| Topic: |
Politics > Politics-USA |
| User: |
"Wide Eyed in Wonder" |
| Date: |
14 Jul 2006 09:09:28 AM |
| Object: |
If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
You've heard or seen the mantra of contemporary society in many
locations, but it comes down to this: everyone decides what is good and
evil, right and wrong, for themselves.
Here's the funny part. Those that hold this position then strike out
at fundamentalist Christians for being too narrow minded.
Question: If everyone is able to decide what is right and wrong for
themselves, what is wrong with fundamentalists deciding what is right
and wrong for themselves according to the Bible? If it is truly up to
the person, why can't the religious, as persons, choose God's way? In
fact, doesn't attacking them for that chose show that it is the other
side (not the religious) that are trying to dictate morals to another
group?
Ken Clifton
http://www.lulu.com/writingken
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| User: "H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." |
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| Title: Re: If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
14 Jul 2006 12:14:24 PM |
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"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kands00@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1152886168.792466.256560@35g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
You've heard or seen the mantra of contemporary society in many
locations, but it comes down to this: everyone decides what is good and
evil, right and wrong, for themselves.
Yes, including ignorant Ephesians such as yourself who don't comprehend the
complexities of the law, thus thinking that their take on the law is the
right one.
To make matters worse (as Jesus stated in His letter to you Ephesians) the
law is irrelevant in light of the Gospel of grace, we all being guilty of
violating the law, so those who put on the law again (as you would have
everyone do), actually revokes your salvation by grace, and Jesus is only
taking half of the Ephesians (for I hold these things against you).
So, are they screwed up?
Absolutely.
Are you screwed up?
Even worse.
Ike
www.eickleberrybooks.com
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| User: "baba" |
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| Title: Re: If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
14 Jul 2006 04:19:26 PM |
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"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <Yeickleberrybooks@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:DtOdnYurmNFtTSrZnZ2dnUVZ_vCdnZ2d@comcast.com...
"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kands00@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1152886168.792466.256560@35g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
You've heard or seen the mantra of contemporary society in many
locations, but it comes down to this: everyone decides what is good
and
evil, right and wrong, for themselves.
Yes, including ignorant Ephesians such as yourself who don't
comprehend the complexities of the law, thus thinking that their take
on the law is the right one.
To make matters worse (as Jesus stated in His letter to you Ephesians)
the
(Snipped the angry ignorance)
------------------------>
"As Jesus stated in His letter..."
Oh boy..Now we *know* you invented your version of the Bible.
Ephesians 1:1
Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, to the saints who
are at Ephesus, and to the faithful in Christ Jesus:
Are you screwed up?
------------------------->
said the kettle to the pot..
Even worse.
Ike
(snipped the spam and forwarded it to )
-baba
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| User: "H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." |
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| Title: Re: If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
14 Jul 2006 11:54:25 PM |
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"baba" <bbdd@terra.spoof.net> wrote in message
news:fTTtg.1484$cu1.1030@bignews3.bellsouth.net...
"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <Yeickleberrybooks@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:DtOdnYurmNFtTSrZnZ2dnUVZ_vCdnZ2d@comcast.com...
"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kands00@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1152886168.792466.256560@35g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
You've heard or seen the mantra of contemporary society in many
locations, but it comes down to this: everyone decides what is good and
evil, right and wrong, for themselves.
Yes, including ignorant Ephesians such as yourself who don't comprehend
the complexities of the law, thus thinking that their take on the law is
the right one.
To make matters worse (as Jesus stated in His letter to you Ephesians)
the
(Snipped the angry ignorance)
------------------------>
"As Jesus stated in His letter..."
Oh boy..Now we *know* you invented your version of the Bible.
Ephesians 1:1
Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, to the saints who are
at Ephesus, and to the faithful in Christ Jesus:
Are you screwed up?
------------------------->
said the kettle to the pot..
Even worse.
LOL
I said Jesus' letter to the Ephesians, not Paul's, goofball.
As in Revelation 2:1-7?
As in Jesus taking those to task who forgot that guilt under the law
requires salvation by grace through faith, and not the other way around,
i.e. those who are saved by grace should not be sitting in judgment by the
law, forgetting that they were saved by their first love (or love that had
at first), i.e. grace?
(Which is not to say that ignoring the law is acceptable, as Jesus also
compliments the Ephesians for hating the deeds of the Nicolaitans, who were
a licentious cult that abused their grace in Christ.)
As usual, you don't have a clue as to what goes on, but go ahead and jump
into your own mouth anyway, swallowing yourself whole in the process.
Ike
www.eickleberrybooks.com
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| User: "Fool For Christ" |
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| Title: Re: If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
16 Jul 2006 05:27:35 PM |
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H.E. Eickleberry, Jr. wrote:
"baba" <bbdd@terra.spoof.net> wrote in message
news:fTTtg.1484$cu1.1030@bignews3.bellsouth.net...
"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <Yeickleberrybooks@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:DtOdnYurmNFtTSrZnZ2dnUVZ_vCdnZ2d@comcast.com...
"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kands00@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1152886168.792466.256560@35g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
You've heard or seen the mantra of contemporary society in many
locations, but it comes down to this: everyone decides what is good and
evil, right and wrong, for themselves.
Yes, including ignorant Ephesians such as yourself who don't comprehend
the complexities of the law, thus thinking that their take on the law is
the right one.
To make matters worse (as Jesus stated in His letter to you Ephesians)
the
(Snipped the angry ignorance)
------------------------>
"As Jesus stated in His letter..."
