| Topic: |
Politics > Politics-USA |
| User: |
"" |
| Date: |
07 Mar 2006 03:39:41 PM |
| Object: |
Hate Speech is Irresponsible |
Hate Speech is Irresponsible
by: Layla Shaikley
I offer my humble words to our First Amendment, which grants us the
right to freedom of speech.
I apologize, First Amendment, on behalf of the people who abuse you and
use you as an excuse to generate hate and enmity.
The framers of the Constitution were men who sought liberty and justice
for all, and wrote the Constitution for people who would hopefully
realize that with rights come responsibilities.
Freedom of speech, more specifically, is a right that requires
responsibility, as established in Brandenburg v. Ohio, 1969.
Some people, however, want to take the right and not accept the
responsibility by using the freedom of speech to generate hate toward
an entire people, nation or religion.
For those who abuse their rights, I apologize to the First Amendment.
Freedom of speech was abused when African-Americans were publicly
harassed and verbally abused before the Civil Rights Movement.
The abuse of the freedom of speech also created and sustained hate
toward Jews in the history of the United States, which is just as
despicable.
Similarly, displaying cartoons attacking the core beliefs of an entire
religion is nothing but tasteless disrespect for freedoms that some of
us have come to take for granted.
And yes, I mean you, College Republicans.
Within the last few months, the Muslim world has been enraged by a
Danish cartoon that depicted the prophet Muhammad with a bomb on his
head in place of his turban.
The cartoonist reached an abject low by depicting the revered prophet
of Islam as a terrorist.
The cartoonist did not mock the few terrorists who hide under the name
of Islam.
Rather, the cartoonists mocked the prophet of Islam himself.
The message that is sent out by the cartoon is clear: Islam teaches
terrorism.
The cartoon propagates hate toward all Muslims - over 1.2 billion
people worldwide - and further propagates false and absurd
stereotypes that Islam is a religion of terror.
Are there crazy, evil terrorists out there? Yes. Do some of them claim
themselves Muslim? Yes. Does Islam teach terror? No.
But these criminals justify their crimes with their own small-minded
misinterpretations of Islam that most Muslims completely abhor and
reject.
This is an important distinction that must be understood.
There is no mistaking why Muslims were categorically offended by the
cartoons. However, as for the violence that ensued in their aftermath,
it has more to do with socioeconomic and political frustrations in each
of the nations and less to do with anything 'Islam told them to
do.'
So this Danish cartoonist is an ignorant hater.
Well, there are ignorant haters everywhere-the world is peppered with
stupid people! A lot of us are in college now trying to open up our
minds and expand our understanding of the world.
UC Irvine should not be a forum for hate, but rather one for
understanding, discussion and debate.
I was appalled last Tuesday when the College Republicans, in
association with the United American Committee, used their freedom of
speech as a guise to generate hate against Muslims.
The event unveiled the cartoon, and showcased it next to hateful
cartoons from the Middle East, as if two wrongs make a right!
After failed meetings with the College Republicans to cancel the event,
over 1,000 UCI students and community members (tallied by a petition
against hate that night) protested the event on Tuesday to boycott the
abuse of freedom of speech and the propagation of Islamophobia.
The problem is not with us Muslims here on campus, but rather with the
haters and those who do not want to confront the truth.
What would happen to you if your war on Islam (or the "evil
religion" as one of the event speakers called it) finally ended and
you couldn't hate all Muslims anymore?
What if you engaged in dialogue with the Muslims and found out that the
fellow Muslims on campus are against Bin Laden and his cohorts (see Ann
Coulter: "We should invade their countries, kill their leaders and
convert them")?
What if you learned that Islam forbids anti-Christian or anti-Jewish
cartoons, like those you brandished before all as justification for
your hate?
What if you opened a history book, or learned about the world beyond
the O.C., and learned that some of the biggest terrorist acts in recent
history have been committed by those calling themselves Christians, or
members of other religions? 50 Cent had "21 Questions," and now
Layla Shaikley has got a few, too.
Let us expose haters for what they are, no matter who they are, whether
Muslim, Christian, Jewish, white or black. Racism and hate need to end.
And let those people of conscience who have learned from the lessons of
history move beyond racism and toward understanding, reconciliation and
a better, more peaceful tomorrow.
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| User: "Me" |
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| Title: Re: Hate Speech is Irresponsible |
07 Mar 2006 04:16:34 PM |
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<John_seeyou@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1141767581.835280.242930@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Hate Speech is Irresponsible
Then start by making Koran illegal.
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| User: "thereactionary" |
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| Title: Re: Hate Speech is Irresponsible |
07 Mar 2006 04:35:46 PM |
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"Rather, the cartoonists mocked the prophet of Islam himself."
The prophet of Islam was a murderer, a pedophile, a rapist, a robber, a
sexist, a bigot, an imperialist, and a slave trader. All of this
information is in Islam's own texts.
"The message that is sent out by the cartoon is clear: Islam teaches
terrorism. "
Islam does teach terrorism:
Quran:
[4.74] Therefore let those fight in the way of Allah, who sell this
world's life for the hereafter; and whoever fights in the way of Allah,
then be he slain or be he victorious, We shall grant him a mighty
reward.
[4:95] Not equal are those believers who sit (at home) and receive no
hurt, and those who strive and fight in the cause of God with their
goods and their persons. God hath granted a grade higher to those who
strive and fight with their goods and persons than to those who sit (at
home). Unto all (in Faith) Hath God promised good: But those who strive
and fight Hath He distinguished above those who sit (at home) by a
special reward,-
[8.12] When your Lord revealed to the angels: I am with you, therefore
make firm those who believe. I will cast terror into the hearts of
those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off
every fingertip of them.
[8.39] And fight with them until there is no more opposition and
religion should be only for Allah; but if they desist, then surely
Allah sees what they do.
[8.57] Therefore if you overtake them in fighting, then scatter by
(making an example of) them those who are in their rear, that they may
be mindful.
[9:4] (But the treaties are) not dissolved with those Pagans with whom
ye have entered into alliance and who have not subsequently failed you
in aught, nor aided any one against you. So fulfil your engagements
with them to the end of their term: for God loveth the righteous.
[9:5] But when the forbidden months are past, then fight and slay the
Pagans wherever ye find them, an seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in
wait for them in every stratagem (of war); but if they repent, and
establish regular prayers and practise r egular charity, then open the
way for them: for God is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful.
[9.29] Fight those who do not believe in Allah, nor in the latter day,
nor do they prohibit what Allah and His Apostle have prohibited, nor
follow the religion of truth, out of those who have been given the
Book, until they pay the tax in acknowledgment of superiority and they
are in a state of subjection.
[9.111] Surely Allah has bought of the believers their persons and
their property for this, that they shall have the garden; they fight in
Allah's way, so they slay and are slain; a promise which is binding on
Him in the Taurat and the Injeel and the Quran; and who is more
faithful to his covenant than Allah? Rejoice therefore in the pledge
which you have made; and that is the mighty achievement.
[9.123] O you who believe! fight those of the unbelievers who are near
to you and let them find in you hardness; and know that Allah is with
those who guard (against evil).
[24.62] Only those are believers who believe in Allah and His Apostle,
and when they are with him on a momentous affair they go not away until
they have asked his permission; surely they who ask your permission are
they who believe in Allah and His Apostle; so when they ask your
permission for some affair of theirs, give permission to whom you
please of them and ask forgiveness for them from Allah; surely Allah is
Forgiving, Merciful.
[33.26] And He drove down those of the followers of the Book who backed
them from their fortresses and He cast awe into their hearts; some you
killed and you took captive another part.
[33.27] And He made you heirs to their land and their dwellings and
their property, and (to) a land which you have not yet trodden, and
Allah has power over all things.
[33.64] Surely Allah has cursed the unbelievers and has prepared for
them a burning fire,
[41:27] But We will certainly give the Unbelievers a taste of a severe
Penalty, and We will requite them for the worst of their deeds.
[41:28] Such is the requital of the enemies of God,- the Fire: therein
will be for them the Eternal Home: a (fit) requital, for that they were
wont to reject Our Sings.
[47.4] So when you meet in battle those who disbelieve, then smite the
necks until when you have overcome them, then make (them) prisoners,
and afterwards either set them free as a favor or let them ransom
(themselves) until the war terminates. That (shall be so); and if Allah
had pleased He would certainly have exacted what is due from them, but
that He may try some of you by means of others; and (as for) those who
are slain in the way of Allah, He will by no means allow their deeds to
perish.
[48.16] Say to those of the dwellers of the desert who were left
behind: You shall soon be invited (to fight) against a people
possessing mighty prowess; you will fight against them until they
submit; then if you obey, Allah will grant you a good reward; and if
you turn back as you turned back before, He will punish you with a
painful punishment.
[47.34] Surely those who disbelieve and turn away from Allah's way,
then they die while they are unbelievers, Allah will by no means
forgive them.
[47.35] And be not slack so as to cry for peace and you have the upper
hand, and Allah is with you, and He will not bring your deeds to
naught.
[5.80] You will see many of them befriending those who disbelieve;
certainly evil is that which their souls have sent before for them,
that Allah became displeased with them and in chastisement shall they
abide.
