| Topic: |
Politics > Politics-USA |
| User: |
"" |
| Date: |
02 Jan 2005 10:13:07 PM |
| Object: |
What You Get as One of Gunner's "Patriots." |
http://www.alternet.org/waroniraq/20840/
<snip>
Combat experiences such as Noel's have a strong bearing on whether a
veteran develops PTSD. The New England Journal study found that among
troops who engaged in more than five firefights while deployed in Iraq,
the prevalence of post-traumatic stress disorder was more than 19
percent. In contrast, the rate of PTSD among Vietnam veterans is
currently 15 percent. "It was about that oil that was spilling from the
streets. If you saw the way we slaughtered those people, it was
disgusting," Noel said of the war's beginning. "There would be little
kids laying down on the floor. Two- or three-year-olds caught in the
crossfire. It was sickening."
While Noel was trapped in a war zone, the army mistakenly listed him as
AWOL and cut off his pay, causing him to lose his home in Fort Stewart,
Georgia. Upon returning, he moved into a trailer off-base with his
wife, Tamara, and their three young children. When their car died and
he was no longer able to get to work, they decided to move back to New
York.
However, Noel was a changed man and found it difficult to keep a steady
job, and his family slipped through an almost nonexistent safety net.
Tamara started to notice changes in her husband about a month after
they were reunited. "He'd get upset easily. We were arguing all the
time. One time we got in an argument and he put me in the car and drove
me to some bushes and he said he would kill me if I kept arguing with
him. I was really scared. He was never like that before."
Noel still struggles with his rage, but now he disappears when he feels
like he is going to explode. "I don't know where he goes," Tamara says.
"He tells me sometimes he has to get away from it all." "I have an
anger problem. I still got that war mentality," Noel says. "You got
that anger in you being around all that death. I still have nightmares.
I'm still paranoid sometimes to walk the street, thinking something is
going to happen... It's hard to be in a working situation. You're
always on your guard."
<snip>
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| User: "potatoblight bdsfdsf@bdfdsfcom" |
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| Title: Re: What You Get as One of Gunner's "Patriots." |
02 Jan 2005 10:29:46 PM |
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<knews4u2chew@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1104725587.863287.83630@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
http://www.alternet.org/waroniraq/20840/
<snip>
Combat experiences such as Noel's have a strong bearing on whether a
veteran develops PTSD. The New England Journal study found that among
troops who engaged in more than five firefights while deployed in Iraq,
the prevalence of post-traumatic stress disorder was more than 19
percent. In contrast, the rate of PTSD among Vietnam veterans is
currently 15 percent. "It was about that oil that was spilling from the
streets. If you saw the way we slaughtered those people, it was
disgusting," Noel said of the war's beginning. "There would be little
kids laying down on the floor. Two- or three-year-olds caught in the
crossfire. It was sickening."
While Noel was trapped in a war zone, the army mistakenly listed him as
AWOL and cut off his pay, causing him to lose his home in Fort Stewart,
Georgia. Upon returning, he moved into a trailer off-base with his
wife, Tamara, and their three young children. When their car died and
he was no longer able to get to work, they decided to move back to New
York.
However, Noel was a changed man and found it difficult to keep a steady
job, and his family slipped through an almost nonexistent safety net.
Tamara started to notice changes in her husband about a month after
they were reunited. "He'd get upset easily. We were arguing all the
time. One time we got in an argument and he put me in the car and drove
me to some bushes and he said he would kill me if I kept arguing with
him. I was really scared. He was never like that before."
Noel still struggles with his rage, but now he disappears when he feels
like he is going to explode. "I don't know where he goes," Tamara says.
"He tells me sometimes he has to get away from it all." "I have an
anger problem. I still got that war mentality," Noel says. "You got
that anger in you being around all that death. I still have nightmares.
I'm still paranoid sometimes to walk the street, thinking something is
going to happen... It's hard to be in a working situation. You're
always on your guard."
<snip>
excellent...I hope this story is true and is repeated a hundred thousand
times over.
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| User: "Gunner" |
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| Title: Re: What You Get as One of Gunner's "Patriots." |
03 Jan 2005 02:41:31 AM |
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On Sun, 2 Jan 2005 23:29:46 -0500, "potatoblight" <bdsfdsf@bdfdsfcom>
wrote:
http://www.alternet.org/waroniraq/20840/
This wouldnt be another Anti-war, anti-Bush site, would it?
