| Topic: |
Politics > Politics-USA |
| User: |
"Fool For Christ" |
| Date: |
19 Aug 2006 11:04:21 AM |
| Object: |
Evolution of Man Doubted in Study |
A recent article being touted as a "proof" of evolution actually show
the reverse. In a recent study...
http://dsc.discovery.com/news/2006/08/17/chimpgene_ani.html?category=animals&guid=20060817103030
...scientists were trying to figure out why man "evolved" so much faster
than chimps and others animals. What they found was that a certain
area of our brain would have had to have evolved faster than the rest
of the creature and, indeed, faster than would be normal for evolution.
In the article, the scientists say that this area of the brain
would've had to have evolved 70 times faster than the rest of our
genetic code. One of the scientists in the study said that they had a
hard time believing this could be possible, saying that it's not part
of normal evolution and that some unusual mutation would've had to have
occurred to make it happen.
There you go. Suddenly, those who choose evolution as the easy
explanation have lost their foundation. Evolution and creation BOTH
would require an unusual, sudden, change that is not part of evolution
in order for evolution to be the answer.
Ken Clifton
http://www.lulu.com/writingken
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| User: "Timothy Sutter" |
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| Title: Re: Evolution of Man Doubted in Study |
28 Aug 2006 05:39:52 AM |
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Bob LeChevalier wrote:
Since there still exist chimpanzees as well as humans, science clearly
is not playing your game.
Timothy Sutter wrote:
no, some people are playing a game
with themself and -calling- it science.
Bob LeChevalier wrote:
Yep. And scientists make the rules for that game, not you.
and the rules are a series of guesses
based on other guesses with zero corroboration.
But society looks at the results. Science gives results. It is
*useful*. Your silly arguments are *useless*. Therefore you lose.
the simple fact is that guessing when an event happened
and then guessing at the significance of alterations which
would signify this event and then making two sets of
guesses fit each other is not giving you any useful information.
you set a date, and you guess at the years per alteration
until these two give you a straight line.
it's still just a guess.
Provide a definition of "rigorously" that makes any sense whatsoever
in that sentence.
(A computer can *follow* an algorithm, but an algorithm cannot carry
out anything, not even the garbage. Algorthms, being conceptual in
nature, don't DO anything; they simply ARE).
and the processes associated with DNA replication
and prtien formation are being carried out -on-
the molecular level.
On the cellular level, and not by the DNA, but by the entire cell.
it's a little machine carrying out algorithms and
coded sets of instructions with the matter
they are written on.
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| User: "Timothy Sutter" |
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| Title: Re: Evolution of Man Doubted in Study |
26 Aug 2006 10:41:15 AM |
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"Timothy Sutter" wrote in message
but the phenotypes produced from the single genotype
have their own specific population predominances.
James Powell wrote:
If environmental conditions are held constant (as in a laboratory colony),
phenotypic variation will be very close to nil.
Timothy Sutter wrote:
'very close to nil' is not -zero-.
there will be fractional
percentages of variant strains.
when poisonings are introduced,
there are several varieties.
one has a large population and that is the one
that is succeptible to the particular
variety of poisonings.
the varieties that are not killed
are then enriched in succession.
you see a population inverion.
bacteria play a crowd control game.
one strain tends to crowd the others down.
but as you kill off the one, the others then
can compete more sucessfully for the resources
of subsistence, and so, with these low levels
of poisonings, anti-biotics and such,
it can tend to leave behind some of the strains
that are not affected by it to compete for
resources and enrich -their- populations.
and then, you get a predominant strain/population
that drinks a particular anti-biotic for breakfast.
which is why sometimes, you can administer a variety
of anti-biotics all at once and keep several at bay.
so, you may have to develope as many anti-biotics
as their are resistant strains, and/but,
the bacterium will still always have an advantage.
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| User: "Timothy Sutter" |
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| Title: Re: Evolution of Man Doubted in Study |
24 Aug 2006 10:19:03 PM |
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God has no beginning nor end
but this stuff called the material world
has not always been.
.
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| User: "Timothy Sutter" |
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| Title: Re: Evolution of Man Doubted in Study |
24 Aug 2006 10:24:13 PM |
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God has no beginning nor end
but this stuff called the material world
has not always been.
see, time begins with this stuff
God precedes this stuff
there is no 'before' before this stuff
no ability to cite a 'before' God
because no 'before' exists to cite.
God simply IS
.
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| User: "Timothy Sutter" |
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| Title: Re: Evolution of Man Doubted in Study |
24 Aug 2006 10:26:19 PM |
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God has no beginning nor end
but this stuff called the material world
has not always been.
see, time begins with this stuff
God precedes this stuff
there is no 'before' before this stuff
no ability to cite a 'before' God
because no 'before' exists to cite.
God simply IS
God breathes God
somewhat like you breathe the air.
God is Breathing eternally God.
when the breathing Spirit moves forward
in some utterance, this Word brings
the Spirit in to a 'new place'
a 'new place' that comes in to being
simultaneously with the utterance.
before this beginning, God knows God
as the private inspiration of God.
before this beginning, Love is a
private matter known only in God.
one can suggest that The Word which is
always present in Spirit and with Spirit
summarily formulates an encapsulation
of God's own Spirit, and,
as God speaks
this unseen Word, that which was not seen,
becomes seen, and God is beginning to show
that which God has always known.
in this beginning, of material and
non-material structures, is seen the
evidence of the unseen Word
and, as
the unseen Word is made manifest,
so also, the Spirit is realized
in this 'new place'
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| User: "Timothy Sutter" |
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| Title: Re: Evolution of Man Doubted in Study |
24 Aug 2006 10:27:20 PM |
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God has no beginning nor end
but this stuff called the material world
has not always been.
see, time begins with this stuff
God precedes this stuff
there is no 'before' before this stuff
no ability to cite a 'before' God
because no 'before' exists to cite.
God simply IS
God breathes God
somewhat like you breathe the air.
God is Breathing eternally God.
when the breathing Spirit moves forward
in some utterance, this Word brings
the Spirit in to a 'new place'
a 'new place' that comes in to being
simultaneously with the utterance.
before this beginning, God knows God
as the private inspiration of God.
before this beginning, Love is a
private matter known only in God.
one can suggest that The Word which is
always present in Spirit and with Spirit
summarily formulates an encapsulation
of God's own Spirit, and,
as God speaks
this unseen Word, that which was not seen,
becomes seen, and God is beginning to show
that which God has always known.
in this beginning, of material and
non-material structures, is seen the
evidence of the unseen Word
and, as
the unseen Word is made manifest,
so also, the Spirit is realized
in this 'new place'
strange is the singular declaration
made by God and conceived in
the human Mary,
is
different from the multiple
declarations made by God which
resulted in the material universe.
which is to say: the material universe
is brought forth in discrete stages,
whereas
Jesus,
that ultimate manifestation of The Word,
came about in one complete declaration.
one minor detail;
there is first, a declaration which
results in the conception in Mary,
and later, two declarations
of support for the human
being so formed,
which is to say, the thunder
from the blue which states;
"this is My Son in whom
i am well pleased"
and then;
"this is My Son, listen to Him"
and then, Jesus is -declared-
"first born from the dead"
but each time here,
it's stamping the same
general remark upon
the human race.
a remark of God's own completeness and
Holiness upon a material creation that
was made to stand apart from God, suffered
paling anguish in comparison to God, and
is redeemed to a station of Unity in God.
.
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| User: "Timothy Sutter" |
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| Title: Re: Evolution of Man Doubted in Study |
24 Aug 2006 10:27:48 PM |
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if we say that each declaration made by God
carries an exacting image of God's own presence,
then, the multiple declarations made in bringing
forth the material universe, each resemble
particular manifestations of Theistic attribution,
whereas, that singular declaration which
conceives Christ, is the Spirit made Word
made material.
