Hamas Chief Won't Recognize Israel's Right To Exist
New York Sun - 7 hours ago
By BENNY AVNI - Staff Reporter of the Sun. UNITED NATIONS - As
America joined European, Russian, and UN officials at Turtle Bay
yesterday in welcoming the possible participation of Hamas in a future
Palestinian ...
Bush: Israel can't work with PA gov't that does not recognize ...
Ha'aretz
Haniyeh again refuses to recognize Israel Jerusalem Post
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| User: "Werewolfy" |
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| Title: Re: Hamas Chief Won't Recognize Israel's Right To Exist |
21 Sep 2006 12:30:40 PM |
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lkgeo1 wrote:
Hamas Chief Won't Recognize Israel's Right To Exist
Who the Hell cares, Ikgeo?
I don't.
Always interfering, always spreading your grasping Nation further and
further. Leave the bloody place alone.
Werewolfy
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| User: "Woodswun" |
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| Title: Re: Hamas Chief Won't Recognize Israel's Right To Exist |
21 Sep 2006 04:33:08 PM |
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On Thu, 21 Sep 2006 10:30:40 -0700, Werewolfy wrote:
lkgeo1 wrote:
Hamas Chief Won't Recognize Israel's Right To Exist
Who the Hell cares, Ikgeo?
I don't.
Most of us would prefer a peaceful coexistence between the nations of the
Middle East. This is because problems there keep spilling over into other
areas of the world. (Otherwise, of course, nobody would care).
The very first step to a peaceful outcome is for the Palestinians to
accept the fact that the British handed over a fairly small piece of land,
from which was created the nation of Israel. The other half of the
equation is to have Israel accept the right for a Palestinian nation to
exist.
Always interfering, always spreading your grasping Nation further and
further. Leave the bloody place alone.
Which Nation is that? (First Nation that pops into my mind is the Aryan
Nation, but I really don't think they'd support Israel in any way, shape
or form!)
Woods
Werewolfy
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| User: "Werewolfy" |
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| Title: Re: Hamas Chief Won't Recognize Israel's Right To Exist |
21 Sep 2006 06:50:02 PM |
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Woodswun wrote:
Which Nation is that? (First Nation that pops into my mind is the Aryan
Nation, but I really don't think they'd support Israel in any way, shape
or form!)
Oh, just me having an anti US day, Woodsy.
I think reading so much recently about American politics in here, and
finding it all to be rather like a children's play school, has provoked
a jaundiced attack ;)
Americans tend to see themselves as a superior race, spreading
benevolance throughout the world.
The World views America rather differently. Many would say it is a
malignent Society, violent and with all the endearing characteristics
of a school bully.
I don't like your coffee either.
;)
Werewolfy
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| User: "dreamwalker" |
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| Title: Re: Hamas Chief Won't Recognize Israel's Right To Exist |
24 Sep 2006 01:53:25 AM |
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"Werewolfy" <thegrimreaper10@lycos.com> wrote in message
news:1158882602.261499.190490@e3g2000cwe.googlegroups.com...
Woodswun wrote:
Which Nation is that? (First Nation that pops into my mind is the Aryan
Nation, but I really don't think they'd support Israel in any way, shape
or form!)
Oh, just me having an anti US day, Woodsy.
I think reading so much recently about American politics in here, and
finding it all to be rather like a children's play school, has provoked
a jaundiced attack ;)
Americans tend to see themselves as a superior race, spreading
benevolance throughout the world.
The World views America rather differently. Many would say it is a
malignent Society, violent and with all the endearing characteristics
of a school bully.
I don't like your coffee either.
;)
Werewolfy
So what? Who's going to stop us? Anyone? Anyone? Maybe a Islamo/Russian/Chinese trio will nuke our
sorry asses. Then they could carve up an unarmed Europe for Christmas feast. The future looks very
interesting indeed. I'd rather die under a nuclear blast than bend to the ways of your world.
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| User: "Woodswun" |
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| Title: Re: Hamas Chief Won't Recognize Israel's Right To Exist |
24 Sep 2006 06:39:17 AM |
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On Sun, 24 Sep 2006 01:53:25 -0500, dreamwalker wrote:
"Werewolfy" <thegrimreaper10@lycos.com> wrote in message
news:1158882602.261499.190490@e3g2000cwe.googlegroups.com...