[5.81] And had they believed in Allah and the prophet and what was
revealed to him, they would not have taken them for friends but! most
of them are transgressors.
[5.82] Certainly you will find the most violent of people in enmity for
those who believe (to be) the Jews and those who are polytheists, and
you will certainly find the nearest in friendship to those who believe
(to be) those who say: We are Christians; this is because there are
priests and monks among them and because they do not behave proudly.
Sahih Muslim
The Book of Faith (Kitab Al-Iman)
Book 001, Number 0033:
It has been narrated on the authority of Abdullah b. 'Umar that the
Messenger of Allah said: I have been commanded to fight against people
till they testify that there is no god but Allah, that Muhammad is the
messenger of Allah, and they establish prayer, and pay Zakat and if
they do it, their blood and property are guaranteed protection on my
behalf except when justified by law, and their affairs rest with Allah.
Sahih Bukhari
Volume 4, Book 53, Number 392:
Narrated Abu Huraira:
While we were in the Mosque, the Prophet came out and said, "Let us go
to the Jews" We went out till we reached Bait-ul-Midras. He said to
them, "If you embrace Islam, you will be safe. You should know that the
earth belongs to Allah and His Apostle, and I want to expel you from
this land. So, if anyone amongst you owns some property, he is
permitted to sell it, otherwise you should know that the Earth belongs
to Allah and His Apostle."
Sahih Muslim
Book 019, Number 4366:
It has been narrated by 'Umar b. al-Khattib that he heard the Messenger
of Allah (may peace be upon him) say: I will expel the Jews and
Christians from the Arabian Peninsula and will not leave any but
Muslim.
Volume 4, Book 52, Number 283:
Narrated Abu Juhaifa:
I asked Ali, "Do you have the knowledge of any Divine Inspiration
besides what is in Allah's Book?" 'Ali replied, "No, by Him Who splits
the grain of corn and creates the soul. I don't think we have such
knowledge, but we have the ability of understanding which Allah may
endow a person with, so that he may understand the Qur'an, and we have
what is written in this paper as well." I asked, "What is written in
this paper?" He replied, "(The regulations of) blood-money, the freeing
of captives, and the judgment that no Muslim should be killed for
killing an infidel."
Volume 4, Book 52, Number 280:
Narrated Abu Sa'id Al-Khudri:
When the tribe of Bani Quraiza was ready to accept Sad's judgment,
Allah's Apostle sent for Sad who was near to him. Sad came, riding a
donkey and when he came near, Allah's Apostle said (to the Ansar),
"Stand up for your leader." Then Sad came and sat beside Allah's
Apostle who said to him. "These people are ready to accept your
judgment." Sad said, "I give the judgment that their warriors should be
killed and their children and women should be taken as prisoners." The
Prophet then remarked, "O Sad! You have judged amongst them with (or
similar to) the judgment of the King Allah."
Volume 5, Book 59, Number 448:
Narrated 'Aisha:
Sad was wounded on the day of Khandaq (i.e. Trench) when a man from
Quraish, called Hibban bin Al-'Araqa hit him (with an arrow). The man
was Hibban bin Qais from (the tribe of) Bani Mais bin 'Amir bin Lu'ai
who shot an arrow at Sad's medial arm vein (or main artery of the arm).
The Prophet pitched a tent (for Sad) in the Mosque so that he might be
near to the Prophet to visit. When the Prophet returned from the
(battle) of Al-Khandaq (i.e. Trench) and laid down his arms and took a
bath Gabriel came to him while he (i.e. Gabriel) was shaking the dust
off his head, and said, "You have laid down the arms?" By Allah, I have
not laid them down. Go out to them (to attack them)." The Prophet said,
"Where?" Gabriel pointed towards Bani Quraiza. So Allah's Apostle went
to them (i.e. Banu Quraiza) (i.e. besieged them). They then surrendered
to the Prophet's judgment but he directed them to Sad to give his
verdict concerning them. Sad said, "I give my judgment that their
warriors should be killed, their women and children should be taken as
captives, and their properties distributed."
Quran:
[22:19-22] But as for those who disbelieve, garments of fire will be
cut out for them, boiling fluid will be poured down their heads.
Whereby that which is in their bellies, and their skins too, will be
melted; And for them are hooked rods of iron. Whenever, in their
anguish, they would go forth from thence they are driven back therein
and (it is said unto them): Taste the doom of burning.
[4.56] (As for) those who disbelieve in Our communications, We shall
make them enter fire; so oft as their skins are thoroughly burned, We
will change them for other skins, that they may taste the chastisement;
surely Allah is Mighty, Wise.
[4.57] And (as for) those who believe and do good deeds, We will make
them enter gardens beneath which rivers flow, to abide in them for
ever; they shall have therein virgins, and We shall make them enter a
dense shade.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Hate Speech is Irresponsible |
07 Mar 2006 05:39:30 PM |
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thereactionary wrote:
"Rather, the cartoonists mocked the prophet of Islam himself."
Anti-Muslim hate and bigotry snipped
"The message that is sent out by the cartoon is clear: Islam teaches
terrorism. "
"One of the commonest charges brought against Islam historically, and
as a religion, by Western writers is that it is intolerant. This is
turning the tables with a vengeance when one remembers various facts:
One remembers that not a Muslim is left alive in Spain or Sicily or
Apulia. One remembers that not a Muslim was left alive and not a mosque
left standing in Greece after the great rebellion in l821. One
remembers how the Muslims of the Balkan peninsula, once the majority,
have been systematically reduced with the approval of the whole of
Europe, how the Christian under Muslim rule have in recent times been
urged on to rebel and massacre the Muslims, and how reprisals by the
latter have been condemned as quite uncalled for."
http://www.cyberistan.org/islamic/toleran1.html
Islam does teach terrorism:
Lets read these verses of the bible
Psalms 79:6: "Pour out thy wrath upon the heathen that have not known
thee, and upon the kingdoms that have not called upon thy name."
Palms 139:19-22: "Surely thou wilt slay the wicked, O God: Depart from
me therefore, ye bloodthirsty men. For they speak against thee
wickedly, And thine enemies take (thy name) in vain. Do not I hate
them, O Jehovah, that hate thee? And am not I grieved with those that
rise up against thee? I hate them with perfect hatred: They are become
mine enemies." (ASV)
Exodus 32:28 "...Put every man his sword by his side, and go in and out
from gate to gate throughout the camp, and slay every man his brother,
and every man his companion, and every man his neighbor. And the
children of Levi did according to the word of Moses: and there fell of
the people that day about three thousand men."
Joshua 6:21 "And they utterly destroyed all that was in the city, both
man and woman, young and old, and ox, and sheep, and *****, with the edge
of the sword."
Deuteronomy 12:2-3 "Ye shall utterly destroy all the places, wherein
the nations which ye shall possess served their gods, upon the high
mountains, and upon the hills, and under every green tree: And ye shall
overthrow their altars, and break their pillars, and burn their groves
with fire; and ye shall hew down the graven images of their gods, and
destroy the names of them out of that place.
Judges 11:30-39 "And Jephthah vowed a vow unto the LORD, and said, If
thou shalt without fail deliver the children of Ammon into mine hands,
Then it shall be, that whatsoever cometh forth of the doors of my house
to meet me, when I return in peace from the children of Ammon, shall
surely be the LORD's, and I will offer it up for a burnt offering...And
Jephthah came to Mizpeh unto his house, and, behold, his daughter came
out to meet him with timbrels and with dances: and she was his only
child...And it came to pass at the end of two months, that she returned
unto her father, who did with her according to his vow which he had
vowed..." Did he burn her, that is sick ...
2 Chronicles 15:10-15 "So they gathered themselves together at
Jerusalem...And they entered into a covenant to seek the LORD God of
their fathers with all their heart and with all their soul; That
whosoever would not seek the LORD God of Israel should be put to death,
whether small or great, whether man or woman. [The LORD] was found of
them: and the LORD gave them rest round about."
Deuteronomy 13:12-15 "If thou shalt hear say in one of thy cities,
which the LORD thy God hath given thee to dwell there, saying, Certain
men, the children of Belial, are gone out from among you, and have
withdrawn the inhabitants of their city, saying, Let us go and serve
other gods, which ye have not known; Then shalt thou inquire, and make
search, and ask diligently; and, behold, if it be truth, and the thing
certain, that such abomination is wrought among you; --> Thou shalt
surely smite the inhabitants of that city with the edge of the sword,
destroying it utterly, and all that is therein, and the cattle thereof,
with the edge of the sword." <---
1 King 18:19; 18:40 "Now therefore send, and gather to me all Israel
unto mount Carmel, and the prophets of Baal four hundred and fifty, and
the prophets of the groves four hundred, which eat at Jezebel's
table....And Elijah said unto them, Take the prophets of Baal; let not
one of them escape. And they took them: and Elijah brought them down to
the brook Kishon, and slew them there."
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| User: "robert merritt" |
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| Title: Re: Hate Speech is Irresponsible |
07 Mar 2006 07:39:20 PM |
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Find out why the muslims were in Spain, Sicily,Apulia, or Greece in the
first place.
