Impeachment is Now Real.



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Topic: Politics > Politics-USA
User: "Harry Hope"
Date: 28 Dec 2005 05:53:12 PM
Object: Impeachment is Now Real.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/martin-garbus/impeachment-is-now-real_b_12972.html
12.28.2005
Impeachment is Now Real
By Martin Garbus
An hour after the New York Times described Bush’s illegal surveillance
program, I wrote on the Huffington Post that Bush had committed a
crime, a "High Crime," and should be impeached.
Was there then enough evidence to justify the beginning of an attempt
to impeach the President?
No.
Did the President have a good defense that he relied on Gonzalez,
Ashcroft and the best lawyers in the country (in the Solicitor
General’s and Department of Justice’s offices)?
Yes.
Would any significant number of Americans of Congressmen then support
such a process?
No.
Given all that, would the turmoil and consequential turmoil have
justified the start of that brutal process?
No.
But that has all changed.
Because we shall soon see the consequences of those warrantless
searches, the consequences of the government’s five years of secrecy,
and even the citizens of the "Red States" will be outraged.
Firstly, the warrantless taps will infect hundreds of "terrorist" and
criminal cases throughout the country.
Not only future cases, but past and present cases, even if there were
convictions or plea bargains after the survellance started.
The defendants in "terrorist" and other infected criminal cases, the
Court must find, must get access to everything, or very close to
everything to make sure they were never improperly surveilled.
The Bush Administration, in these cases will refuse, as did the Nixon
administration, to divulge information on national security grounds.
Many alleged critical cases must then be dismissed.
It will include Organized Crime and drug cases.
The entire criminal process will be brought to a standstill.
Cases that should take six months to a year, will take three times as
long, as motions go up and down the appellate ladder -- as federal
judges trial disagree with each other.
Appellate Courts will disagree on issues so novel and so important
that the Supreme Court will look at them.
Secondly, there will be an endless amounts of civil suits, that we can
see will result in substantial damage awards.
Commentators claimed there cannot be suits because no one has standing
to challenge the surveillance.
They are wrong.
They do not remember the history of the Palmer Raids in the 1920’s,
the surveillance in the Sixties and Seventies.
The future will show both the enormous information the new technology
has gathered but also the dishonest minimization of the extent of the
surveillance.
That minimization is standard operating procedure for governments,
whether they be run by Democrats or Republicans.
Thirdly, and most importantly, it is safe to preduct there will be
coverups.
This administration is not known for its candor.
The coverup starts by trying to get away with the vauge and
meaningless defenses.
Both Nixon and Clinton tried that.
When that doesn’t work, the coverup will be based on a foundation of
small lies.
Both Nixon and Clinton tried that.
We do not yet know what the FISA judges already fear -- that they have
been not just ignored by the executive but misused.
The public shall also learn about the FISA judges’ misuse of the FISA
courts and their warrants.
The courts were created to permit eavesdropping and electronic
surveillance, not physical break-ins.
But the facts will show that the Bush administration, with the
knowledge, and at times, the consent of, the FISA judges, conducted
illegal physical break-ins - break-ins that to this day, the involved
person, is unaware of.
Were the results of these "terrorist" break-ins then given to criminal
authorities to start unrelated prosecutions?
Of course.
The American public will also learn what this Administration has thus
far successfully hidden.
When Bush came into office, he signed an Exeutive Order making all of
his, and his father’s, papers privileged.
The order, extending 12 years out, also says if the President is
incapacitated, then a third person can execute the privilege.
This means anybody -- a wife, a family lawyer, a child.
The order also says the Vice President’s papers are privileged.
It is an extraordinary Executive Order -- this has never been anything
like this.
No one ever suggested a Vice President has executive privilege.
If we do not find out what they are hiding, we will see witholding on
a scale never before seen.
He will no longer be able to use 9/11 and the war on terror as an
excuse.
It will confirm the fact that illegality and secrecy existed long
before 9/11, that it started as soon as Bush-Cheney-Rumsfield got into
office.
It will show deliberate attempts to avoid any judicial or legislative
oversight of the illegal use of executive privilege.
Impeachment procedures will come not because of wrongdoing but because
of the discovery of lies.
Both Nixon and Clinton faced impeachments because they lied.
It was inconceivable before the Nixon and Clinton impeachment
procedures began that there could be, or would be a country or Senate
that would be responsive to it.
In the Nixon case, it spiraled from a petty break-in -- in Clinton’s
case from a petty sexual act.
But what Bush has done, and will do, to protect himself is not petty.
It goes to the heart of the government.
He already has a history of misleading the public on the searches
conducted thus far.
As he and his colleagues seek to minimize the vast amount of data
collection, the lies will necessarily expand to cover the wrongdoing.
Bush can be brought down.
__________________________________________________________
Harry
.