God has taken hold of this 'new place' and
the multiple manifestations all reside as One.
The Word made manifest is God,
but, a summed duplication of God is not God,
this drama serves first to demonstrate
with crystal clarity that God is God
and there can be no other God.
while God knew that God's own Spirit
would be presented with undeniable
clarity in God's own Word,
God can also be aware that any summation
of all Theistic attribution would remain
short of the Fullness of Deity in Love,
but, any lack of recognition of God's
Ultimate Preeminence in All
found in any summed
duplication of God's attributes must
be met with the strictest Judgement
until such time as God's own Mercy
is to be correspondingly bestowed.
to be 'not God' is not a crime.
to be 'not God' and not comprehend,
must be treated as a crime.
such chastizement is unutterably profound
subsequently, the removal of all blot is
Joy unspeakable and full of Glory.
Timothy Sutter wrote:
God has no beginning nor end
but this stuff called the material world
has not always been.
see, time begins with this stuff
God precedes this stuff
there is no 'before' before this stuff
no ability to cite a 'before' God
because no 'before' exists to cite.
God simply IS
God breathes God
somewhat like you breathe the air.
God is Breathing eternally God.
when the breathing Spirit moves forward
in some utterance, this Word brings
the Spirit in to a 'new place'
a 'new place' that comes in to being
simultaneously with the utterance.
before this beginning, God knows God
as the private inspiration of God.
before this beginning, Love is a
private matter known only in God.
one can suggest that The Word which is
always present in Spirit and with Spirit
summarily formulates an encapsulation
of God's own Spirit, and,
as God speaks
this unseen Word, that which was not seen,
becomes seen, and God is beginning to show
that which God has always known.
in this beginning, of material and
non-material structures, is seen the
evidence of the unseen Word
and, as
the unseen Word is made manifest,
so also, the Spirit is realized
in this 'new place'
strange is the singular declaration
made by God and conceived in
the human Mary,
is
different from the multiple
declarations made by God which
resulted in the material universe.
which is to say: the material universe
is brought forth in discrete stages,
whereas
Jesus,
that ultimate manifestation of The Word,
came about in one complete declaration.
one minor detail;
there is first, a declaration which
results in the conception in Mary,
and later, two declarations
of support for the human
being so formed,
which is to say, the thunder
from the blue which states;
"this is My Son in whom
i am well pleased"
and then;
"this is My Son, listen to Him"
and then, Jesus is -declared-
"first born from the dead"
but each time here,
it's stamping the same
general remark upon
the human race.
a remark of God's own completeness and
Holiness upon a material creation that
was made to stand apart from God, suffered
paling anguish in comparison to God, and
is redeemed to a station of Unity in God.
.
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| User: "Timothy Sutter" |
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| Title: Re: Evolution of Man Doubted in Study |
24 Aug 2006 10:28:16 PM |
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God acts according to God's own Will
founded in that Love which human beings
aspire to comprehend.
Timothy Sutter wrote:
if we say that each declaration made by God
carries an exacting image of God's own presence,
then, the multiple declarations made in bringing
forth the material universe, each resemble
particular manifestations of Theistic attribution,
whereas, that singular declaration which
conceives Christ, is the Spirit made Word
made material.
God has taken hold of this 'new place' and
the multiple manifestations all reside as One.
The Word made manifest is God,
but, a summed duplication of God is not God,
this drama serves first to demonstrate
with crystal clarity that God is God
and there can be no other God.
while God knew that God's own Spirit
would be presented with undeniable
clarity in God's own Word,
God can also be aware that any summation
of all Theistic attribution would remain
short of the Fullness of Deity in Love,
but, any lack of recognition of God's
Ultimate Preeminence in All
found in any summed
duplication of God's attributes must
be met with the strictest Judgement
until such time as God's own Mercy
is to be correspondingly bestowed.
to be 'not God' is not a crime.
to be 'not God' and not comprehend,
must be treated as a crime.
such chastizement is unutterably profound
subsequently, the removal of all blot is
Joy unspeakable and full of Glory.
Timothy Sutter wrote:
God has no beginning nor end
but this stuff called the material world
has not always been.
see, time begins with this stuff
God precedes this stuff
there is no 'before' before this stuff
no ability to cite a 'before' God
because no 'before' exists to cite.
God simply IS
God breathes God
somewhat like you breathe the air.
God is Breathing eternally God.
when the breathing Spirit moves forward
in some utterance, this Word brings
the Spirit in to a 'new place'
a 'new place' that comes in to being
simultaneously with the utterance.
before this beginning, God knows God
as the private inspiration of God.
before this beginning, Love is a
private matter known only in God.
one can suggest that The Word which is
always present in Spirit and with Spirit
summarily formulates an encapsulation
of God's own Spirit, and,
as God speaks
this unseen Word, that which was not seen,
becomes seen, and God is beginning to show
that which God has always known.
in this beginning, of material and
non-material structures, is seen the
evidence of the unseen Word
and, as
the unseen Word is made manifest,
so also, the Spirit is realized
in this 'new place'
strange is the singular declaration
made by God and conceived in
the human Mary,
is
different from the multiple
declarations made by God which
resulted in the material universe.
which is to say: the material universe
is brought forth in discrete stages,
whereas
Jesus,
that ultimate manifestation of The Word,
came about in one complete declaration.
one minor detail;
there is first, a declaration which
results in the conception in Mary,
and later, two declarations
of support for the human
being so formed,
which is to say, the thunder
from the blue which states;
"this is My Son in whom
i am well pleased"
and then;
"this is My Son, listen to Him"
and then, Jesus is -declared-
"first born from the dead"
but each time here,
it's stamping the same
general remark upon
the human race.
a remark of God's own completeness and
Holiness upon a material creation that
was made to stand apart from God, suffered
paling anguish in comparison to God, and
is redeemed to a station of Unity in God.
.
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| User: "Timothy Sutter" |
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| Title: Re: Evolution of Man Doubted in Study |
24 Aug 2006 10:28:50 PM |
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God acts according to God's own Will
founded in that Love which human beings
aspire to comprehend.
God spins out a governing authority
as independant Beings.
before we examine the purpose to which
these independant Beings were spun out,
we would consider that in spinning out
these structural elements as independant
characteristics, these elements first take
on the attribute of 'not God' inasmuch as
they become as creations, and therefore,
God must redeem these structural elements,
themselves, in to full unity with God.
what could be considered strange, is that
any of these God breathed characteristics
could turn around, and view God as subject
to -it's- authority.
so, now, looking at this view, we can
easily see a potential for God's own
creation to turn on God and convince
itself that God belongs in
-its- dominion.
the Creator being ruled by a creation.
such authority as God already possesses
in God's own Perfect Will in Love.
God acts according to God's
own Will founded in Love.
such a turnaround could found a Selfish
elevation which would nullify ·that·
creation's claim to Love, the defining
characteristic of God.
should such a turnaround occur, its reckoning
as a potential hazzard would already have been
recognized, but still, it will remain as a
controversy in any creation that would desire
to subjugate that perfect Will of God.
in so doing,
·that· creation stymies its own freedom.
in so doing,
·that· creation distorts it's
view of Self to deny that
perfect Will of God.
in so doing,
·that· creation captures itself in a snare.
to aspire to God by denying that to which it aspires
it must deny it's own God breathed characteristics
and distort it's own view of it's own authority.
meanwhile, God is still God and only Loves.
but, ·that· unruly ruler has fallen headlong
in to a morass of irrational justifications.
whereas, ideally it would have it's
independant will in submission to
the unity of God's perfect
Will in Love,
it now has two ·competing· wills
it has birthed an indecisive
competition with it·self which
it also translates into an
adversarial position against
God, its Creator.