Imagine , Greeks in "the great rebellion of 1821" rebelling against
Islam......were they not rather trying to liberate themselves from Islamic
oppression?
What goes on in that tiny muslim mind of yours anyway?
RM
<John_seeyou@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1141774770.834509.171520@e56g2000cwe.googlegroups.com...
thereactionary wrote:
"Rather, the cartoonists mocked the prophet of Islam himself."
Anti-Muslim hate and bigotry snipped
"The message that is sent out by the cartoon is clear: Islam teaches
terrorism. "
"One of the commonest charges brought against Islam historically, and
as a religion, by Western writers is that it is intolerant. This is
turning the tables with a vengeance when one remembers various facts:
One remembers that not a Muslim is left alive in Spain or Sicily or
Apulia. One remembers that not a Muslim was left alive and not a mosque
left standing in Greece after the great rebellion in l821. One
remembers how the Muslims of the Balkan peninsula, once the majority,
have been systematically reduced with the approval of the whole of
Europe, how the Christian under Muslim rule have in recent times been
urged on to rebel and massacre the Muslims, and how reprisals by the
latter have been condemned as quite uncalled for."
http://www.cyberistan.org/islamic/toleran1.html
Islam does teach terrorism:
Lets read these verses of the bible
Psalms 79:6: "Pour out thy wrath upon the heathen that have not known
thee, and upon the kingdoms that have not called upon thy name."
Palms 139:19-22: "Surely thou wilt slay the wicked, O God: Depart from
me therefore, ye bloodthirsty men. For they speak against thee
wickedly, And thine enemies take (thy name) in vain. Do not I hate
them, O Jehovah, that hate thee? And am not I grieved with those that
rise up against thee? I hate them with perfect hatred: They are become
mine enemies." (ASV)
Exodus 32:28 "...Put every man his sword by his side, and go in and out
from gate to gate throughout the camp, and slay every man his brother,
and every man his companion, and every man his neighbor. And the
children of Levi did according to the word of Moses: and there fell of
the people that day about three thousand men."
Joshua 6:21 "And they utterly destroyed all that was in the city, both
man and woman, young and old, and ox, and sheep, and *****, with the edge
of the sword."
Deuteronomy 12:2-3 "Ye shall utterly destroy all the places, wherein
the nations which ye shall possess served their gods, upon the high
mountains, and upon the hills, and under every green tree: And ye shall
overthrow their altars, and break their pillars, and burn their groves
with fire; and ye shall hew down the graven images of their gods, and
destroy the names of them out of that place.
Judges 11:30-39 "And Jephthah vowed a vow unto the LORD, and said, If
thou shalt without fail deliver the children of Ammon into mine hands,
Then it shall be, that whatsoever cometh forth of the doors of my house
to meet me, when I return in peace from the children of Ammon, shall
surely be the LORD's, and I will offer it up for a burnt offering...And
Jephthah came to Mizpeh unto his house, and, behold, his daughter came
out to meet him with timbrels and with dances: and she was his only
child...And it came to pass at the end of two months, that she returned
unto her father, who did with her according to his vow which he had
vowed..." Did he burn her, that is sick ...
2 Chronicles 15:10-15 "So they gathered themselves together at
Jerusalem...And they entered into a covenant to seek the LORD God of
their fathers with all their heart and with all their soul; That
whosoever would not seek the LORD God of Israel should be put to death,
whether small or great, whether man or woman. [The LORD] was found of
them: and the LORD gave them rest round about."
Deuteronomy 13:12-15 "If thou shalt hear say in one of thy cities,
which the LORD thy God hath given thee to dwell there, saying, Certain
men, the children of Belial, are gone out from among you, and have
withdrawn the inhabitants of their city, saying, Let us go and serve
other gods, which ye have not known; Then shalt thou inquire, and make
search, and ask diligently; and, behold, if it be truth, and the thing
certain, that such abomination is wrought among you; --> Thou shalt
surely smite the inhabitants of that city with the edge of the sword,
destroying it utterly, and all that is therein, and the cattle thereof,
with the edge of the sword." <---
1 King 18:19; 18:40 "Now therefore send, and gather to me all Israel
unto mount Carmel, and the prophets of Baal four hundred and fifty, and
the prophets of the groves four hundred, which eat at Jezebel's
table....And Elijah said unto them, Take the prophets of Baal; let not
one of them escape. And they took them: and Elijah brought them down to
the brook Kishon, and slew them there."
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| User: "serebel" |
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| Title: Re: Hate Speech is Irresponsible |
07 Mar 2006 07:49:27 PM |
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Muslims don't have minds. Their brains haven't developed. They can read
cartoons though.
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| User: "Koppe74" |
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| Title: Re: Hate Speech is Irresponsible |
13 Mar 2006 04:25:27 AM |
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thereactionary wrote:
"Rather, the cartoonists mocked the prophet of Islam himself."
The prophet of Islam was a murderer,
As were many of the Israeli-leaders in the OT
a pedophile,
Doubtful. He did *marry* a child, but he didn't
have sex with her --even if it was *his right* as
her husband -- until she was older (entered puberty?).
A pedophile would not have waited.
He also bedded her after she became an adult and
she bore his children... so he must have still found
her sexually attractive as an adult...
He also had other wifes -- both before and after... his
first wife was concideriably older than him, and his
others wifes were also all adults...
A pedophile per definition finds pre-pubicents (children)
sexually attractive -- and *only* them. As this was
obviously *not* the case with Muhammed, then he
was not a pedophile.
Muhammed did nothing illegal here: Children -- especially
girls -- where more or less concidered property. Marriage
were used for making political and familiar bonds. There
were no age-of-concent. Girls where concidered adults
the moment they hit puberty. It was a husbands *right*
to bed his wife. So Muhammed was neither a pedophile
nor a child-rapiest.
I would also like to remid you about Mary (mother of Jesus)...
she was 12-14 and about to marry a man old enough to be
her father. If she hadn't had her run-in with the Holly Ghost,
she would've had slept with Joseph and bore his child
before she turned 15... and this was *common*... this
was how things were done.
a rapist,
At the time it was legally impossible to rape your own
wife, so that falls through...
a robber,
But not as great a robber as Moses perhaps?
a
sexist,
So where several of Jesus' disipples -- especially
Paulus. And Jesus had only men as desipples, and
preached that women should "submit to their husbands
as the head of the family" and "not speak in the
congregation"... so it seems that sexism was
somethig quite common in that area at that time...
Muhammed actually *gave* women more rights than
women typically had back then (e.g. the right to
a divorce), but of course he was not a feminist...
a bigot,
Jesus once said that His words was for Jews only, and
that he would not "throw food to dogs while the
children of Israel was stll hungry"... the "dogs" were
non-Jews and the "food" was His words. It was first
when He realized that most Jews couldn't care less about
what He was preching, He changed his tune.
an imperialist,
Moses... Perhaps God should have cleared-out
the land first? And Christians certainly have not
been above a little imperialism.
and a slave trader.
Slavery is something the OT actually
permits. For one thing, a father is allowed
to sell his daughters into slavery.
All of this
information is in Islam's own texts.
And you can pretty much find the *same* BS in the Bible...
-Koppe
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| User: "geltab" |
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| Title: Re: Hate Speech is Irresponsible |
09 Mar 2006 10:57:31 PM |
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wrote...
The framers of the Constitution were men who sought liberty and justice
for all, and wrote the Constitution for people who would hopefully
realize that with rights come responsibilities.
Like the responsibility to not say anything that offends you.
Freedom of speech, more specifically, is a right that requires
responsibility, as established in Brandenburg v. Ohio, 1969.
I looked the case up and it involved speech advocating violence. You
and your ilk co-mingle such speech with speech that offends you and
declare both should be illegal. In this case your trick is to equate
the Ku Klux Klan advocating the burning of churches with a cartoon
that offends moozlums and causes them to burn churches in protest.
Similarly, if the supermarket advertises tomatoes for $100 a pound and
such a high price offends me, I can burn it down and blame the
supermarket for inciting me to do so. Nevermind that the supermarket
never realized that there were nutcases out there who would attack it
for charging offensively-high prices, it is still their fault.
The abuse of the freedom of speech also created and sustained hate
toward Jews in the history of the United States, which is just as
despicable.
Blah blah blah, the USA with its near-total freedom of speech to
express one's dislike of Jews has a far lower incidence of anti-
semitism than countries that suppress such speech (e.g. neo-nazis
are a tiny and unimportant minority in the USA, while in Europe
where they are outlawed they often pose a serious political
threat).
The cartoonist reached an abject low by depicting the revered prophet
of Islam as a terrorist.
The cartoonist did not mock the few terrorists who hide under the name
of Islam.
Some of the other cartoonists touched on them, such as the one where
the gatekeeper of heaven announces to the dead suicide bombers that
they have run out of virgins.
Rather, the cartoonists mocked the prophet of Islam himself.
I'll mock him too. In fact, I've downloaded all 12 cartoons and I
think tomorrow I'll print out the one with Mohamud with the bomb in
his turban and tape it onto my car bumper
The message that is sent out by the cartoon is clear: Islam teaches
terrorism.
