http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/story.jsp?story=516303Canadians
Muslims will get sharia courts to settle disputes
By David Usborne in New York
29 April 2004
Canada is embarking on an unusual judicial experiment that will allow
members of its Muslim community to submit to the teachings of the
Koran to resolve a variety of civil legal disputes, ranging from
divorces to business conflicts.
The new model, which will be closely examined by other countries
grappling with the place of growing Muslim communities in their
populations, is to be administered by a body of imams and Islamic
scholars, the Islamic Institute of Justice, which was created at the
end of last year.
It will be pioneered in the province of Ontario under a law introduced
in 1991, the Ontario Arbitration Act, which allows minority groups to
provide arbitration to members in a limited number of civil matters.
Enforcement of rulings and awards would be left to Canada's regular
courts.
Many of Canada's 600,000 Muslims have applauded the opportunity to
settle differences according to Islamic law. Known as sharia, it is
drawn from the Koran and from the teachings of the prophet Mohamed. It
is hoped that if significant numbers of Muslims agree to settle
disputes before the arbitrators, pressure will be taken off the
province's clogged court system. "Many judges prefer this," said
Mohamed Elmasry, president of the Canadian Islamic Congress. "If
Canadian Muslims have an impartial body they trust, it will ease the
backlog in the courts."
Controversy surrounds the initiative even within the Muslim community.
Suggestions that it could lead to the stoning of women for adultery
have been swiftly knocked down by Canadian authorities, who point out
that the new courts would still have to respect all provisions of the
country's Charter of Rights and Freedoms that guarantees human and
equal rights. But they will not be allowed to deal with criminal
matters. Ontario's government is insisting that cases will only go
before Muslim arbitrators with the voluntary assent of all parties
involved.
Brendan Crawley, a spokesman for the Ontario attorney general, said:
"If the award is not compatible with Canadian law, then the court will
not enforce it. You can't agree to violate Canadian law."
There is also the concern among some Muslim women that they will feel
religious and social pressure to enter the Sharia system when
sometimes they would rather avoid it.
"If I am a woman of faith, and the community of people who see
themselves as leaders say that if I do not follow the sharia court
here, the Islamic Institute, then I will be tantamount to blasphemy
and apostasy," said Alia Hogben of the Canadian Council of Muslim
Women.
4 May 2004 21:37
.
|
|
| User: "Tom" |
|
| Title: Re: Just For You, tw....Sharia in Canada |
05 May 2004 02:08:08 AM |
|
|
(Jane) wrote in message news:<a8a04f01.0405041730.589bc0bf@posting.google.com>...
http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/story.jsp?story=516303Canadians
Muslims will get sharia courts to settle disputes
By David Usborne in New York
29 April 2004
Canada is embarking on an unusual judicial experiment that will allow
members of its Muslim community to submit to the teachings of the
Koran to resolve a variety of civil legal disputes, ranging from
divorces to business conflicts.
So what? This is harldy Taleban style Sharia is it? Why are you
posting this?
The new model, which will be closely examined by other countries
grappling with the place of growing Muslim communities in their
populations, is to be administered by a body of imams and Islamic
scholars, the Islamic Institute of Justice, which was created at the
end of last year.
It will be pioneered in the province of Ontario under a law introduced
in 1991, the Ontario Arbitration Act, which allows minority groups to
provide arbitration to members in a limited number of civil matters.
See? CIVIL MATTERS - not legal ones.
Enforcement of rulings and awards would be left to Canada's regular
courts.
See? It doesn't circumvent or overrule standard Canadian law. It's a
non-issue.
Many of Canada's 600,000 Muslims have applauded the opportunity to
settle differences according to Islamic law. Known as sharia, it is
drawn from the Koran and from the teachings of the prophet Mohamed. It
is hoped that if significant numbers of Muslims agree to settle
disputes before the arbitrators, pressure will be taken off the
province's clogged court system. "Many judges prefer this," said
Mohamed Elmasry, president of the Canadian Islamic Congress. "If
Canadian Muslims have an impartial body they trust, it will ease the
backlog in the courts."
Did you miss this bit?
Controversy surrounds the initiative even within the Muslim community.
Suggestions that it could lead to the stoning of women for adultery
have been swiftly knocked down by Canadian authorities, who point out
that the new courts would still have to respect all provisions of the
country's Charter of Rights and Freedoms that guarantees human and
equal rights.
Or this?
But they will not be allowed to deal with criminal
matters. Ontario's government is insisting that cases will only go
before Muslim arbitrators with the voluntary assent of all parties
involved.
Or this?
Brendan Crawley, a spokesman for the Ontario attorney general, said:
"If the award is not compatible with Canadian law, then the court will
not enforce it. You can't agree to violate Canadian law."
There is also the concern among some Muslim women that they will feel
religious and social pressure to enter the Sharia system when
sometimes they would rather avoid it.
"If I am a woman of faith, and the community of people who see
themselves as leaders say that if I do not follow the sharia court
here, the Islamic Institute, then I will be tantamount to blasphemy
and apostasy," said Alia Hogben of the Canadian Council of Muslim
Women.
I reaaly can't see what your problem is.. how do e.g. Native American
populations settle civil matters which trangsress their own traditions
but not Canadian law?
