| Topic: |
Politics > Politics-Misc |
| User: |
"Michael Ejercito" |
| Date: |
23 Jun 2003 05:56:29 PM |
| Object: |
Recall Threatens to Rock the Foundation of Politics in California |
The recall has been a tradition in California politics as much as
elections have. A few years ago, several members of the State Assembly
had been recalled. There had been thirty-one petitions to recall
governors, starting with Governor Edmund G. Brown back in the 1960's.
The gubernatorial recall petitions were mostly limited to a small
subset of one political party's voters. These recall petitions never
reached out beyond this small subset, and thus the required signatures
of registered voters were never obtained.
Now, recall petitions are once again being circulated, this time to
recall Governor Gray Davis. This recall atttempt has spread beyond a
subset of the voters of one political party, and is going to bring a
storm that will shake up the political power brokers in Sacramento.
When the state's budget deficit was revealed to be thrity-eight
billion dollars, various polls placed Governor Davis's approval rating
below thirty percent. Most voters believe that the governor lied about
the size of the deficit to win re-election in 2002.
Ted Costa, a taxpayers' rights activist, began the recall drive,
circulating petitions to get a recall election by the end of the year.
Then, in February 18, 2002, the California Libertarian Party endorsed
the recal at their conventionl, becoming the first political party to
do so. This endorsement was a sign that this recall had gained support
outside of the Republican Party. Then Represenative Darrel Issa
donated seven hundred thousand dollars to the campaign, and pledged to
run as a replacement.
The California Democratic Party decided to formally oppose the
recall, something they did not do when recall petitions against
Governor Brown were being circulated. Governor Davis has decided to
respond to the recall. Just recently, the Democrats decided to stand
behind Davis as their strategy to keep the governor's office.
For the time being, the California Republican Party has decided to
stay neutral on this, focusing their attempts on the Bush re-election
campaign and the U.S. Senate campaign. That may very well change if
the recall becomes more imminent.
The reasons for the Democrats and Republicans to oppose this recall
are nearly identical-the possibility that a governor from another
political party will get elected and be able to run for governor as an
incumbent in 2006. Needless to say, nonpartisan and third-party voters
would not be persuaded by such an argument to oppose the recall.
This recall campaign may have started as a longshot political
opportunity for some people on the fringes, but now it is a campaign
for the voters to weaken the party bosses in Sacramento, for good or
for ill.
.
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| User: "Merlin Dorfman" |
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| Title: Re: Recall Threatens to Rock the Foundation of Politics in California |
23 Jun 2003 06:17:11 PM |
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Michael Ejercito (mejercit@hotmail.com) wrote:
: The recall has been a tradition in California politics as much as
: elections have. A few years ago, several members of the State Assembly
: had been recalled. There had been thirty-one petitions to recall
: governors, starting with Governor Edmund G. Brown back in the 1960's.
: The gubernatorial recall petitions were mostly limited to a small
: subset of one political party's voters. These recall petitions never
: reached out beyond this small subset, and thus the required signatures
: of registered voters were never obtained.
: Now, recall petitions are once again being circulated, this time to
: recall Governor Gray Davis. This recall atttempt has spread beyond a
: subset of the voters of one political party, and is going to bring a
: storm that will shake up the political power brokers in Sacramento.
: When the state's budget deficit was revealed to be thrity-eight
: billion dollars, various polls placed Governor Davis's approval rating
: below thirty percent. Most voters believe that the governor lied about
: the size of the deficit to win re-election in 2002.
: Ted Costa, a taxpayers' rights activist, began the recall drive,
: circulating petitions to get a recall election by the end of the year.
: Then, in February 18, 2002, the California Libertarian Party endorsed
: the recal at their conventionl, becoming the first political party to
: do so. This endorsement was a sign that this recall had gained support
: outside of the Republican Party. Then Represenative Darrel Issa
: donated seven hundred thousand dollars to the campaign, and pledged to
: run as a replacement.
