| Topic: |
Politics > Politics-USA |
| User: |
"Transition Zone" |
| Date: |
15 Nov 2003 08:11:14 AM |
| Object: |
bush iraq war dead exceeds VIETNAM (early years) |
US War Dead in Iraq Exceeds Early Vietnam Years
Nov. 13 — By David Morgan
PHILADELPHIA (Reuters) - The U.S. death toll in Iraq has surpassed the
number of American soldiers killed during the first three years of the
Vietnam War, the brutal Cold War conflict that cast a shadow over U.S.
affairs for more than a generation.
A Reuters analysis of Defense Department statistics showed on Thursday
that the Vietnam War, which the Army says officially began on Dec. 11,
1961, produced a combined 392 fatal casualties from 1962 through 1964,
when American troop levels in Indochina stood at just over 17,000.
By comparison, a roadside bomb attack that killed a soldier in Baghdad
on Wednesday brought to 397 the tally of American dead in Iraq, where
U.S. forces number about 130,000 troops -- the same number reached in
Vietnam by October 1965.
The casualty count for Iraq apparently surpassed the Vietnam figure
last Sunday, when a U.S. soldier killed in a rocket-propelled grenade
attack south of Baghdad became the conflict's 393rd American casualty
since Operation Iraqi Freedom began on March 20.
Larger still is the number of American casualties from the broader
U.S. war on terrorism, which has produced 488 military deaths in Iraq,
Afghanistan, the Philippines, Southwest Asia and other locations.
Statistics from battle zones outside Iraq show that 91 soldiers have
died since Oct. 7, 2001, as part of Operation Enduring Freedom, which
President Bush launched against Afghanistan's former Taliban regime
after the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks on New York and Washington killed
3,000 people.
The Bush administration has rejected comparisons between Iraq and
Vietnam, which traumatized Americans a generation ago with a sad
procession of military body bags and television footage of grim
wartime cruelty.
Recent opinion polls show public support for the president eroding as
he heads toward the 2004 election, partly because of public concern
over the deadly cycle of guerrilla attacks and suicide bombings in
Iraq.
On Thursday, heavy gunfire and explosions echoed across Baghdad as
U.S. troops pounded rebel positions for a second night, and
administration officials sought ways to accelerate a transfer of power
to the Iraqi people.
U.S. COMBAT POWER
Because U.S. involvement in Vietnam increased gradually after the
French defeat at Dien Bien Phu in 1954, there is little consensus on
when the war in Southeast Asia began.
Some date the war to the late 1950s. Others say it began on Aug. 5,
1964, when Lyndon Johnson announced air strikes against North Vietnam
in retaliation for a reported torpedo attack on a U.S. destroyer in
the Gulf of Tonkin.
However, the Army's start date for the Vietnam War has been set by its
Center of Military History as Dec. 11, 1961, when two helicopter
companies consisting of 32 aircraft and 400 soldiers arrived in the
country, an Army public affairs specialist said.
"It was the first major assemblage of U.S. combat power in Vietnam,"
explained Army historian Joe Webb.
Vietnam casualties, which amounted to 25 deaths from 1956 through
1961, climbed to 53 in 1962, 123 in 1963 and 216 in 1964, Pentagon
statistics show.
At the time, the U.S. presence in Vietnam consisted mainly of military
advisers. President John F. Kennedy increased their number from about
960 in 1961 to show Washington's commitment to containing communism.
But not until 1965, after Congress had approved the Gulf of Tonkin
Resolution, did Washington begin its massive escalation of the war
effort. With a huge influx of soldiers, casualties in Vietnam soared
to 1,926 in 1965 and peaked at 16,869 in 1968, the year of the Tet
Offensive, data show.
In a major revision of U.S. military history in 1995, former Defense
Secretary Robert McNamara said he believed the Gulf of Tonkin torpedo
attack never occurred.
More than 58,000 U.S. military personnel died in Vietnam before the
war ended in the mid-1970s.
In another comparison, British forces that created Iraq in the
aftermath of World War One suffered 2,000 casualties from tribal
reprisals, guerrilla attacks and a jihad proclaimed from the Shi'ite
holy city of Kerbala, before conditions stabilized in 1921, according
to U.S. military scholars.
Reuters included military deaths both on and off the battlefield for
Operation Iraqi Freedom and Operation Enduring Freedom, for comparison
with Vietnam War statistics that made no distinction between hostile
and non-hostile casualties.
On Thursday, U.S. combat deaths totaled 270 for Iraq and 28 for other
battle zones, including Afghanistan.