Hummmm looking at the articles...Id have to say YES!!!
As such, all articles and data is immediatly suspect.
Gunner
"War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling
which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight,
nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being
free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself."
- John Stewart Mill
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| User: "Bob Brock" |
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| Title: Re: What You Get as One of Gunner's "Patriots." |
03 Jan 2005 11:15:13 AM |
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On Mon, 03 Jan 2005 08:41:31 GMT, Gunner <gunner@lightspeed.net>
wrote:
On Sun, 2 Jan 2005 23:29:46 -0500, "potatoblight" <bdsfdsf@bdfdsfcom>
wrote:
http://www.alternet.org/waroniraq/20840/
This wouldnt be another Anti-war, anti-Bush site, would it?
Hummmm looking at the articles...Id have to say YES!!!
As such, all articles and data is immediatly suspect.
So? Suspect doesn't mean wrong and I see that you failed to say that
the information was incorrect. Is there a reason that you didn't say
it was wrong?
Snipped that long assed sig file...
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| User: "Mysterion" |
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| Title: Re: What You Get as One of Gunner's "Patriots." |
03 Jan 2005 12:03:46 PM |
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"Bob Brock" <bbrock@i-america.net> wrote in message
news:navit01mbso6q2rekv43mgpc64bu0d2lst@4ax.com...
On Mon, 03 Jan 2005 08:41:31 GMT, Gunner <gunner@lightspeed.net>
wrote:
On Sun, 2 Jan 2005 23:29:46 -0500, "potatoblight" <bdsfdsf@bdfdsfcom>
wrote:
http://www.alternet.org/waroniraq/20840/
This wouldnt be another Anti-war, anti-Bush site, would it?
Hummmm looking at the articles...Id have to say YES!!!
As such, all articles and data is immediatly suspect.
So? Suspect doesn't mean wrong and I see that you failed to say that
the information was incorrect. Is there a reason that you didn't say
it was wrong?
Get used to that.
Anything Goofer disagrees with is "suspect" and will be ignored no matter
how well documented, researched or obvious.
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| User: "Bob Brock" |
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| Title: Re: What You Get as One of Gunner's "Patriots." |
03 Jan 2005 12:55:26 PM |
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On Mon, 03 Jan 2005 18:03:46 GMT, "Mysterion"
<mysterion@supernetNOSPAM.com> wrote:
"Bob Brock" <bbrock@i-america.net> wrote in message
news:navit01mbso6q2rekv43mgpc64bu0d2lst@4ax.com...
On Mon, 03 Jan 2005 08:41:31 GMT, Gunner <gunner@lightspeed.net>
wrote:
On Sun, 2 Jan 2005 23:29:46 -0500, "potatoblight" <bdsfdsf@bdfdsfcom>
wrote:
http://www.alternet.org/waroniraq/20840/
This wouldnt be another Anti-war, anti-Bush site, would it?
Hummmm looking at the articles...Id have to say YES!!!
As such, all articles and data is immediatly suspect.
So? Suspect doesn't mean wrong and I see that you failed to say that
the information was incorrect. Is there a reason that you didn't say
it was wrong?
Get used to that.
Anything Goofer disagrees with is "suspect" and will be ignored no matter
how well documented, researched or obvious.
Yeah, I know. No wonder he and ral get along so well together.
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| User: "Tim May" |
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| Title: Re: What You Get as One of Gunner's "Patriots." |
03 Jan 2005 12:06:39 AM |
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While Noel was trapped in a war zone, the army mistakenly listed him as
AWOL and cut off his pay, causing him to lose his home in Fort Stewart,
Georgia. Upon returning, he moved into a trailer off-base with his
wife, Tamara, and their three young children. When their car died and
he was no longer able to get to work, they decided to move back to New
York.
However, Noel was a changed man and found it difficult to keep a steady
job, and his family slipped through an almost nonexistent safety net.
Tamara started to notice changes in her husband about a month after
they were reunited. "He'd get upset easily. We were arguing all the
time. One time we got in an argument and he put me in the car and drove
me to some bushes and he said he would kill me if I kept arguing with
him. I was really scared. He was never like that before."
A month later Noel drove to Washington and killed 16 of those in the
Pentagon he considered responsible. Six more are in Virginia hospitals with
burns over 80% of their bodies and are not expected to live.
Meanwhile, "Friends of Noel" are anonymously organizing, via untraceable
remailers, to carry out similar acts in all states.