Oh boy..Now we *know* you invented your version of the Bible.
Ephesians 1:1
Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, to the saints who are
at Ephesus, and to the faithful in Christ Jesus:
Are you screwed up?
------------------------->
said the kettle to the pot..
Even worse.
LOL
I said Jesus' letter to the Ephesians, not Paul's, goofball.
So, let me get this straight, since your extremist views keep
expanding. Paul's letter, inspired by the Holy Spirit, was the words
of Paul, but John's non-letter apocalypse book was the Words of Jesus?
You're saying Paul's letters are not Scripture?
Ken Clifton
http://www.lulu.com/writingken
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| User: "dk" |
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| Title: Re: If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
14 Jul 2006 11:18:35 AM |
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I have absolutely NO issue with the fundamentalist deciding what moral
rights to follow as long as it does not break the law of the country.
Hassidic Jews and the Amish are far more fundamentalist than the
Southern Baptists of Fawell and Robertson like but the difference is
they do not rape others with their religious beliefs. Sex and Region
between consenting adults should be entirely a private affair and not
interfered with but when you try to force either on someone who is
unwilling that is rape or assault.
Wide Eyed in Wonder wrote:
You've heard or seen the mantra of contemporary society in many
locations, but it comes down to this: everyone decides what is good and
evil, right and wrong, for themselves.
Here's the funny part. Those that hold this position then strike out
at fundamentalist Christians for being too narrow minded.
Question: If everyone is able to decide what is right and wrong for
themselves, what is wrong with fundamentalists deciding what is right
and wrong for themselves according to the Bible? If it is truly up to
the person, why can't the religious, as persons, choose God's way? In
fact, doesn't attacking them for that chose show that it is the other
side (not the religious) that are trying to dictate morals to another
group?
Ken Clifton
http://www.lulu.com/writingken
.
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| User: "Cary Kittrell" |
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| Title: Re: If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
14 Jul 2006 12:55:25 PM |
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In article <1152886168.792466.256560@35g2000cwc.googlegroups.com> "Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kands00@hotmail.com> writes:
You've heard or seen the mantra of contemporary society in many
locations, but it comes down to this: everyone decides what is good and
evil, right and wrong, for themselves.
Here's the funny part. Those that hold this position then strike out
at fundamentalist Christians for being too narrow minded.
Question: If everyone is able to decide what is right and wrong for
themselves, what is wrong with fundamentalists deciding what is right
and wrong for themselves according to the Bible? If it is truly up to
the person, why can't the religious, as persons, choose God's way? In
fact, doesn't attacking them for that chose show that it is the other
side (not the religious) that are trying to dictate morals to another
group?
And since when does saying "Everyone must make up their own minds"
equate to "I will therefore agree with anyone's choices?"
That's as silly as saying that if somone supports free speech,
then that person should never against what anyone else says.
You should make up your own mind. It's sad if you get it wrong,
but then you pays your money and you takes your chances.
Hope this helps.
-- cay
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| User: "ZenIsWhen" |
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| Title: Re: If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
15 Jul 2006 09:30:21 AM |
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"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kands00@hotmail.com> writes:
Ahhhhh. another pile of crap from a moronic *****!
You've heard or seen the mantra of contemporary society in many
locations, but it comes down to this: everyone decides what is good and
evil, right and wrong, for themselves.
Yes.
I've heard it many times.
It is something (not based in any resemblance to fact) that is CONSTANTLY
bellowed by ignorant, Reich wing, (so called) christians.
Here's the funny part. Those that hold this position then strike out
at fundamentalist Christians for being too narrow minded.
Not only that - it shows them (and you) as deranged idiots - to INVENT
distorted claims like this - and then to act like it is REALLY a fact!
Question: If everyone is able to decide what is right and wrong for
themselves, what is wrong with fundamentalists deciding what is right
and wrong for themselves according to the Bible?
They are trying to use (THEIR deranged and distorted - extreme
interpretation of ) the bible to run EVERYONE's life!
If it is truly up to
the person, why can't the religious, as persons, choose God's way? In
fact, doesn't attacking them for that chose show that it is the other
side (not the religious) that are trying to dictate morals to another
group?
Only in your demented, psychotic imagination!
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
14 Jul 2006 09:24:44 AM |
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No, your argument is just profoundly stupid. First you explain about
people deciding for themselves. I despise fundamentalists and I could
not care less what you decide for yourself. You can feel free to decide
to burn yourself alive in a fire, jump off a bridge, or just put a gun
in your mouth and pull the trigger.
But as you know, fundamentalists have zero intention of deciding
anything for themselves nor is it even an issue they think about.
Fundamentalists think about making decisions for OTHER PEOPLE.
Their idiot fallacious scam works like this: "I have freedom of
religion. Well, my religion says that you are my slave. If you refuse
to be my slave then you are denying me my freedom of religion."
As you said, feel free to decide anything you want for 'yourself'.
However, at the point where your decisions for yourself are deciding
that I become your servant and obey you then you will have a problem.
I certainly in no way am suggesting that other people do as I do. Other
people have no chance of doing as I do. I can ignore the decisions of
other people because I am more intelligent than other people. That does
not mean that stupid people should start telling everyone else how to
live their lives. Your post proves all of this. Stupid people spew
forth fallacious nonsense and think it is logical argument; it is not.
Lastly, I would not bother telling other people what to do. Stupid
people never listen anyway. They only get angry and want to murder
people smarter than they are. Do anything you want to yourself. I won't
be forced to kill you for it until you try and force your stupidity on
me.