There are a number of moozlums in my area, including my Pakistani
neighbors. I wonder how long before one of them runs me off the
road or sets my car on fire?
Let us expose haters for what they are, no matter who they are, whether
Muslim, Christian, Jewish, white or black. Racism and hate need to end.
I'm a white Satanist. Anyway, izlam is a religious cult, so hatred of
it is not racism. Hatred of the cult is also not unjustified; regardless
of your claim that moozlums are peaceful, in reality a war exists between
our civilization and their barbarism. For over 500 years we Westerners
have fought to liberate ourselves from the oppression of religion, finally
reducing the xian church to marginal status in our society, then the cult
of izlam comes along and would not only abolish our last 500 years of
secular progress, they would take us back another 800 years to the 7th
century. Democracy will be destroyed and replaced with rule by some
insane old man with a long beard and rag on his head whose interpretation
of the koran will dictate our daily lives.
***** the moozlums. Even if they were sincere in their desire to co-exist
peacefully with us, I still consider their culture to be a total violation
of fundamental human rights. To allow any child to be born into and raised
in an izlamist society is cruel and force is justified to remove him from
such horrible conditions and place him a proper educational environment.
Hundred of millions of children face a life of physical and intellectual
oppression and are doomed to live out their lives with a level of
conscienceness and awareness that approaches that of domesticated animals.
Instead of free-thinking individuals, izlam produces unconscious automatons
who wash their feet and stick their butts up in the air with no more free
will than a lab rat who pushes the button to get his dose of cocaine.
And let those people of conscience who have learned from the lessons of
history move beyond racism and toward understanding, reconciliation and
a better, more peaceful tomorrow.
Blah blah fucking blah. While Gahndi said that an eye for an eye makes
the whole world blind, we should also not just blindly follow Jebus'
advice to turn the other cheek and let insane cultists blow up our
buses and skyscrapers with no retaliation. I'm not sure how tolerant we
should be of an alien and hostile horde of cultists who have infiltrated
Western society and are now demanding that we abolish just about every
basic principle we stand for (e.g. free speech, democracy, religious
freedom, separation of church and state, etc.).
Like with Mexico, I'll offer the compromise of reciprocity. That means
we will be happy to accomodate their cultural quirks if they accomodate
ours. So moozlum women will be able to walk down the streets of
Amsterdam or Copenhagen in burqas the day Western women can walk down
the streets of Riyadh or Izlamabad in miniskirts. Until that happens I
don't want to hear any ***** from them about our intolerance.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Don't you see that the whole aim of Islam is to narrow the range of
thought? In the end we shall make thoughtcrime literally impossible,
because there will be no words in which to express it. Every concept
that can ever be needed will be expressed by exactly one verse from the
Koran... The whole literature of the past will have been destroyed.
Douglas Adams, Michael Crichton, George Orwell, Greg Bear - they'll
exist only in Islamic versions, not merely changed into something
different, but actually changed into something contradictory of what
they used to be... The whole climate of thought will be different. In
fact there will BE no thought, as we understand it now. Islam means not
thinking - not needing to think. Islam is unconsciousness."
-- Slightly modified excerpt from "1984"
------------------------------------------------------------------------
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| User: "Topaz" |
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| Title: Re: Re: Hate Speech is Irresponsible |
10 Mar 2006 07:55:09 PM |
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Here are some quotes from the 1911 Encyclopedia Britannica
after the heading Ku Klux Klan:
"Ku Klux Klan, the name of an American secret association of Southern
whites united for self-protection and to oppose the Reconstruction
measures of the United States Congress"
"The various causes assigned for the origin and development of
this movement were: the absence of stable government in the South for
several years after the Civil War; the corrupt and tyrannical rule of
the alien, renegade and negro, and the belief that it was supported by
the Federal troops which controlled elections and legislative bodies;
the disfranchisement of whites; the spread of ideas of social and
political equality among the negroes; fear of negro insurrections; the
arming of negro militia and the disarming of whites; outrages upon
white women by black men"
"The constitutions and rituals of these secret orders have
declarations of principles, of which the following are characteristic:
to protect and succour the weak and unfortunate, especially the widows
and orphans of Confederate soldiers; to protect members of the white
race in life, honour and property from the encroachments of the
blacks"
"To control the negro the Klan played upon his superstitious
fears by having night patrols, parades and drills of silent horsemen
covered with white sheets, carrying skulls with coals of fire for
eyes"
"the Ku Klux movement went on until it accomplished its object by
giving protection to the whites, reducing the blacks to order,
replacing the whites in control of society and state, expelling the
worst of the carpet-baggers and scalawags, and nullifying those laws
of Congress which had resulted in placing the Southern whites under
the control of a party composed principally of ex-slaves."
http://www.nationalvanguard.org http://www.natvan.com
http://www.thebirdman.org http://www.RealNews247.com
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| User: "Tani Jantsang ©" |
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| Title: Re: Re: Hate Speech is Irresponsible |
12 Mar 2006 03:20:01 AM |
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Accurate - and then the KKK was disbanded by its founder about 3 or so years
later. That's also a fact. It was originally a self defense organization.
Btw, blacks such as Chuck D (Fight the Power) realize the things blacks did
HAVE under dejure segregation following the Civil War - things that they
lost completely after "forced integration" was put into (draconian tyranny)
law. And Chuck D knows who did it - of course, he can write a book all
about it - and he did. Read it. "Fight the Power" is the title. He speaks
the truth.
"Topaz" <mars1933@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:veb412d33brk339dr2d8idcilb6om4nsmg@4ax.com...
Here are some quotes from the 1911 Encyclopedia Britannica
after the heading Ku Klux Klan:
"Ku Klux Klan, the name of an American secret association of Southern
whites united for self-protection and to oppose the Reconstruction
measures of the United States Congress"
"The various causes assigned for the origin and development of
this movement were: the absence of stable government in the South for
several years after the Civil War; the corrupt and tyrannical rule of
the alien, renegade and negro, and the belief that it was supported by
the Federal troops which controlled elections and legislative bodies;
the disfranchisement of whites; the spread of ideas of social and
political equality among the negroes; fear of negro insurrections; the
arming of negro militia and the disarming of whites; outrages upon
white women by black men"
"The constitutions and rituals of these secret orders have
declarations of principles, of which the following are characteristic:
to protect and succour the weak and unfortunate, especially the widows
and orphans of Confederate soldiers; to protect members of the white
race in life, honour and property from the encroachments of the
blacks"
"To control the negro the Klan played upon his superstitious
fears by having night patrols, parades and drills of silent horsemen
covered with white sheets, carrying skulls with coals of fire for
eyes"
"the Ku Klux movement went on until it accomplished its object by
giving protection to the whites, reducing the blacks to order,
replacing the whites in control of society and state, expelling the
worst of the carpet-baggers and scalawags, and nullifying those laws
of Congress which had resulted in placing the Southern whites under
the control of a party composed principally of ex-slaves."
http://www.nationalvanguard.org http://www.natvan.com
http://www.thebirdman.org http://www.RealNews247.com
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| User: "Tani Jantsang ©" |
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| Title: Re: Hate Speech is Irresponsible |
12 Mar 2006 03:18:37 AM |
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Do I have time on my hands this morning? You bet. Please see in.
"geltab" <lsd@trip.com> wrote in message
news:%G7Qf.28307$2O6.7405@newssvr12.news.prodigy.com...
John_seeyou@yahoo.com wrote...
The framers of the Constitution were men who sought liberty and justice
for all, and wrote the Constitution for people who would hopefully
realize that with rights come responsibilities.
Like the responsibility to not say anything that offends you.
You mean "that doesn't offend someone else?" Defense of free speech means
that you defend the speech of those whose views you despise and hate, not
just views you agree with. But there are limitations - like screaming fire
in a crowded area when there is no fire. Another problem is that there can
be NO tolerance toward intolerance itself. It's just not possible.
If this is about the Danish cartoons, then there is a bit more to consider
here. If they wanted to poke fun at leaders of terror organizations, then
they failed to do that. They instead insulted the prophet of the god of
millions of people - most of whom are not terrorists and not overly
religious at all. Well, insult someone's parents or family in the press -
see how that plays out. Insult their god or their holy prophet and EXPECT
trouble. It was the "***** Jesus" crap and a heap of piled on grievances
that caused a final banding together of what you now see as the very
powerful christian coalition. Such people that make such statements or such
"art" are provocateurs - and I have to wonder who PAID them to provoke, with
such predictable results. Has anyone asked that obvious question YET?
So speak freely - and then take responsible for what happens if you do *****
off millions of people that are well known for bombing people for a lot
less. Feel free! You gonna do that behind the safety of a computer, or are
you gonna go into a Mosque and do it? Ha!
Freedom of speech, more specifically, is a right that requires
responsibility, as established in Brandenburg v. Ohio, 1969.
I looked the case up and it involved speech advocating violence.
How about provoking predictable violence? Does the cartoonist live in a
closet? Is he that stupid? Did he NOT expect what he got? I refuse to
believe that. Now the prime minister of the whole country calls it a worse
disaster than world war 2. So far, there has been no violence. So far.