Woodswun wrote:
Which Nation is that? (First Nation that pops into my mind is the Aryan
Nation, but I really don't think they'd support Israel in any way, shape
or form!)
Oh, just me having an anti US day, Woodsy.
I think reading so much recently about American politics in here, and
finding it all to be rather like a children's play school, has provoked
a jaundiced attack ;)
Americans tend to see themselves as a superior race, spreading
benevolance throughout the world.
The World views America rather differently. Many would say it is a
malignent Society, violent and with all the endearing characteristics
of a school bully.
I don't like your coffee either.
;)
Werewolfy
So what? Who's going to stop us? Anyone? Anyone? Maybe a Islamo/Russian/Chinese trio will nuke our
sorry asses. Then they could carve up an unarmed Europe for Christmas feast. The future looks very
interesting indeed. I'd rather die under a nuclear blast than bend to the ways of your world.
The rest of the world could decide to stop buying U.S. goods, collapsing
our economy. It's not like countries have never gotten together before in
a trade embargo.
Woods
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| User: "Perseid" |
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| Title: Re: Hamas Chief Won't Recognize Israel's Right To Exist |
24 Sep 2006 10:33:26 AM |
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After Much Chewing of Cud and Cogitation, Woodswun
<woodswun@tepidmail.com> Spat the Words
On Sun, 24 Sep 2006 01:53:25 -0500, dreamwalker wrote:
"Werewolfy" <thegrimreaper10@lycos.com> wrote in message
news:1158882602.261499.190490@e3g2000cwe.googlegroups.com...
Woodswun wrote:
Which Nation is that? (First Nation that pops into my mind is the
Aryan Nation, but I really don't think they'd support Israel in any
way, shape or form!)
Oh, just me having an anti US day, Woodsy.
I think reading so much recently about American politics in here, and
finding it all to be rather like a children's play school, has
provoked a jaundiced attack ;)
Americans tend to see themselves as a superior race, spreading
benevolance throughout the world.
The World views America rather differently. Many would say it is a
malignent Society, violent and with all the endearing characteristics
of a school bully.
I don't like your coffee either.
;)
Werewolfy
So what? Who's going to stop us? Anyone? Anyone? Maybe a
Islamo/Russian/Chinese trio will nuke our sorry asses. Then they could
carve up an unarmed Europe for Christmas feast. The future looks very
interesting indeed. I'd rather die under a nuclear blast than bend to
the ways of your world.
The rest of the world could decide to stop buying U.S. goods, collapsing
our economy. It's not like countries have never gotten together before
in a trade embargo.
Or they could just sell all their US debt holdings... that would
screw up our economy just as easily, sending our bond prices into
the toilet and our interest rates to the moon.
Woods
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| User: "JTEM" |
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| Title: Re: Hamas Chief Won't Recognize Israel's Right To Exist |
24 Sep 2006 08:00:38 AM |
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Woodswun wrote:
The rest of the world could decide to stop buying U.S.
goods, collapsing our economy.
And their's as well!
It's not like countries have never gotten together before in
a trade embargo.
I hate to burst anyone's bubble, but the E.U. was worried
about Iran long before the U.S.
They've certainly been a lot more active in pursuing an end
to the Iranian nuclear weapons program than Bush has. Their
efforts began before Bush ever invaded Iraq.
Don't be fooled by morons like that wearypuppy who think
they've actually got a clue. Europe & Japan are far more
dependent on middle eastern oil than the United States is.
We could make up the 2 million barrels a day we're getting
from Saudi Arabia simply by banning SUVs & light trucks
for personal transportation.
If everyone in America currently driving a SUV or light truck
switched to, say, a 4-cylinder Camry (which is a monster
by European standards) we wouldn't need any oil from Saudi
Arabia.
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| User: "Werewolfy" |
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| Title: Re: Hamas Chief Won't Recognize Israel's Right To Exist |
24 Sep 2006 04:00:15 AM |
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dreamwalker wrote:
So what? Who's going to stop us? Anyone? Anyone?