Copyright 2003 Reuters News Service. All rights reserved. This
material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed.
http://abcnews.go.com/wire/US/reuters20031113_420.html
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| User: "BW" |
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| Title: Re: Democrat Party losses in 2003 exceeds those in 2002 and 2000 (the early years of the Demmie Death Spiral) |
15 Nov 2003 08:21:06 AM |
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"Transition Zone" <mogulah@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:3f224cda.0311150611.4dd84982@posting.google.com...
Larger still is the number of American casualties from the broader
U.S. war on terrorism, which has produced 488 military deaths in Iraq,
Afghanistan, the Philippines, Southwest Asia and other locations.
Democrats absolutely LOVE to focus on American soldiers who die in the fight
against Muslim Terrorists. 488 dead American soldiers so far, according to
Transition Zone. That's for Iraq, Afghanistan, the Philippines, Southwest
Asia, and other locations combined. Meanwhile, you won't see any posts from
Transition Zone and his Democrat pals about the 3,000+ American civilians
who died in New York City alone, in just one day, on September 11. Nor
will you see Transitition Zone add up and total the numbers of Americans
killed over the past few years by Muslim Terrorists in New York City,
Washington, onboard the USS Cole, in various American embassies around the
globe, and elsewhere. No, THOSE deaths, caused by Muslim Terrorists, just
don't capture the hearts and minds of Democrats such as our little
Transition Zone.
No, Democrats such as Transition Zone much prefer to try and always paint
America in as bad a picture as they and their sick Party can possibly
achieve. For example, for months and months now they have beat their little
DNC drums about how "bad" the economy is. Never mind that the economy had
already been turned around by President Bush and the GOP and was headed into
the highest growth rate that the economy has enjoyed in the last 20 years.
No, for today's Democrats, it's always Doom N' Gloom, for as far as the
Democrat eye can see.......
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| User: "Transition Zone" |
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| Title: Re: Democrat Party losses in 2003 exceeds those in 2002 and 2000 (the early years of the Demmie Death Spiral) |
15 Nov 2003 01:45:06 PM |
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"BW" <bw4@verizon.net> wrote in message news:<mDqtb.154780$mZ5.1049733@attbi_s54>...
"Transition Zone" <mogulah@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:3f224cda.0311150611.4dd84982@posting.google.com...
Larger still is the number of American casualties from the broader
U.S. war on terrorism, which has produced 488 military deaths in Iraq,
Afghanistan, the Philippines, Southwest Asia and other locations.
Democrats absolutely LOVE to focus on American soldiers who die in the fight
against Muslim Terrorists. 488 dead American soldiers so far, according to
Transition Zone. That's for Iraq, Afghanistan, the Philippines, Southwest
Asia, and other locations combined. Meanwhile, you won't see any posts from
Transition Zone and his Democrat pals about the 3,000+ American civilians
who died in New York City alone, in just one day, on September 11. Nor
will you see Transitition Zone add up and total the numbers of Americans
killed over the past few years by Muslim Terrorists in New York City,
Washington, onboard the USS Cole, in various American embassies around the
globe, and elsewhere. No, THOSE deaths, caused by Muslim Terrorists, just
don't capture the hearts and minds of Democrats such as our little
Transition Zone.
No, Democrats such as Transition Zone
Already know that General Clark didn't lose ONE SOLDIER during his
stint as Supreme Allied Commander in Bosnia.
Can your drunk driving RNC friends top that ?? No. I didn't think so.
Now go back to giving the US Military more casualties, you creep.
much prefer to try and always paint America in as bad a picture as they and > their sick Party can possibly achieve. For example, for months and months
now they have beat their little DNC drums about how "bad" the economy is.
Jobs were created under clinton. They were lost under Bush. Have a
nice day.
Never mind that the economy had already been turned around by President Bush > and the GOP and was headed into the highest growth rate that the economy has > enjoyed in the last 20 years. No, for today's Democrats, it's always Doom N' > Gloom, for as far as the Democrat eye can see.......
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| User: "BW" |
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| Title: Re: Democrat Party losses in 2003 exceeds those in 2002 and 2000 (the early years of the Demmie Death Spiral) |
15 Nov 2003 04:31:10 PM |
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"Transition Zone" <mogulah@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:3f224cda.0311151145.341243fd@posting.google.com...
Already know that General Clark didn't lose ONE SOLDIER during his
stint as Supreme Allied Commander in Bosnia.
Clark's a real zero. His chances among the Nine Dwarves are probably even
lower than Sharpton's. Plus he's not nearly as entertaining, nor does he
sound as intelligent.....