User: "whofan"

Title: Re: Impeachment is Now Real. 28 Dec 2005 07:45:14 PM
Harry Hope wrote:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/martin-garbus/impeachment-is-now-real_b_12972.html

12.28.2005

Impeachment is Now Real

By Ma

<Rest of silliness snipped>
Yep...since 2000 we've been hearing that "impeachment is now
real".
Demmies are still bitter that Clinton was actually impeached.
They'll do *ANYTHING*, including throwing the United States
under the bus if there's a chance they will get to bash Bush,
and claim that the latest, greatest issue makes "impeachment
now real".
Bush isn't going to be impeached. In fact, Bush's popularity
poll numbers will increase in-part due to the dispicable
manner in which the demmies are whining about the wire-tap
thing. You can bank on it!!!
BTW - in 3 or 4 weeks there will be a new issue that the
demmies will hang their hat on and claim that new issue is
making "impeachment is now real". Sounds like a broken
record.
.

User: "mortimer"

Title: Re: Impeachment is Now Real. 28 Dec 2005 11:14:37 PM
If the New York Times had released the report before Nov 2, 2004 Bush
would not have been elected!!
.
User: "ouroboros rex"

Title: Re: Impeachment is Now Real. 29 Dec 2005 10:57:15 AM
"mortimer" <@glimmer.net> wrote in message
news:_gKsf.3996$Z95.1328@fe04.lga...

If the New York Times had released the report before Nov 2, 2004 Bush
would not have been elected!!

But, but, but, the NYT is LIBERAL!!!!!!!!!! rofl
.


User: "A Veteran for Peace"

Title: Re: Impeachment is Now Real. 28 Dec 2005 06:26:00 PM
In article <1c96r1l4a5ahjr4g2kii1paot3ah1m3smi@4ax.com>,
Harry Hope <rivrvu@ix.netcom.com> wrote:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/martin-garbus/impeachment-is-now-real_b_12972.ht
ml

12.28.2005

Impeachment is Now Real

By Martin Garbus


An hour after the New York Times described Bush’s illegal surveillance
program, I wrote on the Huffington Post that Bush had committed a
crime, a "High Crime," and should be impeached.

Was there then enough evidence to justify the beginning of an attempt
to impeach the President?

No.

Did the President have a good defense that he relied on Gonzalez,
Ashcroft and the best lawyers in the country (in the Solicitor
General’s and Department of Justice’s offices)?

Yes.

Would any significant number of Americans of Congressmen then support
such a process?

No.

Given all that, would the turmoil and consequential turmoil have
justified the start of that brutal process?

No.

But that has all changed.

Because we shall soon see the consequences of those warrantless
searches, the consequences of the government’s five years of secrecy,
and even the citizens of the "Red States" will be outraged.

Firstly, the warrantless taps will infect hundreds of "terrorist" and
criminal cases throughout the country.

Not only future cases, but past and present cases, even if there were
convictions or plea bargains after the survellance started.

The defendants in "terrorist" and other infected criminal cases, the
Court must find, must get access to everything, or very close to
everything to make sure they were never improperly surveilled.

The Bush Administration, in these cases will refuse, as did the Nixon
administration, to divulge information on national security grounds.

Many alleged critical cases must then be dismissed.

It will include Organized Crime and drug cases.

The entire criminal process will be brought to a standstill.

Cases that should take six months to a year, will take three times as
long, as motions go up and down the appellate ladder -- as federal
judges trial disagree with each other.

Appellate Courts will disagree on issues so novel and so important
that the Supreme Court will look at them.

Secondly, there will be an endless amounts of civil suits, that we can
see will result in substantial damage awards.

Commentators claimed there cannot be suits because no one has standing
to challenge the surveillance.

They are wrong.

They do not remember the history of the Palmer Raids in the 1920’s,
the surveillance in the Sixties and Seventies.