Self destruction is immenent
freeze it there for a while...
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| User: "Timothy Sutter" |
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| Title: Re: Evolution of Man Doubted in Study |
24 Aug 2006 10:29:14 PM |
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God acts according to God's own Will
founded in that Love which human beings
aspire to comprehend.
we could call this True autonomy.
behaving independantly according to personal will,
coupled with designs only to carry those admirable,
harmless and benevolent actions borne out of Love.
as God grants autonomy to its creations, we would
not consider it harmless and benevolent to allow
any creation to fixate on its own attributes
to the point of self destructive idolatry.
and so, should such a situation arise, during the
subsequent course of extracting such a creation
from it's self induced strugglings, if God appears
to 'smite' that creation with harsh criticisms,
we may still conclude that these criticisms are
borne out of an admirable Love.
even if that criticism involves removal
of autonomy and exacting demonstrations
of shortfall.
so, we should conclude that God's meting
out Justice is itself borne out of Love
and alone accomplishes the most Merciful ends.
it is not that God's work is purposefully 'booby-trapped'
but it is as if, in spinning out autonomous figures,
God stands at the door when those autonomous figures
seek an immediate return to the domain of God,
and now, God at the door represents a stumbling stone.
there is no way around God at the door,
because God is the door, and the desire
towards True autonomy is all pervasive.
there is this fine line tripwire which
is simply inherent in the situation.
in God as perfect Unity in Love the good
of the neighbor is exactly the good of God,
but, as God spins out these autonomous figures,
these new creatures must confront the motivating
forces towards True autonomy coupled with the
overriding necessity to cede 'all others' their
own personal autonomy.
and so, when these newly spun autonomous figures
are able to see their own good in and as the good
of all others, they succeed, but as any see their
own personal good as of primary and even sole
importance, they fall short.
and i mean, fall headlong over the stumbling stone.
and so, what may seem to us as
unbearably harsh chastizements,
is simply God falling with the stumbler,
and being there to lift 'it' back up
in newness of Life.
God never pushed it down, it fell.
and God alone can make it rise again.
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| User: "Timothy Sutter" |
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| Title: Re: Evolution of Man Doubted in Study |
24 Aug 2006 10:42:32 PM |
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common knowledge
not simply that any particular grouping
of people have what may be considered
common knowledge inasmuch as they may
draw the same conclusions on
a day to day basis,
but that, to have a common knowledge
is that thing which will designate
one as in league with God.
you may find yourself saying that given
the nature of God, that God is beyond the
grasp of human understanding, and at first
glance, you may think that you have
a valid opinion.
so, who can call to order that
which seems like a formless unknown?
or, more importantly, how will anyone
be able to afford themselves with the
common knowledge that so aligns them
with God that they may actually suggest
that they are in communion with God and
have some semblance of understanding
of things as God considers them?
when God peers into your mind,
does God find anything there
that God can relate to?
what is necessary is the simple impression
of God's own nature which comes from God
and provides a template which guides the
reorganization of your conscious personality
into that image of God, which is
your intended purpose.
as such an effort nears a more complete state
you will not be needing to evaluate your stance
each time a complicated set of circumstances
arises whereby you would need to consider how
God would approach such a thing, or what actions
God expects of you.
you would simply act in the appropriate manner
because you are in possession of that clear
understanding of that perfect will of God as
if that were your first nature.
so, it would not be enough for God to
approach you in your mind and rearrange
things so that God can have a better
idea of where everything is
in your conscious being,
like God walks up to you and starts
alphabetizing soup recipes in your mind
so that God now knows where you are,
and now, to God, you are more well known,
but, that God has to implant some
common knowledge in you that God
can then recognize as an attribute
of significance to God.
it would be only then, that you could
begin to participate in your own
reclamation into the station of God.
before that, you may have some idea
that such a thing as "God" exists and
work at developing some sort of portrait,
of your own device, that you think may
represent what "God" is and is like
based on your own careful assessment
of your environs,
and still fall short of a True
understanding or even a somewhat
sensible picture of the very
nature of God.
a God which you realize may stand
aloof to the material reality
which is your own.
after that God has implanted
a bit of God's own personal
understanding within your
concious being, you may begin
organizing your own personal
conscious stimula around the
seed crystal of God's own Spirit.
in this way, we can say that your
unique identity is maintained but
your conscious superstructure is
simply reorganized so as to allow
you and God to recognize each other
as friendly acquaintances.
particulars not being
particularly important
at this time.
that is, at this time, you don't need
a detailed listing from me which would
delineate the thoughts and attitudes
which are not recognized by God as
fruitful in your progression towards
that perfected image corresponding
to the love which is God.
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| User: "Timothy Sutter" |
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| Title: Re: Evolution of Man Doubted in Study |
24 Aug 2006 10:43:07 PM |
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you may find yourself saying that given
the nature of God, that God is beyond the
grasp of human understanding, and at first
glance, you may think that you have
a valid opinion.
so, who can call to order that
which seems like a formless unknown?
anyway, so, you'll tell me
that the bible is incomprehensible
inasmuch as the bible is transmitted
to human beings from God and God
is incomprehensible. or, so you may say.
all we'd be saying is that the bible
is unlocked to human understanding
by Jesus, the opener of the seals.
Jesus, that mediator between human beings and God.
that Jesus who is in possession of the
Divine Nature and most assuredly tasted
human nature, and presents you with
a focused avenue of approach.
that Jesus who knew a Glory with
God and as God, before the beginning
of all things,
and that Jesus who came among us
and tasted the flesh with its life
and its death and that Jesus who
returned to that original Glory
with God and as God.
that Jesus who breathed insights to mankind.
a very simple, and quite valid, necessity.
"Daniel, close this book up
until the end of the age"
and Daniel didn't even
understand what he was
transcribing.
same can be said for much of
the work before Jesus appears.
faint glimpse, as it would be easy
to comprehend when God says
something like this;
"my ways are higher than your ways"
so, God tells you that God is beyond
your immediate grasp, and -that-
you can understand.
so, God says;
"ok, little man, let's reason together,
God means to declare you righteous before God"
thereby telling you that God must come
to you and that God will come to you.
there is no other way.
for certainly God could forever
stand aloof to you and remain
forever out of focus and
incomprehensible to you.
but God did not create mankind
to dash his head upon the
craggy outcroppings.
making vain attempts at rising
to some unattainable pinnacle and
crashing in his hopes long before
he reaches the phantoms of his own device.
you can't walk around this
stumbling stone so as to find
your own way into the
eternal majesty.
it follows you wherever you
go and flaming and revolving.
as if, God may not only remain aloof,
but also, harden God's face against
your ever finding out.
but that's not what we're here for.
we're here to point you at Jesus
and exclaim the all sufficient atonement.
that Jesus who did you a service so as
to make God comprehensible to you and
then would not turn around and shut
you out from God's own presence.
more...
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| User: "Timothy Sutter" |
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| Title: Re: Evolution of Man Doubted in Study |
24 Aug 2006 10:43:33 PM |
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we're here to point you at Jesus
and exclaim the all sufficient atonement.
that Jesus who did you a service so as
to make God comprehensible to you and
then would not turn around and shut
you out from God's own presence.
more...
and then there's the currency of God.
God's currency doesn't have
an emperor's nor a president's
face etched upon it.
