| Topic: |
Politics > Politics-USA |
| User: |
"Anti-Venom" |
| Date: |
06 May 2007 10:29:34 AM |
| Object: |
Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
The mantra of liberals is that everyone can decide right and wrong for
themselves, that no one should tell others they are wrong for their
point of view.
IF this is true, then, liberalism has just justified fundamentalism.
For Fundamentalists are choosing right and wrong for themselves. That
is their point of view, and, according to liberals, they are free to
do so. So, according to liberals, Fundamentalists are right (for
themselves) to believe the Bible to be truth, abortion to be sin,
homosexuality to be wrong, and Jesus to be the Lord of all and savior
of all who will call upon Him to save them.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
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| User: "Roger" |
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| Title: Re: Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
07 May 2007 06:31:52 AM |
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*****.
Christian = Moron
"Anti-Venom" <writingken@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1178465374.633470.301500@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
The mantra of liberals is that everyone can decide right and wrong for
themselves, that no one should tell others they are wrong for their
point of view.
IF this is true, then, liberalism has just justified fundamentalism.
For Fundamentalists are choosing right and wrong for themselves. That
is their point of view, and, according to liberals, they are free to
do so. So, according to liberals, Fundamentalists are right (for
themselves) to believe the Bible to be truth, abortion to be sin,
homosexuality to be wrong, and Jesus to be the Lord of all and savior
of all who will call upon Him to save them.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
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| User: "Witziges Rätsel" |
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| Title: Re: Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
06 May 2007 12:39:24 PM |
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The mantra of liberals is that everyone can decide right and wrong for
themselves,
No it isn't. Whenever a fundy attempts to speak for anyone else
they get it wrong.
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| User: "Christian Dude" |
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| Title: Re: Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
01 Jul 2007 04:07:58 PM |
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Anti-Venom <writingken@yahoo.com> wrote in news:1178465374.633470.301500
@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com:
The mantra of liberals is that everyone can decide right and wrong for
themselves, that no one should tell others they are wrong for their
point of view.
IF this is true, then, liberalism has just justified fundamentalism.
For Fundamentalists are choosing right and wrong for themselves. That
is their point of view, and, according to liberals, they are free to
do so. So, according to liberals, Fundamentalists are right (for
themselves) to believe the Bible to be truth, abortion to be sin,
homosexuality to be wrong, and Jesus to be the Lord of all and savior
of all who will call upon Him to save them.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
Wrong The Liberals believe that Everyone can decide right and wrong and
they have a choice. The Fundamentalist want everyone to be sheep and
blindly follow what they tell them to do.
I guess you haven't heard of Rudy Giuliani he has said he's not against
Abortion and he's a Republican.
Fundamentalists are for telling people what is right or wrong and if you
don't follow what they say they make up crap about you.
Look at Jerry 'Fundamentalist' Falwell the people he went after because
they didn't conform to the fundamentalist beliefs.
What is funny though after he died it came out that he was good friends
with Larry Flynt one of the people he went after.
So some fundies are hypocrites.
Liberals are going to take back the Presidency in 2008.
Neo Con fundy righ wing Republicans are going to lose.
It's the Neo Con Fundy butt kissing republicans who have ruined the
reputation of the U.S. around the world. Because they blindly follow and
believe what their precious George W Bush tells them. Our reputation was
better before Bush stole both elections.
Also lately it's been more corrupt republicans in the U.S. than
democrats.
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| User: "Broderick Crawford" |
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| Title: Re: Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
06 May 2007 11:25:07 AM |
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Anti-Venom wrote:
The mantra of liberals is that everyone can decide right and wrong for
themselves, that no one should tell others they are wrong for their
point of view.
IF this is true, then, liberalism has just justified fundamentalism.
For Fundamentalists are choosing right and wrong for themselves. That
is their point of view, and, according to liberals, they are free to
do so. So, according to liberals, Fundamentalists are right (for
themselves) to believe the Bible to be truth, abortion to be sin,
homosexuality to be wrong, and Jesus to be the Lord of all and savior
of all who will call upon Him to save them.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
Don't worry. Jesus H. Fucking Christ will save the world.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
07 May 2007 09:51:44 AM |
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On 6 May 2007 08:29:34 -0700, Anti-Venom <writingken@yahoo.com> wrote:
The mantra of liberals is that everyone can decide right and wrong for
themselves, that no one should tell others they are wrong for their
point of view.
IF this is true, then, liberalism has just justified fundamentalism.
For Fundamentalists are choosing right and wrong for themselves. That
is their point of view, and, according to liberals, they are free to
do so. So, according to liberals, Fundamentalists are right (for
themselves) to believe the Bible to be truth, abortion to be sin,
homosexuality to be wrong, and Jesus to be the Lord of all and savior
of all who will call upon Him to save them.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
No problem. Anyone can believe whatever one wishes. If you wish to
believe that Christ is your savior, so be it. But if you wish to
believe this then shouldn't your daily actions mirror Christ's
philosophy? What's your feeling on immigration? Love thy neighbor or
love thy neighbor only if he stays in his own country? Or thou shalt
not kill - except muslims? It's probably okay if you covet thy
neighbor's double-wide but stay away for his *****. This country was
founded upon separation of church and state and we'd like to keep it
that way.
WB Yeats
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| User: "Jerry Kraus" |
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| Title: Re: Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
07 May 2007 01:11:40 PM |
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On May 6, 10:29 am, Anti-Venom <writing...@yahoo.com> wrote:
The mantra of liberals is that everyone can decide right and wrong for
themselves, that no one should tell others they are wrong for their
point of view.
IF this is true, then, liberalism has just justified fundamentalism.
For Fundamentalists are choosing right and wrong for themselves. That
is their point of view, and, according to liberals, they are free to
do so. So, according to liberals, Fundamentalists are right (for
themselves) to believe the Bible to be truth, abortion to be sin,
homosexuality to be wrong, and Jesus to be the Lord of all and savior
of all who will call upon Him to save them.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
You are quite correct. Liberals like myself are quite happy for
people to believe whatever they wish to believe.
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| User: "Kickin Ass and Takin Names" |
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| Title: Re: Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
06 May 2007 11:00:51 AM |
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On May 6, 11:29 am, Anti-Venom <writing...@yahoo.com> wrote:
The mantra of liberals is that everyone can decide right and wrong for
themselves, that no one should tell others they are wrong for their
point of view.
IF this is true, then, liberalism has just justified fundamentalism.
For Fundamentalists are choosing right and wrong for themselves. That
is their point of view, and, according to liberals, they are free to
do so. So, according to liberals, Fundamentalists are right (for
themselves) to believe the Bible to be truth, abortion to be sin,
homosexuality to be wrong, and Jesus to be the Lord of all and savior
of all who will call upon Him to save them.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
You're forgetting the critical point: Fundamentalists not only want
to decide right or wrong for themselves, THEY WANT TO FORCE EVERYONE
ELSE TO CONFORM TO THEIR BELIEFS.
Fundamental christianity and fundamental islam are exactly alike in
the most important aspects:
-- They have a "holy book" that contains "revealed truth," thus, they
don't need logic, reason, debate, questioning, and scientific
research.
