| Topic: |
Politics > Politics-USA |
| User: |
"Harry Hope" |
| Date: |
21 Oct 2006 09:39:42 AM |
| Object: |
What Are They Dying For? |
It is probable that American soldiers are dying at least in part for
the sake of US oil companies, but the main reason for their slaughter
is that Cheney, Bush and Rumsfeld do not want to change course because
that would entail admitting they are wrong.
For so long as they wield power in Washington there will be chaos and
death in Iraq.
US soldiers, and others, are dying because of mighty egos in
Washington.
It's as simple as that.
http://www.counterpunch.org/cloughly10202006.html
October 20 / 22, 2006
What Are They Dying For?
By BRIAN CLOUGHLEY
I was a soldier for 36 years.
And when soldiers of NATO (including the US) and Commonwealth
countries are killed, nowadays, I feel that "there but for the Grace
of God go I" because during my military service I was preparing to
fight (or was actually fighting) against people who were enemies of my
country.
But when I examine the wars going on at the moment I wonder whether
NATO and Commonwealth soldiers (and others, too) who are suffering so
many casualties in Iraq and Afghanistan should feel morally
comfortable with fighting against the people who are resisting their
presence and attacking them.
What are they fighting for?
In September, 74 US soldiers were killed in Iraq.
In the first 19 days of October, 70 US troops died.
Of the 370 US soldiers wounded in September, 295 are seriously
incapacitated.
In Afghanistan the picture is equally grim.
Day by day the number of dead soldiers increases--British, American,
Canadian and French, mainly.
And of course there are hundreds of Afghan and Iraqi soldiers and
police who have been killed, in addition to countless thousands of
civilians in both countries whose deaths matter not one jot to the
Washington warfighters.
Why have they died?
Why are so many people being killed?
What vital Cause have these soldiers died for?
What message do their gravestones have for us?
And why have hundreds of thousands of civilians been killed in
countries since they were invaded by foreigners in order, we are told
by the Bush people, to "bring democracy" to them.
What's going on in Washington?
Forget the sexual peccadilloes of a hypocritical little Congressman
and the lies of Republican leaders who protected him until the game
was up and their contemptible conduct was exposed.
These people are but tiny morsels of stinking dross in the stove of
history.
They are slimy maggots who are as worthless as they are
self-important, and their posturing and pompousness deserve nothing
but scorn.
They have forgotten they have a higher duty to the American people
than simply being re-elected, which, to the whole lot of them (and to
all politicians, everywhere in the world) is the most important thing
in their squalid little lives.
There isn't a politician alive (or dead, or yet to come) who wouldn't
sacrifice his or her dearest principle if they realized that by
sticking to it they would fail to be elected.
Members of both Houses in Washington forget or ignore the fact that
they are just as responsible as Cheney, Bush, Rumsfeld and Rice for
the deaths of American (and other) soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan.
These legislators are just as guilty as the White House barbarians,
too, for the deaths of all the women and children who have been killed
by berserk militias that didn't exist in Iraq until after the US
invaded.
And they are equally responsible for the deaths of all the ordinary
citizens who have died in screaming agony after being subjected to
"precision" bombing by US aircraft or the midnight guns, grenades and
fists of door-smashing soldiery.
***
On October 17, Cheney, on a brief trip to Planet Earth, announced that
"If you look at the general overall situation, they [the Iraqi
government] are doing remarkably well", which is absolute nonsense, as
over 100 people had been slaughtered in Baghdad the previous day.
And here's Bush on October 11:
"We're on the move. We're taking action. We're helping this young
democracy succeed . . . Our troops have increased their presence on
the streets of Baghdad. Together with Iraqi forces, they're working to
ensure that terrorists and death squads cannot intimidate the local
population and operate murder rings . . ."
Is the man insane?
Can this really be the President of the United States of America
speaking?
Bush must know that since his forces' attempts to control Baghdad
began in August there has been an amazing and terrible increase in
deaths in the city, and that over 400 Iraqi civilians have died
horribly since he made his absurd pronouncement.
Why did they die?
And what are his soldiers dying for?
Bush must know that in September there were at least (according to
verifiable morgue figures) 2,660 civilians killed in Baghdad;
400 more than in the previous month.