God's currency can't be stolen
nor earned by deceit nor trickery.
its rewards are eternal,
everlasting and can never be broken.
you become the wealth of God.
the routine begins;
the routine begins in your realization
that your life is not your own.
what you realize is that your life
is a gift, and one that will be
given you in measure.
you give the life, you find
in your possession, to God,
and God begins to reward you
with the profound understanding
of God's Own Presence.
as you accept that profound understanding
and make good faith effort to show yourself
as approved, God continues to shower you with
praises in the form of an ever clearer and
deepening realization of God's Own Presence.
aside from this realization,
you are dust destined for dust.
with this realization, entrance
in to the Rest is where the treasures
of the eternal existance are held safe,
and no robbery can remove from this haven.
this is the Mercy of God.
God gives you the entry
an entry you could never earn
you contribute to the elaboration
of God's fineries, these are
treasures you will never lose.
more will be in the details.
the fine lines and intricate crafting
may show themselves to you as of a
more profound beauty than that
exquisite image of the crucified Savior,
but none will be possible to see
aside from that Providence,
as therein is expressed the
initiation of God's Good Will.
anyway, for that abreviated version
the 'common knowledge' that we find important
is that knowledge between God and man.
God knows God and only God is able
to make God known to people,
and Jesus Christ is the common focal point.
God and man come to terms in Christ.
in this respect, it's not of primary importance
that you were ever a backstabber or a murderer
or a thief or held any number of the more
harmful attributes.
you may have been a guy who walked little
old ladies across the street from early childhood
and have always been a civic minded person
who stays out of 'trouble' and -still- you need
Jesus Christ to get a revelation from God.
this has absolutely nothing to do
with how good you feel you are,
but with how God has chosen to focus
and bestow the greater understanding
of God upon mankind.
but it is never a matter of man being owed
something by God and so such a person may
tap his feet on the ground and stand
impatiently before God and demand that
God bring him to completion.
"well God, i'm waiting, finish me"
no, before God,
that person who has the perfectly
manicured finger nails and sits at the
very best table in the very finest restaurants
may have the greater difficulty realizing that
he is naked and bereft and in complete
and utter want,
but, his want before God is no less
than that lowly street urchin.
if you don't see God's flaming chariots
circling your horizons, you won't know this.
we would that everyone could see.
and as such,
if we, or the Angels of God,
were to hate such as these,
we would be wrong,
but when we can pity you,
we see the truth,
because such can be naked
and bereft and not know it.
certainly, we come to God
because we know we need God,
God has allowed us to comprehend this.
and in our gratitude to God, we would see
that all be clothed in fine linens, such that
can never tatter nor decompose.
it's this obstacle course that we have
meandered about in for some time,
because in stark reality
Jesus -is- that magnificence
of awe inspiring enormity
and -not- a leper.
but it is we who need that
clarity of vision to comprehend
that the man with the perfectly
manicured finger nails is no
better as a human being
than a leper.
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| User: "Timothy Sutter" |
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| Title: Re: Evolution of Man Doubted in Study |
24 Aug 2006 10:44:19 PM |
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# you trust this person,
# and your trust is well placed.
this ends up addressing two aspects.
first you address the nature of this trust
and find it can be traced back to God and the
beginning of creation and then you find that
because you can trace this sort of detail back
to the same old story, that you can say that
this strengthens the view of the same old story
as that much more representative of the 'truth'.
meaning, because you can add another detail
to your description, that your description more
and more resembles the way things are.
so anyway;
there's trust, and for you, the human being who
is just waking up from a long nap, this trust is
centered entirely in you. meaning, you have yet
to actually place your trust in anyone as of yet.
so, you decide to trust another person whom
you've only just met and of whom you have
limited prior knowledge .
at first, this trust is purely, faith based, on your part.
to keep this as simple as possible for now,
we won't mention that you don't know yourself
all that well seeing as how you just woke up
from a long nap and you've never placed your
trust in anyone else before.
so, just stash that detail in the back of your mind.
right now, as a given, we say that you can trust your self.
this because we first want to address how God
could see things, and then, maybe we can come
back and look at what can go wrong.
like we keep one variable fixed so we can
look at the way an other variable behaves.
our old convoluted friend.
just remember, everyone knows and
can cite what dear Paul said about things;
"now, we see thru a glass and darkly,
but then clearly for we shall
see God as God is"
so, we've never denied that we, as
human beings, get a filtered image.
we simply suggest that as we use and hone
our sensory apparatus, both physical and spiritual,
that we can place more credence in what these tell us.
and that is the second part of the first sentence.
anyway, in the same manner as we traced "Love"
back to an image of God, and said that God as
complete 'parental' figure could be viewed as having
a nature that seems to be a Unity of two unique and
complementary identities that together form a third
total identitity which is all simply One God,
we can now look at trust as if that stems
from this perfect Love which is God.
just as if you were to call both
of your parents, together as one, "the Father"
only "the Father" is Justice and Mercy,
Word and Spirit, Love and Love and
sees no conflict.
whereas, human beings are lacking completeness,
and so, in general and quite often, the parental
figure we see is disjointed and polarized.
right off the bat, you see two people, where in God,
no one at all knows the full depths of God but God
and to whomever God reveals God.
so, i wrote a piece on a view of God
analogous to a marriage of sorts.
what's sort of funny, is that we never 'see'
any thing of the complete "the Father"
but have been gifted with "the Son"
who is that perfected -Image- of the
complete "the Father"
God doesn't need to split imagery up
into pink is for boys and blue is for girls.
God doesn't say, "Mercy is a female
quality and Justice is a male quality"
this because these qualities have zero
dependance upon sexual gender identification.
not even sure that a billy goat actually
could recognize such a thing as justice
or that a lady lion has any knowledge
of that which is mercy.
so, when and if we suggest that "the Father"
is a -complete- parental figure, we still don't
split this figure up into light and dark meat.
we have no right to categorize aspects
of God's own spirit into classes that are
dictated by our own flesh.
so, anyway, God trusts God as if the knowledge
were so intimate that no apparent component
could possibly hide anything from the other.
'they' have always known each other
so much so that no thing else can even
distinguish that there is any sort
of bifurcation at all.
so, back to you and other human beings.
obviously, you cannot claim an intimate
knowledge with someone you have just met,
and you can claim that there are, most definitely,
two people and not some singular entity.
but, in this example, you can claim that you
have trust and that you know what trust is
and that you can use your trust with someone
whom you have only just met.
long story short;
what begins as a 'faith' issue on your part
grows into a 'knowledge' issue on both parts.
where your faith is transformed into knowledge
by successful interactions of uncertain designs
coming into fruition.
uncertain only because they have yet to appear.
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| User: "Timothy Sutter" |
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| Title: Re: Evolution of Man Doubted in Study |
24 Aug 2006 10:44:41 PM |
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#> you trust this person,
#> and your trust is well placed.
first you address the nature of this trust
and find it can be traced back to God and the
beginning of creation and then you find that
because you can trace this sort of detail back
to the same old story, that you can say that
this strengthens the view of the same old story
as that much more representative of the 'truth'.
anyway, as a side note;
as an example,
for no good reason,
there are 65 people with red/green color blindness
and 3 people with regular twenty-twenty vision.
independantly, all of them look at an
array of spots that are red and green.