: The California Democratic Party decided to formally oppose the
: recall, something they did not do when recall petitions against
: Governor Brown were being circulated. Governor Davis has decided to
: respond to the recall. Just recently, the Democrats decided to stand
: behind Davis as their strategy to keep the governor's office.
: For the time being, the California Republican Party has decided to
: stay neutral on this, focusing their attempts on the Bush re-election
: campaign and the U.S. Senate campaign. That may very well change if
: the recall becomes more imminent.
: The reasons for the Democrats and Republicans to oppose this recall
: are nearly identical-the possibility that a governor from another
: political party will get elected and be able to run for governor as an
: incumbent in 2006. Needless to say, nonpartisan and third-party voters
: would not be persuaded by such an argument to oppose the recall.
: This recall campaign may have started as a longshot political
: opportunity for some people on the fringes, but now it is a campaign
: for the voters to weaken the party bosses in Sacramento, for good or
: for ill.
Recalling the governor won't weaken the party bosses. Now if I
could recall the entire state legislature at the same time, I'd vote
for that.
.
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| User: "Jafo" |
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| Title: Re: Recall Threatens to Rock the Foundation of Politics in California |
23 Jun 2003 08:29:08 PM |
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As viewed from alt.california, Merlin Dorfman wrote:
Recalling the governor won't weaken the party bosses. Now if I
could recall the entire state legislature at the same time, I'd vote
for that.
Works for me.
--
Jafo
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| User: "Tempest" |
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| Title: Re: Recall Threatens to Rock the Foundation of Politics in California |
23 Jun 2003 07:18:14 PM |
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Michael Ejercito wrote:
The recall has been a tradition in California politics as much as
elections have. A few years ago, several members of the State Assembly
had been recalled. There had been thirty-one petitions to recall
governors, starting with Governor Edmund G. Brown back in the 1960's.
The gubernatorial recall petitions were mostly limited to a small
subset of one political party's voters. These recall petitions never
reached out beyond this small subset, and thus the required signatures
of registered voters were never obtained.
Now, recall petitions are once again being circulated, this time to
recall Governor Gray Davis. This recall atttempt has spread beyond a
subset of the voters of one political party, and is going to bring a
storm that will shake up the political power brokers in Sacramento.
When the state's budget deficit was revealed to be thrity-eight
billion dollars, various polls placed Governor Davis's approval rating
below thirty percent. Most voters believe that the governor lied about
the size of the deficit to win re-election in 2002.
Ted Costa, a taxpayers' rights activist, began the recall drive,
circulating petitions to get a recall election by the end of the year.
Then, in February 18, 2002, the California Libertarian Party endorsed
the recal at their conventionl, becoming the first political party to
do so. This endorsement was a sign that this recall had gained support
outside of the Republican Party. Then Represenative Darrel Issa
donated seven hundred thousand dollars to the campaign, and pledged to
run as a replacement.
The California Democratic Party decided to formally oppose the
recall, something they did not do when recall petitions against
Governor Brown were being circulated. Governor Davis has decided to
respond to the recall. Just recently, the Democrats decided to stand
behind Davis as their strategy to keep the governor's office.
For the time being, the California Republican Party has decided to
stay neutral on this, focusing their attempts on the Bush re-election
campaign and the U.S. Senate campaign. That may very well change if
the recall becomes more imminent.
The reasons for the Democrats and Republicans to oppose this recall
are nearly identical-the possibility that a governor from another
political party will get elected and be able to run for governor as an
incumbent in 2006. Needless to say, nonpartisan and third-party voters
would not be persuaded by such an argument to oppose the recall.
This recall campaign may have started as a longshot political
opportunity for some people on the fringes, but now it is a campaign
for the voters to weaken the party bosses in Sacramento, for good or
for ill.
The recall would be going nowhere if it wasn't for Issa's massive influx
of money.
The repugs will pay dearly for this farce.