.
|
|
|
| User: "Jane" |
|
| Title: Re: Just For You, tw....Sharia in Canada |
05 May 2004 06:52:21 AM |
|
|
"Tom" <parris_k@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:aa5c37da.0405042308.5c11dd10@posting.google.com...
pushlinque@hotmail.com (Jane) wrote in message
news:<a8a04f01.0405041730.589bc0bf@posting.google.com>...
http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/story.jsp?story=516303Canadians
Muslims will get sharia courts to settle disputes
By David Usborne in New York
29 April 2004
Canada is embarking on an unusual judicial experiment that will allow
members of its Muslim community to submit to the teachings of the
Koran to resolve a variety of civil legal disputes, ranging from
divorces to business conflicts.
So what? This is harldy Taleban style Sharia is it? Why are you
posting this?
It is a beginning.
The new model, which will be closely examined by other countries
grappling with the place of growing Muslim communities in their
populations, is to be administered by a body of imams and Islamic
scholars, the Islamic Institute of Justice, which was created at the
end of last year.
It will be pioneered in the province of Ontario under a law introduced
in 1991, the Ontario Arbitration Act, which allows minority groups to
provide arbitration to members in a limited number of civil matters.
See? CIVIL MATTERS - not legal ones.
Enforcement of rulings and awards would be left to Canada's regular
courts.
See? It doesn't circumvent or overrule standard Canadian law. It's a
non-issue.
For now
Many of Canada's 600,000 Muslims have applauded the opportunity to
settle differences according to Islamic law. Known as sharia, it is
drawn from the Koran and from the teachings of the prophet Mohamed. It
is hoped that if significant numbers of Muslims agree to settle
disputes before the arbitrators, pressure will be taken off the
province's clogged court system. "Many judges prefer this," said
Mohamed Elmasry, president of the Canadian Islamic Congress. "If
Canadian Muslims have an impartial body they trust, it will ease the
backlog in the courts."
Did you miss this bit?
Controversy surrounds the initiative even within the Muslim community.
Suggestions that it could lead to the stoning of women for adultery
have been swiftly knocked down by Canadian authorities, who point out
that the new courts would still have to respect all provisions of the
country's Charter of Rights and Freedoms that guarantees human and
equal rights.
Or this?
But they will not be allowed to deal with criminal
matters. Ontario's government is insisting that cases will only go
before Muslim arbitrators with the voluntary assent of all parties
involved.
Or this?
Brendan Crawley, a spokesman for the Ontario attorney general, said:
"If the award is not compatible with Canadian law, then the court will
not enforce it. You can't agree to violate Canadian law."
There is also the concern among some Muslim women that they will feel
religious and social pressure to enter the Sharia system when
sometimes they would rather avoid it.
"If I am a woman of faith, and the community of people who see
themselves as leaders say that if I do not follow the sharia court
here, the Islamic Institute, then I will be tantamount to blasphemy
and apostasy," said Alia Hogben of the Canadian Council of Muslim
Women.
I reaaly can't see what your problem is.. how do e.g. Native American
populations settle civil matters which trangsress their own traditions
but not Canadian law?
I didn't miss ANY of it! Muslims do not have the numbers in Canada to have
any *real* political power...yet.
In the meantime, the poor, immigrant muslim woman who is not allowed out of
the house without an escort is really not going to have any say in whether
she has a secular court decide the provisions of her divorce (for example)
or a misogynist bunch of imams.
As for polygamy, the govt turns a blind eye to the polygamist sect of
Mormons in BC...
Jane
.
|
|
|
| User: "tw" |
|
| Title: Re: Just For You, tw....Sharia in Canada |
05 May 2004 07:19:02 AM |
|
|
"Jane" <pushlinque@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:Dz4mc.39984$ZJ5.1216946@news20.bellglobal.com...
"Tom" <parris_k@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:aa5c37da.0405042308.5c11dd10@posting.google.com...
pushlinque@hotmail.com (Jane) wrote in message
news:<a8a04f01.0405041730.589bc0bf@posting.google.com>...
http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/story.jsp?story=516303Canadians
Muslims will get sharia courts to settle disputes
By David Usborne in New York
29 April 2004
Canada is embarking on an unusual judicial experiment that will allow
members of its Muslim community to submit to the teachings of the
Koran to resolve a variety of civil legal disputes, ranging from
divorces to business conflicts.
So what? This is harldy Taleban style Sharia is it? Why are you
posting this?
It is a beginning.
As is e.g. teaching Creation science in schools without teaching evolution
too.
The new model, which will be closely examined by other countries
grappling with the place of growing Muslim communities in their
populations, is to be administered by a body of imams and Islamic
scholars, the Islamic Institute of Justice, which was created at the
end of last year.
It will be pioneered in the province of Ontario under a law introduced
in 1991, the Ontario Arbitration Act, which allows minority groups to
provide arbitration to members in a limited number of civil matters.
See? CIVIL MATTERS - not legal ones.
Enforcement of rulings and awards would be left to Canada's regular
courts.
See? It doesn't circumvent or overrule standard Canadian law. It's a
non-issue.
For now
Hmm.. I can't see the CANADIAN government voting to change its constitution
to allow stonings, amputations or whatever other horrors you feel are just
around the corner.