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| User: "H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." |
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| Title: Re: If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
14 Jul 2006 12:15:07 PM |
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<slip_identity@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1152887084.065364.190600@m79g2000cwm.googlegroups.com...
No, your argument is just profoundly stupid.
All of Ken's arguments are profoundly stupid.
You can't expect brilliance from a baby.
Ike
www.eickleberrybooks.com
.
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| User: "sensi" |
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| Title: Re: If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
14 Jul 2006 03:32:00 PM |
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"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <Yeickleberrybooks@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:IY6dnb5tGo2BTCrZnZ2dnUVZ_sSdnZ2d@comcast.com...
<slip_identity@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1152887084.065364.190600@m79g2000cwm.googlegroups.com...
No, your argument is just profoundly stupid.
All of Ken's arguments are profoundly stupid.
You can't expect brilliance from a baby.
Ike
www.eickleberrybooks.com
sensi:
Why do you act like that?
.
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| User: "H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." |
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| Title: Re: If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
14 Jul 2006 11:47:23 PM |
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"sensi" <sensi4sight@home.net> wrote in message
news:HbydnQJFPJHfYirZnZ2dnUVZ_r2dnZ2d@pghconnect.com...
"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <Yeickleberrybooks@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:IY6dnb5tGo2BTCrZnZ2dnUVZ_sSdnZ2d@comcast.com...
<slip_identity@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1152887084.065364.190600@m79g2000cwm.googlegroups.com...
No, your argument is just profoundly stupid.
All of Ken's arguments are profoundly stupid.
You can't expect brilliance from a baby.
Ike
www.eickleberrybooks.com
sensi:
Why do you act like that?
Why did Jesus act like that?
Ike
www.eickleberrybooks.com
.
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| User: "sensi" |
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| Title: Re: If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
14 Jul 2006 11:57:35 PM |
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"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <Yeickleberrybooks@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:AcednaNfyuPG7iXZnZ2dnUVZ_oadnZ2d@comcast.com...
"sensi" <sensi4sight@home.net> wrote in message
news:HbydnQJFPJHfYirZnZ2dnUVZ_r2dnZ2d@pghconnect.com...
"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <Yeickleberrybooks@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:IY6dnb5tGo2BTCrZnZ2dnUVZ_sSdnZ2d@comcast.com...
<slip_identity@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1152887084.065364.190600@m79g2000cwm.googlegroups.com...
No, your argument is just profoundly stupid.
All of Ken's arguments are profoundly stupid.
You can't expect brilliance from a baby.
Ike
www.eickleberrybooks.com
sensi:
Why do you act like that?
Why did Jesus act like that?
Ike
www.eickleberrybooks.com
sensi:
He didn't and if by some slim chance that he did he was more than likely
turning away bad thoughts (not people but their thoughts and ideas of
bad -that people tried to enter into his mind and heart.
It would be like you trying to call him stupid. He would look at your idea
and send it away from him.
He did not call people stupid, ever!.
.
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| User: "H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." |
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| Title: Re: If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
15 Jul 2006 01:00:33 AM |
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"sensi" <sensi4sight@home.net> wrote in message
news:ueCdnZV-6IZd6CXZnZ2dnUVZ_uudnZ2d@pghconnect.com...
"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <Yeickleberrybooks@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:AcednaNfyuPG7iXZnZ2dnUVZ_oadnZ2d@comcast.com...
"sensi" <sensi4sight@home.net> wrote in message
news:HbydnQJFPJHfYirZnZ2dnUVZ_r2dnZ2d@pghconnect.com...
"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <Yeickleberrybooks@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:IY6dnb5tGo2BTCrZnZ2dnUVZ_sSdnZ2d@comcast.com...
<slip_identity@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1152887084.065364.190600@m79g2000cwm.googlegroups.com...
No, your argument is just profoundly stupid.
All of Ken's arguments are profoundly stupid.
You can't expect brilliance from a baby.
Ike
www.eickleberrybooks.com
sensi:
Why do you act like that?
Why did Jesus act like that?
Ike
www.eickleberrybooks.com
sensi:
He didn't....
Ohhhh, yes He did.
and if by some slim chance that he did he was more than likely turning
away bad thoughts (not people but their thoughts and ideas of bad -that
people tried to enter into his mind and heart.
And once again Sensi returns to her silliness.
Yeah, Jesus was "turning away bad thoughts and ideas" alright--as espoused
by those who imposed their own desires on scripture instead of taking it at
face value, hard parts and all.
It would be like you trying to call him stupid. He would look at your idea
and send it away from him.
He did not call people stupid, ever!.
LOL
Sure He did.
He was just more clever at it than me.
Mt 23:13-33
But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the
kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither
suffer ye them that are entering to go in.
Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye devour widows’
houses, and for a pretence make long prayer: therefore ye shall receive the
greater damnation.
Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and
land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more
the child of hell than yourselves.
Woe unto you, ye blind guides, which say, Whosoever shall swear by the
temple, it is nothing; but whosoever shall swear by the gold of the temple,
he is a debtor! Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gold, or the
temple that sanctifieth the gold?
And, Whosoever shall swear by the altar, it is nothing; but whosoever
sweareth by the gift that is upon it, he is guilty. Ye fools and blind: for
whether is greater, the gift, or the altar that sanctifieth the gift? Whoso
therefore shall swear by the altar, sweareth by it, and by all things
thereon. And whoso shall swear by the temple, sweareth by it, and by him
that dwelleth therein. And he that shall swear by heaven, sweareth by the
throne of God, and by him that sitteth thereon.
Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of
mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the
law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to
leave the other undone.
Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel.
Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye make clean the
outside of the cup and of the platter, but within they are full of extortion
and excess. Thou blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is within the cup
and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also.
Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto
whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within
full of dead men’s bones, and of all uncleanness. Even so ye also outwardly
appear righteous unto men, but within ye are full of hypocrisy and iniquity.
Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye build the
tombs of the prophets, and garnish the sepulchres of the righteous, And say,
If we had been in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers
with them in the blood of the prophets. Wherefore ye be witnesses unto
yourselves, that ye are the children of them which killed the prophets.
Fill ye up then the measure of your fathers.
Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of
hell?
Who drinks from a cup that is clean on the outside but filthy on the inside?
Who swears by a pledge to the temple when the temple sanctifies the pledge?
Who strains at a nat but swallows a camel?
Etc. etc. etc.
Every one of these statements means "stupid, stupid, and stupid."
Ike
--
www.eickleberrybooks.com
******************************
The Tree of Life (from "The Character Map")
The Beloved
Faith Hope
Righteousness Judgment Compassion
Courage Integrity Diligence Grace
Discipline of Thought Service Desire Decision and Belief
Glory Honor Power Wisdom Riches Blessing Strength w/Thanksgiving
He Who Loves
******************************
Remove X from address to reply
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| User: "sensi" |
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| Title: Re: If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
15 Jul 2006 11:34:29 AM |
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"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <Yeickleberrybooks@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:WNOdnfVqzZoeGSXZnZ2dnUVZ_tqdnZ2d@comcast.com...
"sensi" <sensi4sight@home.net> wrote in message
news:ueCdnZV-6IZd6CXZnZ2dnUVZ_uudnZ2d@pghconnect.com...
"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <Yeickleberrybooks@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:AcednaNfyuPG7iXZnZ2dnUVZ_oadnZ2d@comcast.com...
"sensi" <sensi4sight@home.net> wrote in message
news:HbydnQJFPJHfYirZnZ2dnUVZ_r2dnZ2d@pghconnect.com...
"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <Yeickleberrybooks@comcast.net> wrote in
message news:IY6dnb5tGo2BTCrZnZ2dnUVZ_sSdnZ2d@comcast.com...
<slip_identity@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1152887084.065364.190600@m79g2000cwm.googlegroups.com...
No, your argument is just profoundly stupid.
All of Ken's arguments are profoundly stupid.
You can't expect brilliance from a baby.
Ike
www.eickleberrybooks.com
sensi:
Why do you act like that?
Why did Jesus act like that?
Ike
www.eickleberrybooks.com
sensi:
He didn't....
Ohhhh, yes He did.
and if by some slim chance that he did he was more than likely turning
away bad thoughts (not people but their thoughts and ideas of bad -that
people tried to enter into his mind and heart.
And once again Sensi returns to her silliness.
Yeah, Jesus was "turning away bad thoughts and ideas" alright--as espoused
by those who imposed their own desires on scripture instead of taking it
at face value, hard parts and all.
It would be like you trying to call him stupid. He would look at your
idea and send it away from him.
He did not call people stupid, ever!.
LOL
Sure He did.
He was just more clever at it than me.
sensi:
So you want to be another Jesus huh?
Okay, I'm all for it but suppose you wanted to work a crowd and tell the
people you have the Living God within you as your savior and comforter. .
1. Do you just walk up to people and call them idiots?
2. Do you carefully listen at their reasons why God would not be a savior
and a comforter?
Mt 23:13-33
But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the
kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither
suffer ye them that are entering to go in.
Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye devour widows'
houses, and for a pretence make long prayer: therefore ye shall receive
the greater damnation.
Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and
land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more
the child of hell than yourselves.
Woe unto you, ye blind guides, which say, Whosoever shall swear by the
temple, it is nothing; but whosoever shall swear by the gold of the
temple, he is a debtor! Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the
gold, or the temple that sanctifieth the gold?
And, Whosoever shall swear by the altar, it is nothing; but whosoever
sweareth by the gift that is upon it, he is guilty. Ye fools and blind:
for whether is greater, the gift, or the altar that sanctifieth the gift?
Whoso therefore shall swear by the altar, sweareth by it, and by all
things thereon. And whoso shall swear by the temple, sweareth by it, and
by him that dwelleth therein. And he that shall swear by heaven, sweareth
by the throne of God, and by him that sitteth thereon.
Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of
mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the
law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to
leave the other undone.
Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel.
Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye make clean the
outside of the cup and of the platter, but within they are full of
extortion and excess. Thou blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is
within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also.
Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto
whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within
full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness. Even so ye also
outwardly appear righteous unto men, but within ye are full of hypocrisy
and iniquity.
Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye build the
tombs of the prophets, and garnish the sepulchres of the righteous, And
say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we would not have been
partakers with them in the blood of the prophets. Wherefore ye be
witnesses unto yourselves, that ye are the children of them which killed
the prophets.
Fill ye up then the measure of your fathers.
Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation
of hell?
Who drinks from a cup that is clean on the outside but filthy on the
inside?
sensi:
Okay, Jesus (Ike) You're preaching to me about an important step I need to
make.. Are you telling me my soul (within) has no value to God and is lost
in dogma, (Pharisees)doctrine, (Scribes) tradition (man) where I as a person
must follow words rather than follow God in my heart? .. Or... are you
telling me to look within my own heart and my mind and find God within
rather than follow man-made laws?....Or are you just mouthing?