65 people see a blur and 3 people see
a picture of a red apple on a green pie plate.
by consensus, the 'true' representation
is taken to be that of the blur.
but the 3 people who see the apple on
the pie plate offer up a consistent and
detailed description of what they see.
so what?
can anyone convince, with persuasive language,
that the 65 who see a blur are not seeing a blur?
they are seeing a blur.
for them, what they see is a blur and
that is what the array represents to them.
for them, the blur is the 'truth'
what may trouble you here is
the idea of 'truth by consensus'
not that each individual does or
does not see what they see.
but which group understanding
more closely represents reality?
and you have 4% of people saying;
"it's an apple on a pie plate"
and 96% saying; "it's a blur"
and the simple fact that the 4% can never
use persuasive language, nor forceful action,
to make the 96% see the apple on the pie plate.
and by consensus, the 'truth' is taken to be; 'it's a blur'
so, what the 4% decide is to change the colors
of the apple on the pie plate to black and white
and then show that to the 96%.
the 96% all see the image of the apple on the plate.
and now, by concensus, the 'truth' is that the
image represents an apple on a pie plate.
and they all lived happily ever after.
of course, we could have said that the 4% were color blind
and the 96% saw the apple on the pie plate and the 4% wormed
their way into academia and proclaimed that everyone who believed
what they saw was a clear and distinct image were all stupid
and uneducated into the fact that the image was a blur and
that the truth of the blur was the only truth and that this
truth must be spread to all people regardless of any fact
such as their seeing a clear and distinct image of an apple
on a pie plate, even going so far as to openly persecute
anyone who said they saw an apple on a pie plate.
but then you'd have to cut out the part
about them all living happily ever after.
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| User: "Timothy Sutter" |
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| Title: Re: Evolution of Man Doubted in Study |
24 Aug 2006 10:45:16 PM |
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anyway, in the same manner as we traced "Love"
back to an image of God, and said that God as
complete 'parental' figure could be viewed as having
a nature that seems to be a Unity of two unique and
complementary identities that together form a third
total identitity which is all simply One God,
we can now look at trust as if that stems
from this perfect Love which is God.
as another little side remark, what may
be sort of funny is that God is something
like the twisted helical stranded structure
of the dna molecule.
and i mean -like-
not identical to.
like this sort of thing;
fixed width font;
___ ___ ___
....___/ \____/ \___/ \___...
\___/ \___/ \___/
look, there are places where it's just one line
and then branchings which give a virtual impression
of duality, and union joining and separations
are inherent aspects of God's own make-up.
and you see this sort of thing
over and over again in Genesis.
divide unify divide unify divide unify...
the immediate conclusion we -don't-
jump to is that God is at war with God.
no moreso than one could conclude that
cell division is a phenomenon associated
with conflict and animosities.
just that this idea of apparent division is
that phenomenon which proves that God
is One God.
Love as Justice and Mercy more reflects
the splitting of white light into component
colors than any disintegration into total darkness.
but you've heard these things before.
and we can begin to see the forms
of God's initiation of the creation.
as examples, not that God
-is- electromagnetic radiation,
but that God's own personality and
Spirit may -resemble- things of this nature.
so, say we do have something like
white light splitting into multiplex colors.
and then we have God, splitting out a variety
of independant personality structures which
each resemble -like- a color.
like several independant facets of God's
own nature each get a being of their own,
not that God cedes away this facet of God's
personality, but that God recognizes it as a
structured portion, splits it out and gives
it a spirit of it's own.
God still maintaining God's totallity.
i'm still meddling with this bit.
------------------------------------
Mercy------------- Joy ---------- Justice
/ \ / \
/ \ / \
Spirit \ / Word
/ \ / \ /
/ \Justice--------- Patience----- Mercy/
Love__/______________\_______________________/_______Love
\ / \
\ /Mercy --------- Patience----- Justice\
\ / \ / \
Word / \ Spirit
\ / \ /
\ / \ /
Justice ------------- Joy ------------- Mercy
look, there are places where it's just one line
and then branchings which give a virtual impression
of duality, and union joining and separations
are inherent aspects of God's own make-up.
Love as Justice and Mercy more reflects
the splitting of white light into component
colors than any disintegration into total darkness.
just as a for instance;
Mercy ------ Joy ------ Justice
/ \ / \
/ \ / \
Spirit \ / Word
/ \ / \ /
/ \Justice --- Patience--- Mercy/
Love__/_____________\____________________/_________Love
\ / \
\ /Mercy --- Patience--- Justice\
\ / \ / \
Word / \ Spirit
\ / \ /
\ / \ /
Justice ------ Joy ------ Mercy
anyway, i could add in things like
peace, kindness, goodness, faithfulness,
gentleness and self-control, and make
a very fine wiring diagram.
seeing as these would be
considered 'fruit of the Spirit'
then we can safely consider
them as attributes the
Spirit has or is.
but, "my words are spirit"
so, anyway, you get the general idea.
it's just that in God as Total Preeminent Being,
God is Both God and 'neighbor', that is,
Love for God and Love for 'neighbor' are
tied together in an apparent duality of sorts.
but 'they' are One God,
and we can't even suggest that a given
attribute is the sole possession of 'part'
of God, because 'they' are not parted.
but we can speak of it as a complementary
nature with apparent forks which are, in themselves,
expressions of this Love which is God in totallity.
and then we come to address the Creation.
again.
i'll work on it...
---------------------------------------
anyway, it seemed compelling so i tried to meddle with it.
whats funny is that to a first approximation,
this diagram below sort of models the "Mind of Christ."
it is funny because it seems to have two hemispheres
and it's all interconnected and convoluted like a brain.
'first approximation'
just as a for instance; [fixed width font]
=================
Faithfulness
/ \
Mercy Kindness \ Justice
/ \ / \ / \
/ Patience Joy \
/ \
Spirit Word
\ /
\ Self-control Peace /
\ / \ / \ /
Justice Gentleness / Mercy
\ /
\ /
Love
/ \
/ \
Justice Gentleness \ Mercy
/ \ / \ / \
/ Self-control Peace \
/ \
Word Spirit
\ /
\ Patience Joy /
\ / \ / \ /
Mercy Kindness / Justice
\ /
Faithfulness
===================
see, if you consider that God thinks in a manner somewhat
generalized by this diagram, you can easily see that God
is not in some interminable argument with God.
and God's Creativity is an expression of this Love.
see, the interpersonal adversary forsook
this Love for a parade of Self.
which i would like to look at in a bit.
the mind of the adversary takes
on a quarrelsome and conflicted nature.
internally darkened.
in a bit...
Spirit Word
Mercy Justice
Joy Peace
Faithfulness Kindness
Self-control Goodness
Patience Gentleness
--------------------------------
and we define the Creation as an act of Love.
love <---> creation
just as an example, God lets 7 aspects
of God's own unified and singular Spirit
express themselves as seven independant
'colors' each of which carry God's Glory.
Christ is the stamped image of God even
if we as human beings cannot see all there
is to see, God can see it all and
God approves, entirely.
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| User: "Timothy Sutter" |
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| Title: Re: Evolution of Man Doubted in Study |
24 Aug 2006 10:47:33 PM |
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so, the incorruptible God, alone,
can compare 'you' against God's own
exacting nature so as to assess
your emulation.
will you trust God?
if God tells you that you can properly
emulate God's nature, will you believe
and trust God to carry through
to the end, this design?
when can God trust you to
carry out your own will?
from the onset, your understanding
of God's nature is limited by;
'there's something i don't know'
God knows what motivates you and how you operate.
God knows exactly who and what you can be.
you don't know yourself nearly as well.
now, as you can muse to yourself,
'how -would- God behave in my situation'
God can look at you and know to a certainty
how your intent and behavior aligns with
God's own Love.
what we would like is for this hypothetical
self assessment to be transformed in to God's
own emulation, practically applied to your
own circumstance.
from your own corruptible awareness
towards God's perfecting awareness.
you shall become who God knows.
which is to suggest that God implants
and verifies an emulation of God's own
knowledgeable presence in to your
unique circumstance.
but, your own knowledgeable self assessment
represents a permeable barrier through which
God must be continually invited and welcomed.
which is to suggest that you must use your
willingness to allow God to write this
emulation upon your consciousness.
you can block God out by failing to trust God
and this failure of trust emanates from your
own self assessment.
and...
so, the incorruptible God, alone,
can compare 'you' against God's own
exacting nature so as to assess
your emulation.