Many of Canada's 600,000 Muslims have applauded the opportunity to
settle differences according to Islamic law. Known as sharia, it is
drawn from the Koran and from the teachings of the prophet Mohamed. It
is hoped that if significant numbers of Muslims agree to settle
disputes before the arbitrators, pressure will be taken off the
province's clogged court system. "Many judges prefer this," said
Mohamed Elmasry, president of the Canadian Islamic Congress. "If
Canadian Muslims have an impartial body they trust, it will ease the
backlog in the courts."
Did you miss this bit?
Controversy surrounds the initiative even within the Muslim community.
Suggestions that it could lead to the stoning of women for adultery
have been swiftly knocked down by Canadian authorities, who point out
that the new courts would still have to respect all provisions of the
country's Charter of Rights and Freedoms that guarantees human and
equal rights.
Or this?
But they will not be allowed to deal with criminal
matters. Ontario's government is insisting that cases will only go
before Muslim arbitrators with the voluntary assent of all parties
involved.
Or this?
Brendan Crawley, a spokesman for the Ontario attorney general, said:
"If the award is not compatible with Canadian law, then the court will
not enforce it. You can't agree to violate Canadian law."
There is also the concern among some Muslim women that they will feel
religious and social pressure to enter the Sharia system when
sometimes they would rather avoid it.
"If I am a woman of faith, and the community of people who see
themselves as leaders say that if I do not follow the sharia court
here, the Islamic Institute, then I will be tantamount to blasphemy
and apostasy," said Alia Hogben of the Canadian Council of Muslim
Women.
I reaaly can't see what your problem is.. how do e.g. Native American
populations settle civil matters which trangsress their own traditions
but not Canadian law?
I didn't miss ANY of it! Muslims do not have the numbers in Canada to
have
any *real* political power...yet.
You feel they are just waiting to mob-up and start voting in Sharia law?
Look at a country such as teh UK, where muslim immigration has been a fact
of life for decades now - the majority of muslim kids (in the UK) eant the
same things as their non-muslim counterparts. They won't be marching in the
streets demanding Sharia any time soon.
In the meantime, the poor, immigrant muslim woman who is not allowed out
of
the house without an escort is really not going to have any say in whether
she has a secular court decide the provisions of her divorce (for example)
or a misogynist bunch of imams.
The article also said both parties had to agree to settling matters this
way. I suppose you DID miss that?'
As for polygamy, the govt turns a blind eye to the polygamist sect of
Mormons in BC...
So how come you aren't scared of those weirdo mormons conquering the world
and imposing their craziness on us?
Seems you are a little prejudiced..
.
|
|
|
| User: "Jane" |
|
| Title: Re: Just For You, tw....Sharia in Canada |
05 May 2004 02:06:30 PM |
|
|
"tw" <no@no.com> wrote in message news:<c7alvc$haa$1@newstree.wise.edt.ericsson.se>...
"Jane" <pushlinque@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:Dz4mc.39984$ZJ5.1216946@news20.bellglobal.com...
"Tom" <parris_k@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:aa5c37da.0405042308.5c11dd10@posting.google.com...
pushlinque@hotmail.com (Jane) wrote in message
news:<a8a04f01.0405041730.589bc0bf@posting.google.com>...
http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/story.jsp?story=516303Canadians
Muslims will get sharia courts to settle disputes
By David Usborne in New York
29 April 2004
Canada is embarking on an unusual judicial experiment that will allow
members of its Muslim community to submit to the teachings of the
Koran to resolve a variety of civil legal disputes, ranging from
divorces to business conflicts.
So what? This is harldy Taleban style Sharia is it? Why are you
posting this?
It is a beginning.
As is e.g. teaching Creation science in schools without teaching evolution
too.
I am not in favour of that! I'm not sure where you get the idea that
I am religious...
My degree is in biology and I certainly favour the theory of
eveolution over creationism, or the muslim idea that dinosaurs never
existed because they are not mentioned in the Qu'ran (got that one
from the horse's mouth)
The new model, which will be closely examined by other countries
grappling with the place of growing Muslim communities in their
populations, is to be administered by a body of imams and Islamic
scholars, the Islamic Institute of Justice, which was created at the
end of last year.
It will be pioneered in the province of Ontario under a law introduced
in 1991, the Ontario Arbitration Act, which allows minority groups to
provide arbitration to members in a limited number of civil matters.
See? CIVIL MATTERS - not legal ones.
Enforcement of rulings and awards would be left to Canada's regular
courts.
See? It doesn't circumvent or overrule standard Canadian law. It's a
non-issue.
For now
Hmm.. I can't see the CANADIAN government voting to change its constitution
to allow stonings, amputations or whatever other horrors you feel are just
around the corner.
Not yet, as I have said.
Many of Canada's 600,000 Muslims have applauded the opportunity to
settle differences according to Islamic law. Known as sharia, it is
drawn from the Koran and from the teachings of the prophet Mohamed. It
is hoped that if significant numbers of Muslims agree to settle
disputes before the arbitrators, pressure will be taken off the
province's clogged court system. "Many judges prefer this," said
Mohamed Elmasry, president of the Canadian Islamic Congress. "If
Canadian Muslims have an impartial body they trust, it will ease the
backlog in the courts."
Did you miss this bit?
Controversy surrounds the initiative even within the Muslim community.
