Politics > Politics-USA > "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended." 10.27.03
| Topic: |
Politics > Politics-USA |
| User: |
"Tom Jefferson" |
| Date: |
27 Oct 2003 05:39:15 PM |
| Object: |
"My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended." 10.27.03 |
Bring em on sez AWOL Dubya and that's exactly what they're doing.
------------------------------------------------------
Admiral Kelly, Captain Card (ph), officers and sailors of the USS Abraham
Lincoln, my fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended. In
the battle of Iraq, the United States and our allies have prevailed.
http://www.milparts.net/bush-on-uss-lincoln.html
-------------------------------------------------------
10/26/2003 8:51 PM
Guerrillas in no danger of running out of arms
By John Diamond, USA TODAY
WASHINGTON — Iraqi guerrillas have an abundant supply of small arms and
explosives that could allow them to maintain their pace of attacks
indefinitely, Pentagon and U.S. Central Command intelligence analysts have
concluded.
The guerrillas' shoot-and-scoot tactics use up relatively little ammunition
while inflicting serious casualties and even deeper psychological damage.
At least 107 U.S. troops have died in guerrilla attacks and other hostile
action in Iraq since May 1. And although Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld
has argued that the attacks are relatively few considering the size of the
country, he acknowledges they have succeeded in intimidating Iraqis who
might otherwise support the coalition.
Iraq's armed forces disbanded and melted into the countryside in late April
during the final stages of the U.S.-led effort to topple Saddam Hussein's
regime by force. The Iraqi soldiers took their weapons home with them.
Coalition forces took note of an ominous sign at the end of the fighting:
hundreds of disabled Iraqi military vehicles along roads and in fields,
stripped of any ammunition.
The discovery of thousands of arms caches — not only at military bases, but
also in schools, mosques, hospitals and homes — indicates to U.S. commanders
that there remain thousands more undiscovered caches accessible to
guerrillas.
Coalition commanders have various estimates for how much is stored in those
caches. Army Lt. Gen. Ricardo Sanchez cited an estimate of 650,000 tons, an
enormous figure equal to about a third of the U.S. military's vast
ammunition stockpile. Brig. Gen. Robert Davis, the officer in charge of a
program to collect and destroy Iraqi weapons stocks, said the figure could
be closer to 1 million tons.
Dan Coberly, spokesman for the Army Corps of Engineers, which is overseeing
destruction of seized Iraqi arms, said in an interview, "No one has a firm
number for the total amount" of small arms in Iraq.
"We don't have any notion at this point where all of these sites are,"
Sanchez told reporters in Baghdad last week. "We're still finding ammunition
in backyards. Every day we're finding it."
Central Command, the military headquarters responsible for U.S. operations
in Iraq, has been under pressure from Capitol Hill to explain why it has not
secured all of the conventional weapons caches found since major combat was
declared over May 1.
"There are so many different places where the forces on the ground have
discovered weapons caches, and to dedicate soldiers to guard them before
they are confiscated or destroyed is simply impossible," said a Central
Command spokesman, Sgt. Danny Martin.
The problem facing U.S. and allied soldiers stems not from weapons snatched
by guerrillas from under the noses of coalition guards but rather from
weapons the guerrillas already had when the main fighting ended six months
ago.
Much of what coalition forces do in Iraq revolves around small arms — either
looking for them, securing them or dodging them.
Two U.S. intelligence officials, one civilian, the other military, said
there is simply no way to keep weapons out of the hands of guerrillas.
Instead, the focus is turning to finding technologies that can be used to
detect mines, booby traps and roadside bombs before they inflict casualties
on coalition patrols.
The combination of readily available small arms and explosives with tactics
that require relatively little use of ammunition indicates that Iraqi forces
will be able to sustain their ambush-style attacks indefinitely, these two
intelligence officials said.
Rumsfeld has argued that the news media are overplaying the significance of
the attacks and that most of Iraq is stable and calm. In a speech Oct. 10 at
the Ronald Reagan Presidential Library in Simi Valley, Calif., Rumsfeld said
that of 1,700 coalition patrols per day, only about one-tenth of 1%
encounter violence.
That would be fewer than two attacks per day. In fact, at that time, there
were about 20-25 attacks per day, or a little more than 1% of the patrols.
Rumsfeld acknowledges that the guerrilla strikes have had an impact. In the
Reagan Library speech, he was asked what was the biggest surprise so far in
the Iraq campaign. He answered that it was the ability of the guerrillas "to
terrorize and frighten the rest of the Iraqi people and cause them not to
come over to the other side."
A major problem for the coalition stems from the makeup of the small arms
store. Those arms include not only automatic weapons and rocket-propelled
grenades but also high explosives that can be fashioned into the
remote-controlled roadside bombs used so effectively against U.S. military
convoys. Guerrillas have also increased their use of mortar attacks. And
coalition commanders are particularly concerned about man-portable
surface-to-air missiles that threaten commercial and military aircraft.
Iraq expert Anthony Cordesman of the Center for Strategic and International
Studies likened the small arms problem to controlling the flow of illegal
drugs or of money to terrorists: "You have to do what you can, but nothing
that is practical will ever succeed ... unless you can eliminate demand and
create a
climate where society rejects such behavior."
http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/iraq/2003-10-26-arms-iraq_x.htm
--
A hard truth appears to have escaped the notice of the public and received
scant attention from the media: Bush is the first president in American
history to use deceptive propaganda as his main means of communications in
selling his policies. His pattern of deception continues unabated and in
direct conflict with the notion of the public's informed consent that is
central to American democracy.
http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/news/opinion/6378746.htm
.
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| User: "Bryan" |
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| Title: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended."10.27.03 |
27 Oct 2003 10:24:18 PM |
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Are we to understand that you are a total pacifist, and urge our nation
to withdraw, and just hope we don't get attacked?
Tom Jefferson wrote:
Bring em on sez AWOL Dubya and that's exactly what they're doing.
------------------------------------------------------
Admiral Kelly, Captain Card (ph), officers and sailors of the USS Abraham
Lincoln, my fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended. In
the battle of Iraq, the United States and our allies have prevailed.
http://www.milparts.net/bush-on-uss-lincoln.html
-------------------------------------------------------
10/26/2003 8:51 PM
Guerrillas in no danger of running out of arms
By John Diamond, USA TODAY
WASHINGTON — Iraqi guerrillas have an abundant supply of small arms and
explosives that could allow them to maintain their pace of attacks
indefinitely, Pentagon and U.S. Central Command intelligence analysts have
concluded.
The guerrillas' shoot-and-scoot tactics use up relatively little ammunition
while inflicting serious casualties and even deeper psychological damage.
At least 107 U.S. troops have died in guerrilla attacks and other hostile
action in Iraq since May 1. And although Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld
has argued that the attacks are relatively few considering the size of the
country, he acknowledges they have succeeded in intimidating Iraqis who
might otherwise support the coalition.
Iraq's armed forces disbanded and melted into the countryside in late April
during the final stages of the U.S.-led effort to topple Saddam Hussein's
regime by force. The Iraqi soldiers took their weapons home with them.
Coalition forces took note of an ominous sign at the end of the fighting:
hundreds of disabled Iraqi military vehicles along roads and in fields,
stripped of any ammunition.