The future will show both the enormous information the new technology
has gathered but also the dishonest minimization of the extent of the
surveillance.

That minimization is standard operating procedure for governments,
whether they be run by Democrats or Republicans.

Thirdly, and most importantly, it is safe to preduct there will be
coverups.

This administration is not known for its candor.

The coverup starts by trying to get away with the vauge and
meaningless defenses.

Both Nixon and Clinton tried that.

When that doesn’t work, the coverup will be based on a foundation of
small lies.

Both Nixon and Clinton tried that.

We do not yet know what the FISA judges already fear -- that they have
been not just ignored by the executive but misused.

The public shall also learn about the FISA judges’ misuse of the FISA
courts and their warrants.

The courts were created to permit eavesdropping and electronic
surveillance, not physical break-ins.

But the facts will show that the Bush administration, with the
knowledge, and at times, the consent of, the FISA judges, conducted
illegal physical break-ins - break-ins that to this day, the involved
person, is unaware of.

Were the results of these "terrorist" break-ins then given to criminal
authorities to start unrelated prosecutions?

Of course.

The American public will also learn what this Administration has thus
far successfully hidden.

When Bush came into office, he signed an Exeutive Order making all of
his, and his father’s, papers privileged.

The order, extending 12 years out, also says if the President is
incapacitated, then a third person can execute the privilege.

This means anybody -- a wife, a family lawyer, a child.

The order also says the Vice President’s papers are privileged.

It is an extraordinary Executive Order -- this has never been anything
like this.

No one ever suggested a Vice President has executive privilege.

If we do not find out what they are hiding, we will see witholding on
a scale never before seen.

He will no longer be able to use 9/11 and the war on terror as an
excuse.

It will confirm the fact that illegality and secrecy existed long
before 9/11, that it started as soon as Bush-Cheney-Rumsfield got into
office.

It will show deliberate attempts to avoid any judicial or legislative
oversight of the illegal use of executive privilege.

Impeachment procedures will come not because of wrongdoing but because
of the discovery of lies.

Both Nixon and Clinton faced impeachments because they lied.

It was inconceivable before the Nixon and Clinton impeachment
procedures began that there could be, or would be a country or Senate
that would be responsive to it.

In the Nixon case, it spiraled from a petty break-in -- in Clinton’s
case from a petty sexual act.

But what Bush has done, and will do, to protect himself is not petty.

It goes to the heart of the government.

He already has a history of misleading the public on the searches
conducted thus far.

As he and his colleagues seek to minimize the vast amount of data
collection, the lies will necessarily expand to cover the wrongdoing.

Bush can be brought down.

__________________________________________________________


Harry

Well, Progress is being made.
--
Impeach Bush ! a noble cause
Operation Iraqi Liberation = O.I.L.
.

User: "Geno1234"

Title: Re: Impeachment is Now Real. 28 Dec 2005 06:44:55 PM
Well when Congress comes back from their December break on Jan. 5th let us
hope that they were lesening to what the voters are saying and not sipping
on the egg nog with their corrupt business associates.
"Harry Hope" <rivrvu@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:1c96r1l4a5ahjr4g2kii1paot3ah1m3smi@4ax.com...


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/martin-garbus/impeachment-is-now-real_b_12972.html

12.28.2005

Impeachment is Now Real

By Martin Garbus


An hour after the New York Times described Bush’s illegal surveillance
program, I wrote on the Huffington Post that Bush had committed a
crime, a "High Crime," and should be impeached.

Was there then enough evidence to justify the beginning of an attempt
to impeach the President?

No.

Did the President have a good defense that he relied on Gonzalez,
Ashcroft and the best lawyers in the country (in the Solicitor
General’s and Department of Justice’s offices)?

Yes.

Would any significant number of Americans of Congressmen then support
such a process?

No.

Given all that, would the turmoil and consequential turmoil have
justified the start of that brutal process?

No.

But that has all changed.

Because we shall soon see the consequences of those warrantless
searches, the consequences of the government’s five years of secrecy,
and even the citizens of the "Red States" will be outraged.

Firstly, the warrantless taps will infect hundreds of "terrorist" and
criminal cases throughout the country.

Not only future cases, but past and present cases, even if there were
convictions or plea bargains after the survellance started.

The defendants in "terrorist" and other infected criminal cases, the
Court must find, must get access to everything, or very close to
everything to make sure they were never improperly surveilled.

