| Topic: |
Politics > Politics-USA |
| User: |
"Stan de SD" |
| Date: |
12 Feb 2006 05:54:44 PM |
| Object: |
Re: White House details public forest sale plan |
"NobodyYouKnow" <TheVoiceOfReason@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:XjMHf.521$T35.83027@news20.bellglobal.com...
Looting the future to pay for the misuse of funds in the present has been
the Repubican/Neocon game for a long time..
Funny how many private forests are better maintained than the public
national parks and forests our trusted goverment officials keep letting burn
down in the name of "environmentalism", or stupid regulations such as not
letting fire-fighting helicopters take off after sunset. Call the private
loggers greedy and selfish, but they have at least figured out that they
won't have any lumber to cut down unless they plant replacement trees.
Meanwhile, the government bureaucrats continue to draw paychecks, no matter
how often they ***** things up... :O|
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| User: "NobodyYouKnow" |
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| Title: Re: White House details public forest sale plan |
12 Feb 2006 06:23:51 PM |
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"Stan de SD" <standesd_DIGA_NO_A_SPAM@covad.net> wrote in message
news:ec340$43efca4f$45035f0b$9106@msgid.meganewsservers.com...
"NobodyYouKnow" <TheVoiceOfReason@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:XjMHf.521$T35.83027@news20.bellglobal.com...
Looting the future to pay for the misuse of funds in the present has
been
the Repubican/Neocon game for a long time..
Funny how many private forests are better maintained than the public
national parks
If you consider being chopped down after growing to 5" size 'better
maintained'. I will admit that they genrally wait until they can get at
least ONE two by four out of it. Not like the scrub they grow for 'paper
making' where they don't even wait till you can properly call it a 'tree'.
and forests our trusted goverment officials keep letting burn
down in the name of "environmentalism", or stupid regulations such as not
letting fire-fighting helicopters take off after sunset.
Wow. Stupid regulations such as not flying helicopters when you can't see a
horison and are as likely as not to fly into a tree or power line. Have you
ever flowing in a helicopter at night or are you just ignorant of VFR? I
will admit that there are some sophisticated Military helicopters that can
( in certain circumstances ) fly at night but they are NOT generally in
civilan or government machines and fly only between known ( and well lit )
locations, not to a fire in the back country.
Call the private
loggers greedy and selfish, but they have at least figured out that they
won't have any lumber to cut down unless they plant replacement trees.
Actually mostly they go after 'old growth' because they get the money
without the need to first grow anything. This will be the fate of MOST of
the lands sold, I would imagine. Quick profits that can fund 'back room
kickbacks' to the very same politicians that gave them the land in the first
place.
Meanwhile, the government bureaucrats continue to draw paychecks, no
matter
how often they ***** things up... :O|
Oh, yah. They just always are the problem aren't they, at least in your
private universe. Must have bee Fire Ranger Smith that started the "Only You
Can Prevent Forest Fires' program and not the logging companies at all,
right? Yah, right.. In some alternate reality maybe.
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| User: "Stan de SD" |
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| Title: Re: White House details public forest sale plan |
12 Feb 2006 06:52:41 PM |
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"NobodyYouKnow" <TheVoiceOfReason@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:dkQHf.278$_D5.55286@news20.bellglobal.com...
"Stan de SD" <standesd_DIGA_NO_A_SPAM@covad.net> wrote in message
news:ec340$43efca4f$45035f0b$9106@msgid.meganewsservers.com...
"NobodyYouKnow" <TheVoiceOfReason@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:XjMHf.521$T35.83027@news20.bellglobal.com...
Looting the future to pay for the misuse of funds in the present has
been
the Repubican/Neocon game for a long time..
Funny how many private forests are better maintained than the public
national parks
If you consider being chopped down after growing to 5" size 'better
maintained'.
Sure is better maintained than having the idiots let the entire forest burn
down (and the rivers fill with debris and kill off all the wildlife) because
it's more "natural" that way...
I will admit that they genrally wait until they can get at
least ONE two by four out of it. Not like the scrub they grow for 'paper
making' where they don't even wait till you can properly call it a 'tree'.
and forests our trusted goverment officials keep letting burn
down in the name of "environmentalism", or stupid regulations such as
not
letting fire-fighting helicopters take off after sunset.
Wow. Stupid regulations such as not flying helicopters when you can't see
a
horison and are as likely as not to fly into a tree or power line. Have
you
ever flowing in a helicopter at night or are you just ignorant of VFR? I
will admit that there are some sophisticated Military helicopters that can
( in certain circumstances ) fly at night but they are NOT generally in
civilan or government machines and fly only between known ( and well lit )
locations, not to a fire in the back country.
Most chopper pilots get their training via the military, and are expected to
fly through far worse conditions than dusk on a normally clear day/moonlit
night. Your ignorance shows - this was NOT a case where the pilots were
protesting unsafe conditions. I was referring to the October 2003 debacle in
San Diego County where the chopper pilots were willing to fly and made the
judgement call to go, but had their sorties aborted by a bunch of idiot
bureaucrats who didn't understand the concept of "life-threatening
emergency":
SAN DIEGO, California (AP) -- The southern California wildfires have been
vanquished, but the second-guessing is in full swing.