The discovery of thousands of arms caches — not only at military bases, but
also in schools, mosques, hospitals and homes — indicates to U.S. commanders
that there remain thousands more undiscovered caches accessible to
guerrillas.
Coalition commanders have various estimates for how much is stored in those
caches. Army Lt. Gen. Ricardo Sanchez cited an estimate of 650,000 tons, an
enormous figure equal to about a third of the U.S. military's vast
ammunition stockpile. Brig. Gen. Robert Davis, the officer in charge of a
program to collect and destroy Iraqi weapons stocks, said the figure could
be closer to 1 million tons.
Dan Coberly, spokesman for the Army Corps of Engineers, which is overseeing
destruction of seized Iraqi arms, said in an interview, "No one has a firm
number for the total amount" of small arms in Iraq.
"We don't have any notion at this point where all of these sites are,"
Sanchez told reporters in Baghdad last week. "We're still finding ammunition
in backyards. Every day we're finding it."
Central Command, the military headquarters responsible for U.S. operations
in Iraq, has been under pressure from Capitol Hill to explain why it has not
secured all of the conventional weapons caches found since major combat was
declared over May 1.
"There are so many different places where the forces on the ground have
discovered weapons caches, and to dedicate soldiers to guard them before
they are confiscated or destroyed is simply impossible," said a Central
Command spokesman, Sgt. Danny Martin.
The problem facing U.S. and allied soldiers stems not from weapons snatched
by guerrillas from under the noses of coalition guards but rather from
weapons the guerrillas already had when the main fighting ended six months
ago.
Much of what coalition forces do in Iraq revolves around small arms — either
looking for them, securing them or dodging them.
Two U.S. intelligence officials, one civilian, the other military, said
there is simply no way to keep weapons out of the hands of guerrillas.
Instead, the focus is turning to finding technologies that can be used to
detect mines, booby traps and roadside bombs before they inflict casualties
on coalition patrols.
The combination of readily available small arms and explosives with tactics
that require relatively little use of ammunition indicates that Iraqi forces
will be able to sustain their ambush-style attacks indefinitely, these two
intelligence officials said.
Rumsfeld has argued that the news media are overplaying the significance of
the attacks and that most of Iraq is stable and calm. In a speech Oct. 10 at
the Ronald Reagan Presidential Library in Simi Valley, Calif., Rumsfeld said
that of 1,700 coalition patrols per day, only about one-tenth of 1%
encounter violence.
That would be fewer than two attacks per day. In fact, at that time, there
were about 20-25 attacks per day, or a little more than 1% of the patrols.
Rumsfeld acknowledges that the guerrilla strikes have had an impact. In the
Reagan Library speech, he was asked what was the biggest surprise so far in
the Iraq campaign. He answered that it was the ability of the guerrillas "to
terrorize and frighten the rest of the Iraqi people and cause them not to
come over to the other side."
A major problem for the coalition stems from the makeup of the small arms
store. Those arms include not only automatic weapons and rocket-propelled
grenades but also high explosives that can be fashioned into the
remote-controlled roadside bombs used so effectively against U.S. military
convoys. Guerrillas have also increased their use of mortar attacks. And
coalition commanders are particularly concerned about man-portable
surface-to-air missiles that threaten commercial and military aircraft.
Iraq expert Anthony Cordesman of the Center for Strategic and International
Studies likened the small arms problem to controlling the flow of illegal
drugs or of money to terrorists: "You have to do what you can, but nothing
that is practical will ever succeed ... unless you can eliminate demand and
create a
climate where society rejects such behavior."
http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/iraq/2003-10-26-arms-iraq_x.htm
--
A hard truth appears to have escaped the notice of the public and received
scant attention from the media: Bush is the first president in American
history to use deceptive propaganda as his main means of communications in
selling his policies. His pattern of deception continues unabated and in
direct conflict with the notion of the public's informed consent that is
central to American democracy.
http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/news/opinion/6378746.htm
.
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| User: "Piglet" |
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| Title: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended." 10.27.03 |
28 Oct 2003 12:07:35 AM |
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"Bryan" <Bryan@news.net> wrote in message
news:Sbmnb.44720$Fm2.21441@attbi_s04...
Are we to understand that you are a total pacifist, and urge our nation
to withdraw, and just hope we don't get attacked?
Are we to understand that you are a total warmonger, and urge our nation to
attack, and just hope that after killing (more) of people's families and
colonizing their land and stealing their resources we don't get attacked?
.
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| User: "Plonk!" |
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| Title: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended." 10.27.03 |
28 Oct 2003 12:10:09 AM |
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"Piglet" <Piglet@RNC.org> wrote in message
news:HInnb.17104$294.13279@nwrdny03.gnilink.net...
"Bryan" <Bryan@news.net> wrote in message
news:Sbmnb.44720$Fm2.21441@attbi_s04...
Are we to understand that you are a total pacifist, and urge our nation
to withdraw, and just hope we don't get attacked?
Are we to understand that you are a total warmonger, and urge our nation
to
attack, and just hope that after killing (more) of people's families and
colonizing their land and stealing their resources we don't get attacked?
Unwarranted, unsubstantiated, ***** response.
.
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| User: "Bryan" |
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| Title: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended."10.27.03 |
28 Oct 2003 11:46:42 PM |
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InsuranceBroker wrote:
Subject: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have
ended." 10.27.03
From: "Plonk!" Plonk!@liberalismisstupid.com
Date: 10/28/2003 1:10 AM Eastern Standard Time
Message-id: <5Lnnb.46028$Tr4.103454@attbi_s03>
"Piglet" <Piglet@RNC.org> wrote in message
news:HInnb.17104$294.13279@nwrdny03.gnilink.net...
"Bryan" <Bryan@news.net> wrote in message
news:Sbmnb.44720$Fm2.21441@attbi_s04...
Are we to understand that you are a total pacifist, and urge our nation
to withdraw, and just hope we don't get attacked?
Are we to understand that you are a total warmonger, and urge our nation
to
attack, and just hope that after killing (more) of people's families and
colonizing their land and stealing their resources we don't get attacked?
Unwarranted, unsubstantiated, ***** response.
Actually it is a very good answer. It is your warmongering that is
unsubstantiated *****.
It was dumb, uninformed, and as juvenile as your similar contribution here.
Doing Insurance business in the Garden State
.
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| User: "Bryan" |
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| Title: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended."10.27.03 |
28 Oct 2003 11:34:58 PM |
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Rico wrote:
In article <5Lnnb.46028$Tr4.103454@attbi_s03>, "Plonk!" <Plonk!@liberalismisstupid.com> wrote:
"Piglet" <Piglet@RNC.org> wrote in message
news:HInnb.17104$294.13279@nwrdny03.gnilink.net...
"Bryan" <Bryan@news.net> wrote in message
news:Sbmnb.44720$Fm2.21441@attbi_s04...
Are we to understand that you are a total pacifist, and urge our nation
to withdraw, and just hope we don't get attacked?
Are we to understand that you are a total warmonger, and urge our nation
to
attack, and just hope that after killing (more) of people's families and
colonizing their land and stealing their resources we don't get attacked?
Unwarranted, unsubstantiated, ***** response.