Suggestions that it could lead to the stoning of women for adultery
have been swiftly knocked down by Canadian authorities, who point out
that the new courts would still have to respect all provisions of the
country's Charter of Rights and Freedoms that guarantees human and
equal rights.
Or this?
But they will not be allowed to deal with criminal
matters. Ontario's government is insisting that cases will only go
before Muslim arbitrators with the voluntary assent of all parties
involved.
Or this?
Brendan Crawley, a spokesman for the Ontario attorney general, said:
"If the award is not compatible with Canadian law, then the court will
not enforce it. You can't agree to violate Canadian law."
There is also the concern among some Muslim women that they will feel
religious and social pressure to enter the Sharia system when
sometimes they would rather avoid it.
"If I am a woman of faith, and the community of people who see
themselves as leaders say that if I do not follow the sharia court
here, the Islamic Institute, then I will be tantamount to blasphemy
and apostasy," said Alia Hogben of the Canadian Council of Muslim
Women.
I reaaly can't see what your problem is.. how do e.g. Native American
populations settle civil matters which trangsress their own traditions
but not Canadian law?
I didn't miss ANY of it! Muslims do not have the numbers in Canada to
have
any *real* political power...yet.
You feel they are just waiting to mob-up and start voting in Sharia law?
Look at a country such as teh UK, where muslim immigration has been a fact
of life for decades now - the majority of muslim kids (in the UK) eant the
same things as their non-muslim counterparts. They won't be marching in the
streets demanding Sharia any time soon.
Here's an article for you from The Toronto Star (a liberal rag, BTW),
entitled "Jihad in London"
http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=thestar/Layout/Article_Type1&c=Article&cid=1083450009066&call_pageid=970599109774&col=Columnist972859096039
not exactly marching for sharia, but close. It'll come.
In the meantime, the poor, immigrant muslim woman who is not allowed out
of
the house without an escort is really not going to have any say in whether
she has a secular court decide the provisions of her divorce (for example)
or a misogynist bunch of imams.
The article also said both parties had to agree to settling matters this
way. I suppose you DID miss that?'
Nope! You REALLY think the woman I referred to has any say in
anything??? Of course, she will agree to sharia court or get the crap
beaten out of her! And lose her kids, because children always go to
the father after they are weaned.
As for polygamy, the govt turns a blind eye to the polygamist sect of
Mormons in BC...
So how come you aren't scared of those weirdo mormons conquering the world
and imposing their craziness on us?
They are a tiny sect that are not sanctioned by the larger Mormon
church. Big difference!
Seems you are a little prejudiced..
Not against any race...against Islam, yes.
Jane
.
|
|
|
| User: "WillyWaco" |
|
| Title: Re: Just For You, tw....Sharia in Canada |
05 May 2004 04:26:46 PM |
|
|
"Jane" <pushlinque@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:a8a04f01.0405051106.a2ecb45@posting.google.com...
"tw" <no@no.com> wrote in message
news:<c7alvc$haa$1@newstree.wise.edt.ericsson.se>...
"Jane" <pushlinque@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:Dz4mc.39984$ZJ5.1216946@news20.bellglobal.com...
"Tom" <parris_k@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:aa5c37da.0405042308.5c11dd10@posting.google.com...
pushlinque@hotmail.com (Jane) wrote in message
news:<a8a04f01.0405041730.589bc0bf@posting.google.com>...
http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/story.jsp?story=516303Canadians
Muslims will get sharia courts to settle disputes
By David Usborne in New York
29 April 2004
Canada is embarking on an unusual judicial experiment that will
allow
members of its Muslim community to submit to the teachings of
the
Koran to resolve a variety of civil legal disputes, ranging from
divorces to business conflicts.
So what? This is harldy Taleban style Sharia is it? Why are you
posting this?
It is a beginning.
As is e.g. teaching Creation science in schools without teaching
evolution
too.
I am not in favour of that! I'm not sure where you get the idea that
I am religious...
My degree is in biology and I certainly favour the theory of
eveolution over creationism, or the muslim idea that dinosaurs never
existed because they are not mentioned in the Qu'ran (got that one
from the horse's mouth)
The new model, which will be closely examined by other countries
grappling with the place of growing Muslim communities in their
populations, is to be administered by a body of imams and
Islamic
scholars, the Islamic Institute of Justice, which was created at
the
end of last year.
It will be pioneered in the province of Ontario under a law
introduced
in 1991, the Ontario Arbitration Act, which allows minority
groups to
provide arbitration to members in a limited number of civil
matters.
See? CIVIL MATTERS - not legal ones.
Enforcement of rulings and awards would be left to Canada's
regular
courts.
See? It doesn't circumvent or overrule standard Canadian law. It's
a
non-issue.
For now
Hmm.. I can't see the CANADIAN government voting to change its
constitution
to allow stonings, amputations or whatever other horrors you feel are
just
around the corner.
Not yet, as I have said.
Many of Canada's 600,000 Muslims have applauded the opportunity
to
settle differences according to Islamic law. Known as sharia, it
is
drawn from the Koran and from the teachings of the prophet
Mohamed. It
is hoped that if significant numbers of Muslims agree to settle
disputes before the arbitrators, pressure will be taken off the
province's clogged court system. "Many judges prefer this," said
Mohamed Elmasry, president of the Canadian Islamic Congress. "If
Canadian Muslims have an impartial body they trust, it will ease
the
backlog in the courts."