Politicians and residents have a lot of questions about how the wildfires
managed to do so much damage, scorching more than 740,000 acres, burning
about 3,600 homes and killing 22 people. They were the most destructive
wildfires ever to hit California.
In hard-hit San Diego County, they want to know whether a lack of
coordination and equipment hindered the firefighting effort and prevented
communities from being saved. President Bush, Gov. Gray Davis and a 1932
state law have all come under criticism.
....The lack of air support at times, and the red tape involved in putting
firefighting planes in the air, have also led to scrutiny.
The first helicopter to spot the big San Diego fire radioed for backup, but
never got it. It was too late in the day and state rules regulating
night-flying prohibited it. Officials and residents say the rules need
changing.
http://www.cnn.com/2003/US/West/11/06/wildfires.blamegame.ap/
Call the private
loggers greedy and selfish, but they have at least figured out that they
won't have any lumber to cut down unless they plant replacement trees.
Actually mostly they go after 'old growth' because they get the money
without the need to first grow anything. This will be the fate of MOST of
the lands sold, I would imagine.
Most of this is HARDLY "old growth", having been either cut or burned out
more than once during the history that the feds had jurisdiction over the
land.
Quick profits that can fund 'back room
kickbacks' to the very same politicians that gave them the land in the
first
place.
Pure speculation on your part, but would it be fair to say that eco-kooks
and NIMBY liberal types also engage in their own share of corruption?
.
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| User: "NobodyYouKnow" |
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| Title: Re: White House details public forest sale plan |
13 Feb 2006 06:25:50 PM |
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"Stan de SD" <standesd_DIGA_NO_A_SPAM@covad.net> wrote in message
news:5d0bf$43efd7e5$45035f0b$9678@msgid.meganewsservers.com...
"NobodyYouKnow" <TheVoiceOfReason@nowhere.com> wrote in message
<snip>
Wow. Stupid regulations such as not flying helicopters when you can't
see
a
horison and are as likely as not to fly into a tree or power line. Have
you
ever flowing in a helicopter at night or are you just ignorant of VFR? I
will admit that there are some sophisticated Military helicopters that
can
( in certain circumstances ) fly at night but they are NOT generally in
civilan or government machines and fly only between known ( and well
lit )
locations, not to a fire in the back country.
Most chopper pilots get their training via the military,
Most? Some? Any? You cannot write the rules so that you can fly in the dark
unless you can qualify ALL pilots tow hich the regulation appleis to fly in
the dark.
You are such an idiot. Even *if* the pilots were trained, most civiilian
helicopters do not maintain the required military equipment. This was just
'daring do' on the part of the pilots who may have succeeded or may have
added a million dollar helicopter and a few funerals to the bill.
and are expected to
fly through far worse conditions than dusk on a normally clear day/moonlit
night.
You moron. Twilight is the HARDEST time to fly because night vision and day
vision compete and neither work very well. Check the statistics on traffic
accidents if you are too clueless to understand the concept.
Your ignorance shows - this was NOT a case where the pilots were
protesting unsafe conditions. I was referring to the October 2003 debacle
in
San Diego County where the chopper pilots were willing to fly and made the
judgement call to go, but had their sorties aborted by a bunch of idiot
bureaucrats who didn't understand the concept of "life-threatening
emergency":
Or rather, understood the 'urge to take risks' but were unwilling to back
poor reasoning with their own bad judgement especially when the regulations
prohibited it for good and sufficient reasons. YOU may think you are some
combination of Godzilla and Arnold Swartzenegger but the regulation are
written with the actual reality in mind. Too many have lost their lives to
'flying the edges' and so they set up regulations to ensure that 'evolution
in action' applies only the the totally clueless.
Now if you wanted to have a specialist training in night flying and equip
the helicopters for IFR, you mgiht have some support,but as a clueless booby
all you can do is cry. Not that anyone would PAY for such specialised and
infrequently needed options, but then you just can't deal with grown up
responsibiliteis can you?
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| User: "coco" |
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| Title: Re: White House details public forest sale plan |
13 Feb 2006 09:30:13 AM |
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Stan de SD wrote:
"NobodyYouKnow" <TheVoiceOfReason@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:dkQHf.278$_D5.55286@news20.bellglobal.com...
"Stan de SD" <standesd_DIGA_NO_A_SPAM@covad.net> wrote in message
news:ec340$43efca4f$45035f0b$9106@msgid.meganewsservers.com...
"NobodyYouKnow" <TheVoiceOfReason@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:XjMHf.521$T35.83027@news20.bellglobal.com...
Looting the future to pay for the misuse of funds in the present has
been
the Repubican/Neocon game for a long time..
Funny how many private forests are better maintained than the public
national parks
If you consider being chopped down after growing to 5" size 'better
maintained'.