-- They are "evangelizing" religions -- that is, they are ordered by
their god to convert others to their beliefs.
We liberals aren't trying to convert anyone -- live and let live.
If you want to decide your own position on abortion, marriage, or any
other human activity, fine, decide -- but do not write your beliefs
into the laws that I must follow.
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| User: "Roger" |
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| Title: Re: Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
07 May 2007 06:32:57 AM |
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"Kickin' ***** and Takin' Names" <PopUlist349@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1178467251.451986.46360@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
On May 6, 11:29 am, Anti-Venom <writing...@yahoo.com> wrote:
The mantra of liberals is that everyone can decide right and wrong for
themselves, that no one should tell others they are wrong for their
point of view.
IF this is true, then, liberalism has just justified fundamentalism.
For Fundamentalists are choosing right and wrong for themselves. That
is their point of view, and, according to liberals, they are free to
do so. So, according to liberals, Fundamentalists are right (for
themselves) to believe the Bible to be truth, abortion to be sin,
homosexuality to be wrong, and Jesus to be the Lord of all and savior
of all who will call upon Him to save them.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
You're forgetting the critical point: Fundamentalists not only want
to decide right or wrong for themselves, THEY WANT TO FORCE EVERYONE
ELSE TO CONFORM TO THEIR BELIEFS.
Fundamentalist Christians have more in common with fundamentalist Muslims
than they do with most Christians.
Fundamental christianity and fundamental islam are exactly alike in
the most important aspects:
-- They have a "holy book" that contains "revealed truth," thus, they
don't need logic, reason, debate, questioning, and scientific
research.
-- They are "evangelizing" religions -- that is, they are ordered by
their god to convert others to their beliefs.
We liberals aren't trying to convert anyone -- live and let live.
If you want to decide your own position on abortion, marriage, or any
other human activity, fine, decide -- but do not write your beliefs
into the laws that I must follow.
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| User: "Scotius" |
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| Title: Re: Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
08 May 2007 03:44:14 PM |
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On 6 May 2007 09:00:51 -0700, Kickin' ***** and Takin' Names
<PopUlist349@hotmail.com> wrote:
On May 6, 11:29 am, Anti-Venom <writing...@yahoo.com> wrote:
The mantra of liberals is that everyone can decide right and wrong for
themselves, that no one should tell others they are wrong for their
point of view.
IF this is true, then, liberalism has just justified fundamentalism.
For Fundamentalists are choosing right and wrong for themselves. That
is their point of view, and, according to liberals, they are free to
do so. So, according to liberals, Fundamentalists are right (for
themselves) to believe the Bible to be truth, abortion to be sin,
homosexuality to be wrong, and Jesus to be the Lord of all and savior
of all who will call upon Him to save them.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
You're forgetting the critical point: Fundamentalists not only want
to decide right or wrong for themselves, THEY WANT TO FORCE EVERYONE
ELSE TO CONFORM TO THEIR BELIEFS.
Just like the people who criticize them want to force everyone
to accept the idea that there's no such thing as right and wrong to
begin with in certain matters.
Fundamental christianity and fundamental islam are exactly alike in
the most important aspects:
-- They have a "holy book" that contains "revealed truth," thus, they
don't need logic, reason, debate, questioning, and scientific
research.
-- They are "evangelizing" religions -- that is, they are ordered by
their god to convert others to their beliefs.
We liberals aren't trying to convert anyone -- live and let live.
You might have been able to get away with saying that before
Democratic "centrists" were so obviously centrists in name only, and
in fact were most often mouthpieces for the radical left, but then the
"moderate" Republicans are also only mouthpieces for the radical
right. Just look at what the Bush (dis)administration is trying to do
to workers rights, etc.
If you want to decide your own position on abortion, marriage, or any
other human activity, fine, decide -- but do not write your beliefs
into the laws that I must follow.
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| User: "Wide Eyed in Wonder" |
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| Title: Re: Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
07 May 2007 08:13:41 AM |
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On May 6, 11:00 am, Kickin' ***** and Takin' Names
<PopUlist...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On May 6, 11:29 am, Anti-Venom <writing...@yahoo.com> wrote:
The mantra of liberals is that everyone can decide right and wrong for
themselves, that no one should tell others they are wrong for their
point of view.
IF this is true, then, liberalism has just justified fundamentalism.
For Fundamentalists are choosing right and wrong for themselves. That
is their point of view, and, according to liberals, they are free to
do so. So, according to liberals, Fundamentalists are right (for
themselves) to believe the Bible to be truth, abortion to be sin,
homosexuality to be wrong, and Jesus to be the Lord of all and savior
of all who will call upon Him to save them.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
You're forgetting the critical point: Fundamentalists not only want
to decide right or wrong for themselves, THEY WANT TO FORCE EVERYONE
ELSE TO CONFORM TO THEIR BELIEFS.
Fundamental christianity and fundamental islam are exactly alike in
the most important aspects:
-- They have a "holy book" that contains "revealed truth," thus, they
don't need logic, reason, debate, questioning, and scientific
research.
-- They are "evangelizing" religions -- that is, they are ordered by
their god to convert others to their beliefs.
We liberals aren't trying to convert anyone -- live and let live.
If you want to decide your own position on abortion, marriage, or any
other human activity, fine, decide -- but do not write your beliefs
into the laws that I must follow.
Are you not telling ME how to believe and live in this thread? Who
are you to tell me what to believe, IF everyone decides right and
wrong for themselves? See...you don't even believe it yourself and
make yourself a hypocrite.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
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| User: "Chris Morris" |
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| Title: Re: Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
07 May 2007 09:39:16 AM |
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"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kands00@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1178543621.500933.284140@n59g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
On May 6, 11:00 am, Kickin' ***** and Takin' Names
<PopUlist...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On May 6, 11:29 am, Anti-Venom <writing...@yahoo.com> wrote:
The mantra of liberals is that everyone can decide right and wrong for
themselves, that no one should tell others they are wrong for their
point of view.
IF this is true, then, liberalism has just justified fundamentalism.
For Fundamentalists are choosing right and wrong for themselves. That
is their point of view, and, according to liberals, they are free to
do so. So, according to liberals, Fundamentalists are right (for
themselves) to believe the Bible to be truth, abortion to be sin,
homosexuality to be wrong, and Jesus to be the Lord of all and savior
of all who will call upon Him to save them.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
You're forgetting the critical point: Fundamentalists not only want
to decide right or wrong for themselves, THEY WANT TO FORCE EVERYONE
ELSE TO CONFORM TO THEIR BELIEFS.
Fundamental christianity and fundamental islam are exactly alike in
the most important aspects:
-- They have a "holy book" that contains "revealed truth," thus, they
don't need logic, reason, debate, questioning, and scientific
research.
-- They are "evangelizing" religions -- that is, they are ordered by
their god to convert others to their beliefs.
We liberals aren't trying to convert anyone -- live and let live.
If you want to decide your own position on abortion, marriage, or any
other human activity, fine, decide -- but do not write your beliefs
into the laws that I must follow.