They were killed by "death squads" and "murder rings", but the armed
forces of the occupying power, the United States of America, were
unable to do anything to bring to an end or even reduce the slaughter
of thousands of Iraqis whose only crime was to belong to a different
faction to the people who killed them.
In response to a question about a report that over 300,000 Iraqis had
been killed since he went to war on Iraq Bush could only stumblebum
that "I do -- I do know that a lot of innocent people have died, and
that troubles me. And it grieves me. And I applaud the Iraqis for
their courage in the face of violence. I am, you know, amazed that
this is a society which so wants to be free that they're willing to --
you know, that there's a level of violence that they tolerate."
George W Bush has the temerity, the grotesque insolence, to state that
Iraqis are actually willing to "tolerate" , to accept willingly, the
hideous violence that has been caused by his invasion and occupation
of a country that presented no threat whatever to the United States.
And after his disastrous war developed into the bloody quagmire that
is killing scores of American soldiers every week, Bush had the
impudence to declare that " . . . it's now time for the Iraqi
government to work hard to bring security in neighborhoods so people
can feel -- can feel, you know, at peace."
When did you last hear such rubbish from a president?
Cheney and Bush have brought war, devastation and death to Iraq.
It is entirely the fault of the Washington warfighters that hundreds
of thousands of people have died since their invasion only a few years
ago.
The "Iraqi government" is a sham.
It governs the green lawns outside its premises in the US-owned Green
Area which is full of swimming pools, electricity generators and
coffee bars.
It is ridiculous for Bush to demand that the "Iraqi government" should
"bring security" to anywhere in the country.
140,000 US troops can't do it.
How can a raggle-taggle Iraqi army possibly do any better?
On October 17 McClatchy News reported that "U.S. Ambassador Zalmay
Khalilzad [. . .] also sounded that alarm, saying the government must
tackle such broad issues as de-Baathification, needed changes to the
constitution, distribution of oil and strengthening the security
forces. But when pressed on how he expects the government to respond,
he couldn't offer an answer."
Of course he couldn't offer an answer.
The man is out of his depth and incompetent.
And the day after he made his idiot pronouncement the bombs and
bullets of the Iraqi resistance killed ten American soldiers.
Why?
What did these soldiers die for?
Bush said on October 11 that "We can't tolerate a new terrorist state
in the heart of the Middle East with large oil reserves that could be
used to fund its radical ambitions or used to inflict economic damage
on the West".
Have 2,800 American soldiers (and thousands of Iraqis) been killed for
the sake of LARGE OIL RESERVES?
How many more will have to die in the Cheney-Bush war for oil?
When you look at the casualty lists on such sites as
http://icasualties.org/oif/ you can't help being emotional after
reading descriptions of how young soldiers met their unnecessary
deaths.
And we all know that these lists will become longer for so long as the
War Party is supreme in Washington.
It is probable that American soldiers are dying at least in part for
the sake of US oil companies, but the main reason for their slaughter
is that Cheney, Bush and Rumsfeld do not want to change course because
that would entail admitting they are wrong.
For so long as they wield power in Washington there will be chaos and
death in Iraq.
US soldiers, and others, are dying because of mighty egos in
Washington.
It's as simple as that.
________________________________________________________
Harry
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| User: "Taylor" |
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| Title: Re: What Are They Dying For? |
21 Oct 2006 10:43:18 AM |
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"Harry Hope" <rivrvu@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:emckj29g801cfh13ccg2o3lv29r8qne90n@4ax.com...
It is probable that American soldiers are dying at least in part for
the sake of US oil companies, but the main reason for their slaughter
is that Cheney, Bush and Rumsfeld do not want to change course because
that would entail admitting they are wrong.
For so long as they wield power in Washington there will be chaos and
death in Iraq.
US soldiers, and others, are dying because of mighty egos in
Washington.
It's as simple as that.
What a lame assertion. Our professional soldiers are dying to provide
security to a fledgling democracy in the middle east so we can remove the
root causes of terrorism.
.
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| User: "Adam Whyte-Settlar" |
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| Title: Re: What Are They Dying For? |
21 Oct 2006 09:42:11 PM |
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"Taylor" <123@456.com> wrote in message
news:qer_g.274$GR2.127@tornado.texas.rr.com...