At least they are carrying this illegal war back to the corrupt
politicians who launched it.
--Tim May
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| User: "Jim Hart" |
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| Title: Re: What You Get as One of Gunner's "Patriots." |
16 Jan 2005 06:01:46 PM |
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Noel is the first in the new crop of Timothy McVeighs, killers trained
by the U.S. who will use their well-honed skills to take revenge on
the U.S. They have been ordered to kill and torture civilians, and
then abandoned as with Noel, or used as scapegoats to allow the
civilian bosses and military officers to get away with war crimes. Now
they are starting to return and take revenge on their masters.
Returning Gulf War vets will, as further reward for their patriotism,
now need to be added to the "No Fly" and "No Entry" lists as the most
suspected terrorists this side of Palestine. Having "fought for
freedom" they will live in a virtual prison. Their reward for allowing
the media to brainwash them into thinking that by killing people for
the U.S. military, they were "fighting for freedom."
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| User: "Len Helmer" |
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| Title: Re: What You Get as One of Gunner's "Patriots." |
17 Jan 2005 12:38:28 PM |
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Jim Hart wrote:
Noel is the first in the new crop of Timothy McVeighs, killers trained
by the U.S. who will use their well-honed skills to take revenge on
the U.S. They have been ordered to kill and torture civilians, and
then abandoned as with Noel, or used as scapegoats to allow the
civilian bosses and military officers to get away with war crimes. Now
they are starting to return and take revenge on their masters.
Returning Gulf War vets will, as further reward for their patriotism,
now need to be added to the "No Fly" and "No Entry" lists as the most
suspected terrorists this side of Palestine. Having "fought for
freedom" they will live in a virtual prison. Their reward for allowing
the media to brainwash them into thinking that by killing people for
the U.S. military, they were "fighting for freedom."
There seems to be an echo in here
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| User: "Gunner" |
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| Title: Re: What You Get as One of Gunner's "Patriots." |
16 Jan 2005 09:39:06 PM |
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On 16 Jan 2005 16:01:46 -0800, "Jim Hart" <jzhart@hushmail.com> wrote:
Noel is the first in the new crop of Timothy McVeighs, killers trained
by the U.S. who will use their well-honed skills to take revenge on
the U.S. They have been ordered to kill and torture civilians, and
then abandoned as with Noel, or used as scapegoats to allow the
civilian bosses and military officers to get away with war crimes. Now
they are starting to return and take revenge on their masters.
Returning Gulf War vets will, as further reward for their patriotism,
now need to be added to the "No Fly" and "No Entry" lists as the most
suspected terrorists this side of Palestine. Having "fought for
freedom" they will live in a virtual prison. Their reward for allowing
the media to brainwash them into thinking that by killing people for
the U.S. military, they were "fighting for freedom."
Went off your meds Friday, didnt you?
Gunner
"At the core of liberalism is the spoiled child -
miserable, as all spoiled children are, unsatisfied,
demanding, ill-disciplined, despotic and useless.
Liberalism is a philosphy of sniveling brats." -- P.J. O'Rourke
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| User: "Worry Not" |
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| Title: Re: What You Get as One of Gunner's "Patriots." |
17 Jan 2005 02:00:55 AM |
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begin Jim Hart piddled around and finally wrote:
I like to sniff my farts.
No wonder you walk around gape-mouthed all the time.
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| User: "Gunner" |
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| Title: Re: What You Get as One of Gunner's "Patriots." |
03 Jan 2005 02:37:48 AM |
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On 2 Jan 2005 20:13:07 -0800, wrote:
http://www.alternet.org/waroniraq/20840/
<snip>
Combat experiences such as Noel's have a strong bearing on whether a
veteran develops PTSD. The New England Journal study found that among
troops who engaged in more than five firefights while deployed in Iraq,
the prevalence of post-traumatic stress disorder was more than 19
percent. In contrast, the rate of PTSD among Vietnam veterans is
currently 15 percent.
A whole 19%? I would have thought it would be higher.
Ayup..war sucks. But then, the other 85% of RVN vets seemed to have
done ok.
I wonder why there are 4% more this time around? Kids gotten softer?
Maybe it was the sight of all that oil spilling on the ground that did
it? They knew that when they got home, it would be over $2 a gallon
for gas. Thats enough to depress anyone.
Gunner
"War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling
which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight,
nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being
free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself."