Are you not telling ME how to believe and live in this thread? Who
are you to tell me what to believe, IF everyone decides right and
wrong for themselves? See...you don't even believe it yourself and
make yourself a hypocrite.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
No it is you that does not grasp reality. Your rights end at my nose you do
not have the right to dictate to me how to live my life anymore than others
have to dictate how you live your life. A person can believe and live as
they choose if they do not believe in abortion, don't have an abortion, if
you do not believe in homosexual marriage do not marry a person of the same
sex. All of these are the rights of the rights of each person to decide, but
your right ends with yourself you do not have the right to dictate to anyone
else how they should live. A right to self determination ends at the
boundaries of the self and does not extend to forcing your values on to any
other person.
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| User: "Vosotros" |
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| Title: Re: Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
07 May 2007 01:07:28 PM |
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"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kands00@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1178543621.500933.284140@n59g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
On May 6, 11:00 am, Kickin' ***** and Takin' Names
<PopUlist...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On May 6, 11:29 am, Anti-Venom <writing...@yahoo.com> wrote:
The mantra of liberals is that everyone can decide right and wrong for
themselves, that no one should tell others they are wrong for their
point of view.
IF this is true, then, liberalism has just justified fundamentalism.
For Fundamentalists are choosing right and wrong for themselves. That
is their point of view, and, according to liberals, they are free to
do so. So, according to liberals, Fundamentalists are right (for
themselves) to believe the Bible to be truth, abortion to be sin,
homosexuality to be wrong, and Jesus to be the Lord of all and savior
of all who will call upon Him to save them.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
You're forgetting the critical point: Fundamentalists not only want
to decide right or wrong for themselves, THEY WANT TO FORCE EVERYONE
ELSE TO CONFORM TO THEIR BELIEFS.
Fundamental christianity and fundamental islam are exactly alike in
the most important aspects:
-- They have a "holy book" that contains "revealed truth," thus, they
don't need logic, reason, debate, questioning, and scientific
research.
-- They are "evangelizing" religions -- that is, they are ordered by
their god to convert others to their beliefs.
We liberals aren't trying to convert anyone -- live and let live.
If you want to decide your own position on abortion, marriage, or any
other human activity, fine, decide -- but do not write your beliefs
into the laws that I must follow.
Are you not telling ME how to believe and live in this thread? Who
are you to tell me what to believe, IF everyone decides right and
wrong for themselves? See...you don't even believe it yourself and
make yourself a hypocrite.
I wonder if you actually know the difference between writing a law and
posting an opinion on the usenet?
I also wonder if you think that freely practicing your beliefs includes
deciding what your neighbor can freely practice.
.
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| User: "Wide Eyed in Wonder" |
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| Title: Re: Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
07 May 2007 03:58:56 PM |
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On May 7, 1:07 pm, "Vosotros" <Vosot...@spam.com> wrote:
"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kand...@hotmail.com> wrote in messagenews:1178543621.500933.284140@n59g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
On May 6, 11:00 am, Kickin' ***** and Takin' Names
<PopUlist...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On May 6, 11:29 am, Anti-Venom <writing...@yahoo.com> wrote:
The mantra of liberals is that everyone can decide right and wrong for
themselves, that no one should tell others they are wrong for their
point of view.
IF this is true, then, liberalism has just justified fundamentalism.
For Fundamentalists are choosing right and wrong for themselves. That
is their point of view, and, according to liberals, they are free to
do so. So, according to liberals, Fundamentalists are right (for
themselves) to believe the Bible to be truth, abortion to be sin,
homosexuality to be wrong, and Jesus to be the Lord of all and savior
of all who will call upon Him to save them.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
You're forgetting the critical point: Fundamentalists not only want
to decide right or wrong for themselves, THEY WANT TO FORCE EVERYONE
ELSE TO CONFORM TO THEIR BELIEFS.
Fundamental christianity and fundamental islam are exactly alike in
the most important aspects:
-- They have a "holy book" that contains "revealed truth," thus, they
don't need logic, reason, debate, questioning, and scientific
research.
-- They are "evangelizing" religions -- that is, they are ordered by
their god to convert others to their beliefs.
We liberals aren't trying to convert anyone -- live and let live.
If you want to decide your own position on abortion, marriage, or any
other human activity, fine, decide -- but do not write your beliefs
into the laws that I must follow.
Are you not telling ME how to believe and live in this thread? Who
are you to tell me what to believe, IF everyone decides right and
wrong for themselves? See...you don't even believe it yourself and
make yourself a hypocrite.
I wonder if you actually know the difference between writing a law and
posting an opinion on the usenet?
I also wonder if you think that freely practicing your beliefs includes
deciding what your neighbor can freely practice.
You didn't answer the question. Are you telling me what to believe
and do or not?
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
.
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| User: "Vosotros" |
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| Title: Re: Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
07 May 2007 05:28:26 PM |
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"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kands00@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1178571536.904026.220970@e51g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
On May 7, 1:07 pm, "Vosotros" <Vosot...@spam.com> wrote:
"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kand...@hotmail.com> wrote in
messagenews:1178543621.500933.284140@n59g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
On May 6, 11:00 am, Kickin' ***** and Takin' Names
<PopUlist...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On May 6, 11:29 am, Anti-Venom <writing...@yahoo.com> wrote:
The mantra of liberals is that everyone can decide right and wrong
for
themselves, that no one should tell others they are wrong for their
point of view.
IF this is true, then, liberalism has just justified fundamentalism.
For Fundamentalists are choosing right and wrong for themselves.
That
is their point of view, and, according to liberals, they are free to
do so. So, according to liberals, Fundamentalists are right (for
themselves) to believe the Bible to be truth, abortion to be sin,
homosexuality to be wrong, and Jesus to be the Lord of all and
savior
of all who will call upon Him to save them.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
You're forgetting the critical point: Fundamentalists not only want
to decide right or wrong for themselves, THEY WANT TO FORCE EVERYONE
ELSE TO CONFORM TO THEIR BELIEFS.
Fundamental christianity and fundamental islam are exactly alike in
the most important aspects:
-- They have a "holy book" that contains "revealed truth," thus, they
don't need logic, reason, debate, questioning, and scientific
research.
-- They are "evangelizing" religions -- that is, they are ordered by
their god to convert others to their beliefs.
We liberals aren't trying to convert anyone -- live and let live.
If you want to decide your own position on abortion, marriage, or any
other human activity, fine, decide -- but do not write your beliefs
into the laws that I must follow.
Are you not telling ME how to believe and live in this thread? Who
are you to tell me what to believe, IF everyone decides right and
wrong for themselves? See...you don't even believe it yourself and
make yourself a hypocrite.
I wonder if you actually know the difference between writing a law and
posting an opinion on the usenet?
I also wonder if you think that freely practicing your beliefs includes
deciding what your neighbor can freely practice.
You didn't answer the question. Are you telling me what to believe
and do or not?
I am not telling you to do anything. I am free to comment on your beliefs,
however, if you air them. And telling someone to do something is quite
different then making them through law.
Now, do you know the difference between writing a law and posting an opinion
on the usenet because if you do then you are trying really hard to conflate
the two and make them equal.