Who swears by a pledge to the temple when the temple sanctifies the
pledge?
sensi:
Okay, Jesus (Ike)....Are you telling me my mind, heart, soul which inhabits
a physical body is my temple where I worship God and pledge to worship him
and honor him from within or are you saying I should say the pledge of
allegiance?
Remember you're my teacher and a lot depends on how you handle my heart and
soul?
Who strains at a nat but swallows a camel?
sensi:
Okay...Jesus (Ike) Are you telling me that I worry over pesty little things
and they burden my soul and to give these little burdens to you and you'll
Jesus..(Ike)will comfort me?
Or.....Am I a burden to God by your idea that my soul is less worthy than
yours?
Remember you're the teacher and how you handle my heart, mind and soul
depends a lot on what you see in yourself.
Etc. etc. etc.
Every one of these statements means "stupid, stupid, and stupid."
sensi:
I beg your pardon.. Jesus (IKE). You were only shouting obscenities. You've
not told me one thing about yourself or showed me that you cared enough to
save me from my own transgressions.
I don't have much faith in your calling people stupid.It's not the way
Christ.
Ike
--
www.eickleberrybooks.com
******************************
The Tree of Life (from "The Character Map")
The Beloved
Faith Hope
Righteousness Judgment Compassion
Courage Integrity Diligence Grace
Discipline of Thought Service Desire Decision and Belief
Glory Honor Power Wisdom Riches Blessing Strength w/Thanksgiving
He Who Loves
******************************
Remove X from address to reply
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| User: "H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." |
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| Title: Re: If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
16 Jul 2006 12:25:23 AM |
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"sensi" <sensi4sight@home.net> wrote in message
news:Wa6dnYX2xaSLhCTZnZ2dnUVZ_oKdnZ2d@pghconnect.com...
[her usual rambling nonsense]
Forget it. As usual, your pointless drivel leads nowhere.
But who would expect more?
You and that other twit were goofing around with the Teacher's prophecy of
Ecclesiastes 3 and totally missed the point, which is that everything
proceeds from and returns to the same God, in its due course, and in its
proper measure.
Living and dying, growing and reaping, unity and division, creating and
destroying, sorrow and joy, prosperity and poverty, gain and loss, silence
and roaring, hate and love, war and peace, there is a time for every single
one of them in everyone's life, because every one of them is dictated by the
same God.
So continue to ramble in your feminine-minded goofiness, but know that you
and God have nothing in common, and you don't know one another.
And that makes you the enemy of God, and the believers.
Ike
--
www.eickleberrybooks.com
******************************
The Tree of Life (from "The Character Map")
The Beloved
Faith Hope
Righteousness Judgment Compassion
Courage Integrity Diligence Grace
Discipline of Thought Service Desire Decision and Belief
Glory Honor Power Wisdom Riches Blessing Strength w/Thanksgiving
He Who Loves
******************************
Remove X from address to reply
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| User: "sensi" |
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| Title: Re: If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
16 Jul 2006 10:42:55 AM |
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"H.E. Eickleberry, Jr." <Yeickleberrybooks@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:meOdnbvynfJZUCTZnZ2dnUVZ_tGdnZ2d@comcast.com...
"sensi" <sensi4sight@home.net> wrote in message
news:Wa6dnYX2xaSLhCTZnZ2dnUVZ_oKdnZ2d@pghconnect.com...
[her usual rambling nonsense]
Forget it. As usual, your pointless drivel leads nowhere.
But who would expect more?
You and that other twit were goofing around with the Teacher's prophecy of
Ecclesiastes 3 and totally missed the point, which is that everything
proceeds from and returns to the same God, in its due course, and in its
proper measure.
Living and dying, growing and reaping, unity and division, creating and
destroying, sorrow and joy, prosperity and poverty, gain and loss, silence
and roaring, hate and love, war and peace, there is a time for every
single one of them in everyone's life, because every one of them is
dictated by the same God.
So continue to ramble in your feminine-minded goofiness, but know that you
and God have nothing in common, and you don't know one another.
And that makes you the enemy of God, and the believers.
sensi:
Would you like to see my male aggressive chauvenist side? I can act like you
but I'd rather just watch you act like a pompous ***** idiot.
..
Ike
--
www.eickleberrybooks.com
******************************
The Tree of Life (from "The Character Map")
The Beloved
Faith Hope
Righteousness Judgment Compassion
Courage Integrity Diligence Grace
Discipline of Thought Service Desire Decision and Belief
Glory Honor Power Wisdom Riches Blessing Strength w/Thanksgiving
He Who Loves
******************************
Remove X from address to reply
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| User: "Wide Eyed in Wonder" |
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| Title: Re: If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
14 Jul 2006 09:29:40 AM |
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wrote:
No, your argument is just profoundly stupid. First you explain about
people deciding for themselves. I despise fundamentalists and I could
not care less what you decide for yourself. You can feel free to decide
to burn yourself alive in a fire, jump off a bridge, or just put a gun
in your mouth and pull the trigger.
But as you know, fundamentalists have zero intention of deciding
anything for themselves nor is it even an issue they think about.
Fundamentalists think about making decisions for OTHER PEOPLE.
Their idiot fallacious scam works like this: "I have freedom of
religion. Well, my religion says that you are my slave. If you refuse
to be my slave then you are denying me my freedom of religion."
As you said, feel free to decide anything you want for 'yourself'.
However, at the point where your decisions for yourself are deciding
that I become your servant and obey you then you will have a problem.