It what way do you think we are winning the hearts and minds of these
people?
How about from the people of Iraq who when recently polled voiced their
support of US activities, overwhelmingly.
With talent on loan from Merck
.
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| User: "InsuranceBroker" |
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| Title: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended." |
29 Oct 2003 06:39:36 AM |
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Subject: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have
ended."
From: Bryan
Date: 10/29/2003 12:34 AM Eastern Standard Time
Message-id: <6kInb.38236$mZ5.214668@attbi_s54>
"Piglet" <Piglet@RNC.org> wrote in message
news:HInnb.17104$294.13279@nwrdny03.gnilink.net...
"Bryan" < > wrote in message
news:Sbmnb.44720$Fm2.21441@attbi_s04...
Are we to understand that you are a total pacifist, and urge our nation
to withdraw, and just hope we don't get attacked?
Are we to understand that you are a total warmonger, and urge our nation
to
attack, and just hope that after killing (more) of people's families and
colonizing their land and stealing their resources we don't get attacked?
Unwarranted, unsubstantiated, ***** response.
It what way do you think we are winning the hearts and minds of these
people?
How about from the people of Iraq who when recently polled voiced their
support of US activities, overwhelmingly.
With talent on loan from Merck
Do you really think that someone is going to give an honest answer when they
know that nightly the US military is knocking down doors and breaking into the
houses. One wrong answer could get you a night visit.
Doing Insurance business in the Garden State
.
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| User: "Bryan" |
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| Title: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended." |
29 Oct 2003 07:07:05 PM |
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InsuranceBroker wrote:
Subject: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have
ended."
From: Bryan
Date: 10/29/2003 12:34 AM Eastern Standard Time
Message-id: <6kInb.38236$mZ5.214668@attbi_s54>
"Piglet" <Piglet@RNC.org> wrote in message
news:HInnb.17104$294.13279@nwrdny03.gnilink.net...
"Bryan" < > wrote in message
news:Sbmnb.44720$Fm2.21441@attbi_s04...
Are we to understand that you are a total pacifist, and urge our nation
to withdraw, and just hope we don't get attacked?
Are we to understand that you are a total warmonger, and urge our nation
to
attack, and just hope that after killing (more) of people's families and
colonizing their land and stealing their resources we don't get attacked?
Unwarranted, unsubstantiated, ***** response.
It what way do you think we are winning the hearts and minds of these
people?
How about from the people of Iraq who when recently polled voiced their
support of US activities, overwhelmingly.
With talent on loan from Merck
Do you really think that someone is going to give an honest answer when they
know that nightly the US military is knocking down doors and breaking into the
houses. One wrong answer could get you a night visit.
Do you honestly believe that this is new to those people there?
If you are an intelligent citizen of Baghdad, you have 2 fundamental
choices..... either believe the anti-American rubbish freely published
on Al-Jahzeerah and other media, or believe your own lying eyes. They
obviously lie, becuase what any Iraqi can see with their own eyes does
not match what they get from the media.
Doing Insurance business in the Garden State
.
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| User: "Rico" |
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| Title: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended."10.27.03 |
29 Oct 2003 09:15:40 AM |
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In article <6kInb.38236$mZ5.214668@attbi_s54>, Bryan <Bryan@news.net> wrote:
Rico wrote:
In article <5Lnnb.46028$Tr4.103454@attbi_s03>, "Plonk!"
<Plonk!@liberalismisstupid.com> wrote:
"Piglet" <Piglet@RNC.org> wrote in message
news:HInnb.17104$294.13279@nwrdny03.gnilink.net...
"Bryan" <Bryan@news.net> wrote in message
news:Sbmnb.44720$Fm2.21441@attbi_s04...
Are we to understand that you are a total pacifist, and urge our nation
to withdraw, and just hope we don't get attacked?
Are we to understand that you are a total warmonger, and urge our nation
to
attack, and just hope that after killing (more) of people's families and
colonizing their land and stealing their resources we don't get attacked?
Unwarranted, unsubstantiated, ***** response.
It what way do you think we are winning the hearts and minds of these
people?
How about from the people of Iraq who when recently polled voiced their
support of US activities, overwhelmingly.
That would be the same people who blew up the Red Cross, and missled
Rummy's hotel? You actually think they are going to say negative things
about the US to a pollster with a Marine standing a few feet away?
With talent on loan from Merck
With talent on loan from Merck
.
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| User: "Jefferson Brady" |
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| Title: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended." 10.27.03 |
29 Oct 2003 04:48:25 AM |
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On Wed, 29 Oct 2003 05:34:58 GMT, Bryan <Bryan@news.net> wrote:
Rico wrote:
In article <5Lnnb.46028$Tr4.103454@attbi_s03>, "Plonk!" <Plonk!@liberalismisstupid.com> wrote:
"Piglet" <Piglet@RNC.org> wrote in message
news:HInnb.17104$294.13279@nwrdny03.gnilink.net...
"Bryan" <Bryan@news.net> wrote in message
news:Sbmnb.44720$Fm2.21441@attbi_s04...
Are we to understand that you are a total pacifist, and urge our nation
to withdraw, and just hope we don't get attacked?
Are we to understand that you are a total warmonger, and urge our nation
to
attack, and just hope that after killing (more) of people's families and
colonizing their land and stealing their resources we don't get attacked?
Unwarranted, unsubstantiated, ***** response.
It what way do you think we are winning the hearts and minds of these
people?
How about from the people of Iraq who when recently polled voiced their
support of US activities, overwhelmingly.
Guess you didn't read or understand the poll. They pretty much all
want the US the hell out of their country ASAP. Those aren't rose
petals they're throwing at the invaders, they're grenades. Iraqis may
be glad to see saddam gone but the dictator who has taken his place is
murdering Iraqi civilians every day.
With talent on loan from Merck
.
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| User: "Bryan" |
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| Title: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended."10.27.03 |
29 Oct 2003 06:47:28 PM |
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Jefferson Brady wrote:
On Wed, 29 Oct 2003 05:34:58 GMT, Bryan <Bryan@news.net> wrote:
Rico wrote:
In article <5Lnnb.46028$Tr4.103454@attbi_s03>, "Plonk!" <Plonk!@liberalismisstupid.com> wrote:
"Piglet" <Piglet@RNC.org> wrote in message
news:HInnb.17104$294.13279@nwrdny03.gnilink.net...
"Bryan" <Bryan@news.net> wrote in message
news:Sbmnb.44720$Fm2.21441@attbi_s04...
Are we to understand that you are a total pacifist, and urge our nation
to withdraw, and just hope we don't get attacked?
Are we to understand that you are a total warmonger, and urge our nation
to
attack, and just hope that after killing (more) of people's families and
colonizing their land and stealing their resources we don't get attacked?
Unwarranted, unsubstantiated, ***** response.
It what way do you think we are winning the hearts and minds of these
people?
How about from the people of Iraq who when recently polled voiced their
support of US activities, overwhelmingly.
Guess you didn't read or understand the poll. They pretty much all
want the US the hell out of their country ASAP. Those aren't rose
petals they're throwing at the invaders, they're grenades. Iraqis may
be glad to see saddam gone but the dictator who has taken his place is
murdering Iraqi civilians every day.