And do you believe that freely practicing your beliefs includes being able
to decide how or what I may believe or practice?
Here's an example, do you believe that sex outside of marriage should be
punished by the state? Do you think school kids should be required by law to
study the bible? Should christianity be given favored status by our
government?
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
.
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| User: "Wide Eyed in Wonder" |
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| Title: Re: Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
07 May 2007 06:59:06 PM |
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On May 7, 5:28 pm, "Vosotros" <Vosot...@spam.com> wrote:
"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kand...@hotmail.com> wrote in messagenews:1178571536.904026.220970@e51g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
On May 7, 1:07 pm, "Vosotros" <Vosot...@spam.com> wrote:
"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kand...@hotmail.com> wrote in
messagenews:1178543621.500933.284140@n59g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
On May 6, 11:00 am, Kickin' ***** and Takin' Names
<PopUlist...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On May 6, 11:29 am, Anti-Venom <writing...@yahoo.com> wrote:
The mantra of liberals is that everyone can decide right and wrong
for
themselves, that no one should tell others they are wrong for their
point of view.
IF this is true, then, liberalism has just justified fundamentalism.
For Fundamentalists are choosing right and wrong for themselves.
That
is their point of view, and, according to liberals, they are free to
do so. So, according to liberals, Fundamentalists are right (for
themselves) to believe the Bible to be truth, abortion to be sin,
homosexuality to be wrong, and Jesus to be the Lord of all and
savior
of all who will call upon Him to save them.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
You're forgetting the critical point: Fundamentalists not only want
to decide right or wrong for themselves, THEY WANT TO FORCE EVERYONE
ELSE TO CONFORM TO THEIR BELIEFS.
Fundamental christianity and fundamental islam are exactly alike in
the most important aspects:
-- They have a "holy book" that contains "revealed truth," thus, they
don't need logic, reason, debate, questioning, and scientific
research.
-- They are "evangelizing" religions -- that is, they are ordered by
their god to convert others to their beliefs.
We liberals aren't trying to convert anyone -- live and let live.
If you want to decide your own position on abortion, marriage, or any
other human activity, fine, decide -- but do not write your beliefs
into the laws that I must follow.
Are you not telling ME how to believe and live in this thread? Who
are you to tell me what to believe, IF everyone decides right and
wrong for themselves? See...you don't even believe it yourself and
make yourself a hypocrite.
I wonder if you actually know the difference between writing a law and
posting an opinion on the usenet?
I also wonder if you think that freely practicing your beliefs includes
deciding what your neighbor can freely practice.
You didn't answer the question. Are you telling me what to believe
and do or not?
I am not telling you to do anything. I am free to comment on your beliefs,
however, if you air them. And telling someone to do something is quite
different then making them through law.
Now, do you know the difference between writing a law and posting an opinion
on the usenet because if you do then you are trying really hard to conflate
the two and make them equal.
Thus, you cannot declare fundamentalists wrong, since they are free to
believe the Bible true...and, according to you are just as "right" as
you are to say it is not.
Also, if you are free to comment on Christian beliefs, if we air
them. Then, by the same token, Christians are free to comment on the
views of others...right?
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
.
|
|
|
| User: "Vosotros" |
|
| Title: Re: Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
08 May 2007 01:24:54 AM |
|
|
"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kands00@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1178582346.075253.318360@w5g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
On May 7, 5:28 pm, "Vosotros" <Vosot...@spam.com> wrote:
"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kand...@hotmail.com> wrote in
messagenews:1178571536.904026.220970@e51g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
On May 7, 1:07 pm, "Vosotros" <Vosot...@spam.com> wrote:
"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kand...@hotmail.com> wrote in
messagenews:1178543621.500933.284140@n59g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
On May 6, 11:00 am, Kickin' ***** and Takin' Names
<PopUlist...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On May 6, 11:29 am, Anti-Venom <writing...@yahoo.com> wrote:
The mantra of liberals is that everyone can decide right and
wrong
for
themselves, that no one should tell others they are wrong for
their
point of view.
IF this is true, then, liberalism has just justified
fundamentalism.
For Fundamentalists are choosing right and wrong for themselves.
That
is their point of view, and, according to liberals, they are free
to
do so. So, according to liberals, Fundamentalists are right (for
themselves) to believe the Bible to be truth, abortion to be sin,
homosexuality to be wrong, and Jesus to be the Lord of all and
savior
of all who will call upon Him to save them.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
You're forgetting the critical point: Fundamentalists not only
want
to decide right or wrong for themselves, THEY WANT TO FORCE
EVERYONE
ELSE TO CONFORM TO THEIR BELIEFS.
Fundamental christianity and fundamental islam are exactly alike in
the most important aspects:
-- They have a "holy book" that contains "revealed truth," thus,
they
don't need logic, reason, debate, questioning, and scientific
research.
-- They are "evangelizing" religions -- that is, they are ordered
by
their god to convert others to their beliefs.
We liberals aren't trying to convert anyone -- live and let live.
If you want to decide your own position on abortion, marriage, or
any
other human activity, fine, decide -- but do not write your beliefs
into the laws that I must follow.
Are you not telling ME how to believe and live in this thread? Who
are you to tell me what to believe, IF everyone decides right and
wrong for themselves? See...you don't even believe it yourself and
make yourself a hypocrite.
I wonder if you actually know the difference between writing a law and
posting an opinion on the usenet?
I also wonder if you think that freely practicing your beliefs
includes
deciding what your neighbor can freely practice.
You didn't answer the question. Are you telling me what to believe
and do or not?
I am not telling you to do anything. I am free to comment on your
beliefs,
however, if you air them. And telling someone to do something is quite
different then making them through law.
Now, do you know the difference between writing a law and posting an
opinion
on the usenet because if you do then you are trying really hard to
conflate
the two and make them equal.
Thus, you cannot declare fundamentalists wrong,
Sure I can.
since they are free to
believe the Bible true...and, according to you are just as "right" as
you are to say it is not.
I never said they are right, I said they have a right to believe whatever
they want.
Also, if you are free to comment on Christian beliefs, if we air
them. Then, by the same token, Christians are free to comment on the
views of others...right?
Not through law, which you are pretty much avoiding.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
.
|
|
|
| User: "Wide Eyed in Wonder" |
|
| Title: Re: Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
08 May 2007 10:26:29 AM |
|
|
On May 8, 1:24 am, "Vosotros" <Vosot...@spam.com> wrote:
"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kand...@hotmail.com> wrote in messagenews:1178582346.075253.318360@w5g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
On May 7, 5:28 pm, "Vosotros" <Vosot...@spam.com> wrote:
"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kand...@hotmail.com> wrote in
messagenews:1178571536.904026.220970@e51g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
On May 7, 1:07 pm, "Vosotros" <Vosot...@spam.com> wrote:
"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kand...@hotmail.com> wrote in
messagenews:1178543621.500933.284140@n59g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
On May 6, 11:00 am, Kickin' ***** and Takin' Names
<PopUlist...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On May 6, 11:29 am, Anti-Venom <writing...@yahoo.com> wrote:
The mantra of liberals is that everyone can decide right and
wrong
for
themselves, that no one should tell others they are wrong for
their
point of view.