I certainly in no way am suggesting that other people do as I do. Other
people have no chance of doing as I do. I can ignore the decisions of
other people because I am more intelligent than other people. That does
not mean that stupid people should start telling everyone else how to
live their lives. Your post proves all of this. Stupid people spew
forth fallacious nonsense and think it is logical argument; it is not.
Lastly, I would not bother telling other people what to do. Stupid
people never listen anyway. They only get angry and want to murder
people smarter than they are. Do anything you want to yourself. I won't
be forced to kill you for it until you try and force your stupidity on
me.
If everyone decides for themselves, Christians can decide for
themselves what is best for them. If you are free to chose to believe
God and believe everyone can make that choice, I shouldn't find you
attacking believers for their choice of faith on these groups, right?
After all, no one on these groups is forcing you to believe their way,
right? If you say that simply speaking up about your choice is wrong,
I shouldn't find you preaching atheist views either...correct?
Ken Clifton
http://www.lulu.com/writingken
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| User: "Bob LeChevalier" |
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| Title: Re: If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
14 Jul 2006 01:09:03 PM |
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"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <writingken@yahoo.com> wrote:
If everyone decides for themselves, Christians can decide for
themselves what is best for them.
Yep.
If you are free to chose to believe
God and believe everyone can make that choice, I shouldn't find you
attacking believers for their choice of faith on these groups, right?
No one attacks you for your choice of faith. People attack you
because you post nonsense.
lojbab
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
14 Jul 2006 09:42:30 AM |
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Wide Eyed in Wonder wrote: (my translation)
Christians can decide for themselves what is best for them therefore I
shouldn't find you attacking believers for their choice of faith. If
you say that Christian preaching is wrong then I shouldn't find you
preaching atheist views either...correct?
This part, Christians can decide for themselves what is best for them
therefore I shouldn't find you attacking believers for their choice of
faith, amounts to a Non Sequitur ("It does not follow") fallacy. This
is the simple fallacy of stating, as a conclusion, something that does
not strictly follow from the premises. For example, "Racism is wrong.
Therefore, we need affirmative action."
So, that while you have the right to make decisions for yourself, no
that does not make you immune to criticism. I do not have the space to
explain all the reasons why. Freedom of Speech is one main reason.
Also, I am an expert on the Christian religion because I had to study
it under World History. It's not part of the Christian religion to
exist in a criticism free environment. Jesus was an avid debater. But
then again, he could win his debates. You are obligated to render unto
Caesar. That means you are obligated to exist in an external secular
state of government and society with its own irreligious facets.
This part, If you say that Christian preaching is wrong then I
shouldn't find you preaching atheist views either...correct? is another
matter. I do not say you are forbidden to speak your own views. I just
won't be obligated to obey your views. But, as a 'what if', if
someone told you that it was wrong to speak your mind and then spoke
their own mind, then they would be in the wrong. The term for that is a
hypocrite; the world has many of these.
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| User: "The Watch Dog" |
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| Title: Re: If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
14 Jul 2006 12:46:11 PM |
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Oh, look, everybody, Ken's started a new topic - or rather, returned to
an old one, misrepresenting and demonizing liberals.
Ken, what part of "Judge not, lest you be judged?" do you not
understand? Or is it that, once you're born again, you can ignored the
words Jesus says in the Bible?
Of course, changing the subject with a barrage of new topics is what
Ken does when he can't answer any of the obvious questions about his
previous posts. Recently Ken wrote (without, as far as I could tell, a
hint of irony):
And, as usual, you show that you cannot answer a straight question.
There's a word for that, you know.
Let's hold him to it. Ken, pleaseanswer the questions you've already
been asked. If you don't, "there's a word for that, you know."
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| User: "Fool For Christ" |
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| Title: Re: If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
16 Jul 2006 05:30:35 PM |
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The Watch Dog wrote:
Oh, look, everybody, Ken's started a new topic - or rather, returned to
an old one, misrepresenting and demonizing liberals.
Ken, what part of "Judge not, lest you be judged?" do you not
understand? Or is it that, once you're born again, you can ignored the
words Jesus says in the Bible?
Of course, changing the subject with a barrage of new topics is what
Ken does when he can't answer any of the obvious questions about his
previous posts. Recently Ken wrote (without, as far as I could tell, a
hint of irony):
And, as usual, you show that you cannot answer a straight question.
There's a word for that, you know.
Let's hold him to it. Ken, pleaseanswer the questions you've already
been asked. If you don't, "there's a word for that, you know."
Aparently, the word for me is "dangerous," since my words are such a
threat to the left to garner such attack. I choose what I answer and
what I don't. Right now, not answering a fool for his folly is rather
fun.
Ken Clifton
http://www.lulu.com/writingken
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| User: "The Watch Dog" |
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| Title: Re: If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
16 Jul 2006 11:58:36 PM |
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Fool For Christ wrote:
The Watch Dog wrote:
Oh, look, everybody, Ken's started a new topic - or rather, returned to
an old one, misrepresenting and demonizing liberals.
Ken, what part of "Judge not, lest you be judged?" do you not
understand? Or is it that, once you're born again, you can ignored the
words Jesus says in the Bible?
Of course, changing the subject with a barrage of new topics is what
Ken does when he can't answer any of the obvious questions about his
previous posts. Recently Ken wrote (without, as far as I could tell, a
hint of irony):
And, as usual, you show that you cannot answer a straight question.
There's a word for that, you know.
Let's hold him to it. Ken, pleaseanswer the questions you've already
been asked. If you don't, "there's a word for that, you know."