So you have concluded that the terrorists that have moved into Iraq from
various other surrounding countries, are in fact Iraqis, that are
attacking U.N. and Red Cross buildings, and killing Iraqi citizens in
large quantities.
With talent on loan from Merck
.
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| User: "InsuranceBroker" |
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| Title: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended." |
29 Oct 2003 07:31:02 PM |
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Subject: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have
ended."
From: Bryan
Date: 10/29/2003 7:47 PM Eastern Standard Time
Message-id: <AcZnb.45306$ao4.107110@attbi_s51>
Jefferson Brady wrote:
On Wed, 29 Oct 2003 05:34:58 GMT, Bryan < > wrote:
Rico wrote:
In article <5Lnnb.46028$Tr4.103454@attbi_s03>, "Plonk!"
<Plonk!@liberalismisstupid.com> wrote:
"Piglet" <Piglet@RNC.org> wrote in message
news:HInnb.17104$294.13279@nwrdny03.gnilink.net...
"Bryan" < > wrote in message
news:Sbmnb.44720$Fm2.21441@attbi_s04...
Are we to understand that you are a total pacifist, and urge our nation
to withdraw, and just hope we don't get attacked?
Are we to understand that you are a total warmonger, and urge our nation
to
attack, and just hope that after killing (more) of people's families and
colonizing their land and stealing their resources we don't get
attacked?
Unwarranted, unsubstantiated, ***** response.
It what way do you think we are winning the hearts and minds of these
people?
How about from the people of Iraq who when recently polled voiced their
support of US activities, overwhelmingly.
Guess you didn't read or understand the poll. They pretty much all
want the US the hell out of their country ASAP. Those aren't rose
petals they're throwing at the invaders, they're grenades. Iraqis may
be glad to see saddam gone but the dictator who has taken his place is
murdering Iraqi civilians every day.
So you have concluded that the terrorists that have moved into Iraq from
various other surrounding countries, are in fact Iraqis, that are
attacking U.N. and Red Cross buildings, and killing Iraqi citizens in
large quantities.
How would you know who or what they are. Are you going to tell us the the US
that cannot stop these people know who they are. Get real will you. Iraq is
controled by the US Military. If they had any clue who was doing these deeds
they would be in cuba.
With talent on loan from Merck
Doing Insurance business in the Garden State
.
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| User: "Bryan" |
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| Title: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended." |
29 Oct 2003 11:10:08 PM |
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InsuranceBroker wrote:
Subject: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have
ended."
From: Bryan
Date: 10/29/2003 7:47 PM Eastern Standard Time
Message-id: <AcZnb.45306$ao4.107110@attbi_s51>
Jefferson Brady wrote:
On Wed, 29 Oct 2003 05:34:58 GMT, Bryan < > wrote:
Rico wrote:
In article <5Lnnb.46028$Tr4.103454@attbi_s03>, "Plonk!"
<Plonk!@liberalismisstupid.com> wrote:
"Piglet" <Piglet@RNC.org> wrote in message
news:HInnb.17104$294.13279@nwrdny03.gnilink.net...
"Bryan" < > wrote in message
news:Sbmnb.44720$Fm2.21441@attbi_s04...
Are we to understand that you are a total pacifist, and urge our nation
to withdraw, and just hope we don't get attacked?
Are we to understand that you are a total warmonger, and urge our nation
to
attack, and just hope that after killing (more) of people's families and
colonizing their land and stealing their resources we don't get
attacked?
Unwarranted, unsubstantiated, ***** response.
It what way do you think we are winning the hearts and minds of these
people?
How about from the people of Iraq who when recently polled voiced their
support of US activities, overwhelmingly.
Guess you didn't read or understand the poll. They pretty much all
want the US the hell out of their country ASAP. Those aren't rose
petals they're throwing at the invaders, they're grenades. Iraqis may
be glad to see saddam gone but the dictator who has taken his place is
murdering Iraqi civilians every day.
So you have concluded that the terrorists that have moved into Iraq from
various other surrounding countries, are in fact Iraqis, that are
attacking U.N. and Red Cross buildings, and killing Iraqi citizens in
large quantities.
How would you know who or what they are. Are you going to tell us the the US
that cannot stop these people know who they are. Get real will you. Iraq is
controled by the US Military. If they had any clue who was doing these deeds
they would be in cuba.
Simple. I read much of the worlds news sources. Try to read the news
more and rely on less soundbites.
http://www.ohio.com/mld/ohio/6702154.htm
http://politics.guardian.co.uk/iraq/story/0,12956,1038104,00.html
http://www.thestate.com/mld/thestate/news/nation/6702154.htm
http://www.washtimes.com/national/20030807-112754-4609r.htm
http://news.indiainfo.com/spotlight/usiraqwar/07terrorists.html
http://usinfo.state.gov/topical/pol/terror/
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,97472,00.html
Take your pick, but if you can just get through 1 or 2 of the articles,
you might be able to see how to think for yourself on this subject
moreso than you have displayed in past posts. I tried to provide you
with a wide array of biassed sources. Anything from the Washington
Times to the US Government.
With talent on loan from Merck
Doing Insurance business in the Garden State
.
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| User: "Rico" |
|
| Title: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended."10.27.03 |
30 Oct 2003 08:04:43 AM |
|
|
In article <AcZnb.45306$ao4.107110@attbi_s51>, Bryan <Bryan@news.net> wrote:
Jefferson Brady wrote:
On Wed, 29 Oct 2003 05:34:58 GMT, Bryan <Bryan@news.net> wrote:
Rico wrote:
In article <5Lnnb.46028$Tr4.103454@attbi_s03>, "Plonk!"
<Plonk!@liberalismisstupid.com> wrote:
"Piglet" <Piglet@RNC.org> wrote in message
news:HInnb.17104$294.13279@nwrdny03.gnilink.net...
"Bryan" <Bryan@news.net> wrote in message
news:Sbmnb.44720$Fm2.21441@attbi_s04...
Are we to understand that you are a total pacifist, and urge our nation
to withdraw, and just hope we don't get attacked?
Are we to understand that you are a total warmonger, and urge our nation
to
attack, and just hope that after killing (more) of people's families and
colonizing their land and stealing their resources we don't get attacked?
Unwarranted, unsubstantiated, ***** response.
It what way do you think we are winning the hearts and minds of these
people?
How about from the people of Iraq who when recently polled voiced their
support of US activities, overwhelmingly.
Guess you didn't read or understand the poll. They pretty much all
want the US the hell out of their country ASAP. Those aren't rose
petals they're throwing at the invaders, they're grenades. Iraqis may
be glad to see saddam gone but the dictator who has taken his place is
murdering Iraqi civilians every day.
So you have concluded that the terrorists that have moved into Iraq from
various other surrounding countries, are in fact Iraqis, that are
attacking U.N. and Red Cross buildings, and killing Iraqi citizens in
large quantities.
Funny thing, these outsiders you say are killing Iraqiis, they were not
there before bush and you decided a bunch of young American's needed to
die.