IF this is true, then, liberalism has just justified
fundamentalism.
For Fundamentalists are choosing right and wrong for themselves.
That
is their point of view, and, according to liberals, they are free
to
do so. So, according to liberals, Fundamentalists are right (for
themselves) to believe the Bible to be truth, abortion to be sin,
homosexuality to be wrong, and Jesus to be the Lord of all and
savior
of all who will call upon Him to save them.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
You're forgetting the critical point: Fundamentalists not only
want
to decide right or wrong for themselves, THEY WANT TO FORCE
EVERYONE
ELSE TO CONFORM TO THEIR BELIEFS.
Fundamental christianity and fundamental islam are exactly alike in
the most important aspects:
-- They have a "holy book" that contains "revealed truth," thus,
they
don't need logic, reason, debate, questioning, and scientific
research.
-- They are "evangelizing" religions -- that is, they are ordered
by
their god to convert others to their beliefs.
We liberals aren't trying to convert anyone -- live and let live.
If you want to decide your own position on abortion, marriage, or
any
other human activity, fine, decide -- but do not write your beliefs
into the laws that I must follow.
Are you not telling ME how to believe and live in this thread? Who
are you to tell me what to believe, IF everyone decides right and
wrong for themselves? See...you don't even believe it yourself and
make yourself a hypocrite.
I wonder if you actually know the difference between writing a law and
posting an opinion on the usenet?
I also wonder if you think that freely practicing your beliefs
includes
deciding what your neighbor can freely practice.
You didn't answer the question. Are you telling me what to believe
and do or not?
I am not telling you to do anything. I am free to comment on your
beliefs,
however, if you air them. And telling someone to do something is quite
different then making them through law.
Now, do you know the difference between writing a law and posting an
opinion
on the usenet because if you do then you are trying really hard to
conflate
the two and make them equal.
Thus, you cannot declare fundamentalists wrong,
Sure I can.
since they are free to
believe the Bible true...and, according to you are just as "right" as
you are to say it is not.
I never said they are right, I said they have a right to believe whatever
they want.
Also, if you are free to comment on Christian beliefs, if we air
them. Then, by the same token, Christians are free to comment on the
views of others...right?
Not through law, which you are pretty much avoiding.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
Cary, Bob, And Vosotros...
At what point in the above thread was I talking about law, since the
discussion was about justification and relative morality, or are you
just trying to distract others from the original post with your own
interests? You know my argument wins, here, so you are trying to
distract with alternative topics. I'll stick to mine.
If morals are relative, fundamentalists are right. If everyone can
decide what they want to believe, justly, fundamentalists are as just
as anyone else in doing so.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
.
|
|
|
| User: "Vosotros" |
|
| Title: Re: Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
08 May 2007 11:25:42 AM |
|
|
"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kands00@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1178637989.945862.131180@e65g2000hsc.googlegroups.com...
On May 8, 1:24 am, "Vosotros" <Vosot...@spam.com> wrote:
"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kand...@hotmail.com> wrote in
messagenews:1178582346.075253.318360@w5g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
On May 7, 5:28 pm, "Vosotros" <Vosot...@spam.com> wrote:
"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kand...@hotmail.com> wrote in
messagenews:1178571536.904026.220970@e51g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
On May 7, 1:07 pm, "Vosotros" <Vosot...@spam.com> wrote:
"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kand...@hotmail.com> wrote in
messagenews:1178543621.500933.284140@n59g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
On May 6, 11:00 am, Kickin' ***** and Takin' Names
<PopUlist...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On May 6, 11:29 am, Anti-Venom <writing...@yahoo.com> wrote:
The mantra of liberals is that everyone can decide right and
wrong
for
themselves, that no one should tell others they are wrong for
their
point of view.
IF this is true, then, liberalism has just justified
fundamentalism.
For Fundamentalists are choosing right and wrong for
themselves.
That
is their point of view, and, according to liberals, they are
free
to
do so. So, according to liberals, Fundamentalists are right
(for
themselves) to believe the Bible to be truth, abortion to be
sin,
homosexuality to be wrong, and Jesus to be the Lord of all and
savior
of all who will call upon Him to save them.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
You're forgetting the critical point: Fundamentalists not only
want
to decide right or wrong for themselves, THEY WANT TO FORCE
EVERYONE
ELSE TO CONFORM TO THEIR BELIEFS.
Fundamental christianity and fundamental islam are exactly alike
in
the most important aspects:
-- They have a "holy book" that contains "revealed truth," thus,
they
don't need logic, reason, debate, questioning, and scientific
research.
-- They are "evangelizing" religions -- that is, they are
ordered
by
their god to convert others to their beliefs.
We liberals aren't trying to convert anyone -- live and let
live.
If you want to decide your own position on abortion, marriage,
or
any
other human activity, fine, decide -- but do not write your
beliefs
into the laws that I must follow.
Are you not telling ME how to believe and live in this thread?
Who
are you to tell me what to believe, IF everyone decides right and
wrong for themselves? See...you don't even believe it yourself
and
make yourself a hypocrite.
I wonder if you actually know the difference between writing a law
and
posting an opinion on the usenet?
I also wonder if you think that freely practicing your beliefs
includes
deciding what your neighbor can freely practice.
You didn't answer the question. Are you telling me what to believe
and do or not?
I am not telling you to do anything. I am free to comment on your
beliefs,
however, if you air them. And telling someone to do something is quite
different then making them through law.
Now, do you know the difference between writing a law and posting an
opinion
on the usenet because if you do then you are trying really hard to
conflate
the two and make them equal.
Thus, you cannot declare fundamentalists wrong,
Sure I can.
since they are free to
believe the Bible true...and, according to you are just as "right" as
you are to say it is not.
I never said they are right, I said they have a right to believe whatever
they want.
Also, if you are free to comment on Christian beliefs, if we air
them. Then, by the same token, Christians are free to comment on the
views of others...right?
Not through law, which you are pretty much avoiding.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
Cary, Bob, And Vosotros...
At what point in the above thread was I talking about law, since the
discussion was about justification and relative morality, or are you
just trying to distract others from the original post with your own
interests? You know my argument wins, here, so you are trying to
distract with alternative topics. I'll stick to mine.
Everyone here understands that you are no "relative morality" supporter.
Everyone knows that you believe there is one truth and that either by
submission or force one must live under it. You are trying to play devils
advocate to attempt to undermine any argument against christian
fundamentalism. You are trying to argue that If everyone has the right to
believe what they want then no one has the right to challenge
fundamentalism.
Where your argument falls apart is that a basic belief for fundamentalists
is that everyone must submit to their truth and live by their rules. You
can't have moral relativity, diversity, and tolerance unless everyone
follows the basic idea behind them. It's like trying to argue that if
liberals really are tolerant then they should tolerate hate.
If morals are relative, fundamentalists are right. If everyone can
decide what they want to believe, justly, fundamentalists are as just
as anyone else in doing so.