....
which is to suggest that God implants
and verifies an emulation of God's own
knowledgeable presence in to your
unique circumstance.
while yet alive,
you admit to your death
and petition God for relief.
God will breathe life into your presence.
God will begin to lead you in to your own life.
you comprehend God walking in your life and
then you emulate God's presence in your life.
as you favorably respond to God's overshadowing
of your conscious understanding, you manufacture
behavior in accordance with this template.
as God leads you into this life of yours,
God will verify good and acceptible branching
and clip and prune away any fruitless offshoots.
you see the growth,
you eat the growth,
you become the growth.
ideally, some point should arise when
your comprehension of good and acceptible
growth is such that you can encourage its
multiplication and carefully trim away
any factors which may impede flourishing.
and then you will be emulating God's
knowledgeable presence in your life.
you will be verifying your own purposeful actions
against your own good experience of having walked
in accordance with God's own overshadowing presence.
now, you have a beginning in which you can firmly stand.
that which appeared as an end in itself is now
become your staging platform upon which you may
construct a superstructure that will resist the tides.
thank you, Jesus.
[lest i forget]
[not that i ever could
forget]
in likeness as a for instance;
how could you emulate something that
resides within unapproachable light?
Jesus, that Glorified Image of God, stands
between you and the unapproachable light
and gives you something to comprehend.
veil upon veil
and so, you 'see' a shadow
of Christ in your life.
and coming up behind you,
God is torching a presence
that casts a shadow of you
against the shadow of Christ.
veil upon veil
and now you can reasonably comprehend
how far you are away, and to what heights
you may aspire, all without overwhelming
you in a sea of unspeakable majesties.
veil upon veil
filters patters comprehension
just remember...
your reality is filtered
you live in a world of comparisons
the filters to God would
remain imprenetrable if God
did not make a way to peer through,
and Jesus is -our- 'peer'
.
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| User: "Timothy Sutter" |
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| Title: Re: Evolution of Man Doubted in Study |
24 Aug 2006 10:48:02 PM |
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an interesting thing concerning the
idea of 'adult' as it pertains to God.
if we understand that God is complete then
we can say that God represents 'grown up'
understanding that God is never been unfinished.
instead of saying to ourselves;
"God is perfect"
and then looking at ourselves and saying;
"nobody _can be_ perfect"
and backbiting anyone who would aspire
to God's full characterization, showing
a lack of spiritual depth, being trapped
in a conflicted struggle,
"i envy something i feel superior to"
we could simply suggest that any of us are in stages
of developement that are still 'growing up' into that
-full maturity- which -is- God, even if we reach levels
of maturity which can be described by human beings as
'adult' we can still suggest that as we are in our
human form, we remain in progression towards that
Full Spirit Maturity that God must Fire in the
kiln of God's own twinkling eyes.
i can rework these sentences in several
different ways and it still sounds strange.
and...
we could simply suggest that any of us are in stages
of developement that are still 'growing up' into that
-full maturity- which -is- God, even if we reach levels
of maturity which can be described by human beings as
'adult' we can still suggest that as we are in our
human form, we remain in progression towards that
Full Spirit Maturity that God must Fire in the
kiln of God's own twinkling eyes.
for one thing, this should free you up
from sitting there thinking to yourself;
"i'm not perfect, i'm not a christian"
God has already returned the human being
to 'good' status amomg God's creation.
God has already seen and acknowledged that
the human being can produce the fruit of
God's own pleasant nature, in Christ.
don't curse yourself,
God planted an extension of God's
own Being in to this material nature,
and God knows full well that the only
thing that will grow from that is like
a vineyard whose grapes one can detect
from miles away.
we are on the vine
we will produce grapes
in wet years and in dry.
"i am a christian, God's Holiness is mine"
why is the faith of a child to be desired?
maybe a child has not yet learned
to hide what it is ashamed of, and
what human beings become ashamed of
is a thing God treasures most.
we don't say the child is mature
we say the child is unaware.
we may also say that the hidden
human being is unaware, obscured
by its own fears.
can a child become aware of that which
God treasures and never become ashamed?
in some respects we hide our trust
because we do not know the truth
and without our trust,
we can never know God.
to know that your trust is well placed
brings God in to your midst, and
there is no shame in the Light of God.
you don't grow up by making yourself a child
you remain as a child because you trust God.
you trust God as you lose your fear of death.
a fear you seek to protect
with a veil of obscurity.
a fear a child is unaware of
a phantom of self preservation
veiled in your own efforts.
strip away the efforts, and you find
that you have nothing to protect.
now you can flourish as you shall.
it the trust of God...
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| User: "Timothy Sutter" |
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| Title: Re: Evolution of Man Doubted in Study |
24 Aug 2006 10:48:34 PM |
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a child of God
a 'child of God' is not a device which
carries out functions that God could
normally carry out on God's own.
one can invent a device which is able
to carry out tasks, but a washing machine
nor a dish washer does not operate according
to its own will or purposed intent.
God has purposed intent, and therefore a
'child of God' will have purposed intent.
a way that seems right
but leads to death
God is for ever always living,
life derived of God,
God imparts life.
you would aspire to be alive as
God is alive, by holding on to
and protecting a device that only
emulates life, and thereby reject
the manner that comprises God's
self sustaining existance.
to be a child of God is to rise
above the device and find your
home in the indestructible Sea.
choose life
God has life and is life and chooses
to impart that life in perpetuity.
to be a child of God is to enter
into the channeling currents of
God's own perpetuity.
God made peppermint sticks, and some
spirits stole some of the peppermint
sticks and converted them into murder weapons.
God is, therefore, angered at
those spirits, and, must destroy
those altered peppermint sticks.
God has set aside a portion of peppermint
sticks which will not see an ignoble use,
maintaining their intended
purpose as a sweet effect.
God uses some of the peppermint sticks as
instruments of their own salvation, inasmuch
as more peppermint sticks would have been
stolen and remanufactured as murder weapons
and all trace of the orginally intended
peppermint sticks could have been wiped out.
these sticks witnessed, and were involved in,
the destruction of the altered peppermint
stick murder weapons.
these peppermint sticks came to
appreciate their own finer qualities,
and to revere and respect the Creator
of their kind as one who is stern yet loving.
in short, life is supposed to be sweet,
and, while God doesn't -owe- you anything,
it's important that you appreciate the blessings.
God is complete before the onset of the Creation.
the Creation was not undertaken out of need,
the Creation is an expression of the "Love"
which is God.
man will enter into God's rest by decree from God.
this declaration is made upon mankind
thru the man Jesus Christ, who is YHWH's
stamped representation upon mankind,
who is the representational image of
that unutterable Love which is only
comprehended thru God's own Faith.
the seventh day is declared
as a celebration of the
completion of man.
one of these forward and backward
looking, indefinite, time frames.
somewhat as when we suggest that the
Passover looked forward to Jesus Christ,
and now the body and blood of Christ
commemorates a completion.
a completion stamped by the resurrection.
as you show your understanding that Jesus
lives when you accept the life of
Christ upon yourself.
and so, in the midst of the Creative event,
God pauses to remind the Creation that God
is complete and in need of no thing,
the seventh day is set apart as different
from the rest of the days just as man was
set apart as different from the rest of
the creatures of God.
and so, the seventh day looks
forward to Man's completion and
reminds us that God is complete.
God doesn't tire or suffer fatigue.
the first pause is a commemoration of
a timeless event, and that is God's
ever existing completeness.
the day is set apart for mankind as
an entryway in to God's completeness.