And gimme a break, he didn't publish the cartoon anonymously in some place
outside the country. PHEW. Stupid times 10, imo.
You
and your ilk co-mingle such speech with speech that offends you and
declare both should be illegal. In this case your trick is to equate
the Ku Klux Klan advocating the burning of churches with a cartoon
that offends moozlums and causes them to burn churches in protest.
Yah, so it is about the cartoon. I figured. Imo, the Ku Klux Klan has a
right to be heard. They can be heard - just look on google :) And do y ou
th ink that maybe years of black on white terror, bullying and crime ispired
the KKK of late? Gee, I think so. DUHHHHHHH.
Similarly, if the supermarket advertises tomatoes for $100 a pound and
such a high price offends me, I can burn it down and blame the
supermarket for inciting me to do so. Nevermind that the supermarket
never realized that there were nutcases out there who would attack it
for charging offensively-high prices, it is still their fault.
Not a good analogy. If he intended to insult terrorists, then he FAILED
MISERABLY to do that. He did them a big favor - he got them more allies.
Was that his intention? You see, when you look at a DEED, you have to look
at the Will behind it to figure out the REAL intent and the result that
comes from that deed. That is called magickal thinking by some, but no,
it's pure common sense and logic. Provocation was obviously the real
intent. Well, he provoked. Now the whole of Denmark has to be blamed, even
if many people there were on the side of the Moslem cause against the United
States (and there were quite a few of these there). Now who knows what
comes of this. People will die - that is guaranteed. The pen IS mightier
than the sword, then. HA.
The abuse of the freedom of speech also created and sustained hate
toward Jews in the history of the United States, which is just as
despicable.
Excuse me, but a lot of the actual activities of the Jews in the USA has
helped to sustain hatred of them. Kevin MacDonald - read his books. He
sees these things Jews have done as excellent survival strategies - but I
doubt the people at whose expense they did these things will see it in the
same positive light. And no one on the planet can deny they actually did
these things. No one is even trying to deny it.
Blah blah blah, the USA with its near-total freedom of speech to
express one's dislike of Jews has a far lower incidence of anti-
semitism than countries that suppress such speech (e.g. neo-nazis
are a tiny and unimportant minority in the USA,
Neo Nazis are a fringe group of Hitler fan clubbies into WW2 styles - or
they are gay and into S&M with Nazi fetishes (see, it's on the web, too).
There is a LOT of anti Jewish feeling in the United States and damned good
reason for it. People do not have the freedom of speech to say kike or
*****. What's this Jewish Black coalition that was threatened (he he he -
there was never a Jewish Italian coalition, you know. But Jews can say
goyim and blacks can say honky. Do you not think that people resent the
political thought police? Oh, THEY DO. And they have learned the art of
lying thru their teeth to avoid the thought cops. When asked certain
question in the way they are asked, WHO dares oppose the "patriot act?" The
Democrats are wimpering and running scared. CIA agents get outed for
telling the truth about the situation in Iraq. That's not an atmosphere
condusive to free speech at all.
while in Europe
where they are outlawed they often pose a serious political
threat).
Why are they outlawed? Freedom of assembly is OK for anyone except National
Socialists? Why? They are not hardly as big a political and cultural
threat as the millions of Moslems invading European countries and ruining
the culture. If the people had an ounce of nationalism and two balls worth
mentioning, they'd round them up, citizens or not, and kick them out. Even
the ultra libral Bill Maher sees the wisdom in doing that. Round them up
and send them out. When Moslems born in Britain identify with the middle
east as "their country" and bomb stuff - it's time to round them up and ship
them all out. Either do that, or live in danger. They'd have to have the
balls to stand up to the morons that would call them "nazis" if they did
that. >
The cartoonist reached an abject low by depicting the revered prophet
of Islam as a terrorist.
Agree - and he needs to take responsibility and be a bit more honest about
what his real intent was. Obviously - his intent was to achieve exactly
what he DID achieve. Isn't that obvious?
The cartoonist did not mock the few terrorists who hide under the name
of Islam.
Right.
Some of the other cartoonists touched on them, such as the one where
the gatekeeper of heaven announces to the dead suicide bombers that
they have run out of virgins.
Rather, the cartoonists mocked the prophet of Islam himself.
I'll mock him too. In fact, I've downloaded all 12 cartoons and I
think tomorrow I'll print out the one with Mohamud with the bomb in
his turban and tape it onto my car bumper
But you are nobody. You are not The Press in Denmark. Now, let's talk
about free speech. I dare you to go into a Moslem Mosque and mock the
Prophet to the faces of a whole Mosque filled with Moslems. Go ahead. Free
speech, right? Maybe you'd learn what "be responsible for your deeds and
actions" means for real. In real life, not behind a computer.
The message that is sent out by the cartoon is clear: Islam teaches
terrorism.
There are a number of moozlums in my area, including my Pakistani
neighbors. I wonder how long before one of them runs me off the
road or sets my car on fire?
Provoke them and they might do that.
Let us expose haters for what they are, no matter who they are, whether
Muslim, Christian, Jewish, white or black. Racism and hate need to end.
I'm a white Satanist. Anyway, izlam is a religious cult, so hatred of
it is not racism. Hatred of the cult is also not unjustified; regardless
of your claim that moozlums are peaceful, in reality a war exists between
our civilization and their barbarism. For over 500 years we Westerners
have fought to liberate ourselves from the oppression of religion, finally
reducing the xian church to marginal status in our society,
This is true, but unfortunately, when the political correct gestapo went too
far, Christianity rose up like a tiger and well, right now, all it takes is
the evangelicals to get a president with nuclear powers elected here. In
the past it had been marginally Christian, CULTURALLY Christian Westeners
that fought medieval thinking of the Church tooth and nail, fang and claw.
But the politically correct agenda was not something foistered upon the West
by Christians at all, but whole of the movement relentlessly went on a
crusade, in media and elsewhere, to undermine what was a basically Christian
Modern Culture here. Unfortunately. It BACKFIRED. Now we have our own
fundies and they have a LOT of power. Pay attention.
then the cult
of izlam comes along and would not only abolish our last 500 years of
secular progress, they would take us back another 800 years to the 7th
century.
The real dynamic is that the more they push, the stronger equally fanatical
Christians here get. Haven't you noticed this?
Democracy will be destroyed and replaced with rule by some
insane old man with a long beard and rag on his head whose interpretation
of the koran will dictate our daily lives.
***** the moozlums. Even if they were sincere in their desire to co-exist
peacefully with us,
Did you forget that the USA has interfered for quite a long time in their
affairs on behalf of Israel? If WE want to peacefully co-exist with them,
we need to LEAVE THEM ALONE to rule themselves - and STOP SUPPORTING ISRAEL.
It's that simple.
I still consider their culture to be a total violation
of fundamental human rights. To allow any child to be born into and
raised
in an izlamist society is cruel and force is justified to remove him from
such horrible conditions and place him a proper educational environment.
I agree with you, especially for girl children to be raised there - but
then, it's over there, it's not over hear - and I'm not concerned about it.
It's not my problem. Not yours either. Tend to your own house.
Hundred of millions of children face a life of physical and intellectual
oppression and are doomed to live out their lives with a level of
conscienceness and awareness that approaches that of domesticated animals.
That used to be the case in Europe too - as bad. Maybe worse. Consider
also that not all Moslems are like that at all - not even remotely like
that. There are millions of Moslems in the former Soviet Union, all those
SSRs there - and millions of them in Asia. So then, how come Asian Moslem
societies are secular and modern and Semitic ones are not? Perhaps people
interfering with their affairs helped to create this situation. I think so.
In fact, Iraq, before Bush's father bombed them, used to be a modern and
secular society - even Jews that visited it called it the Jewel of Islam.
Then Bush Senior bombed it. Then the rest of the ***** happened.
Instead of free-thinking individuals, izlam produces unconscious
automatons
who wash their feet and stick their butts up in the air with no more free
will than a lab rat who pushes the button to get his dose of cocaine.
You are speaking about an entire religion here - and what you are saying is
100% wrong. You are judging the whole of this religion and millions of
people - by the actions of a minority of fanatics that are obviously and
really using religion for political means. They even admit they are using
it with politics. Religious fanatics make very good soldiers - they are NOT
afraid to die at all. Can American soldiers say the same thing? Hell no.
But provoking anyone by defaming their family is bad enough - provoking them
by defaming their holy icons, prophets and gods? That's crazy, man. It's
plain crazy. It asking for trouble.
And let those people of conscience who have learned from the lessons of
history move beyond racism and toward understanding, reconciliation and
a better, more peaceful tomorrow.
We aren't going to have a peaceful tomorrow at all. The USA is looking to
make trouble with Iran - and Iran is not standing down at all. The USA
needs to have foreign policy written for and by Americans in the USA -not
written in Tel Aviv by the (cough) neocons. Just telling it like it is -
and like it has been for too fucking long.
Blah blah fucking blah. While Gahndi said that an eye for an eye makes
the whole world blind, we should also not just blindly follow Jebus'
advice to turn the other cheek and let insane cultists blow up our
buses and skyscrapers with no retaliation.