There, see, I am right. The school bully appears.
Werewolfy
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| User: "JTEM" |
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| Title: Re: Hamas Chief Won't Recognize Israel's Right To Exist |
22 Sep 2006 09:20:39 AM |
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Werewolfy wrote:
Many would say it is a malignent Society, violent
and with all the endearing characteristics of a
school bully.
One quarter of the globe in slavery....
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| User: "Steven Douglas" |
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| Title: Re: Hamas Chief Won't Recognize Israel's Right To Exist |
21 Sep 2006 01:32:12 PM |
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Werewolfy wrote:
lkgeo1 wrote:
Hamas Chief Won't Recognize Israel's Right To Exist
Who the Hell cares, Ikgeo?
Your Prime Minister cares.
I don't.
Always interfering, always spreading your grasping Nation further and
further. Leave the bloody place alone.
During Bush's first two years in office, he adopted a hands off policy
concerning the Israeli/Palestinian problem. That was because President
Clinton, in the final months of his Presidency, had put together
negotiations that offered Arafat a Palestinian state -- which Arafat
prompty rejected and instead restarted the suicide bombing attacks on
Israel. So Bush stayed out of the peace process since Arafat had made
it perfectly clear he didn't want peace. But Prime Minister Blair
finally convinced Bush he must be engaged in the peace process, as
President Clinton had been. So if you want to blame someone for not
leaving the bloody place alone, talk to your Prime Minister about it.
.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Hamas Chief Won't Recognize Israel's Right To Exist |
21 Sep 2006 02:01:31 PM |
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A Cage for Palestinians:
A 1,000-kilometer Fence Preempts the Road Map
by Jonathan Cook
The writer is a free-lance journalist living in Israel.
JERUSALEM --
A humorous e-mail circulating on the Internet
explains the "law of diminishing territorial returns"
in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.
The first attempt at partitioning the land between
Jews and Arabs, undertaken by the United Nations
in 1947, resulted in the Palestinian majority being
offered 47 percent of its historic homeland,
with the rest allocated to a new Jewish state.
The Palestinians rejected the plan and
the ensuing war established Israel.
The Palestinians had to wait
46 years for the next offer:
Under the 1993 Oslo accords,
the Palestinians were to receive
22 percent of their homeland -
the territories of the West Bank and Gaza.
They accepted the terms,
but Israel never got around to returning most of the land.
Then Prime Minister Ehud Barak of Israel
decided to speed things up and negotiate
a final agreement at Camp David in 2000,
"generously" offering the Palestinians 80
percent of the 22 percent of the 100 percent
of their original homeland.
Yasser Arafat refused to sign and the second intifada began.
The e-mail's payoff line is that Barak's successor,
Ariel Sharon, has devised an even more miserly
take-it-or-leave-it deal: the Palestinians can have
a state on 42 percent of the 80 percent of the 22
percent of 100 percent of their original homeland.
The funniest part is that it isn't a joke.
Sharon is deadly serious.
The proof is not to be found in the "road map,"
which is diverting attention from Sharon's real goal,
which is to redraw the territorial contours of
historic Palestine himself - in concrete and barbed wire.
The security wall Israel is hastily
constructing around the West Bank -
officially justified by the
need to stop terror attacks -
will cage in more than 2 million Palestinians.
Another electrified fence is already
imprisoning 1 million Palestinians in Gaza.
Little attention has focused on this wall,
mainly because it is assumed it follows the Green Line,
the internationally recognized border that existed
between Israel and the West Bank until the war of 1967.
But Sharon admitted in a recent interview
with the Israeli newspaper Yedioth Ahronoth
that the wall will be at least 1,000 kilometers long
(625 miles), whereas the Green Line is only
360 kilometers long.
Why does it need to be so long?
Because Sharon is less interested in
preventing suicide bombers than in
creating a tiny de facto Palestinian state
before the road map forces a bigger one on him.
For decades Sharon has maintained that the
Palestinians should not be allowed a state
that controls its own borders, airspace and
water or one that comprises more than 40
percent of the land of the West Bank and Gaza.