Yes, but only for themselves. When they try to make me believe or do
something I do not agree with then they violate my rights. They can
criticize, but they cannot force me to do a thing.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Wide Eyed in Wonder" |
|
| Title: Re: Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
08 May 2007 11:59:08 AM |
|
|
On May 8, 11:25 am, "Vosotros" <Vosot...@spam.com> wrote:
"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kand...@hotmail.com> wrote in messagenews:1178637989.945862.131180@e65g2000hsc.googlegroups.com...
On May 8, 1:24 am, "Vosotros" <Vosot...@spam.com> wrote:
"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kand...@hotmail.com> wrote in
messagenews:1178582346.075253.318360@w5g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
On May 7, 5:28 pm, "Vosotros" <Vosot...@spam.com> wrote:
"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kand...@hotmail.com> wrote in
messagenews:1178571536.904026.220970@e51g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
On May 7, 1:07 pm, "Vosotros" <Vosot...@spam.com> wrote:
"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kand...@hotmail.com> wrote in
messagenews:1178543621.500933.284140@n59g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
On May 6, 11:00 am, Kickin' ***** and Takin' Names
<PopUlist...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On May 6, 11:29 am, Anti-Venom <writing...@yahoo.com> wrote:
The mantra of liberals is that everyone can decide right and
wrong
for
themselves, that no one should tell others they are wrong for
their
point of view.
IF this is true, then, liberalism has just justified
fundamentalism.
For Fundamentalists are choosing right and wrong for
themselves.
That
is their point of view, and, according to liberals, they are
free
to
do so. So, according to liberals, Fundamentalists are right
(for
themselves) to believe the Bible to be truth, abortion to be
sin,
homosexuality to be wrong, and Jesus to be the Lord of all and
savior
of all who will call upon Him to save them.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
You're forgetting the critical point: Fundamentalists not only
want
to decide right or wrong for themselves, THEY WANT TO FORCE
EVERYONE
ELSE TO CONFORM TO THEIR BELIEFS.
Fundamental christianity and fundamental islam are exactly alike
in
the most important aspects:
-- They have a "holy book" that contains "revealed truth," thus,
they
don't need logic, reason, debate, questioning, and scientific
research.
-- They are "evangelizing" religions -- that is, they are
ordered
by
their god to convert others to their beliefs.
We liberals aren't trying to convert anyone -- live and let
live.
If you want to decide your own position on abortion, marriage,
or
any
other human activity, fine, decide -- but do not write your
beliefs
into the laws that I must follow.
Are you not telling ME how to believe and live in this thread?
Who
are you to tell me what to believe, IF everyone decides right and
wrong for themselves? See...you don't even believe it yourself
and
make yourself a hypocrite.
I wonder if you actually know the difference between writing a law
and
posting an opinion on the usenet?
I also wonder if you think that freely practicing your beliefs
includes
deciding what your neighbor can freely practice.
You didn't answer the question. Are you telling me what to believe
and do or not?
I am not telling you to do anything. I am free to comment on your
beliefs,
however, if you air them. And telling someone to do something is quite
different then making them through law.
Now, do you know the difference between writing a law and posting an
opinion
on the usenet because if you do then you are trying really hard to
conflate
the two and make them equal.
Thus, you cannot declare fundamentalists wrong,
Sure I can.
since they are free to
believe the Bible true...and, according to you are just as "right" as
you are to say it is not.
I never said they are right, I said they have a right to believe whatever
they want.
Also, if you are free to comment on Christian beliefs, if we air
them. Then, by the same token, Christians are free to comment on the
views of others...right?
Not through law, which you are pretty much avoiding.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
Cary, Bob, And Vosotros...
At what point in the above thread was I talking about law, since the
discussion was about justification and relative morality, or are you
just trying to distract others from the original post with your own
interests? You know my argument wins, here, so you are trying to
distract with alternative topics. I'll stick to mine.
Everyone here understands that you are no "relative morality" supporter.
Everyone knows that you believe there is one truth and that either by
submission or force one must live under it. You are trying to play devils
advocate to attempt to undermine any argument against christian
fundamentalism. You are trying to argue that If everyone has the right to
believe what they want then no one has the right to challenge
fundamentalism.
Where your argument falls apart is that a basic belief for fundamentalists
is that everyone must submit to their truth and live by their rules. You
can't have moral relativity, diversity, and tolerance unless everyone
follows the basic idea behind them. It's like trying to argue that if
liberals really are tolerant then they should tolerate hate.
If morals are relative, fundamentalists are right. If everyone can
decide what they want to believe, justly, fundamentalists are as just
as anyone else in doing so.
Yes, but only for themselves. When they try to make me believe or do
something I do not agree with then they violate my rights. They can
criticize, but they cannot force me to do a thing.
So, who are you to tell me I am wrong here or fundamentalists
elsewhere?
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
.
|
|
|
|
|
| User: "Cary Kittrell" |
|
| Title: Re: Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
08 May 2007 11:30:39 AM |
|
|
In article <1178637989.945862.131180@e65g2000hsc.googlegroups.com> Wide Eyed in Wonder <kands00@hotmail.com> writes:
On May 8, 1:24 am, "Vosotros" <Vosot...@spam.com> wrote:
"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kand...@hotmail.com> wrote in messagenews:1178582346.075253.318360@w5g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
On May 7, 5:28 pm, "Vosotros" <Vosot...@spam.com> wrote:
"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kand...@hotmail.com> wrote in
messagenews:1178571536.904026.220970@e51g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
On May 7, 1:07 pm, "Vosotros" <Vosot...@spam.com> wrote:
"Wide Eyed in Wonder" <kand...@hotmail.com> wrote in
messagenews:1178543621.500933.284140@n59g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
On May 6, 11:00 am, Kickin' ***** and Takin' Names
<PopUlist...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On May 6, 11:29 am, Anti-Venom <writing...@yahoo.com> wrote:
The mantra of liberals is that everyone can decide right and
wrong
for
themselves, that no one should tell others they are wrong for
their
point of view.
IF this is true, then, liberalism has just justified
fundamentalism.
For Fundamentalists are choosing right and wrong for themselves.
That
is their point of view, and, according to liberals, they are free
to
do so. So, according to liberals, Fundamentalists are right (for
themselves) to believe the Bible to be truth, abortion to be sin,
homosexuality to be wrong, and Jesus to be the Lord of all and
savior
of all who will call upon Him to save them.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
You're forgetting the critical point: Fundamentalists not only
want
to decide right or wrong for themselves, THEY WANT TO FORCE
EVERYONE
ELSE TO CONFORM TO THEIR BELIEFS.
Fundamental christianity and fundamental islam are exactly alike in
the most important aspects:
-- They have a "holy book" that contains "revealed truth," thus,
they
don't need logic, reason, debate, questioning, and scientific
research.
-- They are "evangelizing" religions -- that is, they are ordered
by
their god to convert others to their beliefs.
We liberals aren't trying to convert anyone -- live and let live.
If you want to decide your own position on abortion, marriage, or
any
other human activity, fine, decide -- but do not write your beliefs
into the laws that I must follow.