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| User: "Transition Zone" |
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| Title: Re: Democrat Party losses in 2003 exceeds those in 2002 and 2000 (the early years of the Demmie Death Spiral) |
16 Nov 2003 12:34:01 AM |
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"BW" <bw4@verizon.net> wrote in message news:<OOxtb.161674$9E1.818686@attbi_s52>...
"Transition Zone" <mogulah@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:3f224cda.0311151145.341243fd@posting.google.com...
Already know that General Clark didn't lose ONE SOLDIER during his
stint as Supreme Allied Commander in Bosnia.
Clark's a real zero. His chances among the Nine Dwarves are probably even
lower than Sharpton's. Plus he's not nearly as entertaining, nor does he
sound as intelligent.....
You are just mad, because your president is BEHIND in the polls.
www.zogby.com
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| User: "JoettaB" |
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| Title: Re: Democrat Party losses in 2003 exceeds those in 2002 and 2000 (the early years of the Demmie Death Spiral) |
16 Nov 2003 02:05:13 PM |
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"Transition Zone" <mogulah@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:3f224cda.0311152234.6f835643@posting.google.com...
"BW" <bw4@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:<OOxtb.161674$9E1.818686@attbi_s52>...
"Transition Zone" <mogulah@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:3f224cda.0311151145.341243fd@posting.google.com...
Already know that General Clark didn't lose ONE
SOLDIER during his
stint as Supreme Allied Commander in Bosnia.
Clark's a real zero. His chances among the Nine Dwarves
are probably even
lower than Sharpton's. Plus he's not nearly as
entertaining, nor does he
sound as intelligent.....
You are just mad, because your president is BEHIND in the
polls.
www.zogby.com
Yeah, these neo-cons get a little testy when their boy isn't
doing so well, which, of course, he hasn't for a long long
long time, if ever.
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| User: "Captain Compassion" |
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| Title: Re: bush iraq war dead exceeds VIETNAM (early years) |
15 Nov 2003 12:34:33 PM |
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On 15 Nov 2003 06:11:14 -0800, (Transition Zone)
wrote:
US War Dead in Iraq Exceeds Early Vietnam Years
Nov. 13 — By David Morgan
PHILADELPHIA (Reuters) - The U.S. death toll in Iraq has surpassed the
number of American soldiers killed during the first three years of the
Vietnam War, the brutal Cold War conflict that cast a shadow over U.S.
affairs for more than a generation.
They also exceed the US death toll for the first 3 minutes of the
D-Day invasion. This guy is an *****.
<SNIP *****>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
"Madmen reason rightly from the wrong premisis" -- Locke
"In this world, which is so plainly the antechamber of another, there
are no happy men. The true division of humanity is between those who
live in light and those who live in darkness. Our aim must be to
diminish the number of the latter and increase the number of the
former. That is why we demand education and knowledge." -- Victor Hugo
"There are two sides to every issue: one side is right and the other
is wrong, but the middle is always evil." -- Ayn Rand
Pluralitas non est ponenda sine neccesitate -- William of Occam
Joseph R. Darancette
res0mp8t@NOSPAMverizon.net
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| User: "Transition Zone" |
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| Title: Re: bush iraq war dead exceeds VIETNAM (early years) |
15 Nov 2003 05:08:10 PM |
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(Captain Compassion) wrote in message news:<3fb670e3.5029031@news.verizon.net>...
On 15 Nov 2003 06:11:14 -0800, (Transition Zone)
wrote:
US War Dead in Iraq Exceeds Early Vietnam Years
Nov. 13 ? By David Morgan
PHILADELPHIA (Reuters) - The U.S. death toll in Iraq has surpassed the
number of American soldiers killed during the first three years of the
Vietnam War, the brutal Cold War conflict that cast a shadow over U.S.
affairs for more than a generation.
They also exceed the US death toll for the first 3 minutes of the
D-Day invasion. This guy is an *****.
<SNIP *****>
Like D-Day lasted as long as Rummy's 7 years.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
"Madmen reason rightly from the wrong premisis" -- Locke
"In this world, which is so plainly the antechamber of another, there
are no happy men. The true division of humanity is between those who
live in light and those who live in darkness. Our aim must be to
diminish the number of the latter and increase the number of the
former. That is why we demand education and knowledge." -- Victor Hugo
"There are two sides to every issue: one side is right and the other
is wrong, but the middle is always evil." -- Ayn Rand
Pluralitas non est ponenda sine neccesitate -- William of Occam
Joseph R. Darancette
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