With talent on loan from Merck
.
|
|
|
| User: "Bryan" |
|
| Title: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended."10.27.03 |
30 Oct 2003 10:00:13 PM |
|
|
Rico wrote:
In article <AcZnb.45306$ao4.107110@attbi_s51>, Bryan <Bryan@news.net> wrote:
Jefferson Brady wrote:
On Wed, 29 Oct 2003 05:34:58 GMT, Bryan <Bryan@news.net> wrote:
Rico wrote:
In article <5Lnnb.46028$Tr4.103454@attbi_s03>, "Plonk!"
<Plonk!@liberalismisstupid.com> wrote:
"Piglet" <Piglet@RNC.org> wrote in message
news:HInnb.17104$294.13279@nwrdny03.gnilink.net...
"Bryan" <Bryan@news.net> wrote in message
news:Sbmnb.44720$Fm2.21441@attbi_s04...
Are we to understand that you are a total pacifist, and urge our nation
to withdraw, and just hope we don't get attacked?
Are we to understand that you are a total warmonger, and urge our nation
to
attack, and just hope that after killing (more) of people's families and
colonizing their land and stealing their resources we don't get attacked?
Unwarranted, unsubstantiated, ***** response.
It what way do you think we are winning the hearts and minds of these
people?
How about from the people of Iraq who when recently polled voiced their
support of US activities, overwhelmingly.
Guess you didn't read or understand the poll. They pretty much all
want the US the hell out of their country ASAP. Those aren't rose
petals they're throwing at the invaders, they're grenades. Iraqis may
be glad to see saddam gone but the dictator who has taken his place is
murdering Iraqi civilians every day.
So you have concluded that the terrorists that have moved into Iraq from
various other surrounding countries, are in fact Iraqis, that are
attacking U.N. and Red Cross buildings, and killing Iraqi citizens in
large quantities.
Funny thing, these outsiders you say are killing Iraqiis, they were not
there before bush and you decided a bunch of young American's needed to
die.
And is your point that this makes terrorism justifiable?
With talent on loan from Merck
.
|
|
|
| User: "Rico" |
|
| Title: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended."10.27.03 |
01 Nov 2003 03:14:07 PM |
|
|
In article <ZxJob.58720$9E1.259709@attbi_s52>, Bryan <Bryan@news.net> wrote:
Rico wrote:
In article <h7lob.66083$Tr4.185945@attbi_s03>, Bryan <Bryan@news.net> wrote:
Rico wrote:
In article <AcZnb.45306$ao4.107110@attbi_s51>, Bryan <Bryan@news.net> wrote:
Jefferson Brady wrote:
On Wed, 29 Oct 2003 05:34:58 GMT, Bryan <Bryan@news.net> wrote:
Rico wrote:
In article <5Lnnb.46028$Tr4.103454@attbi_s03>, "Plonk!"
<Plonk!@liberalismisstupid.com> wrote:
"Piglet" <Piglet@RNC.org> wrote in message
news:HInnb.17104$294.13279@nwrdny03.gnilink.net...
"Bryan" <Bryan@news.net> wrote in message
news:Sbmnb.44720$Fm2.21441@attbi_s04...
Are we to understand that you are a total pacifist, and urge our
nation
to withdraw, and just hope we don't get attacked?
Are we to understand that you are a total warmonger, and urge our
nation
to
attack, and just hope that after killing (more) of people's families
and
colonizing their land and stealing their resources we don't get
attacked?
Unwarranted, unsubstantiated, ***** response.
It what way do you think we are winning the hearts and minds of these
people?
How about from the people of Iraq who when recently polled voiced their
support of US activities, overwhelmingly.
Guess you didn't read or understand the poll. They pretty much all
want the US the hell out of their country ASAP. Those aren't rose
petals they're throwing at the invaders, they're grenades. Iraqis may
be glad to see saddam gone but the dictator who has taken his place is
murdering Iraqi civilians every day.
So you have concluded that the terrorists that have moved into Iraq from
various other surrounding countries, are in fact Iraqis, that are
attacking U.N. and Red Cross buildings, and killing Iraqi citizens in
large quantities.
Funny thing, these outsiders you say are killing Iraqiis, they were not
there before bush and you decided a bunch of young American's needed to
die.
And is your point that this makes terrorism justifiable?
No, that you and bush have encouraged it and made it possible. I thought
that was obvious. You have turned secular Iraq in to a hotbed of radical
Islam, good going.
Me and Bush as Muslims? I thought Islam was managed and administrated
by the Islamic world?
You really don't think you have turn Iraq into a magnet for every radical
muslim in the world? You thinbk your actions don't have consequenses??
By your account, because some fundamentalist
prats choose to hijack that religion, and an entire people, we are to
blame?
You and bush toppled the secular regime in Iraq. Do you not have even a
basic grasp of what has happened? DO you not understand that you have and
bush are the poster children for radical muslims recruiting new suicide
bombers. I'll bet al qaeda has to turn away recruits these days because
they cannot train them fast enough, where as a year ago, they were likely
beating the drums trying to find them.
Speaking oof al qaeda, still think they were the government in Afghanistan?
(see earlier post you made about bin laden, same thread)?
Now you are insulting all Muslims everywhere, by suggesting
that they are like you and are unable to think for themselves.
Oh, I think you and bush and your ilk have given them lots to think about.
What is that General's name in charge of Afghanistan, name slips me at the
moment.
Thank God I don't know you.... but I'd swear that you were ignorant
enough to be a Liberal.
And yet, I provide cites when I make straight out statements and to date
you have posted one and only one. Now if I ma ignorant, why do you not
provide citations so I can learn. You don't expect me to accept your word
alone do you? What are your credinitals that would make you a primary
authority on the subject or a primary source? (do you understand what is
meant here by the idea of primary souce?)
For the record, we turned Iraq away from being tortured and enslaved by
Sadam and his thugs. I call that a Liberation.
Expect this was not your sales pitch leading up to the war. If you were
after an end to torture and slavery, why iraq and not one of the dozens of
other hell holes around the world. N. Korea? Zimbabwe? Namibia? Iran?
Myanmar? Malasia? Would you like me to name more? Why Iraq instead of one
or more of these if your concern is liberation? Myanmar has about 3 times
the population.
With talent on loan from Merck
With talent on loan from Merck
Because it's murder by numbers, one, two, three
It's as easy to learn as your ABC
Murder by numbers, one, two, three
It's as easy to learn as your A, B, C, D, E
.
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| User: "Bryan" |
|
| Title: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended."10.27.03 |
01 Nov 2003 09:34:20 PM |
|
|
Rico wrote:
In article <ZxJob.58720$9E1.259709@attbi_s52>, Bryan <Bryan@news.net> wrote:
Rico wrote:
In article <h7lob.66083$Tr4.185945@attbi_s03>, Bryan <Bryan@news.net> wrote:
Rico wrote:
In article <AcZnb.45306$ao4.107110@attbi_s51>, Bryan <Bryan@news.net> wrote:
Jefferson Brady wrote:
On Wed, 29 Oct 2003 05:34:58 GMT, Bryan <Bryan@news.net> wrote:
Rico wrote:
In article <5Lnnb.46028$Tr4.103454@attbi_s03>, "Plonk!"
<Plonk!@liberalismisstupid.com> wrote:
"Piglet" <Piglet@RNC.org> wrote in message
news:HInnb.17104$294.13279@nwrdny03.gnilink.net...