Palestinian research based on land expropriation
orders issued by the Israeli Army produces a
map that shows the wall winding its way deep
into the heart of the Palestinian state,
twisting and turning in an elaborate route
designed to keep a large number of the
settlers on "Israel's side" of the wall and
minimize the amount of territory left to the
Palestinians.
Israel is also preparing a second,
similarly tortuous wall near the eastern border
of the West Bank, which it shares with Jordan,
that will steal even more land from the Palestinians
and offers no obvious security benefits.
After the wall is finished, at a cost of more
than $2 billion, the Palestinians will live in
two minuscule states behind concrete and
electrified fencing, restricted to their main
population centers.
Thousands of rural Palestinians will live
outside the West Bank cage in military
controlled zones, denied rights as citizens
of either Palestine or Israel.
The rest will live inside the prison.
Palestine will finally be born from 42 percent
of 80 percent of 22 percent of the historic
Palestinian homeland. (this comes out to about 10% of
the land originally stolen--and it doesn't mention the
fact that when offered, it came with the unacceptable condition
that Arafat sign away the "right of return" and, therefore, his
right to live.)
The writer is a free-lance journalist living in Israel.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
The preceding article, of course, assumes that the reader is capable
of understanding what the terms "Palestinian" and "Palestine" mean,
and would rather not resort to semantic arguments over whether or
not Palestine and the 2 million refugees who have been held under
the guns of an intolerant theocratic apartheid system actually exist.
S~
Steven Douglas wrote:
Werewolfy wrote:
lkgeo1 wrote:
Hamas Chief Won't Recognize Israel's Right To Exist
Who the Hell cares, Ikgeo?
Your Prime Minister cares.
I don't.
Always interfering, always spreading your grasping Nation further and
further. Leave the bloody place alone.
During Bush's first two years in office, he adopted a hands off policy
concerning the Israeli/Palestinian problem. That was because President
Clinton, in the final months of his Presidency, had put together
negotiations that offered Arafat a Palestinian state -- which Arafat
prompty rejected and instead restarted the suicide bombing attacks on
Israel. So Bush stayed out of the peace process since Arafat had made
it perfectly clear he didn't want peace. But Prime Minister Blair
finally convinced Bush he must be engaged in the peace process, as
President Clinton had been. So if you want to blame someone for not
leaving the bloody place alone, talk to your Prime Minister about it.
.
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| User: "Werewolfy" |
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| Title: Re: Hamas Chief Won't Recognize Israel's Right To Exist |
21 Sep 2006 05:52:20 PM |
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Steven Douglas wrote:
So if you want to blame someone for not
leaving the bloody place alone, talk to your Prime Minister about it.
Let there be no doubt, Steven. There certainly isn't any in England.
Blair does that which Bush demands from him.
It is America that is concerned with Jews and Israel to a fanatical
degree. No-one in England does..well, Muslims do, but I was talking
about English people of direct descent.
America and Israel are hand in hand. Blairs kow-tow approach to Bush is
a prime reason for his leaving office...before his party force him so
to do.
I'm speaking fancifully here, but I would love the World to place a
trade embargo on America, forbid travel and contact. We might then see
just how wonderful your gaudy flag is then.
Werewolfy
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| User: "Steven Douglas" |
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| Title: Re: Hamas Chief Won't Recognize Israel's Right To Exist |
21 Sep 2006 07:07:34 PM |
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Werewolfy wrote:
Steven Douglas wrote:
So if you want to blame someone for not
leaving the bloody place alone, talk to your Prime Minister about it.
Let there be no doubt, Steven. There certainly isn't any in England.
Blair does that which Bush demands from him.
I thought this might be your response. So I looked it up, and here it
is:
The Guardian
Julian Borger in Washington and Ewen MacAskill
Friday April 5, 2002
[excerpt] President Bush yesterday bowed to international pressure and
abandoned his hands-off policy towards the Israeli military offensive
in the West Bank, demanding an immediate ceasefire and a halt to
Israeli settlements, while dispatching his secretary of state, Colin
Powell, to try to enforce compliance.
[...]