Aparently, the word for me is "dangerous," since my words are such a
threat to the left to garner such attack. I choose what I answer and
what I don't. Right now, not answering a fool for his folly is rather
fun.
What a complete and utter hypocrite and coward you are. You insult
other people for not answering your questions, but take smug pleasure
in not answering questions posed to you.
It is absolutely obvious that you are unable to answer the most basic
and obvious questions suggested by your posts. Now you've made up a new
excuse for this failing - it's "fun."
A person doesn't have to be on the "left" or the "right" to see what
you are: intellectually dishonest. Somebody like C. S. Lewis, who
actually tried to answer the questions that accompanied his faith,
would be ashamed to recognize you as a co-religionist.
As for referring to me as a "fool" and my questions as "folly" - well,
if that's the only substitute you have for actually answering, then I
guess there isn't much thought behind your dogma.
At one time I thought that, even though we disagree, you were willing
to engage in dicsussion. But now I see you are a typical hit-and-run
troll who treats other people with contempt and calls it "fun." And
this is what you call "Christianity"! I suppose that, once you're Born
Again, you think the normal rules of decent human interaction just
don't apply....
You are not dangerous to me, but you ARE dangerous to anyone who buys
into your incessant falsehoods and poorly-thought-out analogies. I
particularly worry about your children.
.
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| User: "Wide Eyed in Wonder" |
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| Title: Re: If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
17 Jul 2006 07:04:46 AM |
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The Watch Dog wrote:
Fool For Christ wrote:
The Watch Dog wrote:
Oh, look, everybody, Ken's started a new topic - or rather, returned to
an old one, misrepresenting and demonizing liberals.
Ken, what part of "Judge not, lest you be judged?" do you not
understand? Or is it that, once you're born again, you can ignored the
words Jesus says in the Bible?
Of course, changing the subject with a barrage of new topics is what
Ken does when he can't answer any of the obvious questions about his
previous posts. Recently Ken wrote (without, as far as I could tell, a
hint of irony):
And, as usual, you show that you cannot answer a straight question.
There's a word for that, you know.
Let's hold him to it. Ken, pleaseanswer the questions you've already
been asked. If you don't, "there's a word for that, you know."
Aparently, the word for me is "dangerous," since my words are such a
threat to the left to garner such attack. I choose what I answer and
what I don't. Right now, not answering a fool for his folly is rather
fun.
What a complete and utter hypocrite and coward you are. You insult
other people for not answering your questions, but take smug pleasure
in not answering questions posed to you.
It is absolutely obvious that you are unable to answer the most basic
and obvious questions suggested by your posts. Now you've made up a new
excuse for this failing - it's "fun."
A person doesn't have to be on the "left" or the "right" to see what
you are: intellectually dishonest. Somebody like C. S. Lewis, who
actually tried to answer the questions that accompanied his faith,
would be ashamed to recognize you as a co-religionist.
As for referring to me as a "fool" and my questions as "folly" - well,
if that's the only substitute you have for actually answering, then I
guess there isn't much thought behind your dogma.
At one time I thought that, even though we disagree, you were willing
to engage in dicsussion. But now I see you are a typical hit-and-run
troll who treats other people with contempt and calls it "fun." And
this is what you call "Christianity"! I suppose that, once you're Born
Again, you think the normal rules of decent human interaction just
don't apply....
You are not dangerous to me, but you ARE dangerous to anyone who buys
into your incessant falsehoods and poorly-thought-out analogies. I
particularly worry about your children.
So? If I don't respect your position...I don't...do you think I care
what you think of me? Do you think it would change my position, except
maybe strengthen it as a martyr?
Ken Clifton
http://www.lulu.com/writingken
.
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| User: "Bob LeChevalier" |
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| Title: Re: If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
17 Jul 2006 01:33:54 PM |
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"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kands00@hotmail.com> wrote:
So? If I don't respect your position...I don't...do you think I care
what you think of me?
Do you think we care what you think about what we think about you?
Do you think it would change my position,
No. Someone who is intelligent is always seeking new information and
ideas which might change their opinions, but you betray no particular
evidence of such intelligence.
except maybe strengthen it as a martyr?
Unless someone kills you for your belief, you aren't a martyr. No one
is even threatening to kill you, so martyrdom should not even be in
your consideration. Nor ours.
lojbab
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| User: "Cary Kittrell" |
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| Title: Re: If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
17 Jul 2006 12:55:41 PM |
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In article <1153137886.376346.154800@m79g2000cwm.googlegroups.com> "Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kands00@hotmail.com> writes:
The Watch Dog wrote:
{...}
At one time I thought that, even though we disagree, you were willing
to engage in dicsussion. But now I see you are a typical hit-and-run
troll who treats other people with contempt and calls it "fun." And
this is what you call "Christianity"! I suppose that, once you're Born
Again, you think the normal rules of decent human interaction just
don't apply....
You are not dangerous to me, but you ARE dangerous to anyone who buys
into your incessant falsehoods and poorly-thought-out analogies. I
particularly worry about your children.
So? If I don't respect your position...I don't...do you think I care
what you think of me? Do you think it would change my position, except
maybe strengthen it as a martyr?
Well, my own eyes are now wide in wonder...
A "martyr"? Oh my sweet Bast, Ken Clifton as a MARTYR?
Sonny, I've had relatives who were missionaries to China.
Just take my word for this: coming on to Usenet,
insulting, provoking, lying and loudly parading ignorance --
and then getting your lumps for it -- does not qualify you
as a "martyr".