--
"To announce that there must be no criticism of the president, or that
we are to stand by the president right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic
and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public."
Teddy Roosevelt
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| User: "Michael Ejercito" |
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| Title: Re: Recall Threatens to Rock the Foundation of Politics in California |
24 Jun 2003 08:48:20 PM |
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Tempest <tempest@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<3EF798FD.D6C2C4AB@hotmail.com>...
Michael Ejercito wrote:
The recall has been a tradition in California politics as much as
elections have. A few years ago, several members of the State Assembly
had been recalled. There had been thirty-one petitions to recall
governors, starting with Governor Edmund G. Brown back in the 1960's.
The gubernatorial recall petitions were mostly limited to a small
subset of one political party's voters. These recall petitions never
reached out beyond this small subset, and thus the required signatures
of registered voters were never obtained.
Now, recall petitions are once again being circulated, this time to
recall Governor Gray Davis. This recall atttempt has spread beyond a
subset of the voters of one political party, and is going to bring a
storm that will shake up the political power brokers in Sacramento.
When the state's budget deficit was revealed to be thrity-eight
billion dollars, various polls placed Governor Davis's approval rating
below thirty percent. Most voters believe that the governor lied about
the size of the deficit to win re-election in 2002.
Ted Costa, a taxpayers' rights activist, began the recall drive,
circulating petitions to get a recall election by the end of the year.
Then, in February 18, 2002, the California Libertarian Party endorsed
the recal at their conventionl, becoming the first political party to
do so. This endorsement was a sign that this recall had gained support
outside of the Republican Party. Then Represenative Darrel Issa
donated seven hundred thousand dollars to the campaign, and pledged to
run as a replacement.
The California Democratic Party decided to formally oppose the
recall, something they did not do when recall petitions against
Governor Brown were being circulated. Governor Davis has decided to
respond to the recall. Just recently, the Democrats decided to stand
behind Davis as their strategy to keep the governor's office.
For the time being, the California Republican Party has decided to
stay neutral on this, focusing their attempts on the Bush re-election
campaign and the U.S. Senate campaign. That may very well change if
the recall becomes more imminent.
The reasons for the Democrats and Republicans to oppose this recall
are nearly identical-the possibility that a governor from another
political party will get elected and be able to run for governor as an
incumbent in 2006. Needless to say, nonpartisan and third-party voters
would not be persuaded by such an argument to oppose the recall.
This recall campaign may have started as a longshot political
opportunity for some people on the fringes, but now it is a campaign
for the voters to weaken the party bosses in Sacramento, for good or
for ill.
The recall would be going nowhere if it wasn't for Issa's massive influx
of money.
Not to mention the California Libertarian Party's endorsement,
which was the first sign the recall appealed outside of a small
minority of Republicans.
The repugs will pay dearly for this farce.
How dare some of them support something that nearly half of the
voters support!
Michael
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| User: "Foxtrot" |
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| Title: Re: Recall Threatens to Rock the Foundation of Politics in California |
23 Jun 2003 09:34:55 PM |
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Tempest <tempest@hotmail.com> wrote:
Michael Ejercito wrote:
Now, recall petitions are once again being circulated, this time to
recall Governor Gray Davis. This recall atttempt has spread beyond a
subset of the voters of one political party, and is going to bring a
storm that will shake up the political power brokers in Sacramento.
When the state's budget deficit was revealed to be thrity-eight
billion dollars, various polls placed Governor Davis's approval rating
below thirty percent. Most voters believe that the governor lied about
the size of the deficit to win re-election in 2002.
Yes, about a week after he was re-elected, he suspiciously
"discovered" that we were about $10 BILLION further in debt
than previously reported. He obviously lied to get re-elected.
This recall campaign may have started as a longshot political
opportunity for some people on the fringes, but now it is a campaign
for the voters to weaken the party bosses in Sacramento, for good or
for ill.