"Harry Hope" <rivrvu@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:emckj29g801cfh13ccg2o3lv29r8qne90n@4ax.com...
It is probable that American soldiers are dying at least in part for
the sake of US oil companies, but the main reason for their slaughter
is that Cheney, Bush and Rumsfeld do not want to change course because
that would entail admitting they are wrong.
For so long as they wield power in Washington there will be chaos and
death in Iraq.
US soldiers, and others, are dying because of mighty egos in
Washington.
It's as simple as that.
What a lame assertion. Our professional soldiers are dying to provide
security to a fledgling democracy in the middle east so we can remove the
root causes of terrorism.
LOL.
I don't know if you are just being sarcastic, but whichever way it's
hilarious - or it would be if it wasn't such a serious subject.
.
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| User: "Kevin Cunningham" |
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| Title: Re: What Are They Dying For? |
21 Oct 2006 05:30:27 PM |
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"Taylor" <123@456.com> wrote in message
news:qer_g.274$GR2.127@tornado.texas.rr.com...
"Harry Hope" <rivrvu@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:emckj29g801cfh13ccg2o3lv29r8qne90n@4ax.com...
It is probable that American soldiers are dying at least in part for
the sake of US oil companies, but the main reason for their slaughter
is that Cheney, Bush and Rumsfeld do not want to change course because
that would entail admitting they are wrong.
For so long as they wield power in Washington there will be chaos and
death in Iraq.
US soldiers, and others, are dying because of mighty egos in
Washington.
It's as simple as that.
What a lame assertion. Our professional soldiers are dying to provide
security to a fledgling democracy in the middle east so we can remove the
root causes of terrorism.
I'm sorry, what planet are you on? I'd really like to know. What democracy
are you talking about? Must be a neat planet though. We're involved in a
war here.
Write when you get work!
.
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| User: "FIRE BUSH, NOW! PissedOff@the white house.org" |
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| Title: Re: What Are They Dying For? |
21 Oct 2006 10:34:03 PM |
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"Taylor" <123@456.com> wrote in message
news:qer_g.274$GR2.127@tornado.texas.rr.com...
"Harry Hope" <rivrvu@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:emckj29g801cfh13ccg2o3lv29r8qne90n@4ax.com...
It is probable that American soldiers are dying at least in part for
the sake of US oil companies, but the main reason for their slaughter
is that Cheney, Bush and Rumsfeld do not want to change course because
that would entail admitting they are wrong.
For so long as they wield power in Washington there will be chaos and
death in Iraq.
US soldiers, and others, are dying because of mighty egos in
Washington.
It's as simple as that.
What a lame assertion. Our professional soldiers are dying to provide
security to a fledgling democracy in the middle east so we can remove the
root causes of terrorism.
Oil money is the root cause of the Bush Clan vs. the Osama Clan and
Americans are the victims as well as the Iraqis.
.
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| User: "Saberman" |
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| Title: Re: What Are They Dying For? |
21 Oct 2006 12:23:36 PM |
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Taylor wrote:
"Harry Hope" <rivrvu@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:emckj29g801cfh13ccg2o3lv29r8qne90n@4ax.com...
It is probable that American soldiers are dying at least in part for
the sake of US oil companies, but the main reason for their slaughter
is that Cheney, Bush and Rumsfeld do not want to change course
because that would entail admitting they are wrong.
For so long as they wield power in Washington there will be chaos and
death in Iraq.
US soldiers, and others, are dying because of mighty egos in
Washington.
It's as simple as that.
What a lame assertion. Our professional soldiers are dying to provide
security to a fledgling democracy in the middle east so we can remove
the root causes of terrorism.
ROFLMFAO
LOL What a ignorant republican you really are. I didn't think they made
people as stupid any more LOL
Bush and the US are the real terrorists.
.
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| User: "FIRE BUSH, NOW! PissedOff@the white house.org" |
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| Title: Re: What Are They Dying For? |
21 Oct 2006 10:35:09 PM |
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"Harry Hope" <rivrvu@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:emckj29g801cfh13ccg2o3lv29r8qne90n@4ax.com...