Are you not telling ME how to believe and live in this thread? Who
are you to tell me what to believe, IF everyone decides right and
wrong for themselves? See...you don't even believe it yourself and
make yourself a hypocrite.
I wonder if you actually know the difference between writing a law and
posting an opinion on the usenet?
I also wonder if you think that freely practicing your beliefs
includes
deciding what your neighbor can freely practice.
You didn't answer the question. Are you telling me what to believe
and do or not?
I am not telling you to do anything. I am free to comment on your
beliefs,
however, if you air them. And telling someone to do something is quite
different then making them through law.
Now, do you know the difference between writing a law and posting an
opinion
on the usenet because if you do then you are trying really hard to
conflate
the two and make them equal.
Thus, you cannot declare fundamentalists wrong,
Sure I can.
since they are free to
believe the Bible true...and, according to you are just as "right" as
you are to say it is not.
I never said they are right, I said they have a right to believe whatever
they want.
Also, if you are free to comment on Christian beliefs, if we air
them. Then, by the same token, Christians are free to comment on the
views of others...right?
Not through law, which you are pretty much avoiding.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
Cary, Bob, And Vosotros...
At what point in the above thread was I talking about law, since the
discussion was about justification and relative morality, or are you
just trying to distract others from the original post with your own
interests? You know my argument wins, here, so you are trying to
distract with alternative topics. I'll stick to mine.
<sigh>
If morals are relative, fundamentalists are right.
Wrong.
If everyone can
decide what they want to believe, justly, fundamentalists are as just
as anyone else in doing so.
Correct.
Now, see the difference?
-- cary
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "Bob LeChevalier" |
|
| Title: Re: Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
08 May 2007 09:43:25 PM |
|
|
Wide Eyed in Wonder <kands00@hotmail.com> wrote:
Also, if you are free to comment on Christian beliefs, if we air
them. Then, by the same token, Christians are free to comment on the
views of others...right?
Not through law, which you are pretty much avoiding.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
At what point in the above thread was I talking about law, since the
discussion was about justification and relative morality,
You don't get to dictate what the discussion is about, loser.
or are you just trying to distract others from the original post
Nobody gives a damn about your original post, which I've long
forgotten. I respond to THIS post, and I respond in the direction *I*
wish to take the discussion. I don't care what you want to discuss.
Now with respect to your comments:
In a free society anyone can comment on the views of anyone in public
speech.
But that is all they can necessarily do: comment.
If morals are relative, fundamentalists are right.
The right of "Commenting on beliefs" has absolutely nothing to do with
whether morals are relative.
If morals are relative, "right" is a meaningless word without
identifying the relative standard.
If everyone can
decide what they want to believe, justly, fundamentalists are as just
as anyone else in doing so.
Yes. So what?
The issue you are ignoring is that fundamentalists don't merely want
to decide what they want to believe. They want to impose absolute
moral standards on others in the form of law. The attempt to prohibit
abortion happens to be the most controversial of these attempts. They
also want their religious beliefs (and only theirs) promoted in the
public school classroom.
lojbab
.
|
|
|
| User: "Wide Eyed in Wonder" |
|
| Title: Re: Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
09 May 2007 12:33:59 AM |
|
|
On May 8, 9:43 pm, Bob LeChevalier <loj...@lojban.org> wrote:
Wide Eyed in Wonder <kand...@hotmail.com> wrote:
Also, if you are free to comment on Christian beliefs, if we air
them. Then, by the same token, Christians are free to comment on the
views of others...right?
Not through law, which you are pretty much avoiding.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
At what point in the above thread was I talking about law, since the
discussion was about justification and relative morality,
You don't get to dictate what the discussion is about, loser.
or are you just trying to distract others from the original post
Nobody gives a damn about your original post, which I've long
forgotten. I respond to THIS post, and I respond in the direction *I*
wish to take the discussion. I don't care what you want to discuss.
Now with respect to your comments:
In a free society anyone can comment on the views of anyone in public
speech.
But that is all they can necessarily do: comment.
If morals are relative, fundamentalists are right.
The right of "Commenting on beliefs" has absolutely nothing to do with
whether morals are relative.
If morals are relative, "right" is a meaningless word without
identifying the relative standard.
If everyone can
decide what they want to believe, justly, fundamentalists are as just
as anyone else in doing so.
Yes. So what?
The issue you are ignoring is that fundamentalists don't merely want
to decide what they want to believe. They want to impose absolute
moral standards on others in the form of law. The attempt to prohibit
abortion happens to be the most controversial of these attempts. They
also want their religious beliefs (and only theirs) promoted in the
public school classroom.
lojbab
Well, I am in no position to do that...nor are most Christians. So,
since I am no threat to you, you should have no problem with my free
expression of my ideals. Thank you for admitting it.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
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| User: "Bob LeChevalier" |
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| Title: Re: Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
09 May 2007 04:04:47 AM |
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Wide Eyed in Wonder <kands00@hotmail.com> wrote:
The issue you are ignoring is that fundamentalists don't merely want
to decide what they want to believe. They want to impose absolute
moral standards on others in the form of law. The attempt to prohibit
abortion happens to be the most controversial of these attempts. They
also want their religious beliefs (and only theirs) promoted in the
public school classroom.
Well, I am in no position to do that...nor are most Christians. So,
since I am no threat to you,
Oh, I agree that you are no threat to me.
you should have no problem with my free expression of my ideals.
I have no problem with the fact of your doing so. I have a problem
with the forum in which you choose to do so.
You seem to think that your posts have something to do with
"education". The only plausible interpretation that justifies this,
is if you think that your telling others of your religious beliefs is
educating them. That, under most understandings of the word, is
"proselytizing". Indeed any form of teaching of religious dogma that
is unsolicited is considered proselytizing.
It is also a misuse of a Usenet forum. If one thinks that ANY sort of
information transfer constitutes "education", then nothing is
off-topic in the education groups, and there is no reason to have over
50,000 different groups in Usenet - just post everything into one
newsgroup. That clearly is NOT the intent of an education newsgroup.
lojbab
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| User: "Wide Eyed in Wonder" |
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| Title: Re: Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
09 May 2007 09:06:44 AM |
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On May 9, 4:04 am, Bob LeChevalier <loj...@lojban.org> wrote:
Wide Eyed in Wonder <kand...@hotmail.com> wrote:
The issue you are ignoring is that fundamentalists don't merely want
to decide what they want to believe. They want to impose absolute
moral standards on others in the form of law. The attempt to prohibit
abortion happens to be the most controversial of these attempts. They
also want their religious beliefs (and only theirs) promoted in the
public school classroom.
Well, I am in no position to do that...nor are most Christians. So,
since I am no threat to you,
Oh, I agree that you are no threat to me.
you should have no problem with my free expression of my ideals.
I have no problem with the fact of your doing so. I have a problem
with the forum in which you choose to do so.
You seem to think that your posts have something to do with
"education". The only plausible interpretation that justifies this,
is if you think that your telling others of your religious beliefs is
educating them. That, under most understandings of the word, is
"proselytizing". Indeed any form of teaching of religious dogma that
is unsolicited is considered proselytizing.