Turn the other cheek? I ask someone to please tell me WHEN IN HISTORY
Christians ever turned the other cheek? They are the most vindictive and
warlike people on the planet - and conquering types too - or at least they
were before the Guilt Squad (aka political thought cops) got to them and cut
off their balls and made them ashamed of who they are and were.
I'm not sure how tolerant we
should be of an alien and hostile horde of cultists who have infiltrated
Western society and are now demanding that we abolish just about every
basic principle we stand for (e.g. free speech, democracy, religious
freedom, separation of church and state, etc.).
We should round up every single Moslem, citizen or not, and kindly send them
home. That is how tolerant we should be. As I said, even the ultra liberal
Bill Maher suggested this. It makes logical sense, perfect sense. Being
intolerant would be to ship them out in boats and then bomb the boats. You
can not be tolerant towards intolerance - that is not possible. People who
refuse to "Do in Rome as Romans do" must be asked, or forced, to leave Rome.
That would mean that countries would have to discriminate against specific
people being in their countries or entering them. Oh, but wait - the
political thought cops would scream "nazi" if anyone did that. Gee, that
also seems to have BACKFIRED on the ones that invented the crap.
Hate speech is irresponsible if the person doing it doesn't have an agenda
and purpose to CAUSE something pretty damned predictable to happen. Yes?
Yes.
Like with Mexico, I'll offer the compromise of reciprocity. That means
we will be happy to accomodate their cultural quirks if they accomodate
ours.
Disagree. They have already DESTROYED every single labor "working person"
gain that people in the USA ALSO fought and died for. Kick them out, do not
let them enter. Actually, it's corporations that are doing it. Nationalise
the damned corporations and JAIL those responsible for treason - that is
what I would do. Too bad I'm not in charge, hey? LOL.
So moozlum women will be able to walk down the streets of
Amsterdam or Copenhagen in burqas the day Western women can walk down
the streets of Riyadh or Izlamabad in miniskirts. Until that happens I
don't want to hear any ***** from them about our intolerance.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Don't you see that the whole aim of Islam is to narrow the range of
thought? In the end we shall make thoughtcrime literally impossible,
because there will be no words in which to express it. Every concept
that can ever be needed will be expressed by exactly one verse from the
Koran... The whole literature of the past will have been destroyed.
Douglas Adams, Michael Crichton, George Orwell, Greg Bear - they'll
exist only in Islamic versions, not merely changed into something
different, but actually changed into something contradictory of what
they used to be... The whole climate of thought will be different. In
fact there will BE no thought, as we understand it now. Islam means not
thinking - not needing to think. Islam is unconsciousness."
-- Slightly modified excerpt from "1984"
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Pretty good, but human nature would never quite accomodate that unless they
used seriously modern high tech means to destroy free will. The rise of the
Christian Coalition is in fact a SATANIC occurrence in terms of the satan
being a rebel, an adversary. What they have rebelled against, REacted to -
was the political thought police and the repeated and continued trashing of
their own western and yes, christian culture. Western Civilization, like it
or not IS Christian - even if it's only laid back types. The culture shared
by Western people was (or used to be) Christian. Now, heh, it is not - and
it's the worse for the wear. Farraday, for instance, made his brilliant
discoveries (discoveries Einstein and all the rest had to know about in
order to further the science) BECAUSE Farraday believed in God and the
Bible. He wanted to know the underlying reality of God's creation, the
underlying reality beneath the things we see. Western civilization is
thoroughly Christian in that sense - even the free thinkers hailed from a
Christian culture - even if they turned against the religion. The Frankfurt
School, and yes, they were Jewish people by culture, took over media,
education and many others things here and yeah, they UNDERMINED the entire
culture. They systematically trashed it. This is a fact. I don't give two
shits who (one more killfied person) tries to squirm around it and say "oh,
but the specific people in that school didn't do it." Well, SOME DID - and
they had converts and students that furthered it. Look it up in Kevin
MacDonald if you aren't familiar with it. And the rise of the Christian
Coalition proves that this ***** they did BACKFIRED due to a quite satanic
rebellion on the part of people that banded together and fought back -
because they had ENOUGH. And so, all their wretched wrecking efforts have
done is - you got it - THREATEN Western Civilization and EVERYTHING people
fought and died for.
I personally fear for the future - and I never felt that before - not even
during the Cuban Missle Crisis. Bad ***** is coming that doesn't even have a
thing to do with this OTHER bad ***** involving the Moslems. You can not win
a war with terrorists - or don't you know that? It's just not possible.
Anyone can be one - including a person born in the USA who had a secular or
even atheist eduation. Anyone. What you don't grasp is that all of that
fanaticism, religious in tone, is the ONLY means a beaten down people have
to FIGHT an Imperialist World Power - the USA. They have nothing to lose -
and that is a very very dangerous kind of enemy. We have everything to
lose. Americans will give up freedom to be safe IF they start getting
suicide bombed. Then they will lose both freedom and safety. Guaranteed.
Very bad things are coming. I wish to ***** I was wrong about gut feelings
just once in the past. But I have never been wrong about such things.
Never. DAMN.
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| User: "geltab" |
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| Title: Re: Hate Speech is Irresponsible |
12 Mar 2006 02:08:23 PM |
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Tani Jantsang © wrote...
Like with Mexico, I'll offer the compromise of reciprocity. That means
we will be happy to accomodate their cultural quirks if they accomodate
ours.
Disagree. They have already DESTROYED every single labor "working person"
gain that people in the USA ALSO fought and died for. Kick them out, do not
let them enter. Actually, it's corporations that are doing it. Nationalise
the damned corporations and JAIL those responsible for treason - that is
what I would do. Too bad I'm not in charge, hey? LOL.
I should have clarified, readers of alt.mexico know my position is that I
have no problem with Mexicans coming to the USA to live and work *** IF ***
Americans can go to Mexico to live and work. That is reciprocity, but
Mexico doesn't want reciprocity, it wants to export most of its population
to the USA while fiercely defending its borders against any foreign
immigration (well, they let you retire there but forget about being allowed
to work even if you were willing to accept their $5 daily wage, Mexico's
precious jobs are for MEXICANS only).
And of course I mentioned the same applying to izlamist nations, it would
be nice if reciprocated and allowed Westerners to immigrate and express
their culture freely like they demand we do for them.
.
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| User: "Tani Jantsang ©" |
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| Title: Re: Hate Speech is Irresponsible |
12 Mar 2006 08:43:38 PM |
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"geltab" <lsd@trip.com> wrote in message
news:Xc%Qf.59507$dW3.57413@newssvr21.news.prodigy.com...
Tani Jantsang © wrote...
Like with Mexico, I'll offer the compromise of reciprocity. That means
we will be happy to accomodate their cultural quirks if they accomodate
ours.
Disagree. They have already DESTROYED every single labor "working
person" gain that people in the USA ALSO fought and died for. Kick them
out, do not let them enter. Actually, it's corporations that are doing
it. Nationalise the damned corporations and JAIL those responsible for
treason - that is what I would do. Too bad I'm not in charge, hey? LOL.
I should have clarified, readers of alt.mexico know my position is that I
have no problem with Mexicans coming to the USA to live and work *** IF
***
Americans can go to Mexico to live and work. That is reciprocity,
Um, reciprocity would be that Americans can also demand that Mexican
institutions and schools speak English to them, Americans can also demand
free health care - like illegals get here. Point is - illegals are
criminals. They are invaders, predatory parasites invading this country.
Treat them as criminals.
My gripe is that they have destroyed "Labor" here - something millions of
American working people fought and died for. Corporations are the real
culprits. Unbridled capitalism is a sham, a bust - it doesn't work - even
Buchannan figured it out (Marx said it and analyzed it on target long ago).
Not that Marxism works either.
but
Mexico doesn't want reciprocity, it wants to export most of its population
to the USA while fiercely defending its borders against any foreign
immigration (well, they let you retire there but forget about being
allowed
to work even if you were willing to accept their $5 daily wage, Mexico's
precious jobs are for MEXICANS only).
And of course I mentioned the same applying to izlamist nations, it would
be nice if reciprocated and allowed Westerners to immigrate and express
their culture freely like they demand we do for them.
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| User: "geltab" |
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| Title: Re: Hate Speech is Irresponsible |
12 Mar 2006 11:00:17 PM |
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Tani Jantsang © wrote...
Um, reciprocity would be that Americans can also demand that Mexican
institutions and schools speak English to them, Americans can also demand
free health care - like illegals get here. Point is - illegals are
criminals. They are invaders, predatory parasites invading this country.
Treat them as criminals.
I wouldn't go that far, I consider them to be refugees from a country
beyond repair. But you are correct, and I was just thinking of the
comments by former Mexican official Jorge Castañeda (who is lilly-white)
where he decried the racism and discrimination that poor Mexican
migrants face in the USA (so terrible they keep coming for more abuse),
and what really riled me was his demand for "access to decent health
care" for them in the USA. Americans like me don't have such access,
and then I read a news article which described how Mexicans living in
or even just visiting Mexico are immediately deported the moment they
get sick and can't pay for treatment.