I blew it off at first, since no California governor has been
successfully recalled as of yet. But the recall has been picking
up steam, so I'm rooting for it.
The recall would be going nowhere if it wasn't for Issa's massive influx
of money.
The repugs will pay dearly for this farce.
Pay dearly?!? Dems already control the governorship and
both houses of the legislature. WTF do Reps have to lose,
Wimpest?
You're mistaken if you don't think Californians are pissed
about Davis increasing spending 38% in three years, raising
sales tax, and TRIPLING our vehicle registration fees. Some
other tax increases are sneaking through too, and they'll
anger voters even more.
.
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| User: "Jason Gallas" |
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| Title: Re: Recall Threatens to Rock the Foundation of Politics in California |
24 Jun 2003 01:21:53 PM |
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"Foxtrot" <foxtrot@null.com> wrote in message
news:h9dffv4bjs824shsuutbb6tr7f9fvgjaj5@4ax.com...
Tempest <tempest@hotmail.com> wrote:
Michael Ejercito wrote:
Now, recall petitions are once again being circulated, this time to
recall Governor Gray Davis. This recall atttempt has spread beyond a
subset of the voters of one political party, and is going to bring a
storm that will shake up the political power brokers in Sacramento.
When the state's budget deficit was revealed to be thrity-eight
billion dollars, various polls placed Governor Davis's approval rating
below thirty percent. Most voters believe that the governor lied about
the size of the deficit to win re-election in 2002.
Yes, about a week after he was re-elected, he suspiciously
"discovered" that we were about $10 BILLION further in debt
than previously reported. He obviously lied to get re-elected.
This recall campaign may have started as a longshot political
opportunity for some people on the fringes, but now it is a campaign
for the voters to weaken the party bosses in Sacramento, for good or
for ill.
I blew it off at first, since no California governor has been
successfully recalled as of yet. But the recall has been picking
up steam, so I'm rooting for it.
The recall would be going nowhere if it wasn't for Issa's massive influx
of money.
The repugs will pay dearly for this farce.
Pay dearly?!? Dems already control the governorship and
both houses of the legislature. WTF do Reps have to lose,
Wimpest?
You're mistaken if you don't think Californians are pissed
about Davis increasing spending 38% in three years, raising
sales tax, and TRIPLING our vehicle registration fees. Some
other tax increases are sneaking through too, and they'll
anger voters even more.
You especially don't want to raise taxes on people who are on hard times.
Everyone is feeling the pinch of the down economy and making matters worse
with the "fees" as they are calling them now only makes people more angry
and want change.
.
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| User: "Merlin Dorfman" |
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| Title: Re: Recall Threatens to Rock the Foundation of Politics in California |
24 Jun 2003 06:28:52 PM |
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Jason Gallas (jgallas@usa.nospam.net) wrote:
: "Foxtrot" <foxtrot@null.com> wrote in message
: news:h9dffv4bjs824shsuutbb6tr7f9fvgjaj5@4ax.com...
: > Tempest <tempest@hotmail.com> wrote:
: >
: > >Michael Ejercito wrote:
: > >> Now, recall petitions are once again being circulated, this time to
: > >> recall Governor Gray Davis. This recall atttempt has spread beyond a
: > >> subset of the voters of one political party, and is going to bring a
: > >> storm that will shake up the political power brokers in Sacramento.
: > >> When the state's budget deficit was revealed to be thrity-eight
: > >> billion dollars, various polls placed Governor Davis's approval rating
: > >> below thirty percent. Most voters believe that the governor lied about
: > >> the size of the deficit to win re-election in 2002.
: >
: > Yes, about a week after he was re-elected, he suspiciously
: > "discovered" that we were about $10 BILLION further in debt
: > than previously reported. He obviously lied to get re-elected.
: >
: > >> This recall campaign may have started as a longshot political
: > >> opportunity for some people on the fringes, but now it is a campaign
: > >> for the voters to weaken the party bosses in Sacramento, for good or
: > >> for ill.
