if the guys who call themselves
anti-relativists or non relativists have'nt enough brains to call you
on the fictional narrative of the 'Time Machine' then you deserve each
other.
"There is no difference between time and any of the three dimensions of
space except that our consciousness moves along it. But some foolish
people have got hold of the wrong side of that idea. You have all heard
what they have to say about this Fourth Dimension?'"
http://www.bartleby.com/1000/1.html
Maybe you should start reading ' Journey To The Center Of The Earth'
and revolutionise geology for that is basically what Albert did with
the ' Time Machine' .Like everything else Bobby boy,novelties have a
sell by date besides the thing has crumbled into the rubble it always
was.
Actually, Minkowski. Anyway: I had not noticed the link with H.G. Wells.
Nice!
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| User: "Androcles Androcles@ MyPlace.org" |
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| Title: Re: Why Einstein tested his zombis' loyalty and love |
12 Aug 2005 04:23:20 AM |
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"Harry" <harald.vanlintel@epfl.ch> wrote in message
news:42fc514a$1@epflnews.epfl.ch...
|
| <geraldkelleher@hotmail.com> wrote in message
| news:1123790567.634208.212120@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
| > To Bob
| >
| > Albert's source of inspiration could be found in any science fiction
| > section of a bookstore in 1902,if the guys who call themselves
| > anti-relativists or non relativists have'nt enough brains to call
you
| > on the fictional narrative of the 'Time Machine' then you deserve
each
| > other.
| >
| > "There is no difference between time and any of the three dimensions
of
| > space except that our consciousness moves along it. But some foolish
| > people have got hold of the wrong side of that idea. You have all
heard
| > what they have to say about this Fourth Dimension?'"
| >
| > http://www.bartleby.com/1000/1.html
| >
| > Maybe you should start reading ' Journey To The Center Of The Earth'
| > and revolutionise geology for that is basically what Albert did with
| > the ' Time Machine' .Like everything else Bobby boy,novelties have a
| > sell by date besides the thing has crumbled into the rubble it
always
| > was.
|
| Actually, Minkowski. Anyway: I had not noticed the link with H.G.
Wells.
| Nice!
Albert was a patent clerk.
Albert was a patent clerk in Switzerland.
Albert looked at patent applications in Switzerland.
What do they make in Switzerland?
Chocolate.
Cheese.
And .....
cuckoo clocks.
Albert wanted to patent his own clock, and it was cuckoo.
Androcles
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Why Einstein tested his zombis' loyalty and love |
14 Aug 2005 04:19:22 PM |
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aND WHAT ELSE DO THEY MAKE IN sWITZERLAND?
sWIISS aRMY KNIVES!
EINSTEIN WAS MKING SWISS ARMY KNIVES IN SWITZERLAND IN ORDER TO REMOVE
THORNS FROM THE PAWS OF LIONS AND INDEBT THEM TO HIM.
SEE FOLLOWIN PROOF:
WWW.SCIPHYSICSISAPILEOFCRAPFORCONTENTIOUSIDIOTSWITHNOLIFEOFTHEIROWN.COM
HAVE A NICE DAY. ADDRESS YOUR ISSUES.
.
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| User: "Androcles Androcles@ MyPlace.org" |
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| Title: Re: Why Einstein tested his zombis' loyalty and love |
14 Aug 2005 05:02:30 PM |
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<donstockbauer@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1124054362.535388.285440@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
| aND WHAT ELSE DO THEY MAKE IN sWITZERLAND?
|
| sWIISS aRMY KNIVES!
|
| EINSTEIN WAS MKING SWISS ARMY KNIVES IN SWITZERLAND IN ORDER TO REMOVE
| THORNS FROM THE PAWS OF LIONS AND INDEBT THEM TO HIM.
|
| SEE FOLLOWIN PROOF:
|
|
WWW.SCIPHYSICSISAPILEOFCRAPFORCONTENTIOUSIDIOTSWITHNOLIFEOFTHEIROWN.COM
|
| HAVE A NICE DAY. ADDRESS YOUR ISSUES.
http:// www.new%20trolls%20needed.com
The old ones are drunk.
Androcles.
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| User: "Bill Hobba" |
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| Title: Re: Why Einstein tested his zombis' loyalty and love |
11 Aug 2005 06:57:31 PM |
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<geraldkelleher@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1123790567.634208.212120@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
To Bob
Albert's source of inspiration could be found in any science fiction
section of a bookstore in 1902,if the guys who call themselves
anti-relativists or non relativists have'nt enough brains to call you
on the fictional narrative of the 'Time Machine' then you deserve each
other.
"There is no difference between time and any of the three dimensions of
space except that our consciousness moves along it. But some foolish
people have got hold of the wrong side of that idea. You have all heard
what they have to say about this Fourth Dimension?'"
http://www.bartleby.com/1000/1.html
Maybe you should start reading ' Journey To The Center Of The Earth'
and revolutionise geology for that is basically what Albert did with
the ' Time Machine' .Like everything else Bobby boy,novelties have a
sell by date besides the thing has crumbled into the rubble it always
was.
Hmmmmmmmm. Interesting take - maybe even true. However considering time on
equal footing to space did not really occur until Minkowski presented his
formalism and his famous quote about time and space forever being untied or
something to that effect (I can't really be bothered looking it up).
Einstein did not initially warm to the ideas of his teacher - later of
course in developing GR it was indespensible.
Thanks
Bill
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| User: "PD" |
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| Title: Re: Why Einstein tested his zombis' loyalty and love |
11 Aug 2005 09:28:38 AM |
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Pentcho Valev wrote:
Pentcho Valev wrote:
Consider the rotating disk experiment described by Einstein in Chapter
23 in his "Relativity". Assume that, prior to rotating (the disk is
still immobile in the non-rotating Galileian system K), the periphery
of the disk is covered by exactly 1000 standard measuring-rods so that
the length of the periphery is measured to be 1000. Then, with the rods
still fixed on its periphery, the disk starts rotating. While it is
rotating, Einstein says:
"If the observer applies his standard measuring-rod.... tangentially to
the edge of the disc, then, as judged from the Galileian system, the
length of the rod will be less than 1..."
This implies that, as judged from the Galileian system, the length of
both the 1000 rods and the periphery they cover will be measured to be
less than 1000, e.g. 999. At this very moment however Einstein forces
the zombi to immediately forget the implication and accept, with
enthusiasm and love, the opposite assertion. From now on the zombi
should repeat with Einstein that, as judged from the Galileian system,
the length of the periphery is GREATER than 1000. The manifestation of
love is essential. Loving zombis will become professors. The
indifferent may not become professors.
Einstein paid some attention to this problem since he (unlike his
zombis) knew quite well what was at stake. So he made the rotating disk
bend and curve in such a way as to confuse the picture and make
impossible any verification of the idiotic claim that, judging from the
non-rotating system, the circumference of the rotating disk was longer
than that of a non-rotating disk.
No, he only did that in the version of the paper to be read by you,
specifically to try to outwit you and you alone.
Tin-foil hat time, Pentcho.
PD
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