The Bush Administration, in these cases will refuse, as did the Nixon
administration, to divulge information on national security grounds.

Many alleged critical cases must then be dismissed.

It will include Organized Crime and drug cases.

The entire criminal process will be brought to a standstill.

Cases that should take six months to a year, will take three times as
long, as motions go up and down the appellate ladder -- as federal
judges trial disagree with each other.

Appellate Courts will disagree on issues so novel and so important
that the Supreme Court will look at them.

Secondly, there will be an endless amounts of civil suits, that we can
see will result in substantial damage awards.

Commentators claimed there cannot be suits because no one has standing
to challenge the surveillance.

They are wrong.

They do not remember the history of the Palmer Raids in the 1920’s,
the surveillance in the Sixties and Seventies.

The future will show both the enormous information the new technology
has gathered but also the dishonest minimization of the extent of the
surveillance.

That minimization is standard operating procedure for governments,
whether they be run by Democrats or Republicans.

Thirdly, and most importantly, it is safe to preduct there will be
coverups.

This administration is not known for its candor.

The coverup starts by trying to get away with the vauge and
meaningless defenses.

Both Nixon and Clinton tried that.

When that doesn’t work, the coverup will be based on a foundation of
small lies.

Both Nixon and Clinton tried that.

We do not yet know what the FISA judges already fear -- that they have
been not just ignored by the executive but misused.

The public shall also learn about the FISA judges’ misuse of the FISA
courts and their warrants.

The courts were created to permit eavesdropping and electronic
surveillance, not physical break-ins.

But the facts will show that the Bush administration, with the
knowledge, and at times, the consent of, the FISA judges, conducted
illegal physical break-ins - break-ins that to this day, the involved
person, is unaware of.

Were the results of these "terrorist" break-ins then given to criminal
authorities to start unrelated prosecutions?

Of course.

The American public will also learn what this Administration has thus
far successfully hidden.

When Bush came into office, he signed an Exeutive Order making all of
his, and his father’s, papers privileged.

The order, extending 12 years out, also says if the President is
incapacitated, then a third person can execute the privilege.

This means anybody -- a wife, a family lawyer, a child.

The order also says the Vice President’s papers are privileged.

It is an extraordinary Executive Order -- this has never been anything
like this.

No one ever suggested a Vice President has executive privilege.

If we do not find out what they are hiding, we will see witholding on
a scale never before seen.

He will no longer be able to use 9/11 and the war on terror as an
excuse.

It will confirm the fact that illegality and secrecy existed long
before 9/11, that it started as soon as Bush-Cheney-Rumsfield got into
office.

It will show deliberate attempts to avoid any judicial or legislative
oversight of the illegal use of executive privilege.

Impeachment procedures will come not because of wrongdoing but because
of the discovery of lies.

Both Nixon and Clinton faced impeachments because they lied.

It was inconceivable before the Nixon and Clinton impeachment
procedures began that there could be, or would be a country or Senate
that would be responsive to it.

In the Nixon case, it spiraled from a petty break-in -- in Clinton’s
case from a petty sexual act.

But what Bush has done, and will do, to protect himself is not petty.

It goes to the heart of the government.

He already has a history of misleading the public on the searches
conducted thus far.

As he and his colleagues seek to minimize the vast amount of data
collection, the lies will necessarily expand to cover the wrongdoing.

Bush can be brought down.

__________________________________________________________


Harry

.
User: "Jim E"

Title: Re: Impeachment is Now Real. 28 Dec 2005 07:59:52 PM
"Geno1234" <francis1234@fuse.net> wrote in message
news:a1962$43b3318b$d8442a15$31126@FUSE.NET...

Well when Congress comes back from their December break on Jan. 5th let us
hope that they were lesening to what the voters are saying and not sipping
on the egg nog with their corrupt business associates.

There has been no crime, and there can be no impeachment by a powerless
minority that whines incessantly, and accomplishes nothing.
You loons couldn't impeach the basement rats.
Jim E
.
User: "The Pretzel"

Title: Re: Impeachment is Now Real. 29 Dec 2005 07:09:15 PM
--
Freedom may not be free but it shouldn't be a rip-off.
"Jim E" <YD641387@SEA.net> wrote in message
news:41gu8oF1eh2e2U1@individual.net...