: >
: > I blew it off at first, since no California governor has been
: > successfully recalled as of yet. But the recall has been picking
: > up steam, so I'm rooting for it.
: >
: > >The recall would be going nowhere if it wasn't for Issa's massive influx
: > >of money.
: > >
: > >The repugs will pay dearly for this farce.
: >
: > Pay dearly?!? Dems already control the governorship and
: > both houses of the legislature. WTF do Reps have to lose,
: > Wimpest?
: >
: > You're mistaken if you don't think Californians are pissed
: > about Davis increasing spending 38% in three years, raising
: > sales tax, and TRIPLING our vehicle registration fees. Some
: > other tax increases are sneaking through too, and they'll
: > anger voters even more.
: You especially don't want to raise taxes on people who are on hard times.
: Everyone is feeling the pinch of the down economy and making matters worse
: with the "fees" as they are calling them now only makes people more angry
: and want change.
Well, you either raise taxes/fees or cut spending, or some
combination, and nobody seems to want to step up to that--"raise
somebody else's taxes, or cut the spending that goes to them, but
not anything that affects me." And neither the governor nor the
legislature seems to be up to taking a stand and doing something.
.
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| User: "Jason Gallas" |
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| Title: Re: Recall Threatens to Rock the Foundation of Politics in California |
24 Jun 2003 07:38:35 PM |
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"Merlin Dorfman" <dorfman@rahul.net> wrote in message
news:bdamrk$b6t$1@blue.rahul.net...
Jason Gallas (jgallas@usa.nospam.net) wrote:
: "Foxtrot" <foxtrot@null.com> wrote in message
: news:h9dffv4bjs824shsuutbb6tr7f9fvgjaj5@4ax.com...
: > Tempest <tempest@hotmail.com> wrote:
: >
: > >Michael Ejercito wrote:
: > >> Now, recall petitions are once again being circulated, this time
to
: > >> recall Governor Gray Davis. This recall atttempt has spread beyond
a
: > >> subset of the voters of one political party, and is going to bring
a
: > >> storm that will shake up the political power brokers in Sacramento.
: > >> When the state's budget deficit was revealed to be thrity-eight
: > >> billion dollars, various polls placed Governor Davis's approval
rating
: > >> below thirty percent. Most voters believe that the governor lied
about
: > >> the size of the deficit to win re-election in 2002.
: >
: > Yes, about a week after he was re-elected, he suspiciously
: > "discovered" that we were about $10 BILLION further in debt
: > than previously reported. He obviously lied to get re-elected.
: >
: > >> This recall campaign may have started as a longshot political
: > >> opportunity for some people on the fringes, but now it is a
campaign
: > >> for the voters to weaken the party bosses in Sacramento, for good
or
: > >> for ill.
: >
: > I blew it off at first, since no California governor has been
: > successfully recalled as of yet. But the recall has been picking
: > up steam, so I'm rooting for it.
: >
: > >The recall would be going nowhere if it wasn't for Issa's massive
influx
: > >of money.
: > >
: > >The repugs will pay dearly for this farce.
: >
: > Pay dearly?!? Dems already control the governorship and
: > both houses of the legislature. WTF do Reps have to lose,
: > Wimpest?
: >
: > You're mistaken if you don't think Californians are pissed
: > about Davis increasing spending 38% in three years, raising
: > sales tax, and TRIPLING our vehicle registration fees. Some
: > other tax increases are sneaking through too, and they'll
: > anger voters even more.
: You especially don't want to raise taxes on people who are on hard
times.
: Everyone is feeling the pinch of the down economy and making matters
worse
: with the "fees" as they are calling them now only makes people more
angry
: and want change.
Well, you either raise taxes/fees or cut spending, or some
combination, and nobody seems to want to step up to that--"raise
somebody else's taxes, or cut the spending that goes to them, but
not anything that affects me." And neither the governor nor the
legislature seems to be up to taking a stand and doing something.