Did you miss this bit?
Controversy surrounds the initiative even within the Muslim
community.
Suggestions that it could lead to the stoning of women for
adultery
have been swiftly knocked down by Canadian authorities, who
point out
that the new courts would still have to respect all provisions
of the
country's Charter of Rights and Freedoms that guarantees human
and
equal rights.
Or this?
But they will not be allowed to deal with criminal
matters. Ontario's government is insisting that cases will only
go
before Muslim arbitrators with the voluntary assent of all
parties
involved.
Or this?
Brendan Crawley, a spokesman for the Ontario attorney general,
said:
"If the award is not compatible with Canadian law, then the
court will
not enforce it. You can't agree to violate Canadian law."
There is also the concern among some Muslim women that they will
feel
religious and social pressure to enter the Sharia system when
sometimes they would rather avoid it.
"If I am a woman of faith, and the community of people who see
themselves as leaders say that if I do not follow the sharia
court
here, the Islamic Institute, then I will be tantamount to
blasphemy
and apostasy," said Alia Hogben of the Canadian Council of
Muslim
Women.
I reaaly can't see what your problem is.. how do e.g. Native
American
populations settle civil matters which trangsress their own
traditions
but not Canadian law?
I didn't miss ANY of it! Muslims do not have the numbers in Canada
to
have
any *real* political power...yet.
You feel they are just waiting to mob-up and start voting in Sharia
law?
Look at a country such as teh UK, where muslim immigration has been a
fact
of life for decades now - the majority of muslim kids (in the UK) eant
the
same things as their non-muslim counterparts. They won't be marching
in the
streets demanding Sharia any time soon.
Here's an article for you from The Toronto Star (a liberal rag, BTW),
entitled "Jihad in London"
http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=thestar/Layout/Article_Type1&c=Article&cid=1083450009066&call_pageid=970599109774&col=Columnist972859096039
not exactly marching for sharia, but close. It'll come.
In the meantime, the poor, immigrant muslim woman who is not allowed
out
of
the house without an escort is really not going to have any say in
whether
she has a secular court decide the provisions of her divorce (for
example)
or a misogynist bunch of imams.
The article also said both parties had to agree to settling matters
this
way. I suppose you DID miss that?'
Nope! You REALLY think the woman I referred to has any say in
anything??? Of course, she will agree to sharia court or get the crap
beaten out of her! And lose her kids, because children always go to
the father after they are weaned.
As for polygamy, the govt turns a blind eye to the polygamist sect
of
Mormons in BC...
So how come you aren't scared of those weirdo mormons conquering the
world
and imposing their craziness on us?
They are a tiny sect that are not sanctioned by the larger Mormon
church. Big difference!
Seems you are a little prejudiced..
Not against any race...against Islam, yes.
Jane
You're in good company here, then. Also, a number here are probably
unemployed, too. And there's nothing much worse than to be idle and full
of hatred...thankfully, the computer and internet act as a partial
catharsis. lol...
Willy ;)
.
|
|
|
| User: "Jane" |
|
| Title: Re: Just For You, tw....Sharia in Canada |
05 May 2004 09:07:25 PM |
|
|
"WillyWaco" <g-ray52@excite.com> wrote in message news:<c7bm6q011pb@enews3.newsguy.com>...
"Jane" <pushlinque@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:a8a04f01.0405051106.a2ecb45@posting.google.com...
"tw" <no@no.com> wrote in message
news:<c7alvc$haa$1@newstree.wise.edt.ericsson.se>...
"Jane" <pushlinque@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:Dz4mc.39984$ZJ5.1216946@news20.bellglobal.com...
"Tom" <parris_k@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:aa5c37da.0405042308.5c11dd10@posting.google.com...
pushlinque@hotmail.com (Jane) wrote in message
news:<a8a04f01.0405041730.589bc0bf@posting.google.com>...
http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/story.jsp?story=516303Canadians
Muslims will get sharia courts to settle disputes
By David Usborne in New York
29 April 2004
Canada is embarking on an unusual judicial experiment that will
allow
members of its Muslim community to submit to the teachings of
the
Koran to resolve a variety of civil legal disputes, ranging from
divorces to business conflicts.
So what? This is harldy Taleban style Sharia is it? Why are you
posting this?
It is a beginning.
As is e.g. teaching Creation science in schools without teaching
evolution
too.
I am not in favour of that! I'm not sure where you get the idea that
I am religious...
My degree is in biology and I certainly favour the theory of
eveolution over creationism, or the muslim idea that dinosaurs never
existed because they are not mentioned in the Qu'ran (got that one
from the horse's mouth)
The new model, which will be closely examined by other countries
grappling with the place of growing Muslim communities in their
populations, is to be administered by a body of imams and
Islamic
scholars, the Islamic Institute of Justice, which was created at
the
end of last year.
It will be pioneered in the province of Ontario under a law
introduced
in 1991, the Ontario Arbitration Act, which allows minority
groups to
provide arbitration to members in a limited number of civil
matters.
See? CIVIL MATTERS - not legal ones.
Enforcement of rulings and awards would be left to Canada's
regular
courts.