God sets the day apart,
the day sets mankind apart,
God sets mankind apart by that day.
we begin the entry into that rest as we
accept the declaration upon ourselves that
we are seated at the right hand of God
in the heavenly abode.
that is God's Will for mankind.
Jesus is the executor
Christ is our rest.
---
John 5:17
But Jesus answered them, "My Father
has been working until now, and
I have been working."
---
---
Romans 14:5
One person esteems one day above another;
another esteems every day alike. Let each
be fully convinced in his own mind.
---
sometimes things you've
seen and understood properly,
become even more clear:
whereas some may esteem a given
day, in commemoration of events,
as above all others,
i see the crucifixion
and resurrection each
and every day.
the crucifixion and resurrection
is of primary importance, always.
that is what makes you alive
that is makes you a christian
we don't do hocus pocus
we don't walk up to a mountain
and tell it to move and -our-
_words_ lift the mountain away.
no, we come to an agreement with God.
and God works wonders in our midst.
when we speak to God thru
Jesus Christ, we know to
whom we speak.
for instance, if we make a request
thru Jesus Christ, we know who we
are asking, and from whom to
expect an answer.
this specificity of knowledgeable
understanding is -your- safeguard
against being come upon by forces
which may -not- have your best
interest as 'their' interest.
we come to that point where we are
led by God and our doings are in
line with our wants and wishes,
chiefly, the want and wish to be
in agreement with God.
funny thing is, a small "amount"
of Faith is a great and wonderful
thing and no Faith is nothing at all.
so you need not ask;
"how -much- Faith will move this mountain?"
but you may begin to ask;
"where is my assurance that my
wants are in line with my desire
to be in agreement with God?"
so, you come to Christ and reckon
together why this mountain is there
in the first place.
is it to your advantage to be there
even if it seems to block your way?
who would care? who would know?
blind force cannot care and can not know.
but what is Faith and how does one 'get' Faith?
if we suggest that Faith is the confident
assurance that God will act on behalf of
human beings using the name and title
of Jesus Christ as intermediary,
and that Faith is the titled possession
of Christ by virtue of Jesus' unique
identification with God,
we 'get' Faith as we take possession of
God's Gift to humanity thru Jesus Christ.
that is, we 'see' Faith when we
'see' Jesus, but we make Faith
our own as we walk in agreement
with God, thru Jesus Christ,
and that confident assurance that
Jesus had, becomes our possession.
that confident assurance was given to
humanity in the person of Jesus Christ,
and Jesus Christ gives the same to you
as his reconciling gift to God.
and now, when you speak to God
you will have that same confident
assurance that God hears you
as Christ has.
and you will see the evidence
of God's actions on your behalf.
don't be alarmed if some of God's
actions on your behalf is in
tidying up your agreement with,
and understanding of, God, and,
-your- speech begins to change,
and -your- words no longer bring
condemnation on your own head,
but, instead, reflect your
agreement with God.
feeding -your- Faith,
from God to you to God.
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| User: "Timothy Sutter" |
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| Title: Re: Evolution of Man Doubted in Study |
24 Aug 2006 10:50:03 PM |
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-you are a devotion
you are a creature devoted
to God's purpose. that is, God
has devoted the human being to
a useful purpose of God's own will.
this devotion is breathed in to you,
the human being, and you become devoted
to the purpose which God's will has devised.
you are a devotion.
-you are a dedication
God has dedicated the human being
to the purpose of God's own will.
that Will being the expression
of the Love which is God, and
that Will being the duplication
of God's own harmonious nature
and being not losing an identity
but gaining and maintaining one.
that Will being the purpose
of the human being's existance,
you become dedicated to the
discovery of that Will and
pursuant carrying out of that
will under natural parameters.
-you are a memorial stone
you memorialize the life, death, burial
and resurrection of Christ in your life.
Christ being that Image of God in the human being.
Christ being the author and perfector
of your personal version of the Will
of God which is Love.
-you are a marker for an empty tomb
you stand as a living memorial
to Christ's resurrection.
your life in Christ demonstrates
and signifies that Christ lives.
Christ being the Image of God in the human being.
-you are an alien in a strange world
you live in a world whose activities are
dictated by the maintainance conditions
of a temporary natural existance.
your activities are quickly becoming a
memorial signature of Christ's indestructible
Life, the express Image of Love.
this memorial signature is alien to
the world of temporary maintainance.
-it can do you neither harm nor good
as you take on the memorial signature
of Christ's indestructible Life, enslavement
to the dictates of temporary maintainance,
which is devoid of Love, diminishes.
the alien world of reaction to sensory
stimuli does no real good and loses
the ability to sever your ties to God.
that is, in a world dictated by temporary
maintainance, you may 'feel' good by having
your needs met, only to find that these needs
are the exclusive enterprise of the temporary
physical being and have zero correlation to
the devoted purpose of the human being which
is the pursuit of God's own Will which is the
emulation and characterization of Love in your
finite bounded and encapsulated personality
structure, and so, meeting these supposed
needs is not THE good which supercedes
all other goods.
and so, in a walk with Christ, which is not
beholden to prima facia sensory stimuli, you
comprehend with a clearer vision that which
is God's Will, which is this alien
characteristic, which is Love, and
become that devoted purpose for
which you were originally dedicated.
-do not look to it for good
it can not meet your intrinsic need for God.
-do not fear it for harm
no thing can stand in the way
of your relationship with God
so as to engender any separation.
you were created for the express
purpose of taking on the qualities
and characteristics of God.
and God can not be denied the
fruition of a thing which God
has expressly Willed in
to existance.
-you are home in God
God's dwelling is infinitely creative and diverse.
you become that part of God with all the characteristic
traits of God in your own unique personality structure.
you are clothed in God
immersed in Life
immersed in Love
no shackles can hold this.
so you see, we are all of these things.
there is no judgement which
may strip that from me.
i only intend to draw closer.
let's not be too casual about it.
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| User: "Timothy Sutter" |
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| Title: Re: Evolution of Man Doubted in Study |
24 Aug 2006 10:51:30 PM |
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the consciousness of God is the medium
see, before there was any thing
God is conscious of God aside from any thing
the consciousness of God is the medium
upon which the consciousness of God propagates.
for all practical purposes, 'our' consciousness
is propagated upon the electrical impulses
generated by our 'brains'
we have and are, essentially, a
'consciousness emulator'
this consciousness emulator, which we are,
can detect and magnify the consciousness
of God which dwells inviolable
needing no physical medium upon which
to propagate and impervious to tresspass
by any and all physical adulteration.
and so, we shed the 'dead works'
associated with our physical beings
which stand in the way of our conscious
reception of the Holy Conciousness of God.
likewise, as the Holy Consciousness of God
pares away our physical barriers to the Presence
we 'see the light' of this Holy Consciousness of God
more clearly as through a polished lens and not
a dark mirror.
this is the 'Magnificat'
in essence
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| User: "Timothy Sutter" |
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| Title: Re: Evolution of Man Doubted in Study |
25 Aug 2006 06:22:53 AM |
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while the law may not be everyone's
religion, Law -is- some people's religion.
"congress shall make no law establishing law"
and in certain respects, a "church"
is nothing but a congregation of people.