"Bryan" <Bryan@news.net> wrote in message
news:Sbmnb.44720$Fm2.21441@attbi_s04...
Are we to understand that you are a total pacifist, and urge our
nation
to withdraw, and just hope we don't get attacked?
Are we to understand that you are a total warmonger, and urge our
nation
to
attack, and just hope that after killing (more) of people's families
and
colonizing their land and stealing their resources we don't get
attacked?
Unwarranted, unsubstantiated, ***** response.
It what way do you think we are winning the hearts and minds of these
people?
How about from the people of Iraq who when recently polled voiced their
support of US activities, overwhelmingly.
Guess you didn't read or understand the poll. They pretty much all
want the US the hell out of their country ASAP. Those aren't rose
petals they're throwing at the invaders, they're grenades. Iraqis may
be glad to see saddam gone but the dictator who has taken his place is
murdering Iraqi civilians every day.
So you have concluded that the terrorists that have moved into Iraq from
various other surrounding countries, are in fact Iraqis, that are
attacking U.N. and Red Cross buildings, and killing Iraqi citizens in
large quantities.
Funny thing, these outsiders you say are killing Iraqiis, they were not
there before bush and you decided a bunch of young American's needed to
die.
And is your point that this makes terrorism justifiable?
No, that you and bush have encouraged it and made it possible. I thought
that was obvious. You have turned secular Iraq in to a hotbed of radical
Islam, good going.
Me and Bush as Muslims? I thought Islam was managed and administrated
by the Islamic world?
You really don't think you have turn Iraq into a magnet for every radical
muslim in the world? You thinbk your actions don't have consequenses??
By your account, because some fundamentalist
prats choose to hijack that religion, and an entire people, we are to
blame?
You and bush toppled the secular regime in Iraq. Do you not have even a
basic grasp of what has happened? DO you not understand that you have and
bush are the poster children for radical muslims recruiting new suicide
bombers. I'll bet al qaeda has to turn away recruits these days because
they cannot train them fast enough, where as a year ago, they were likely
beating the drums trying to find them.
Yes Liberation can be a frightening thing.... so can ignorance and
hatred. If the willing are dumb enough to sign up to take on their
imagined enemy, then let them.
Unlike you, I do not presume to think I can control what others decide
to believe. The fact that you and them are completely wrong, dos not
mean that the US policy needs to be changed.
Speaking oof al qaeda, still think they were the government in Afghanistan?
(see earlier post you made about bin laden, same thread)?
Now you are insulting all Muslims everywhere, by suggesting
that they are like you and are unable to think for themselves.
Oh, I think you and bush and your ilk have given them lots to think about.
What is that General's name in charge of Afghanistan, name slips me at the
moment.
Thank God I don't know you.... but I'd swear that you were ignorant
enough to be a Liberal.
And yet, I provide cites when I make straight out statements and to date
you have posted one and only one. Now if I ma ignorant, why do you not
provide citations so I can learn. You don't expect me to accept your word
alone do you? What are your credinitals that would make you a primary
authority on the subject or a primary source? (do you understand what is
meant here by the idea of primary souce?)
For the record, we turned Iraq away from being tortured and enslaved by
Sadam and his thugs. I call that a Liberation.
Expect this was not your sales pitch leading up to the war. If you were
after an end to torture and slavery, why iraq and not one of the dozens of
other hell holes around the world. N. Korea? Zimbabwe? Namibia? Iran?
Myanmar? Malasia? Would you like me to name more? Why Iraq instead of one
or more of these if your concern is liberation? Myanmar has about 3 times
the population.
With talent on loan from Merck
With talent on loan from Merck
Because it's murder by numbers, one, two, three
It's as easy to learn as your ABC
Murder by numbers, one, two, three
It's as easy to learn as your A, B, C, D, E
.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
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| User: "Bryan" |
|
| Title: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended."10.27.03 |
28 Oct 2003 11:45:19 PM |
|
|
InsuranceBroker wrote:
Subject: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have
ended." 10.27.03
From: "Piglet"
Date: 10/28/2003 1:07 AM Eastern Standard Time
Message-id: <HInnb.17104$294.13279@nwrdny03.gnilink.net>
"Bryan" <Bryan@news.net> wrote in message
news:Sbmnb.44720$Fm2.21441@attbi_s04...
Are we to understand that you are a total pacifist, and urge our nation
to withdraw, and just hope we don't get attacked?
Are we to understand that you are a total warmonger, and urge our nation to
attack, and just hope that after killing (more) of people's families and
colonizing their land and stealing their resources we don't get attacked?
Actually the guy posted a good question. What would have happened if we had
pulled out and only keep Saddam in check. We would be hundreds of billions of
dollars to the better. Saddam would probably be less of a threat than he is
today. There is nothing like getting the strongest military in the world into
quicksand to improve the status.
What is amazing is they pose such question and expect people to think that the
world would fall apart if we do not get invovled in another war to grab the oil
reserves.
I disagree with the entire premise of your argument. The US did not
invade on any merit of international opinion, nor is the invasion buried
in quicksand. That's the whole point. Blame the President for relying
on our intel reports. Blame or intel community for false conclusions.
But respect the fact that the President acted on the best available
intelligence at the time. This same intelligence only underscored the
very same conclusions that were drawn by the UN for a decade, resulting
in sanctions and inspections. These are also the same conclusions that
the Clinton Administration came to in 1998, and further insisted that
Sadam be bombed and replaced.
Try to consider that this terrorism is due to arrive on US soil soon.
All that is happening in Baghdad, is that we are thinning out the attack
on foreign soil, before it gets going here. What you might see as a
terrible quagmire as terrorists from all over the region and various
other Muslim fundamentals declare open season on our military over
there, I see as a good thing.... we are taking their asses out. You
don't hear much about that in the news, and instead are left to believe
that our troops are pointless targets. This is far from the truth or
reality there.
Doing Insurance business in the Garden State
.
|
|
|
| User: "InsuranceBroker" |
|
| Title: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended." |
29 Oct 2003 06:44:47 AM |
|
|
Subject: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have
ended."
From: Bryan
Date: 10/29/2003 12:45 AM Eastern Standard Time
Message-id: <PtInb.41714$ao4.98745@attbi_s51>
InsuranceBroker wrote:
Subject: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have
ended." 10.27.03
From: "Piglet"
Date: 10/28/2003 1:07 AM Eastern Standard Time
Message-id: <HInnb.17104$294.13279@nwrdny03.gnilink.net>
"Bryan" < > wrote in message
news:Sbmnb.44720$Fm2.21441@attbi_s04...
Are we to understand that you are a total pacifist, and urge our nation
to withdraw, and just hope we don't get attacked?
Are we to understand that you are a total warmonger, and urge our nation to
attack, and just hope that after killing (more) of people's families and
colonizing their land and stealing their resources we don't get attacked?
Actually the guy posted a good question. What would have happened if we had
pulled out and only keep Saddam in check. We would be hundreds of billions
of
dollars to the better. Saddam would probably be less of a threat than he is
today. There is nothing like getting the strongest military in the world
into
quicksand to improve the status.