See? It doesn't circumvent or overrule standard Canadian law. It's
a
non-issue.
For now
Hmm.. I can't see the CANADIAN government voting to change its
constitution
to allow stonings, amputations or whatever other horrors you feel are
just
around the corner.
Not yet, as I have said.
Many of Canada's 600,000 Muslims have applauded the opportunity
to
settle differences according to Islamic law. Known as sharia, it
is
drawn from the Koran and from the teachings of the prophet
Mohamed. It
is hoped that if significant numbers of Muslims agree to settle
disputes before the arbitrators, pressure will be taken off the
province's clogged court system. "Many judges prefer this," said
Mohamed Elmasry, president of the Canadian Islamic Congress. "If
Canadian Muslims have an impartial body they trust, it will ease
the
backlog in the courts."
Did you miss this bit?
Controversy surrounds the initiative even within the Muslim
community.
Suggestions that it could lead to the stoning of women for
adultery
have been swiftly knocked down by Canadian authorities, who
point out
that the new courts would still have to respect all provisions
of the
country's Charter of Rights and Freedoms that guarantees human
and
equal rights.
Or this?
But they will not be allowed to deal with criminal
matters. Ontario's government is insisting that cases will only
go
before Muslim arbitrators with the voluntary assent of all
parties
involved.
Or this?
Brendan Crawley, a spokesman for the Ontario attorney general,
said:
"If the award is not compatible with Canadian law, then the
court will
not enforce it. You can't agree to violate Canadian law."
There is also the concern among some Muslim women that they will
feel
religious and social pressure to enter the Sharia system when
sometimes they would rather avoid it.
"If I am a woman of faith, and the community of people who see
themselves as leaders say that if I do not follow the sharia
court
here, the Islamic Institute, then I will be tantamount to
blasphemy
and apostasy," said Alia Hogben of the Canadian Council of
Muslim
Women.
I reaaly can't see what your problem is.. how do e.g. Native
American
populations settle civil matters which trangsress their own
traditions
but not Canadian law?
I didn't miss ANY of it! Muslims do not have the numbers in Canada
to
have
any *real* political power...yet.
You feel they are just waiting to mob-up and start voting in Sharia
law?
Look at a country such as teh UK, where muslim immigration has been a
fact
of life for decades now - the majority of muslim kids (in the UK) eant
the
same things as their non-muslim counterparts. They won't be marching
in the
streets demanding Sharia any time soon.
Here's an article for you from The Toronto Star (a liberal rag, BTW),
entitled "Jihad in London"
http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=thestar/Layout/Article_Type1&c=Article&cid=1083450009066&call_pageid=970599109774&col=Columnist972859096039
not exactly marching for sharia, but close. It'll come.
In the meantime, the poor, immigrant muslim woman who is not allowed
out
of
the house without an escort is really not going to have any say in
whether
she has a secular court decide the provisions of her divorce (for
example)
or a misogynist bunch of imams.
The article also said both parties had to agree to settling matters
this
way. I suppose you DID miss that?'
Nope! You REALLY think the woman I referred to has any say in
anything??? Of course, she will agree to sharia court or get the crap
beaten out of her! And lose her kids, because children always go to
the father after they are weaned.
As for polygamy, the govt turns a blind eye to the polygamist sect
of
Mormons in BC...
So how come you aren't scared of those weirdo mormons conquering the
world
and imposing their craziness on us?
They are a tiny sect that are not sanctioned by the larger Mormon
church. Big difference!
Seems you are a little prejudiced..
Not against any race...against Islam, yes.
Jane
You're in good company here, then. Also, a number here are probably
unemployed, too. And there's nothing much worse than to be idle and full
of hatred...thankfully, the computer and internet act as a partial
catharsis. lol...
Willy ;)
Speak for yourself, I'm quite gainfully employed, thank you. 21 years
at an auto manufacturer. My husband, likewise. Have never lazed
around the house in my life.
Jane
.
|
|
|
| User: "WillyWaco" |
|
| Title: Re: Just For You, tw....Sharia in Canada |
09 May 2004 02:36:17 PM |
|
|
"Jane" <pushlinque@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:a8a04f01.0405051807.17d5b3bc@posting.google.com...
"WillyWaco" <g-ray52@excite.com> wrote in message
news:<c7bm6q011pb@enews3.newsguy.com>...
"Jane" <pushlinque@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:a8a04f01.0405051106.a2ecb45@posting.google.com...
"tw" <no@no.com> wrote in message
news:<c7alvc$haa$1@newstree.wise.edt.ericsson.se>...
"Jane" <pushlinque@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:Dz4mc.39984$ZJ5.1216946@news20.bellglobal.com...
"Tom" <parris_k@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:aa5c37da.0405042308.5c11dd10@posting.google.com...
pushlinque@hotmail.com (Jane) wrote in message
news:<a8a04f01.0405041730.589bc0bf@posting.google.com>...
http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/story.jsp?story=516303Canadians
Muslims will get sharia courts to settle disputes
By David Usborne in New York
29 April 2004
Canada is embarking on an unusual judicial experiment that
will
allow
members of its Muslim community to submit to the teachings
of
the
Koran to resolve a variety of civil legal disputes, ranging
from
divorces to business conflicts.