The only service I use in California is the roads. Beyond that I have no
problem cutting everything else. Hell, the roads aren't even that great
come to think of it!
.
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| User: "George Grapman" |
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| Title: Re: Recall Threatens to Rock the Foundation of Politics in California |
24 Jun 2003 11:29:06 PM |
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Jason Gallas wrote:
The only service I use in California is the roads. Beyond that I have no
problem cutting everything else. Hell, the roads aren't even that great
come to think of it!
You have private police and fire protection? When you get sick you see doctors
who went to medical schools that got no government funding and paid cash for
their tuition?
--
To reply via e-mail please delete "NOSPAM" from address.
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| User: "Jason Gallas" |
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| Title: Re: Recall Threatens to Rock the Foundation of Politics in California |
24 Jun 2003 07:41:50 PM |
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"Tempest" <tempest@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:3EF8E94B.F5ACD5BB@hotmail.com...
Merlin Dorfman wrote:
Foxtrot (foxtrot@null.com) wrote:
: Tempest <tempest@hotmail.com> wrote:
: >Michael Ejercito wrote:
: >> Now, recall petitions are once again being circulated, this time
to
: >> recall Governor Gray Davis. This recall atttempt has spread beyond
a
: >> subset of the voters of one political party, and is going to bring
a
: >> storm that will shake up the political power brokers in Sacramento.
: >> When the state's budget deficit was revealed to be thrity-eight
: >> billion dollars, various polls placed Governor Davis's approval
rating
: >> below thirty percent. Most voters believe that the governor lied
about
: >> the size of the deficit to win re-election in 2002.
: Yes, about a week after he was re-elected, he suspiciously
: "discovered" that we were about $10 BILLION further in debt
: than previously reported. He obviously lied to get re-elected.
Before the election, Simon was using the same basis of estimate
as Davis; in fact Davis came up with a slightly larger figure for
the deficit than Simon did.
And of course after the election, the Republicans accused
Davis of exaggerating the deficit...
And listen to the silence from the rightards regarding Bush's deficit.
Bush has revised the deficit at least three times in the last two
months, yet you hear no cry of outrage from the wingnutties.
Actually this thread was about California, not the nation. Try to keep up.
But since you addressed it, yes we need to get nationally as well as
statewide. I'm for reducing programs througout the US not just in
California. In fact, the more cuts the better. The fact that California's
deficit is higher as a percentage of budget than any other state however
says a lot about what kind of governor Davis is.
--
"To announce that there must be no criticism of the president, or that
we are to stand by the president right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic
and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public."
Teddy Roosevelt
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| User: "Michael Ejercito" |
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| Title: Re: Recall Threatens to Rock the Foundation of Politics in California |
25 Jun 2003 10:20:21 PM |
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Merlin Dorfman <dorfman@rahul.net> wrote in message news:<bdamuc$b8a$1@blue.rahul.net>...
Foxtrot (foxtrot@null.com) wrote:
: Tempest <tempest@hotmail.com> wrote:
: >Michael Ejercito wrote:
: >> Now, recall petitions are once again being circulated, this time to
: >> recall Governor Gray Davis. This recall atttempt has spread beyond a
: >> subset of the voters of one political party, and is going to bring a
: >> storm that will shake up the political power brokers in Sacramento.
: >> When the state's budget deficit was revealed to be thrity-eight
: >> billion dollars, various polls placed Governor Davis's approval rating
: >> below thirty percent. Most voters believe that the governor lied about
: >> the size of the deficit to win re-election in 2002.
: Yes, about a week after he was re-elected, he suspiciously
: "discovered" that we were about $10 BILLION further in debt
: than previously reported. He obviously lied to get re-elected.
Before the election, Simon was using the same basis of estimate
as Davis; in fact Davis came up with a slightly larger figure for
the deficit than Simon did.
But Simon did not claim the the budget problem was fixed.
Michael
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