That's right, illegal Mexican immigrants flood U.S. emergency rooms and
are given top-notch treatment and then quickly disappear without paying,
while legal American immigrants and tourists in Mexico are promptly
deported (and then consider that health care in Mexico costs a fraction
of what it costs in the USA).
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| User: "Tani Jantsang ©" |
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| Title: Re: Hate Speech is Irresponsible |
17 Mar 2006 03:19:39 PM |
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"geltab" <lsd@trip.com> wrote in message
news:B%6Rf.38252$_S7.3000@newssvr14.news.prodigy.com...
Tani Jantsang © wrote...
Um, reciprocity would be that Americans can also demand that Mexican
institutions and schools speak English to them, Americans can also demand
free health care - like illegals get here. Point is - illegals are
criminals. They are invaders, predatory parasites invading this country.
Treat them as criminals.
I wouldn't go that far, I consider them to be refugees from a country
beyond repair.
They have illegally broken and entered into a sovereign nation - where they
then come and literally STEAL from the American tax payers by getting access
to FREE things that most Americans living in poverty do not have access to.
Shoot them at the borders. Do that, or perish as a nation. Any other
nation would do it if they had the brains back and were not numbed by the
fear of PC tyranny.
But you are correct, and I was just thinking of the
comments by former Mexican official Jorge Castañeda (who is lilly-white)
where he decried the racism and discrimination that poor Mexican
migrants face in the USA (so terrible they keep coming for more abuse),
and what really riled me was his demand for "access to decent health
care" for them in the USA. Americans like me don't have such access,
and then I read a news article which described how Mexicans living in
or even just visiting Mexico are immediately deported the moment they
get sick and can't pay for treatment.
That's right, illegal Mexican immigrants flood U.S. emergency rooms and
are given top-notch treatment and then quickly disappear without paying,
while legal American immigrants and tourists in Mexico are promptly
deported (and then consider that health care in Mexico costs a fraction
of what it costs in the USA).
Bingo. They are illegals, criminals. Period. There was a time in the USA
where no one with a mind would even be arguing or discussing these things -
it would be so cosmically absurd that none would even imagine it possible.
They are unarmed invaders that refuse to accept American culture even when
they legally get here. They are destroying "labor" something western people
fought and died for. First hang the corporation leaders that want them
here, nationalize them, take their assets. Next, round up the illegals and
deport them. I won't budge on that.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Hate Speech is Irresponsible |
07 Mar 2006 04:11:22 PM |
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wrote:
Hate Speech is Irresponsible
by: Layla Shaikley
I offer my humble words to our First Amendment, which grants us the
right to freedom of speech.
shove it up your ***** you dirty muslim *****. Take your evil ***** hole of
a religon and let your false prophet dry hump it like it was three year
old child.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Hate Speech is Irresponsible |
07 Mar 2006 04:25:48 PM |
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wrote:
John_seeyou@yahoo.com wrote:
Hate Speech is Irresponsible
by: Layla Shaikley
I offer my humble words to our First Amendment, which grants us the
right to freedom of speech.
shove it up your ***** you dirty muslim *****. Take your evil ***** hole of
a religon and let your false prophet dry hump it like it was three year
old child.
More of the Nazi filth
http://www.canada.com/topics/news/world/story.html?id=42240886-25f9-443e-aea3-42a9248847dd&k=28346
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| User: "americano" |
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| Title: Re: Hate Speech is Irresponsible |
07 Mar 2006 05:04:57 PM |
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wrote:
Hate Speech is Irresponsible
by: Layla Shaikley
I offer my humble words to our First Amendment, which grants us the
right to freedom of speech.
I apologize, First Amendment, on behalf of the people who abuse you and
use you as an excuse to generate hate and enmity.
The framers of the Constitution were men who sought liberty and justice
for all, and wrote the Constitution for people who would hopefully
realize that with rights come responsibilities.
Freedom of speech, more specifically, is a right that requires
responsibility, as established in Brandenburg v. Ohio, 1969.
Some people, however, want to take the right and not accept the
responsibility by using the freedom of speech to generate hate toward
an entire people, nation or religion.
For those who abuse their rights, I apologize to the First Amendment.
Freedom of speech was abused when African-Americans were publicly
harassed and verbally abused before the Civil Rights Movement.
The abuse of the freedom of speech also created and sustained hate
toward Jews in the history of the United States, which is just as
despicable.
Similarly, displaying cartoons attacking the core beliefs of an entire
religion is nothing but tasteless disrespect for freedoms that some of
us have come to take for granted.
And yes, I mean you, College Republicans.
Within the last few months, the Muslim world has been enraged by a
Danish cartoon that depicted the prophet Muhammad with a bomb on his
head in place of his turban.
The cartoonist reached an abject low by depicting the revered prophet
of Islam as a terrorist.
The cartoonist did not mock the few terrorists who hide under the name
of Islam.
Rather, the cartoonists mocked the prophet of Islam himself.
The message that is sent out by the cartoon is clear: Islam teaches
terrorism.
The cartoon propagates hate toward all Muslims - over 1.2 billion
people worldwide - and further propagates false and absurd
stereotypes that Islam is a religion of terror.
Are there crazy, evil terrorists out there? Yes. Do some of them claim
themselves Muslim? Yes. Does Islam teach terror? No.
But these criminals justify their crimes with their own small-minded
misinterpretations of Islam that most Muslims completely abhor and
reject.
This is an important distinction that must be understood.
There is no mistaking why Muslims were categorically offended by the
cartoons. However, as for the violence that ensued in their aftermath,
it has more to do with socioeconomic and political frustrations in each
of the nations and less to do with anything 'Islam told them to
do.'
So this Danish cartoonist is an ignorant hater.
Well, there are ignorant haters everywhere-the world is peppered with
stupid people! A lot of us are in college now trying to open up our
minds and expand our understanding of the world.
UC Irvine should not be a forum for hate, but rather one for
understanding, discussion and debate.
I was appalled last Tuesday when the College Republicans, in
association with the United American Committee, used their freedom of
speech as a guise to generate hate against Muslims.
The event unveiled the cartoon, and showcased it next to hateful
cartoons from the Middle East, as if two wrongs make a right!
After failed meetings with the College Republicans to cancel the event,
over 1,000 UCI students and community members (tallied by a petition
against hate that night) protested the event on Tuesday to boycott the
abuse of freedom of speech and the propagation of Islamophobia.
The problem is not with us Muslims here on campus, but rather with the
haters and those who do not want to confront the truth.
What would happen to you if your war on Islam (or the "evil
religion" as one of the event speakers called it) finally ended and
you couldn't hate all Muslims anymore?
What if you engaged in dialogue with the Muslims and found out that the
fellow Muslims on campus are against Bin Laden and his cohorts (see Ann
Coulter: "We should invade their countries, kill their leaders and
convert them")?
What if you learned that Islam forbids anti-Christian or anti-Jewish
cartoons, like those you brandished before all as justification for
your hate?
What if you opened a history book, or learned about the world beyond
the O.C., and learned that some of the biggest terrorist acts in recent
history have been committed by those calling themselves Christians, or
members of other religions? 50 Cent had "21 Questions," and now
Layla Shaikley has got a few, too.
Let us expose haters for what they are, no matter who they are, whether
Muslim, Christian, Jewish, white or black. Racism and hate need to end.
And let those people of conscience who have learned from the lessons of
history move beyond racism and toward understanding, reconciliation and
a better, more peaceful tomorrow.
You either have freedom of speech or you don't.
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| User: "robert merritt" |
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| Title: Re: Hate Speech is Irresponsible |
07 Mar 2006 04:07:53 PM |
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A 5th columnist speaks......
RM
<John_seeyou@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1141767581.835280.242930@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Hate Speech is Irresponsible
by: Layla Shaikley
I offer my humble words to our First Amendment, which grants us the
right to freedom of speech.
I apologize, First Amendment, on behalf of the people who abuse you and
use you as an excuse to generate hate and enmity.
The framers of the Constitution were men who sought liberty and justice
for all, and wrote the Constitution for people who would hopefully
realize that with rights come responsibilities.
Freedom of speech, more specifically, is a right that requires
responsibility, as established in Brandenburg v. Ohio, 1969.
Some people, however, want to take the right and not accept the
responsibility by using the freedom of speech to generate hate toward
an entire people, nation or religion.
For those who abuse their rights, I apologize to the First Amendment.
Freedom of speech was abused when African-Americans were publicly
harassed and verbally abused before the Civil Rights Movement.
The abuse of the freedom of speech also created and sustained hate
toward Jews in the history of the United States, which is just as
despicable.
Similarly, displaying cartoons attacking the core beliefs of an entire
religion is nothing but tasteless disrespect for freedoms that some of
us have come to take for granted.
And yes, I mean you, College Republicans.
Within the last few months, the Muslim world has been enraged by a
Danish cartoon that depicted the prophet Muhammad with a bomb on his
head in place of his turban.
The cartoonist reached an abject low by depicting the revered prophet
of Islam as a terrorist.
The cartoonist did not mock the few terrorists who hide under the name
of Islam.