It is also a misuse of a Usenet forum. If one thinks that ANY sort of
information transfer constitutes "education", then nothing is
off-topic in the education groups, and there is no reason to have over
50,000 different groups in Usenet - just post everything into one
newsgroup. That clearly is NOT the intent of an education newsgroup.
lojbab
I believe it IS on topic, since liberalism is defining our public
school system in exclusion of fundamentalists for the most part.
However, all I can say is pa-lease. What other person have you
attacked for being off-topic? Where is your unrighteous indignation
about Buckeye? Shall I point out all of YOUR off topic posts in this
group? If you don't respond, I'll assume you do and will follow up
this post with them.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
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| User: "Cary Kittrell" |
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| Title: Re: Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
09 May 2007 11:39:47 AM |
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In article <1178719604.156249.250190@n59g2000hsh.googlegroups.com> Wide Eyed in Wonder <kands00@hotmail.com> writes:
On May 9, 4:04 am, Bob LeChevalier <loj...@lojban.org> wrote:
Wide Eyed in Wonder <kand...@hotmail.com> wrote:
The issue you are ignoring is that fundamentalists don't merely want
to decide what they want to believe. They want to impose absolute
moral standards on others in the form of law. The attempt to prohibit
abortion happens to be the most controversial of these attempts. They
also want their religious beliefs (and only theirs) promoted in the
public school classroom.
Well, I am in no position to do that...nor are most Christians. So,
since I am no threat to you,
Oh, I agree that you are no threat to me.
you should have no problem with my free expression of my ideals.
I have no problem with the fact of your doing so. I have a problem
with the forum in which you choose to do so.
You seem to think that your posts have something to do with
"education". The only plausible interpretation that justifies this,
is if you think that your telling others of your religious beliefs is
educating them. That, under most understandings of the word, is
"proselytizing". Indeed any form of teaching of religious dogma that
is unsolicited is considered proselytizing.
It is also a misuse of a Usenet forum. If one thinks that ANY sort of
information transfer constitutes "education", then nothing is
off-topic in the education groups, and there is no reason to have over
50,000 different groups in Usenet - just post everything into one
newsgroup. That clearly is NOT the intent of an education newsgroup.
lojbab
I believe it IS on topic, since liberalism is defining our public
school system in exclusion of fundamentalists for the most part.
And Hindus. And Moonies. And Universalist Unitarians. And
Raelians. And Mormons. And Zoroastrians. And Black Muslims.
And Satanists.
-- cary
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| User: "Wide Eyed in Wonder" |
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| Title: Re: Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
09 May 2007 11:55:00 AM |
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On May 9, 9:06 am, Wide Eyed in Wonder <kand...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On May 9, 4:04 am, Bob LeChevalier <loj...@lojban.org> wrote:
Wide Eyed in Wonder <kand...@hotmail.com> wrote:
The issue you are ignoring is that fundamentalists don't merely want
to decide what they want to believe. They want to impose absolute
moral standards on others in the form of law. The attempt to prohibit
abortion happens to be the most controversial of these attempts. They
also want their religious beliefs (and only theirs) promoted in the
public school classroom.
Well, I am in no position to do that...nor are most Christians. So,
since I am no threat to you,
Oh, I agree that you are no threat to me.
you should have no problem with my free expression of my ideals.
I have no problem with the fact of your doing so. I have a problem
with the forum in which you choose to do so.
You seem to think that your posts have something to do with
"education". The only plausible interpretation that justifies this,
is if you think that your telling others of your religious beliefs is
educating them. That, under most understandings of the word, is
"proselytizing". Indeed any form of teaching of religious dogma that
is unsolicited is considered proselytizing.
It is also a misuse of a Usenet forum. If one thinks that ANY sort of
information transfer constitutes "education", then nothing is
off-topic in the education groups, and there is no reason to have over
50,000 different groups in Usenet - just post everything into one
newsgroup. That clearly is NOT the intent of an education newsgroup.
lojbab
I believe it IS on topic, since liberalism is defining our public
school system in exclusion of fundamentalists for the most part.
However, all I can say is pa-lease. What other person have you
attacked for being off-topic? Where is your unrighteous indignation
about Buckeye? Shall I point out all of YOUR off topic posts in this
group? If you don't respond, I'll assume you do and will follow up
this post with them.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
What is Lojban, and what does it have to do with public education?
Shall I go on?
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
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| User: "Bob LeChevalier" |
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| Title: Re: Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
09 May 2007 01:27:41 PM |
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Wide Eyed in Wonder <writingken@yahoo.com> wrote:
What is Lojban,
An artificial language designed for research in linguistics and
language learning.
and what does it have to do with public education?
Not much, which is why I don't post about it on the education forums.
If I do mention it, it is generally for a specific purpose and/or in
response to a question, such as you just posed.
(I have discussed the use of artificial languages and Lojban in
particular in terms of foreign language education, but not recently.)
Shall I go on?
I have no reason to urge you to go on, but that won't stop you.
You have yet to make any point, if that is what you mean.
lojbab
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| User: "Cary Kittrell" |
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| Title: Re: Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
09 May 2007 01:45:25 PM |
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Bob LeChevalier <lojbab@lojban.org>
Wide Eyed in Wonder <writingken@yahoo.com> wrote:
What is Lojban,
An artificial language designed for research in linguistics and
language learning.
and what does it have to do with public education?
Not much, which is why I don't post about it on the education forums.
If I do mention it, it is generally for a specific purpose and/or in
response to a question, such as you just posed.
My impression is that 90 percent of the time it's someone else
who brings it up, either in an attempt to mock you as Klingon Boy,
or else it's He Whose Name Must Not trying to smear you as an
intellectual burglar (oh, the irony there)
-- cary
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| User: "Wide Eyed in Wonder" |
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| Title: Re: Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
09 May 2007 09:22:53 PM |
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On May 9, 1:27 pm, Bob LeChevalier <loj...@lojban.org> wrote:
Wide Eyed in Wonder <writing...@yahoo.com> wrote:
What is Lojban,
An artificial language designed for research in linguistics and
language learning.
and what does it have to do with public education?
Not much, which is why I don't post about it on the education forums.
If I do mention it, it is generally for a specific purpose and/or in
response to a question, such as you just posed.
(I have discussed the use of artificial languages and Lojban in
particular in terms of foreign language education, but not recently.)
Shall I go on?
I have no reason to urge you to go on, but that won't stop you.
You have yet to make any point, if that is what you mean.
lojbab
Fine. I'm a fool (to you). Understood. You are a fool to me. We
are even. This and all discussions with you are over.
Ken Clifton
christiansuperhero.com
.
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| User: "Bob LeChevalier" |
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| Title: Re: Liberals Justify Fundamentalists |
10 May 2007 04:44:34 AM |
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Wide Eyed in Wonder <kands00@hotmail.com> wrote:
Fine. I'm a fool (to you). Understood. You are a fool to me. We
are even. This and all discussions with you are over.
You already posted this. No need to repeat yourself. (You also have
posted this several generations of threads in the past. You keep
coming back for more. I think you are addicted to public abuse.)
lojbab
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