It is probable that American soldiers are dying at least in part for
the sake of US oil companies, but the main reason for their slaughter
is that Cheney, Bush and Rumsfeld do not want to change course because
that would entail admitting they are wrong.
For so long as they wield power in Washington there will be chaos and
death in Iraq.
US soldiers, and others, are dying because of mighty egos in
Washington.
It's as simple as that.
http://www.counterpunch.org/cloughly10202006.html
October 20 / 22, 2006
What Are They Dying For?
By BRIAN CLOUGHLEY
I was a soldier for 36 years.
And when soldiers of NATO (including the US) and Commonwealth
countries are killed, nowadays, I feel that "there but for the Grace
of God go I" because during my military service I was preparing to
fight (or was actually fighting) against people who were enemies of my
country.
But when I examine the wars going on at the moment I wonder whether
NATO and Commonwealth soldiers (and others, too) who are suffering so
many casualties in Iraq and Afghanistan should feel morally
comfortable with fighting against the people who are resisting their
presence and attacking them.
What are they fighting for?
In September, 74 US soldiers were killed in Iraq.
In the first 19 days of October, 70 US troops died.
Of the 370 US soldiers wounded in September, 295 are seriously
incapacitated.
In Afghanistan the picture is equally grim.
Day by day the number of dead soldiers increases--British, American,
Canadian and French, mainly.
And of course there are hundreds of Afghan and Iraqi soldiers and
police who have been killed, in addition to countless thousands of
civilians in both countries whose deaths matter not one jot to the
Washington warfighters.
Why have they died?
Why are so many people being killed?
What vital Cause have these soldiers died for?
What message do their gravestones have for us?
And why have hundreds of thousands of civilians been killed in
countries since they were invaded by foreigners in order, we are told
by the Bush people, to "bring democracy" to them.
What's going on in Washington?
Forget the sexual peccadilloes of a hypocritical little Congressman
and the lies of Republican leaders who protected him until the game
was up and their contemptible conduct was exposed.
These people are but tiny morsels of stinking dross in the stove of
history.
They are slimy maggots who are as worthless as they are
self-important, and their posturing and pompousness deserve nothing
but scorn.
They have forgotten they have a higher duty to the American people
than simply being re-elected, which, to the whole lot of them (and to
all politicians, everywhere in the world) is the most important thing
in their squalid little lives.
There isn't a politician alive (or dead, or yet to come) who wouldn't
sacrifice his or her dearest principle if they realized that by
sticking to it they would fail to be elected.
Members of both Houses in Washington forget or ignore the fact that
they are just as responsible as Cheney, Bush, Rumsfeld and Rice for
the deaths of American (and other) soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan.
These legislators are just as guilty as the White House barbarians,
too, for the deaths of all the women and children who have been killed
by berserk militias that didn't exist in Iraq until after the US
invaded.
And they are equally responsible for the deaths of all the ordinary
citizens who have died in screaming agony after being subjected to
"precision" bombing by US aircraft or the midnight guns, grenades and
fists of door-smashing soldiery.
***
On October 17, Cheney, on a brief trip to Planet Earth, announced that
"If you look at the general overall situation, they [the Iraqi
government] are doing remarkably well", which is absolute nonsense, as
over 100 people had been slaughtered in Baghdad the previous day.
And here's Bush on October 11:
"We're on the move. We're taking action. We're helping this young
democracy succeed . . . Our troops have increased their presence on
the streets of Baghdad. Together with Iraqi forces, they're working to
ensure that terrorists and death squads cannot intimidate the local
population and operate murder rings . . ."
Is the man insane?
Can this really be the President of the United States of America
speaking?
Bush must know that since his forces' attempts to control Baghdad
began in August there has been an amazing and terrible increase in
deaths in the city, and that over 400 Iraqi civilians have died
horribly since he made his absurd pronouncement.
Why did they die?
And what are his soldiers dying for?
Bush must know that in September there were at least (according to
verifiable morgue figures) 2,660 civilians killed in Baghdad;
400 more than in the previous month.