- John Stewart Mill
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: What You Get as One of Gunner's "Patriots." |
03 Jan 2005 09:07:00 AM |
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Maybe they just developed more of a conscience.
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| User: "Gunner" |
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| Title: Re: What You Get as One of Gunner's "Patriots." |
03 Jan 2005 11:49:34 AM |
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On 3 Jan 2005 07:07:00 -0800, wrote:
Maybe they just developed more of a conscience.
Who?
Gunner
"War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling
which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight,
nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being
free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself."
- John Stewart Mill
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| User: "Dan Bloomquist" |
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| Title: Re: What You Get as One of Gunner's "Patriots." |
03 Jan 2005 01:21:14 PM |
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Gunner wrote:
"War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling
which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight,
nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being
free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself."
- John Stewart Mill
So does this make Genghis Khan, Napoleon, Hitler, Pol Pot all great men?
On the other hand, Mahatma Gandhi was a miserable failure to expel the
British by non violent means?
Gunner should distinguish between overt war and defending one's souverenity.
Best, Dan.
--
http://lakeweb.net
http://ReserveAnalyst.com
No EXTRA stuff for email.
What can you see if you can't see it all...
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: What You Get as One of Gunner's "Patriots." |
03 Jan 2005 03:34:05 PM |
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Gunner wrote:
On 3 Jan 2005 07:07:00 -0800, wrote:
Maybe they just developed more of a conscience.
Who?
Gunner
Obviously not you.
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| User: "Gunner" |
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| Title: Re: What You Get as One of Gunner's "Patriots." |
03 Jan 2005 06:54:23 PM |
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On 3 Jan 2005 13:34:05 -0800, wrote:
Gunner wrote:
On 3 Jan 2005 07:07:00 -0800, wrote:
Maybe they just developed more of a conscience.
Who?
Gunner
Obviously not you.
Proof?
Gunner
It's not unwise to remember that Mother Nature is essentially a
murderous, sneakly, promiscuous ***** who has been trying to kill you
since your conception.
Eventually she will succeed, perhaps with the help of your fellow man.
Life consists in putting off the inevitable as long as possible and
taking what good and joy you can before her success.
Whether you attribute that situation to evolutionary forces, a fallen
nature after Adam and Eve screwed the pooch, or whatever, it's no less true.
Be friendly, pleasant, unaggressive, and honest toward all and be
prepared to ignore, avoid, or even kill anyone who is otherwise toward
you. Being ready doesn't mean eager, just ready. What true friends are
found in life will undestand and accept that fundamental rule of human
interaction." John Husvar
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| User: "Dan Bloomquist" |
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| Title: Re: What You Get as One of Gunner's "Patriots." |
03 Jan 2005 09:32:50 PM |
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Gunner wrote:
It's not unwise to remember that Mother Nature is essentially a
murderous, sneakly, promiscuous ***** who has been trying to kill you
since your conception.
Bawhawhawhawhaw...
Gunner must be very religious to put 'Mother Nature' on a pedestal like
that.
Gunner may want to think of reframing from post a sci. group with deep
'beliefs' like this.
By all scientific observations, Nature is only, what she is. Nature has
no propensity to come after mankind. Mankind is doing a fine job of
'doing' mankind, without any help from mother nature.
Eventually she will succeed, perhaps with the help of your fellow man.
See above.
Life consists in putting off the inevitable as long as possible and
taking what good and joy you can before her success.
Some would say that life is what you make of it. 'putting off the
inevitable' would be a poor state of mind... IMHO. Being _afraid_ to
die, is denial, IMHO.
Whether you attribute that situation to evolutionary forces, a fallen
nature after Adam and Eve screwed the pooch, or whatever, it's no less true.
Truth is a personal thing. But you are welcome to claim 'your truth' as
truth. Doesn't mean that anybody else will buy into it.
Be friendly, pleasant, unaggressive, and honest toward all and be
prepared to ignore, avoid, or even kill anyone who is otherwise toward
you. Being ready doesn't mean eager, just ready. What true friends are
found in life will undestand and accept that fundamental rule of human
interaction." John Husvar
Another quote full of 'Truth'?
Best, Dan.
--
http://lakeweb.net
http://ReserveAnalyst.com
No EXTRA stuff for email.
What can you see if you can't see it all...
.