What is amazing is they pose such question and expect people to think that
the
world would fall apart if we do not get invovled in another war to grab the
oil
reserves.
I disagree with the entire premise of your argument. The US did not
invade on any merit of international opinion, nor is the invasion buried
in quicksand. That's the whole point. Blame the President for relying
on our intel reports. Blame or intel community for false conclusions.
But respect the fact that the President acted on the best available
intelligence at the time. This same intelligence only underscored the
very same conclusions that were drawn by the UN for a decade, resulting
in sanctions and inspections. These are also the same conclusions that
the Clinton Administration came to in 1998, and further insisted that
Sadam be bombed and replaced.
Try to consider that this terrorism is due to arrive on US soil soon.
The is nothing to support that if we had not started the war in Iraq that
terrorism would be more or less than it is today. I believe that it has made
us much more in danger than if we did not attack.
All that is happening in Baghdad, is that we are thinning out the attack
on foreign soil, before it gets going here. What you might see as a
terrible quagmire as terrorists from all over the region and various
other Muslim fundamentals declare open season on our military over
there, I see as a good thing.... we are taking their asses out. You
don't hear much about that in the news, and instead are left to believe
that our troops are pointless targets. This is far from the truth or
reality there.
Iraq was not a sponsor of terrorist. Saddam was pretty much contained and all
the right wing crap has not changed that. The US Airforce had total control of
his airspace. As proven by the war, Saddam was not a military threat to the
United States.
Iraq was a target of greater Israel. If you look at the people who expressed
and pushed for the war, you will see a very large number had ties to Israel.
It is hard to ignore that they might not have had the United States interest as
first priority.
Doing Insurance business in the Garden State
Doing Insurance business in the Garden State
.
|
|
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| User: "BW" |
|
| Title: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended." |
29 Oct 2003 12:08:37 PM |
|
|
"InsuranceBroker" <insurancenj@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20031029074447.22437.00000279@mb-m02.aol.com...
Subject: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have
ended."
From: Bryan
Date: 10/29/2003 12:45 AM Eastern Standard Time
Message-id: <PtInb.41714$ao4.98745@attbi_s51>
InsuranceBroker wrote:
Subject: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have
ended." 10.27.03
From: "Piglet"
Date: 10/28/2003 1:07 AM Eastern Standard Time
Message-id: <HInnb.17104$294.13279@nwrdny03.gnilink.net>
"Bryan" < > wrote in message
news:Sbmnb.44720$Fm2.21441@attbi_s04...
Are we to understand that you are a total pacifist, and urge our
nation
to withdraw, and just hope we don't get attacked?
Are we to understand that you are a total warmonger, and urge our
nation to
attack, and just hope that after killing (more) of people's families
and
colonizing their land and stealing their resources we don't get
attacked?
Actually the guy posted a good question. What would have happened if we
had
pulled out and only keep Saddam in check. We would be hundreds of
billions
of
dollars to the better. Saddam would probably be less of a threat than
he is
today. There is nothing like getting the strongest military in the
world
into
quicksand to improve the status.
What is amazing is they pose such question and expect people to think
that
the
world would fall apart if we do not get invovled in another war to grab
the
oil
reserves.
I disagree with the entire premise of your argument. The US did not
invade on any merit of international opinion, nor is the invasion buried
in quicksand. That's the whole point. Blame the President for relying
on our intel reports. Blame or intel community for false conclusions.
But respect the fact that the President acted on the best available
intelligence at the time. This same intelligence only underscored the
very same conclusions that were drawn by the UN for a decade, resulting
in sanctions and inspections. These are also the same conclusions that
the Clinton Administration came to in 1998, and further insisted that
Sadam be bombed and replaced.
Try to consider that this terrorism is due to arrive on US soil soon.
The is nothing to support that if we had not started the war in Iraq that
terrorism would be more or less than it is today. I believe that it has
made
us much more in danger than if we did not attack.
Today's Democrats, if they had been around in the 1940's, would have cut and
run when they learned Hitler was terrorizing Jews, just like they want to
cut and run when they learned that Saddam Hussein was terrorizing Iraqi
Muslims. They would have fretted, "I believe going after Adolph Hitler has
made us much more in danger than if we did not attack him".
Today's Democrat Party - the "Cut and Run Party"
.
|
|
|
| User: "John Doe" |
|
| Title: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended." |
29 Oct 2003 12:44:34 PM |
|
|
"BW" <bw4@verizon.net> wrote
"InsuranceBroker" <insurancenj@aol.com> wrote in message
The is nothing to support that if we had not started the war in Iraq
that terrorism would be more or less than it is today. I believe
that it has made us much more in danger than if we did not attack.
Today's Democrats, if they had been around in the 1940's, would have
cut and run when they learned Hitler was terrorizing Jews, just like
they want to cut and run when they learned that Saddam Hussein was
terrorizing Iraqi Muslims. They would have fretted, "I believe going
after Adolph Hitler has made us much more in danger than if we did not
attack him".
Your comparison between Adolf Hitler / Germany and Saddam Hussein / Iraq is
ludicrus.
.
|
|
|
| User: "BW" |
|
| Title: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended." |
29 Oct 2003 02:23:38 PM |
|
|
"John Doe" <Usenet@Rocks.com> wrote in message
news:Xns942381E143260wisdomandfolly@207.115.63.158...
"BW" <bw4@verizon.net> wrote
"InsuranceBroker" <insurancenj@aol.com> wrote in message
The is nothing to support that if we had not started the war in Iraq
that terrorism would be more or less than it is today. I believe
that it has made us much more in danger than if we did not attack.
Today's Democrats, if they had been around in the 1940's, would have
cut and run when they learned Hitler was terrorizing Jews, just like
they want to cut and run when they learned that Saddam Hussein was
terrorizing Iraqi Muslims. They would have fretted, "I believe going
after Adolph Hitler has made us much more in danger than if we did not
attack him".
Your comparison between Adolf Hitler / Germany and Saddam Hussein / Iraq
is
ludicrus.
No it's not. Not at all. In fact, it's quite apt.
.
|
|
|
| User: "John Doe" |
|
| Title: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended." |
29 Oct 2003 11:22:21 PM |
|
|
"BW" <bw4@verizon.net> wrote
"John Doe" <Usenet@Rocks.com> wrote in message
"BW" <bw4@verizon.net> wrote
"InsuranceBroker" <insurancenj@aol.com> wrote in message
The is nothing to support that if we had not started the war in Iraq
that terrorism would be more or less than it is today. I believe
that it has made us much more in danger than if we did not attack.
Today's Democrats, if they had been around in the 1940's, would have
cut and run
Talking tough over the Internet is easy when it isn't you doing the
fighting.
when they learned Hitler was terrorizing Jews, just like
they want to cut and run when they learned that Saddam Hussein was
terrorizing Iraqi Muslims. They would have fretted, "I believe going
after Adolph Hitler has made us much more in danger than if we did not
attack him".
Your comparison between Adolf Hitler / Germany and Saddam Hussein /
Iraq is ludicrous.
No it's not. Not at all. In fact, it's quite apt.
Saddam Hussein is an old man. Iraq never started a World War, the Gulf War
was more like a TV mini series. Iraq hasn't conquered anything outside its
borders. Iraq had almost no military after its 1991 mistake. Iraq has been
kept in check for twelve years. There is very little similar between the
two.