So what? This is harldy Taleban style Sharia is it? Why are
you
posting this?
It is a beginning.
As is e.g. teaching Creation science in schools without teaching
evolution
too.
I am not in favour of that! I'm not sure where you get the idea
that
I am religious...
My degree is in biology and I certainly favour the theory of
eveolution over creationism, or the muslim idea that dinosaurs never
existed because they are not mentioned in the Qu'ran (got that one
from the horse's mouth)
The new model, which will be closely examined by other
countries
grappling with the place of growing Muslim communities in
their
populations, is to be administered by a body of imams and
Islamic
scholars, the Islamic Institute of Justice, which was
created at
the
end of last year.
It will be pioneered in the province of Ontario under a law
introduced
in 1991, the Ontario Arbitration Act, which allows minority
groups to
provide arbitration to members in a limited number of civil
matters.
See? CIVIL MATTERS - not legal ones.
Enforcement of rulings and awards would be left to Canada's
regular
courts.
See? It doesn't circumvent or overrule standard Canadian law.
It's
a
non-issue.
For now
Hmm.. I can't see the CANADIAN government voting to change its
constitution
to allow stonings, amputations or whatever other horrors you feel
are
just
around the corner.
Not yet, as I have said.
Many of Canada's 600,000 Muslims have applauded the
opportunity
to
settle differences according to Islamic law. Known as
sharia, it
is
drawn from the Koran and from the teachings of the prophet
Mohamed. It
is hoped that if significant numbers of Muslims agree to
settle
disputes before the arbitrators, pressure will be taken off
the
province's clogged court system. "Many judges prefer this,"
said
Mohamed Elmasry, president of the Canadian Islamic Congress.
"If
Canadian Muslims have an impartial body they trust, it will
ease
the
backlog in the courts."
Did you miss this bit?
Controversy surrounds the initiative even within the Muslim
community.
Suggestions that it could lead to the stoning of women for
adultery
have been swiftly knocked down by Canadian authorities, who
point out
that the new courts would still have to respect all
provisions
of the
country's Charter of Rights and Freedoms that guarantees
human
and
equal rights.
Or this?
But they will not be allowed to deal with criminal
matters. Ontario's government is insisting that cases will
only
go
before Muslim arbitrators with the voluntary assent of all
parties
involved.
Or this?
Brendan Crawley, a spokesman for the Ontario attorney
general,
said:
"If the award is not compatible with Canadian law, then the
court will
not enforce it. You can't agree to violate Canadian law."
There is also the concern among some Muslim women that they
will
feel
religious and social pressure to enter the Sharia system
when
sometimes they would rather avoid it.
"If I am a woman of faith, and the community of people who
see
themselves as leaders say that if I do not follow the sharia
court
here, the Islamic Institute, then I will be tantamount to
blasphemy
and apostasy," said Alia Hogben of the Canadian Council of
Muslim
Women.
I reaaly can't see what your problem is.. how do e.g. Native
American
populations settle civil matters which trangsress their own
traditions
but not Canadian law?
I didn't miss ANY of it! Muslims do not have the numbers in
Canada
to
have
any *real* political power...yet.
You feel they are just waiting to mob-up and start voting in
Sharia
law?
Look at a country such as teh UK, where muslim immigration has
been a
fact
of life for decades now - the majority of muslim kids (in the UK)
eant
the
same things as their non-muslim counterparts. They won't be
marching
in the
streets demanding Sharia any time soon.
Here's an article for you from The Toronto Star (a liberal rag,
BTW),
entitled "Jihad in London"
http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=thestar/Layout/Article_Type1&c=Article&cid=1083450009066&call_pageid=970599109774&col=Columnist972859096039
not exactly marching for sharia, but close. It'll come.
In the meantime, the poor, immigrant muslim woman who is not
allowed
out
of
the house without an escort is really not going to have any say
in
whether
she has a secular court decide the provisions of her divorce
(for
example)
or a misogynist bunch of imams.
The article also said both parties had to agree to settling
matters
this
way. I suppose you DID miss that?'
Nope! You REALLY think the woman I referred to has any say in
anything??? Of course, she will agree to sharia court or get the
crap
beaten out of her! And lose her kids, because children always go to
the father after they are weaned.
As for polygamy, the govt turns a blind eye to the polygamist
sect
of
Mormons in BC...
So how come you aren't scared of those weirdo mormons conquering
the
world
and imposing their craziness on us?
They are a tiny sect that are not sanctioned by the larger Mormon
church. Big difference!
Seems you are a little prejudiced..
Not against any race...against Islam, yes.
Jane
You're in good company here, then. Also, a number here are probably
unemployed, too. And there's nothing much worse than to be idle and
full
of hatred...thankfully, the computer and internet act as a partial
catharsis. lol...
Willy ;)
Speak for yourself, I'm quite gainfully employed, thank you. 21 years
at an auto manufacturer. My husband, likewise. Have never lazed
around the house in my life.
Jane
You don't read posts very clearly, dear. Did I say YOU were unemployed?
Huh, honey buns, did I?
Nooooo...and did I saw you were unemployed and LAZY...noooo, again...did I
say ANYTHING about your husband working or not working....noooo, once
again.
So, apparently, all this proves is that you can be employed and full of
hatred, not mention touchy as hell...R O F L ....