Rather, the cartoonists mocked the prophet of Islam himself.
The message that is sent out by the cartoon is clear: Islam teaches
terrorism.
The cartoon propagates hate toward all Muslims - over 1.2 billion
people worldwide - and further propagates false and absurd
stereotypes that Islam is a religion of terror.
Are there crazy, evil terrorists out there? Yes. Do some of them claim
themselves Muslim? Yes. Does Islam teach terror? No.
But these criminals justify their crimes with their own small-minded
misinterpretations of Islam that most Muslims completely abhor and
reject.
This is an important distinction that must be understood.
There is no mistaking why Muslims were categorically offended by the
cartoons. However, as for the violence that ensued in their aftermath,
it has more to do with socioeconomic and political frustrations in each
of the nations and less to do with anything 'Islam told them to
do.'
So this Danish cartoonist is an ignorant hater.
Well, there are ignorant haters everywhere-the world is peppered with
stupid people! A lot of us are in college now trying to open up our
minds and expand our understanding of the world.
UC Irvine should not be a forum for hate, but rather one for
understanding, discussion and debate.
I was appalled last Tuesday when the College Republicans, in
association with the United American Committee, used their freedom of
speech as a guise to generate hate against Muslims.
The event unveiled the cartoon, and showcased it next to hateful
cartoons from the Middle East, as if two wrongs make a right!
After failed meetings with the College Republicans to cancel the event,
over 1,000 UCI students and community members (tallied by a petition
against hate that night) protested the event on Tuesday to boycott the
abuse of freedom of speech and the propagation of Islamophobia.
The problem is not with us Muslims here on campus, but rather with the
haters and those who do not want to confront the truth.
What would happen to you if your war on Islam (or the "evil
religion" as one of the event speakers called it) finally ended and
you couldn't hate all Muslims anymore?
What if you engaged in dialogue with the Muslims and found out that the
fellow Muslims on campus are against Bin Laden and his cohorts (see Ann
Coulter: "We should invade their countries, kill their leaders and
convert them")?
What if you learned that Islam forbids anti-Christian or anti-Jewish
cartoons, like those you brandished before all as justification for
your hate?
What if you opened a history book, or learned about the world beyond
the O.C., and learned that some of the biggest terrorist acts in recent
history have been committed by those calling themselves Christians, or
members of other religions? 50 Cent had "21 Questions," and now
Layla Shaikley has got a few, too.
Let us expose haters for what they are, no matter who they are, whether
Muslim, Christian, Jewish, white or black. Racism and hate need to end.
And let those people of conscience who have learned from the lessons of
history move beyond racism and toward understanding, reconciliation and
a better, more peaceful tomorrow.
.
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| User: "The Pragmatist" |
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| Title: How Totally Ridiculous!!!! |
07 Mar 2006 04:37:08 PM |
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Nice of you to swath yourself in the sanctity of a free-speech protector and
hate-crime advocate--this is ridiculous.
Islam's problems in adapting to other cultures is more than obvious--its a
total handicap.
Supposedly "Moderate" Muslims (are there any out there?) cried after 9/11
that their religion was "hijacked." Good choice of words considering Yassir
Arafat invented airplane hijacking.
So the wonderful Danes have a picture of a Muslim (not Mohammed) with a lit
fuse on his Turban, a PERFECT commentary with NO dialogue
that drives the very claim they are making home to the world
and...........................................Muslims go APE *****
!!!!!!!!!!!
Total insanity--the Arab papers feature the most virulent and disgusting
anti-semitic ***** every other day and the Jews and Infidels yawn......
But IMAGINE!!! A Cartoon that makes a political statements gets this death
cult in an uproar.
Two words--***** 'Em.
They don't want to see reality, they can't take any criticism and are
prepared to murder those who freely express their ideas.
There is no way these cartoons would have been construed as constituting a
"Hate Crime" in Canada or any other nation having powerful
hate crime legislation.
If the I.Q. of Muslims (20% unfortunately of the world population) cannot
distinguish between political statement and hate crime, too bad.
Tell them not to pick up the newspapers.......
God Bless the Humanitarian and Wonderful Danes for holding fast against
Islamic REPRESSION.
MUSLIMS--do yourself a favor, and leave your cult.....for anything!!!
<John_seeyou@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1141767581.835280.242930@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Hate Speech is Irresponsible
by: Layla Shaikley
I offer my humble words to our First Amendment, which grants us the
right to freedom of speech.
I apologize, First Amendment, on behalf of the people who abuse you and
use you as an excuse to generate hate and enmity.
The framers of the Constitution were men who sought liberty and justice
for all, and wrote the Constitution for people who would hopefully
realize that with rights come responsibilities.
Freedom of speech, more specifically, is a right that requires
responsibility, as established in Brandenburg v. Ohio, 1969.
Some people, however, want to take the right and not accept the
responsibility by using the freedom of speech to generate hate toward
an entire people, nation or religion.
For those who abuse their rights, I apologize to the First Amendment.
Freedom of speech was abused when African-Americans were publicly
harassed and verbally abused before the Civil Rights Movement.
The abuse of the freedom of speech also created and sustained hate
toward Jews in the history of the United States, which is just as
despicable.
Similarly, displaying cartoons attacking the core beliefs of an entire
religion is nothing but tasteless disrespect for freedoms that some of
us have come to take for granted.
And yes, I mean you, College Republicans.
Within the last few months, the Muslim world has been enraged by a
Danish cartoon that depicted the prophet Muhammad with a bomb on his
head in place of his turban.
The cartoonist reached an abject low by depicting the revered prophet
of Islam as a terrorist.
The cartoonist did not mock the few terrorists who hide under the name
of Islam.
Rather, the cartoonists mocked the prophet of Islam himself.
The message that is sent out by the cartoon is clear: Islam teaches
terrorism.
The cartoon propagates hate toward all Muslims - over 1.2 billion
people worldwide - and further propagates false and absurd
stereotypes that Islam is a religion of terror.
Are there crazy, evil terrorists out there? Yes. Do some of them claim
themselves Muslim? Yes. Does Islam teach terror? No.
But these criminals justify their crimes with their own small-minded
misinterpretations of Islam that most Muslims completely abhor and
reject.
This is an important distinction that must be understood.
There is no mistaking why Muslims were categorically offended by the
cartoons. However, as for the violence that ensued in their aftermath,
it has more to do with socioeconomic and political frustrations in each
of the nations and less to do with anything 'Islam told them to
do.'
So this Danish cartoonist is an ignorant hater.
Well, there are ignorant haters everywhere-the world is peppered with
stupid people! A lot of us are in college now trying to open up our
minds and expand our understanding of the world.
UC Irvine should not be a forum for hate, but rather one for
understanding, discussion and debate.
I was appalled last Tuesday when the College Republicans, in
association with the United American Committee, used their freedom of
speech as a guise to generate hate against Muslims.
The event unveiled the cartoon, and showcased it next to hateful
cartoons from the Middle East, as if two wrongs make a right!
After failed meetings with the College Republicans to cancel the event,
over 1,000 UCI students and community members (tallied by a petition
against hate that night) protested the event on Tuesday to boycott the
abuse of freedom of speech and the propagation of Islamophobia.
The problem is not with us Muslims here on campus, but rather with the
haters and those who do not want to confront the truth.
What would happen to you if your war on Islam (or the "evil
religion" as one of the event speakers called it) finally ended and
you couldn't hate all Muslims anymore?
What if you engaged in dialogue with the Muslims and found out that the
fellow Muslims on campus are against Bin Laden and his cohorts (see Ann
Coulter: "We should invade their countries, kill their leaders and
convert them")?
What if you learned that Islam forbids anti-Christian or anti-Jewish
cartoons, like those you brandished before all as justification for
your hate?
What if you opened a history book, or learned about the world beyond
the O.C., and learned that some of the biggest terrorist acts in recent
history have been committed by those calling themselves Christians, or
members of other religions? 50 Cent had "21 Questions," and now
Layla Shaikley has got a few, too.
Let us expose haters for what they are, no matter who they are, whether
Muslim, Christian, Jewish, white or black. Racism and hate need to end.
And let those people of conscience who have learned from the lessons of
history move beyond racism and toward understanding, reconciliation and
a better, more peaceful tomorrow.
.
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| User: "John Berg" |
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| Title: Re: Hate Speech is Irresponsible |
08 Mar 2006 11:27:42 AM |
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The problem with this bloviation is that Free Speech is good and many
Muslims commit violence in Mohammed's name. The cartoons with the bomb in
the turban makes exactly this point. In fact they shout it loudly. As is
their right under freedom of speech. Would Muslims ensure my freedom of
religion in their country?
--
John Berg
The fact that in Mohammedan law every woman must belong to some man as his
absolute property - either as a child, a wife, or a concubine - must
delay the final extinction of slavery until the faith of Islam has
ceased to be a great power among men. --W. Churchill
<John_seeyou@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1141767581.835280.242930@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Hate Speech is Irresponsible
by: Layla Shaikley
I offer my humble words to our First Amendment, which grants us the
right to freedom of speech.
I apologize, First Amendment, on behalf of the people who abuse you and
use you as an excuse | |