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| User: "Johan" |
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| Title: Re: What You Get as One of Gunner's "Patriots." |
04 Jan 2005 06:28:43 AM |
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In article <41DA0E57.5020804@lakeweb.com>,
Dan Bloomquist <EXTRApublic21@lakeweb.com> wrote:
Gunner wrote:
It's not unwise to remember that Mother Nature is essentially a
murderous, sneakly, promiscuous ***** who has been trying to kill you
since your conception.
Bawhawhawhawhaw...
Gunner must be very religious to put 'Mother Nature' on a pedestal like
that.
Gunner may want to think of reframing from post a sci. group with deep
'beliefs' like this.
Guess some sci.* folks have never heard of metaphor.
By all scientific observations, Nature is only, what she is. Nature has
no propensity to come after mankind. Mankind is doing a fine job of
'doing' mankind, without any help from mother nature.
Eh? Nature may not come after anyone specifically with malice
aforethought, but the Universe is still a dangerous place.
"Nuttin' personal. Business is business," -- Possibly apocryphal quote
of a minor mafioso.
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| User: "Dan Bloomquist" |
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| Title: Re: What You Get as One of Gunner's "Patriots." |
04 Jan 2005 10:14:03 AM |
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Johan wrote:
In article <41DA0E57.5020804@lakeweb.com>,
Dan Bloomquist <EXTRApublic21@lakeweb.com> wrote:
Gunner wrote:
It's not unwise to remember that Mother Nature is essentially a
murderous, sneakly, promiscuous ***** who has been trying to kill you
since your conception.
Bawhawhawhawhaw...
Gunner must be very religious to put 'Mother Nature' on a pedestal like
that.
Gunner may want to think of reframing from post a sci. group with deep
'beliefs' like this.
Guess some sci.* folks have never heard of metaphor.
I missed it. What's he symbolizing then?
By all scientific observations, Nature is only, what she is. Nature has
no propensity to come after mankind. Mankind is doing a fine job of
'doing' mankind, without any help from mother nature.
Eh? Nature may not come after anyone specifically with malice
aforethought, but the Universe is still a dangerous place.
We seem to have proliferated quite easily on this planet. It doesn't
look dangerous to me.
Best, Dan.
--
http://lakeweb.net
http://ReserveAnalyst.com
No EXTRA stuff for email.
What can you see if you can't see it all...
.
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| User: "Johan" |
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| Title: Re: What You Get as One of Gunner's "Patriots." |
04 Jan 2005 09:33:21 PM |
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In article <41DAC0BF.8070400@lakeweb.com>,
Dan Bloomquist <EXTRApublic21@lakeweb.com> wrote:
Johan wrote:
In article <41DA0E57.5020804@lakeweb.com>,
Dan Bloomquist <EXTRApublic21@lakeweb.com> wrote:
Gunner wrote:
It's not unwise to remember that Mother Nature is essentially a
murderous, sneakly, promiscuous ***** who has been trying to kill you
since your conception.
Bawhawhawhawhaw...
Gunner must be very religious to put 'Mother Nature' on a pedestal like
that.
Gunner may want to think of reframing from post a sci. group with deep
'beliefs' like this.
Guess some sci.* folks have never heard of metaphor.
I missed it. What's he symbolizing then?
I can't say about Gunner's using the .sig. He rotates through apparently
a fair-sized collection of .sig files.
What _I_ was doing when I wrote the thing was playing a bit with
personified abstractions and the anthropomorphizing of impersonal
natural forces.
Just a little playing with the Mother metaphor, twisting the Mother
concept.
In the same vein: Mother Nature -- She'll try to burn you. She'll try to
freeze you, She'll try to crush you. She'll try to suffocate you. She'll
try any way possible to turn you off. Mom can be such a ***** at times!
(A similar twist on an old Lexus (IIRC) advertisement.)
By all scientific observations, Nature is only, what she is. Nature has
no propensity to come after mankind. Mankind is doing a fine job of
'doing' mankind, without any help from mother nature.
Eh? Nature may not come after anyone specifically with malice
aforethought, but the Universe is still a dangerous place.
We seem to have proliferated quite easily on this planet. It doesn't
look dangerous to me.
Yep. So we have -- on this planet anyway. Most of the universe, however,
doesn't seem to present conditions under which human life would persist.
All those open spaces with no air, for example, seem to indicate
bringing one's own oxygen might be a good idea. :)
Best back to you, Don.
John
How'd this topic ever get into the sci.* hierarchy anyhow?!?!