Sure is better maintained than having the idiots let the entire forest burn
down (and the rivers fill with debris and kill off all the wildlife) because
it's more "natural" that way...
You mean like Pacific Lumber?
http://www.wildcalifornia.org/activist_resources/pl_itp.html
Which not only cut to maximize profits but did a lot of illegal
activities also!
Or the growing of tree farms instead of forests!:
http://www.powerlink.net/FEN/BOWIRV22.HTM
excerpt:
The sale by Bowater, the South Carolina-based parent company of Great
Northern Paper Co.,
Represents about half of the 2 million acres the company owns in Maine.
Most of the land Irving is purchasing is in Aroostook County, but
included are parcels located in northern portions of Piscataquis and
Penobscot counties. This purchase makes Irving, which already owns
about 550,000 acres in northern Maine, the state's largest private
landowner.
Bowater and Irving created an agreement to have Irving supply wood
fiber from the timberlands it is purchasing to Great Northern Paper
Co.'s papermaking operations in Millinocket and in East Millinocket, an
agreement similar to the one between Sappi and Plum Creek.
The Forest Ecology Network is very concerned about Irving's forest
practices, which rely heavily on clear-cutting, herbicide spraying and
converting the forest to fast-growing plantations (see page 18) . Of
particular interest are the lands Bowater chose to keep. Those lands
include a horseshoe around Baxter State Park and encompass the
headwaters of the Allagash and St. John rivers and much of the
Penobscot River watershed. Jonathan Carter, Executive Director of FEN
challenged Bowater to put a price tag on its remaining 1 million acres
so the public can try to amass the money needed to purchase all of it.
"These lands that are left over ... represent the heart and soul of the
Maine woods, at least the northern heart and soul. Plum Creek now owns
much of the southern part," Carter said. "This is a core part of what
should be viewed as a first step toward the national park proposal."
Carter said that acquiring public land and restoring wilderness are key
to the region's economic future, since the service industry is the
fastest-growing sector of Maine's economy.
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| User: "Lloyd Parker" |
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| Title: Re: White House details public forest sale plan |
13 Feb 2006 04:29:16 AM |
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In article <ec340$43efca4f$45035f0b$9106@msgid.meganewsservers.com>,
"Stan de SD" <standesd_DIGA_NO_A_SPAM@covad.net> wrote:
"NobodyYouKnow" <TheVoiceOfReason@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:XjMHf.521$T35.83027@news20.bellglobal.com...
Looting the future to pay for the misuse of funds in the present has been
the Repubican/Neocon game for a long time..
Funny how many private forests are better maintained than the public
national parks and forests
If by "maintained" you mean trees cut down.
our trusted goverment officials keep letting burn
down in the name of "environmentalism",
Yeah, that Nature -- doesn't know how to run things!
or stupid regulations such as not
letting fire-fighting helicopters take off after sunset. Call the private
loggers greedy and selfish, but they have at least figured out that they
won't have any lumber to cut down unless they plant replacement trees.
They tend to plant one species, such as pine, and destroy the ecosystem on the
floor.
Meanwhile, the government bureaucrats continue to draw paychecks, no matter
how often they ***** things up... :O|
.
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| User: "Stan de SD" |
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| Title: Re: White House details public forest sale plan |
13 Feb 2006 08:21:11 PM |
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"Lloyd Parker" <lparker@emory.edu> wrote in message
news:dsq8gr$g56$29@leto.cc.emory.edu...
In article <ec340$43efca4f$45035f0b$9106@msgid.meganewsservers.com>,
"Stan de SD" <standesd_DIGA_NO_A_SPAM@covad.net> wrote:
"NobodyYouKnow" <TheVoiceOfReason@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:XjMHf.521$T35.83027@news20.bellglobal.com...
Looting the future to pay for the misuse of funds in the present has
been
the Repubican/Neocon game for a long time..
Funny how many private forests are better maintained than the public
national parks and forests
If by "maintained" you mean trees cut down.
Yes, I mean by cutting trees down. Thinning forests allows more sunlight and
nutrients for the remaining plants, removal of trees damaged by blight or
bark beetles keeps those afflictions from spreading, and occasional clearing
of dead limbs and fallen trees (usually by permitting locals to collect
limited amounts of firewood) were all part of good accepted forest
management before the enviro-retards decided it was more "natural" to let
millions of acres burn to the ground each summer.
our trusted goverment officials keep letting burn
down in the name of "environmentalism",
Yeah, that Nature -- doesn't know how to run things!
Nature has catastrophic events every now and then - are you suggesting that
we do nothing when those happen?
or stupid regulations such as not
letting fire-fighting helicopters take off after sunset. Call the private
loggers greedy and selfish, but they have at least figured out that they
won't have any lumber to cut down unless they plant replacement trees.
They tend to plant one species, such as pine, and destroy the ecosystem on
the
floor.
Tell us how "preserved" the eco-system is when runaway fires feed on
blighted trees and dead biomass on the "floor", because the eco-goo-goos
fight any attempt to cut or thin dead, dying, or diseased trees.
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