They were killed by "death squads" and "murder rings", but the armed
forces of the occupying power, the United States of America, were
unable to do anything to bring to an end or even reduce the slaughter
of thousands of Iraqis whose only crime was to belong to a different
faction to the people who killed them.
In response to a question about a report that over 300,000 Iraqis had
been killed since he went to war on Iraq Bush could only stumblebum
that "I do -- I do know that a lot of innocent people have died, and
that troubles me. And it grieves me. And I applaud the Iraqis for
their courage in the face of violence. I am, you know, amazed that
this is a society which so wants to be free that they're willing to --
you know, that there's a level of violence that they tolerate."
George W Bush has the temerity, the grotesque insolence, to state that
Iraqis are actually willing to "tolerate" , to accept willingly, the
hideous violence that has been caused by his invasion and occupation
of a country that presented no threat whatever to the United States.
And after his disastrous war developed into the bloody quagmire that
is killing scores of American soldiers every week, Bush had the
impudence to declare that " . . . it's now time for the Iraqi
government to work hard to bring security in neighborhoods so people
can feel -- can feel, you know, at peace."
When did you last hear such rubbish from a president?
Cheney and Bush have brought war, devastation and death to Iraq.
It is entirely the fault of the Washington warfighters that hundreds
of thousands of people have died since their invasion only a few years
ago.
The "Iraqi government" is a sham.
It governs the green lawns outside its premises in the US-owned Green
Area which is full of swimming pools, electricity generators and
coffee bars.
It is ridiculous for Bush to demand that the "Iraqi government" should
"bring security" to anywhere in the country.
140,000 US troops can't do it.
How can a raggle-taggle Iraqi army possibly do any better?
On October 17 McClatchy News reported that "U.S. Ambassador Zalmay
Khalilzad [. . .] also sounded that alarm, saying the government must
tackle such broad issues as de-Baathification, needed changes to the
constitution, distribution of oil and strengthening the security
forces. But when pressed on how he expects the government to respond,
he couldn't offer an answer."
Of course he couldn't offer an answer.
The man is out of his depth and incompetent.
And the day after he made his idiot pronouncement the bombs and
bullets of the Iraqi resistance killed ten American soldiers.
Why?
What did these soldiers die for?
Gay Republicans.
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| User: "Denouncer" |
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| Title: Re: What Are They Dying For? |
21 Oct 2006 10:34:53 AM |
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In article <emckj29g801cfh13ccg2o3lv29r8qne90n@4ax.com>, Harry Hope
<rivrvu@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
It is probable that American soldiers are dying at least in part for
the sake of US oil companies, but the main reason for their slaughter
is that Cheney, Bush and Rumsfeld do not want to change course because
that would entail admitting they are wrong.
For so long as they wield power in Washington there will be chaos and
death in Iraq.
US soldiers, and others, are dying because of mighty egos in
Washington.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
WHAT ARE THEY DYING FOR?
THE PURPOSE OF THE IRAQ WAR : AND THE DEFINITION OF VICTORY --WAS/IS
THE ESTABLISHMENT UNITED STATES HEGEMONY OVER THE PETROLEUM RESOURCES
OF IRAQ AND IRAN; AND THE ESTABLISHMENT AND MAINTENANCE OF A MILITARY
PRESENCE WHICH WOULD/WILL PRESERVE THAT HEGEMONY FOR THE FORESEEABLE
FUTURE. THERE WILL BE NO WITHDRAWAL OF TROOPS SO LONG AS THE PETROLEUM
IS THERE.
UNLESS YOU AGREE WITH THIS DEFINITION OF VICTORY, ALL OF THOSE WHO HAVE
DIED HAVE DIED IN VAIN AND THE OIL HAS BEEN PURCHASED WITH THEIR
BLOOD.
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| User: "Arfur Moo" |
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| Title: Re: What Are They Dying For? |
22 Oct 2006 04:06:55 AM |
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The subjectline on Harry Hope's message at
<emckj29g801cfh13ccg2o3lv29r8qne90n@4ax.com> asks:
What are they dying for?
One obvious answer is:
They're dying to go home. One way or another.
--
Arfur Moo
(NB: Those of you who want to post a reply to this message should read the
"Followup-To:" line in my headers and then reinstate those destination groups
that you want to reinstate.)
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