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| User: "Gunner" |
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| Title: Re: What You Get as One of Gunner's "Patriots." |
04 Jan 2005 10:11:22 PM |
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On Wed, 05 Jan 2005 03:33:21 GMT, Johan <jhusvar@neo.rr.com> wrote:
We seem to have proliferated quite easily on this planet. It doesn't
look dangerous to me.
To the op, not Johan...I suggest you ask those in the tsunami effected
areas about how pleasant and non dangerous things appeared to be, 15
minutes before the wall of water changed their lives forever. And
ended far to many of them.
Yep. So we have -- on this planet anyway. Most of the universe, however,
doesn't seem to present conditions under which human life would persist.
All those open spaces with no air, for example, seem to indicate
bringing one's own oxygen might be a good idea. :)
Best back to you, Don.
Considering that we can only exist freely on 25% of this
planet..speculation about how friendly it is is a bit of a
exaggeration.
Gunner
It's not unwise to remember that Mother Nature is essentially a
murderous, sneakly, promiscuous ***** who has been trying to kill you
since your conception.
Eventually she will succeed, perhaps with the help of your fellow man.
Life consists in putting off the inevitable as long as possible and
taking what good and joy you can before her success.
Whether you attribute that situation to evolutionary forces, a fallen
nature after Adam and Eve screwed the pooch, or whatever, it's no less true.
Be friendly, pleasant, unaggressive, and honest toward all and be
prepared to ignore, avoid, or even kill anyone who is otherwise toward
you. Being ready doesn't mean eager, just ready. What true friends are
found in life will undestand and accept that fundamental rule of human
interaction." John Husvar
.
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| User: "Johan" |
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| Title: Re: What You Get as One of Gunner's "Patriots." |
05 Jan 2005 06:35:39 AM |
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In article <3upmt0d03kg06crdqnj13vbds0k96jt2e4@4ax.com>,
Gunner <gunner@lightspeed.net> wrote:
On Wed, 05 Jan 2005 03:33:21 GMT, Johan <jhusvar@neo.rr.com> wrote:
We seem to have proliferated quite easily on this planet. It doesn't
look dangerous to me.
To the op, not Johan...I suggest you ask those in the tsunami effected
areas about how pleasant and non dangerous things appeared to be, 15
minutes before the wall of water changed their lives forever. And
ended far to many of them.
True enough. I rather doubt they think of Momma N. as much of a
sweetheart the last few weeks.
Yep. So we have -- on this planet anyway. Most of the universe, however,
doesn't seem to present conditions under which human life would persist.
All those open spaces with no air, for example, seem to indicate
bringing one's own oxygen might be a good idea. :)
Best back to you, Don.
Considering that we can only exist freely on 25% of this
planet..speculation about how friendly it is is a bit of a
exaggeration.
Yeah, could be. At least one theory (presented on a TV documentary, so
keep a hand on your salt shaker) the early H. sapiens were nearly wiped
out quite a few times. Seems survival was attributable more than a
little to their having had the sense to move when the old neighborhood
went to hell.
No one seems quite sure what happened to the Neanderthals either. :)
.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: What You Get as One of Gunner's "Patriots." |
03 Jan 2005 07:26:58 PM |
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Gunner wrote:
On 3 Jan 2005 13:34:05 -0800, wrote:
Gunner wrote:
On 3 Jan 2005 07:07:00 -0800, wrote:
Maybe they just developed more of a conscience.
Who?
Gunner
Obviously not you.
Proof?
Gunner
Your posts.
.
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| User: "Gunner" |
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| Title: Re: What You Get as One of Gunner's "Patriots." |
04 Jan 2005 02:12:53 AM |
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On 3 Jan 2005 17:26:58 -0800, wrote:
Gunner wrote:
On 3 Jan 2005 13:34:05 -0800, wrote:
Gunner wrote:
On 3 Jan 2005 07:07:00 -0800, wrote:
Maybe they just developed more of a conscience.
Who?
Gunner
Obviously not you.
Proof?
Gunner
Your posts.
Which ones?
Gunner
It's not unwise to remember that Mother Nature is essentially a
murderous, sneakly, promiscuous ***** who has been trying to kill you
since your conception.
Eventually she will succeed, perhaps with the help of your fellow man.
Life consists in putting off the inevitable as long as possible and
taking what good and joy you can before her success.
Whether you attribute that situation to evolutionary forces, a fallen
nature after Adam and Eve screwed the pooch, or whatever, it's no less true.