However, there is one problem produced in Germany we might produce in Iraq.
It went something like this.
From Time magazine, 1938.
http://www.time.com/time/poy2000/archive/1938.html
<begin quote>
The situation which gave rise to this demagogic, ignorant, desperate
movement was inherent in the German Republic's birth and in the craving of
large sections of the politically immature German people for strong,
masterful leadership. Democracy in Germany was conceived in the womb of
military defeat. It was the Republic which put its signature (unwillingly)
to the humiliating Versailles Treaty, a brand of shame which it never lived
down in German minds.
<end quote>
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| User: "John Doe" |
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| Title: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended." |
29 Oct 2003 12:51:32 PM |
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(InsuranceBroker) wrote
The is nothing to support that if we had not started the war in Iraq
that terrorism would be more or less than it is today. I believe
that it has made us much more in danger than if we did not attack.
But you know what they will say "we aren't attacking enough" and "we need
to double our efforts" and "see, the enemy is becoming desperate".
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| User: "BW" |
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| Title: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended." |
29 Oct 2003 02:23:38 PM |
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"John Doe" <Usenet@Rocks.com> wrote in message
news:Xns942383102750Dwisdomandfolly@207.115.63.158...
insurancenj@aol.com (InsuranceBroker) wrote
The is nothing to support that if we had not started the war in Iraq
that terrorism would be more or less than it is today. I believe
that it has made us much more in danger than if we did not attack.
But you know what they will say "we aren't attacking enough" and "we need
to double our efforts" and "see, the enemy is becoming desperate".
Democrats always want to cut and run. They wanted to do that in Vietnam,
and they want to do it now in our fight against the Muslim Terrorists.
Democrats are unwilling to take any positive steps to protect America or to
keep the American People safe.
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| User: "John Doe" |
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| Title: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended." |
29 Oct 2003 11:43:28 PM |
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"BW" <bw4@verizon.net> wrote
"John Doe" <Usenet@Rocks.com> wrote in message
insurancenj@aol.com (InsuranceBroker) wrote
The is nothing to support that if we had not started the war in
Iraq that terrorism would be more or less than it is today. I
believe that it has made us much more in danger than if we did not
attack.
But you know what they will say "we aren't attacking enough" and "we
need to double our efforts" and "see, the enemy is becoming
desperate".
Democrats always want to cut and run.
Right. You are a tough guy. War is cool. You've seen The Terminator 15
times.
They wanted to do that in
Vietnam, and they want to do it now in our fight against the Muslim
Terrorists. Democrats are unwilling to take any positive steps to
protect America or to keep the American People safe.
Safe from thugs with box cutters.
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| User: "Bryan" |
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| Title: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended." |
29 Oct 2003 07:15:26 PM |
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InsuranceBroker wrote:
Subject: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have
ended."
From: Bryan
Date: 10/29/2003 12:45 AM Eastern Standard Time
Message-id: <PtInb.41714$ao4.98745@attbi_s51>
InsuranceBroker wrote:
Subject: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have
ended." 10.27.03
From: "Piglet"
Date: 10/28/2003 1:07 AM Eastern Standard Time
Message-id: <HInnb.17104$294.13279@nwrdny03.gnilink.net>
"Bryan" < > wrote in message
news:Sbmnb.44720$Fm2.21441@attbi_s04...
Are we to understand that you are a total pacifist, and urge our nation
to withdraw, and just hope we don't get attacked?
Are we to understand that you are a total warmonger, and urge our nation to
attack, and just hope that after killing (more) of people's families and
colonizing their land and stealing their resources we don't get attacked?
Actually the guy posted a good question. What would have happened if we had
pulled out and only keep Saddam in check. We would be hundreds of billions
of
dollars to the better. Saddam would probably be less of a threat than he is
today. There is nothing like getting the strongest military in the world
into
quicksand to improve the status.
What is amazing is they pose such question and expect people to think that
the
world would fall apart if we do not get invovled in another war to grab the
oil
reserves.
I disagree with the entire premise of your argument. The US did not
invade on any merit of international opinion, nor is the invasion buried
in quicksand. That's the whole point. Blame the President for relying
on our intel reports. Blame or intel community for false conclusions.
But respect the fact that the President acted on the best available
intelligence at the time. This same intelligence only underscored the
very same conclusions that were drawn by the UN for a decade, resulting
in sanctions and inspections. These are also the same conclusions that
the Clinton Administration came to in 1998, and further insisted that
Sadam be bombed and replaced.
Try to consider that this terrorism is due to arrive on US soil soon.
The is nothing to support that if we had not started the war in Iraq that
terrorism would be more or less than it is today.
Fair argument.
I believe that it has made
us much more in danger than if we did not attack.
I do not share that perspective of yours. It is certainly true that
neither of us have any proof of who is right on that point.
All that is happening in Baghdad, is that we are thinning out the attack
on foreign soil, before it gets going here. What you might see as a
terrible quagmire as terrorists from all over the region and various
other Muslim fundamentals declare open season on our military over
there, I see as a good thing.... we are taking their asses out. You
don't hear much about that in the news, and instead are left to believe
that our troops are pointless targets. This is far from the truth or
reality there.
Iraq was not a sponsor of terrorist. Saddam was pretty much contained and all
the right wing crap has not changed that. The US Airforce had total control of
his airspace. As proven by the war, Saddam was not a military threat to the
United States.
True. But the "right wing crap" never argued that he was a direct
military threat. Yes, militarily he was contained. Visiting Al-Quaeda
members however, were not contained.
Iraq was a target of greater Israel. If you look at the people who expressed
and pushed for the war, you will see a very large number had ties to Israel.
It is hard to ignore that they might not have had the United States interest as
first priority.
That argument of yours is complete crap. It is baseless, un-true, and
completely wrong. Do you think Rumsfeld, Bush, Powell and Condeleeza
Rice are motivated and directed by the Jews? Do you not think that the
slightest evidence of this would be magnificent fodder in a Presidential
campaign?
The Whitehouse was foremost motivated by US and UN intelligence
reports. So, if you have reason to believe that the US intelligence
community is driven and controlled by Israel, then please explain.
Doing Insurance business in the Garden State
Doing Insurance business in the Garden State
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| User: "Bryan" |
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| Title: Re: "My fellow Americans, major combat operations in Iraq have ended."10.27.03 |
28 Oct 2003 11:17:51 PM |
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Piglet wrote:
"Bryan" <Bryan@news.net> wrote in message
news:Sbmnb.44720$Fm2.21441@attbi_s04...
Are we to understand that you are a total pacifist, and urge our nation
to withdraw, and just hope we don't get attacked?
Are we to understand that you are a total warmonger, and urge our nation to
attack, and just hope that after killing (more) of people's families and
colonizing their land and stealing their resources we don't get attacked?
It's hard to tell what Liberals who think like you are capable of not
understanding. I'm trying to understand if you understand the meaning
of "colonize". Your limited understanding of the facts might be
expanded if you read more and pine less. The cash from the oil
production in Iraq is going back directly into the re-building of Iraq.
If you have facts (not opnion) to suggest otherwise, then please share.
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