"separation of people and state"
basically, you don't really even have to consult
the idea of "framer's intent" when you consider
the idea of "separation of Church and State"
it doesn't matter that "separation" isn't
written in the constitution anywhere.
what does matter is the difference between
a "Church" as an institutional body and
a group of people who happen to be religious.
and in America we say that we are
a "nation of laws and not of men"
that is, the "State" -is- the code of Law
which -binds- the people together, and is,
therefore, demonstrably a 'religious' enterprise.
where "religion" means "to tie"
no one wants a -particular- "Church" or
'institutional religious body' to interfere
directly in matters of State or the direct
implacement of a particular interpretation
or group preferrence over all other
interpretations encoded in to Law.
no one wants a "State" to interefere directly
in matters of "Church" where Law would be encoded
which would stand in direct contrast to a given
ethical interpretation of a set of people
who seek self governance.
but, there is simply no convenient way to construe
these sentiments to imply that a people, who happen
to be religious, are to be forbidden from participating
in their own governance or that a State need seek to
maintain the 'secular' nature of -itself- by ridding
-itself- of all -appearance- of 'religious' doctrine.
that is to say, no one may insist that a religious
people must be governed by an irreligious people.
this is false on the face of it.
but the simple fact that 'religion' and 'law'
are identical to some people precludes any notion
that a 'nation of Laws' can -not- be instituted
nor kept safe by a religious people.
in fact a religious people are likely to be
the more staunch protectors of properly
codified ethical behaviors.
with the allowance that variant
points of view shall be considered.
not and never;
"religion has no place in government"
religion does have a place in government,
and, for some, law -is- religion.
walking a tightrope is not to be confused
with cutting the ties that bind us
together as a people.
now, just look at these and see if you
can see how fair business practices are
some people's "religion"
and so, business practices in general
are also points of religious activity.
---
Leviticus 19:36
You shall have honest scales, honest weights,
an honest ephah, and an honest hin: I am YHWH
your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt.
Leviticus 25:36
Take no usury or interest from him;
but fear your God, that your brother
may live with you.
Leviticus 25:37
You shall not lend him your money for
usury, nor lend him your food at a profit.
Deuteronomy 15:1
"At the end of every seven years
you shall grant a release of debts.
Proverbs 11:1
Dishonest scales are an abomination to YHWH,
But a just weight is His delight.
Proverbs 16:11
Honest weights and scales are YHWH's;
All the weights in the bag are His work.
Proverbs 20:23
Diverse weights are an abomination to YHWH,
And dishonest scales are not good.
Proverbs 22:26
Do not be one of those who shakes hands
in a pledge, One of those who is surety
for debts;
Isaiah 24:2
And it shall be: As with the people,
so with the priest; As with the servant,
so with his master; As with the maid,
so with her mistress; As with the buyer,
so with the seller; As with the lender,
so with the borrower; As with the creditor,
so with the debtor.
---
and so this would be funny in that you can see
how Congress shall make no laws establishing
business nor inhibitting the free exercise thereof.
-that- you can see very clearly.
Congress isn't supposed to be in the business
of making business because Congress could be
subsumed and stack the deck in someone's favor.
and we seek after "Justice"
Congress is supposed to see to it that business
is freely carried out but not to establish a
business of it's own.
and for some people, the activity of engaging
in contracts and deals and commerce -is- a
'religious' activity.
the problem arises when "Justice"
is perverted in this endeavor.
the problem arises when people worship
the -benefits- of business practices
over and above the God who makes
all things possible.
the problem arises when one uses governement
to inhibit the free trade of someone else
in favor of their own free trade.
that is our old friend "Cynical Pragmatism"
rearing its ugly head again,,,and again.
and these are 'religious' practices.
and you never -have- to mention "God"
even if "God" appears on all the money.
and now you begin to see the tricky tightrope
of the establishment clause.
it is -not- just about saying "God" in public.
it is -not- just about the free exercise of
going to a Church building on the weekends.
"religion" does -not- consist entirely of
"worship" in a Church building or thereabouts.
"religion" encompasses nearly all
of one's day to day practices.
are -you- a person of your word?
that is, when -you- enter into contract
with soneone, can they trust you to
stand behind your word?
-this- is a "religious" quality.
the so-called 'major religions'
are quite concerned with the
bond of your word.
and so, your 'religion' shows itself
in your business practices and in
your legal practices and in your
interpersonal relationships.
now tell me how much you want "Congress"
involved these aspects of your life.
but they are.
so, don't go on about separation of church and state
as if it pertains -only- to 'worship' of "God"
what exactly is "worship" anyway?
-acting- in manners befitting your call?
etc.
==========
and so, basically, if you want to say that
not all 'laws' found in the 'bible' are of
a 'religious' nature, then anyone who wants
to see that such 'laws' are instituted publicly
are not crashing down any sort of
establishment clause.
if you wish to say that all 'laws' found
in the bible are of a 'religious' nature,
then the practice of law and business
are religious practices, regardless
of perspective.
either way, you really ought
to choose your enemies
more carefully.
or is that friends?
===========
so, i guess what some of this comes down to
is that corruption and dissatisfaction breeds
corruption and dissatisfaction.
if your dealings are corrupted, you invite
legalities into your life which seek out
some sort of correction to justice
and when your legal structures get corrupted
they still get all in your business and you
want them off your back, but you still want
to behave in a corrupt manner yourself, and,
are unwilling to seek out corrections so,
you get stuck with a legal gorilla on your
back even if that legal gorilla is more
corrupt than you are, or less.
meaning, the legal structures that get on your
back are just coming in response to your already
corrupted dealings, so, you can't really blame
that thing if it becomes as corrupted as you are.
but that's its nature.
no matter what, corrupt dealings
-invite- legal structures into
your life.
if you -really- want the
government off your back,
be fair your self.
otherwise, it has every right
to camp out on your doorstep.
and then, you can accuse each other
of encouraging bad dealings -just- so
the 'authorities' can get and remain
all up in your business.
as opposed to encouraging good and fair
dealings, so you can get and remain free.
cuz you -like- the gorilla on your back.
it gives you something to complain about.
and then our eyes glaze over.
and now, for the uplifting finish?
yeah....right.
it's always -been- in your power to be free.
like you needed -me- to tell you that.
but you have to shed your corruption
and walk in a manner befitting free people.
guess this means you have to help each other out.
or not, and then you can go right along
complaining about that beam in your eye
and how it obstructs your view of the hanging.
even if it's your own,
beam -and- hanging.
hurray for Jesus.
make me free in deed indeed.
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| User: "Gray Shockley" |
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| Title: Re: Evolution of Man Doubted in Study |
24 Aug 2006 05:01:38 PM |
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On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 16:25:56 -0500, Cary Kittrell wrote
(in article <ecl5h4$8k3$1@onion.ccit.arizona.edu>):
In article <44EE0DAA.40CE@lycos.com> Timothy Sutter <a202010@lycos.com>
writes:
Timothy Sutter <a202010@lycos.com> wrote:
Bob LeChevalier wrote:
Study biology.
define species.
Bob LeChevalier wrote:
No.
Study biology.
the definition is relevant.
PO43- and HPO42-
are called different 'species' of phosphate.
Not by a chemist. They -- and by that, I mean
"we chemists" -- call them the "phosphate ion" and
the "hydrogen phosphate ion". There are not
"two species of phosphate ion".
Watch it! This one may have a degree in "Professional
Chemistry" from a "bible college".
Remember what happened last time.
++ gray
how are yo uusing the term
matters to statemnts about coyotes and wolves.
this expressed trait is deleterious, right.
that's what i'm saying.
You have no clue what you are saying.
sure i do, you cite what you call mutations
in support of producing a more survivable offspring,
No. Mutations just happen. Those that do not result in the
production of survivable offspring go away by themselves.
in fact the dna guards against
such things very sucessfully.
And there is much current research into mechanisms by
which during times of stress, mutations and
rearrangements of the genotype are programmed
to increase. To cite one example:
The quickening of genetic mutation rates in bacteria may not only
happen when the microorganisms find themselves in strange and stressful
circumstances. A new report in Molecular Microbiology by Indiana
University Bloomington researchers shows that a | |