"Geno1234" <francis1234@fuse.net> wrote in message
news:a1962$43b3318b$d8442a15$31126@FUSE.NET...

Well when Congress comes back from their December break on Jan. 5th let us
hope that they were lesening to what the voters are saying and not sipping
on the egg nog with their corrupt business associates.



There has been no crime,

Says a criminal.

and there can be no impeachment by a powerless
minority that whines incessantly, and accomplishes nothing.
You loons couldn't impeach the basement rats.

Is that a quote from Stalin or Hitler?
.
User: "Jim E"

Title: Re: Impeachment is Now Real. 29 Dec 2005 07:27:52 PM
"The Pretzel" <rold_gold@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:%M%sf.6896$pE4.5369@tornado.socal.rr.com...



--
Freedom may not be free but it shouldn't be a rip-off.
"Jim E" <YD641387@SEA.net> wrote in message
news:41gu8oF1eh2e2U1@individual.net...


"Geno1234" <francis1234@fuse.net> wrote in message
news:a1962$43b3318b$d8442a15$31126@FUSE.NET...

Well when Congress comes back from their December break on Jan. 5th let
us
hope that they were lesening to what the voters are saying and not
sipping
on the egg nog with their corrupt business associates.



There has been no crime,

Says a criminal.

and there can be no impeachment by a powerless
minority that whines incessantly, and accomplishes nothing.
You loons couldn't impeach the basement rats.


Is that a quote from Stalin or Hitler?


Do you see any quotation marks ?
Another blast of insults from a loon with nothing to say.
Jim E
.
User: "gaffo"

Title: Re: Impeachment is Now Real. 29 Dec 2005 11:13:16 PM
Jim E wrote:

"The Pretzel" <rold_gold@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:%M%sf.6896$pE4.5369@tornado.socal.rr.com...


--
Freedom may not be free but it shouldn't be a rip-off.
"Jim E" <YD641387@SEA.net> wrote in message
news:41gu8oF1eh2e2U1@individual.net...

"Geno1234" <francis1234@fuse.net> wrote in message
news:a1962$43b3318b$d8442a15$31126@FUSE.NET...

Well when Congress comes back from their December break on Jan. 5th let
us
hope that they were lesening to what the voters are saying and not
sipping
on the egg nog with their corrupt business associates.



There has been no crime,


Says a criminal.


and there can be no impeachment by a powerless
minority that whines incessantly, and accomplishes nothing.
You loons couldn't impeach the basement rats.


Is that a quote from Stalin or Hitler?




Do you see any quotation marks ?

"That is the point stupid, when it comes to islamizoid terrorists no one
gives a rats ***** about warrants."
happy now? ..................dickmunch

Another blast of insults from a loon with nothing to say.

Jim E

gee looks just my your hero's quote below!
--
"Citizens who have done nothing wrong will have nothing to fear from
warrentless searches."
--Adolf Hitler
.
User: "Jim E"

Title: Re: Impeachment is Now Real. 30 Dec 2005 10:36:09 AM
"gaffo" <gaffo@usenet.net> wrote in message
news:Ml3tf.3598$UF3.859@newssvr25.news.prodigy.net...

Jim E wrote:

"The Pretzel" <rold_gold@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:%M%sf.6896$pE4.5369@tornado.socal.rr.com...


--
Freedom may not be free but it shouldn't be a rip-off.
"Jim E" <YD641387@SEA.net> wrote in message
news:41gu8oF1eh2e2U1@individual.net...

"Geno1234" <francis1234@fuse.net> wrote in message
news:a1962$43b3318b$d8442a15$31126@FUSE.NET...

Well when Congress comes back from their December break on Jan. 5th let
us
hope that they were lesening to what the voters are saying and not
sipping
on the egg nog with their corrupt business associates.



There has been no crime,


Says a criminal.


and there can be no impeachment by a powerless
minority that whines incessantly, and accomplishes nothing.
You loons couldn't impeach the basement rats.


Is that a quote from Stalin or Hitler?




Do you see any quotation marks ?




"That is the point stupid, when it comes to islamizoid terrorists no one
gives a rats ***** about warrants."


happy now? ..................dickmunch




Another blast of insults from a loon with nothing to say.

Jim E



gee looks just my your hero's quote below!

What would that mean in English?
Jim E
.







  Page 1 of 1

1

 


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