Be friendly, pleasant, unaggressive, and honest toward all and be
prepared to ignore, avoid, or even kill anyone who is otherwise toward
you. Being ready doesn't mean eager, just ready. What true friends are
found in life will undestand and accept that fundamental rule of human
interaction." John Husvar
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: What You Get as One of Gunner's "Patriots." |
04 Jan 2005 03:53:34 AM |
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Gunner wrote:
On 3 Jan 2005 17:26:58 -0800, wrote:
Gunner wrote:
On 3 Jan 2005 13:34:05 -0800, wrote:
Gunner wrote:
On 3 Jan 2005 07:07:00 -0800, wrote:
Maybe they just developed more of a conscience.
Who?
Gunner
Obviously not you.
Proof?
Gunner
Your posts.
Which ones?
Gunner
All of them.
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| User: "Gunner" |
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| Title: Re: What You Get as One of Gunner's "Patriots." |
04 Jan 2005 01:25:09 PM |
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On 4 Jan 2005 01:53:34 -0800, wrote:
Gunner wrote:
On 3 Jan 2005 17:26:58 -0800, wrote:
Gunner wrote:
On 3 Jan 2005 13:34:05 -0800, wrote:
Gunner wrote:
On 3 Jan 2005 07:07:00 -0800, wrote:
Maybe they just developed more of a conscience.
Who?
Gunner
Obviously not you.
Proof?
Gunner
Your posts.
Which ones?
Gunner
All of them.
Like this one?
On Tue, 04 Jan 2005 07:29:37 GMT, (Richard
Lewis) wrote:
Gunner <gunner@lightspeed.net> wrote:
Two blade arrow heads fly like *****. They tend to become flying wings
and the arrow may go off in multiple directions.
That's why folks have been using helical fletching on arrows since
about ohhhh, four thousand years ago.
Ask jd....he invented it last year.
ral
Gunner
Chuckle...helical fl etching does NOT do anything for the planeing
effect of two large single blades. Most arrow heads of the past had
small blades and would not plane too badly, and of course the arrows
tended to be far heavier, so there was more inertia to prevent things
from going askew and the arrows traveled MUCH slower.
Todays very large cutting diameters mean large blades. When they are
in groups of 3 or more, the planeing effects are minimized to a large
degree, but not removed. Hence you will see a goodly number of
arrowheads that expand after hitting the target, smaller diameters, 5
and 6 blades, etc. Mechanical opening "broadheads" are the where the
field is going at the moment.
http://www.bowhunting.net/evaluation/001-Barrie-Revolution.html
If you are shooting at very short ranges, this effect is not very
bothersome. If you are shooting out at longer ranges, it becomes an
issue. I shoot ground squirrels as practice at 80 yrds, and have taken
pig, rabbits and coyotes at ranges out that far, and have found that
its can be problematic with large blades, particularly in a bit of
wind, or with marginally tuned or splined arrows. Add a bit of
dolphin to an arrow with 2 blades, even three and things go to *****
rapidly. Shrug. YMMV of course. For normal ranges up to about 50
yrds or a bit less, I use Bear Razorheads for close range on pigs, or
the old 4 bladed 1 5/16" diameter Wasps, but as the range goes out, I
will use the smaller Wasps and some mechanical openers.
You will notice that most large broadheads today use skeletonized
blades, even though they are less strong than say a Bear or Zwickey
Black Diamond. This helps minimize the planing problem
This may help:
http://www.skookumarchers.com/Archery%20Library/Broadheads.htm
http://www.bowhuntingmag.com/tactics/stone_1016/
http://www.gameandfishmag.com/bowhunting/gf_aa076504a/
Gunner
It's not unwise to remember that Mother Nature is essentially a
murderous, sneakly, promiscuous ***** who has been trying to kill you
since your conception.
Eventually she will succeed, perhaps with the help of your fellow man.
Life consists in putting off the inevitable as long as possible and
taking what good and joy you can before her success.
Whether you attribute that situation to evolutionary forces, a fallen
nature after Adam and Eve screwed the pooch, or whatever, it's no less true.
Be friendly, pleasant, unaggressive, and honest toward all and be
prepared to ignore, avoid, or even kill anyone who is otherwise toward
you. Being ready doesn't mean eager, just ready. What true friends are
found in life will undestand and accept that fundamental rule of human
interaction." John Husvar
.
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