Yesterday's rose garden declaration came on the eve of Tony Blair's
arrival in the US for a weekend summit with Mr Bush at the president's
ranch in Crawford, Texas, where the Middle East is now top of the
agenda.
Downing Street welcomed the Bush speech and British officials portrayed
the president's policy reversal as partly the result of Mr Blair's
carefully cultivated influence. But Mr Blair still warned last night
that the Middle East was "a tragic situation that has the makings of a
catastrophe". [end excerpt]
http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,2763,679195,00.html
"... British officials portrayed the president's policy reversal as
partly the result of Mr Blair's carefully cultivated influence." I
remember when that was happening. Bush was getting a lot of criticism
from his political opponents for not remaining engaged with the peace
process begun under President Clinton. Tony Blair was often mentioned
for having been a partner in that process with Clinton, and the
criticism of Bush said he should become involved in that process with
Blair (who had remained engaged in the process without Bush).
.
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| User: "Werewolfy" |
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| Title: Re: Hamas Chief Won't Recognize Israel's Right To Exist |
22 Sep 2006 04:11:36 AM |
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Steven Douglas wrote:
I thought this might be your response. So I looked it up, and here it
is:
Thanks Steven. I keep away from 'The Guardian'..too political for me.
As I said earlier, I regard everything in a newspaper as being
slanted...So take little note of opinions that quote facts. Like
statistics, they echo the ideas of the editorialship, and can
be..adjusted...as required.
I'm trying to point out that newspaper articles are not a reflection of
the Country's ideas. The writer is a paid hack, the editor works to his
own agenda whilst satisfying the demands of the owners.
We are quite blaise in matters political in this Country, by and large.
Conversation is confined to little more than the odd expression of
discontent about an issue. It doesn't rule the lives of ordinary
people, nor is it a matter which we errect walls against anyone
opposing our own allegiances.
Americans and politics seem to me to be rather similar to Christians
and Muslims. Both berate the other simply for being what they are, and
add the odd excuse for their behaviour in order to justify their
outrage.
Of course, political dogma exists here, but it is far less obvious than
I find I this forum.
As to the rights and wrongs of Jews/Palestinians/Iraqi or Iranian
people, well, we don't as a Nation really care an awful lot. The press
may think we do, a small number of interested parties are vocal on the
matter, but in general we are much more insular.
That's why I..and many others..would say, "I don't care"
Werewolfy
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| User: "Steven Douglas" |
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| Title: Re: Hamas Chief Won't Recognize Israel's Right To Exist |
21 Sep 2006 07:11:10 PM |
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Werewolfy wrote:
Steven Douglas wrote:
So if you want to blame someone for not
leaving the bloody place alone, talk to your Prime Minister about it.
Let there be no doubt, Steven. There certainly isn't any in England.
Blair does that which Bush demands from him.
I thought this might be your response. So I looked it up, and here it
is:
The Guardian
Julian Borger in Washington and Ewen MacAskill
Friday April 5, 2002
[excerpt] President Bush yesterday bowed to international pressure and
abandoned his hands-off policy towards the Israeli military offensive
in the West Bank, demanding an immediate ceasefire and a halt to
Israeli settlements, while dispatching his secretary of state, Colin
Powell, to try to enforce compliance.
[...]
Yesterday's rose garden declaration came on the eve of Tony Blair's
arrival in the US for a weekend summit with Mr Bush at the president's
ranch in Crawford, Texas, where the Middle East is now top of the
agenda.
Downing Street welcomed the Bush speech and British officials portrayed
the president's policy reversal as partly the result of Mr Blair's
carefully cultivated influence. But Mr Blair still warned last night
that the Middle East was "a tragic situation that has the makings of a
catastrophe". [end excerpt]
http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,2763,679195,00.html
"... British officials portrayed the president's policy reversal as
partly the result of Mr Blair's carefully cultivated influence." I
remember when that was happening. Bush was getting a lot of criticism
from his political opponents for not remaining engaged with the peace
process begun under President Clinton. Tony Blair was often mentioned
for having been a partner in that process with Clinton, and the
criticism of Bush said he should become involved in that process with
Blair (who had remained engaged in the process without Bush).
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