As T.S. Eliot showed about Becket, martyrdom sought is not martyrdom.
-- cary
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| User: "Wide Eyed in Wonder" |
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| Title: Re: If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
17 Jul 2006 02:54:22 PM |
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Cary Kittrell wrote:
In article <1153137886.376346.154800@m79g2000cwm.googlegroups.com> "Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kands00@hotmail.com> writes:
The Watch Dog wrote:
{...}
At one time I thought that, even though we disagree, you were willing
to engage in dicsussion. But now I see you are a typical hit-and-run
troll who treats other people with contempt and calls it "fun." And
this is what you call "Christianity"! I suppose that, once you're Born
Again, you think the normal rules of decent human interaction just
don't apply....
You are not dangerous to me, but you ARE dangerous to anyone who buys
into your incessant falsehoods and poorly-thought-out analogies. I
particularly worry about your children.
So? If I don't respect your position...I don't...do you think I care
what you think of me? Do you think it would change my position, except
maybe strengthen it as a martyr?
Well, my own eyes are now wide in wonder...
A "martyr"? Oh my sweet Bast, Ken Clifton as a MARTYR?
Sonny, I've had relatives who were missionaries to China.
Just take my word for this: coming on to Usenet,
insulting, provoking, lying and loudly parading ignorance --
and then getting your lumps for it -- does not qualify you
as a "martyr".
As T.S. Eliot showed about Becket, martyrdom sought is not martyrdom.
The point, which apparently the three of you cannot grasp, is that I
don't care what you think of me one bit. The more you argue, the more
I feel the desire to respond....isn't that how wars start. So, if you
fail to be a word pacifist, expect to keep hearing from me.
I'm going to post what I feel is right, whether it is received or not,
whether you respond or not. So, reply if you wish. You're just
wasting your time.
Ken Clifton
http://www.lulu.com/writingken
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| User: "Bob LeChevalier" |
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| Title: Re: If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
18 Jul 2006 03:21:18 AM |
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"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kands00@hotmail.com> wrote:
The point, which apparently the three of you cannot grasp, is that I
don't care what you think of me one bit.
We grasp that entirely, and do not care what you care about.
The more you argue, the more
I feel the desire to respond....isn't that how wars start.
No. Nations generally have more maturity than that. That is how
children act on the playground, when they go "NAA, NANA, NAA, NAA"
So, if you fail to be a word pacifist, expect to keep hearing from me.
No skin of our noses. You are the one who is embarrassing yourself.
I'm going to post what I feel is right, whether it is received or not,
whether you respond or not. So, reply if you wish. You're just
wasting your time.
in other words "NAA, NANA, NAA, NAA"
lojbab
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| User: "ZenIsWhen" |
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| Title: Re: If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
20 Jul 2006 02:24:14 AM |
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"Bob LeChevalier" <lojbab@lojban.org> wrote in message
news:aa6pb29v4t1ift371udfnjs5v0emovj14l@4ax.com...
"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kands00@hotmail.com> wrote:
The point, which apparently the three of you cannot grasp, is that I
don't care what you think of me one bit.
We grasp that entirely, and do not care what you care about.
The more you argue, the more
I feel the desire to respond....isn't that how wars start.
No. Nations generally have more maturity than that. That is how
children act on the playground, when they go "NAA, NANA, NAA, NAA"
So, if you fail to be a word pacifist, expect to keep hearing from me.
No skin of our noses. You are the one who is embarrassing yourself.
I'm going to post what I feel is right, whether it is received or not,
whether you respond or not. So, reply if you wish. You're just
wasting your time.
As opposed to what others KNOW is right!
in other words "NAA, NANA, NAA, NAA"
lojbab
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| User: "Wide Eyed in Wonder" |
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| Title: Re: If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
18 Jul 2006 07:28:26 AM |
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Bob LeChevalier wrote:
"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kands00@hotmail.com> wrote:
The point, which apparently the three of you cannot grasp, is that I
don't care what you think of me one bit.
We grasp that entirely, and do not care what you care about.
The more you argue, the more
I feel the desire to respond....isn't that how wars start.
No. Nations generally have more maturity than that. That is how
children act on the playground, when they go "NAA, NANA, NAA, NAA"
So, if you fail to be a word pacifist, expect to keep hearing from me.
No skin of our noses. You are the one who is embarrassing yourself.
I'm going to post what I feel is right, whether it is received or not,
whether you respond or not. So, reply if you wish. You're just
wasting your time.
in other words "NAA, NANA, NAA, NAA"
lojbab
Very well...naa naa naa, if anyone cares what you think...I don't. So,
here's a thought. Who's the least mature, the one who has my attitude
or the one that continues to argue with them?
Ken Clifton
http://www.lulu.com/writingken
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| User: "Bob LeChevalier" |
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| Title: Re: If everyone decides right and wrong for self, fundamentalists are right! |
18 Jul 2006 12:32:53 PM |
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"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kands00@hotmail.com> wrote:
Very well...naa naa naa, if anyone cares what you think...I don't. So,
here's a thought. Who's the least mature, the one who has my attitude
or the one that continues to argue with them?
The one who has that attitude is immature.
No one bothers to argue with you. We just make fun of you. Making
fun of someone isn't especially mature, butit can be fun. Most of us
attempt to do so in a manner that enhances the Usenet experience for
other readers, by bringing in interesting and useful facts. As such,
you and your noise become irrelevant, merely serving as a useful
vehicle for mature dialog, education, and humor.
lojbab
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