I know nothing much matters to you, if you don't experience it
yourself...that's certainly clear...R O F L...you are, as I said (read
carefully) in good company here with lots of bigoted dummies who hate
Islam. And THAT, gainfully employed, hard working person, is what I said
in regards specifically to YOU, and the rest of my comments were directed
generally at others in this NG. My heavens...what a temper...estrogen
level off today?
Willy
.
|
|
|
|
|
|
| User: "Ex" |
|
| Title: Re: Just For You, tw....Sharia in Canada |
05 May 2004 05:04:44 PM |
|
|
"Jane" <pushlinque@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:a8a04f01.0405051106.a2ecb45@posting.google.com...
"tw" <no@no.com> wrote in message
news:<c7alvc$haa$1@newstree.wise.edt.ericsson.se>...
"Jane" <pushlinque@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:Dz4mc.39984$ZJ5.1216946@news20.bellglobal.com...
"Tom" <parris_k@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:aa5c37da.0405042308.5c11dd10@posting.google.com...
pushlinque@hotmail.com (Jane) wrote in message
news:<a8a04f01.0405041730.589bc0bf@posting.google.com>...
http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/story.jsp?story=516303Canadians
Muslims will get sharia courts to settle disputes
By David Usborne in New York
29 April 2004
Canada is embarking on an unusual judicial experiment that will
allow
members of its Muslim community to submit to the teachings of the
Koran to resolve a variety of civil legal disputes, ranging from
divorces to business conflicts.
So what? This is harldy Taleban style Sharia is it? Why are you
posting this?
It is a beginning.
As is e.g. teaching Creation science in schools without teaching
evolution
too.
I am not in favour of that! I'm not sure where you get the idea that
I am religious...
My degree is in biology and I certainly favour the theory of
eveolution over creationism, or the muslim idea that dinosaurs never
existed because they are not mentioned in the Qu'ran (got that one
from the horse's mouth)
The new model, which will be closely examined by other countries
grappling with the place of growing Muslim communities in their
populations, is to be administered by a body of imams and Islamic
scholars, the Islamic Institute of Justice, which was created at
the
end of last year.
It will be pioneered in the province of Ontario under a law
introduced
in 1991, the Ontario Arbitration Act, which allows minority groups
to
provide arbitration to members in a limited number of civil
matters.
See? CIVIL MATTERS - not legal ones.
Enforcement of rulings and awards would be left to Canada's
regular
courts.
See? It doesn't circumvent or overrule standard Canadian law. It's a
non-issue.
For now
Hmm.. I can't see the CANADIAN government voting to change its
constitution
to allow stonings, amputations or whatever other horrors you feel are
just
around the corner.
Not yet, as I have said.
Us people in Canuckistan are known for our relaxed view of life so ... it's
*HIGHLY* doubtful that we would change our constitution to allow for
stonings, etc ... unless the stonings are somehow related to the
legalization of marijuana.
As long as the beer store maintains decent hours and the hospital emergency
room wait time isn't more then a couple of hours no one seems to get too
bothered.
Many of Canada's 600,000 Muslims have applauded the opportunity to
settle differences according to Islamic law. Known as sharia, it
is
drawn from the Koran and from the teachings of the prophet
Mohamed. It
is hoped that if significant numbers of Muslims agree to settle
disputes before the arbitrators, pressure will be taken off the
province's clogged court system. "Many judges prefer this," said
Mohamed Elmasry, president of the Canadian Islamic Congress. "If
Canadian Muslims have an impartial body they trust, it will ease
the
backlog in the courts."
Did you miss this bit?
Controversy surrounds the initiative even within the Muslim
community.
Suggestions that it could lead to the stoning of women for
adultery
have been swiftly knocked down by Canadian authorities, who point
out
that the new courts would still have to respect all provisions of
the
country's Charter of Rights and Freedoms that guarantees human and
equal rights.
Or this?
But they will not be allowed to deal with criminal
matters. Ontario's government is insisting that cases will only go
before Muslim arbitrators with the voluntary assent of all parties
involved.
Or this?
Brendan Crawley, a spokesman for the Ontario attorney general,
said:
"If the award is not compatible with Canadian law, then the court
will
not enforce it. You can't agree to violate Canadian law."
There is also the concern among some Muslim women that they will
feel
religious and social pressure to enter the Sharia system when
sometimes they would rather avoid it.
"If I am a woman of faith, and the community of people who see
themselves as leaders say that if I do not follow the sharia court
here, the Islamic Institute, then I will be tantamount to
blasphemy
and apostasy," said Alia Hogben of the Canadian Council of Muslim
Women.
I reaaly can't see what your problem is.. how do e.g. Native
American
populations settle civil matters which trangsress their own
traditions
but not Canadian law?
I didn't miss ANY of it! Muslims do not have the numbers in Canada to
have
any *real* political power...yet.
You feel they are just waiting to mob-up and start voting in Sharia law?
Look at a country such as teh UK, where muslim immigration has been a
fact
of life for decades now - the majority of muslim kids (in the UK) eant
the
same things as their non-muslim counterparts. They won't be marching in
the
streets demanding Sharia any time soon.
Here's an article for you from The Toronto Star (a liberal rag, BTW),
entitled "Jihad in London"
http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=thestar/Layout/Article_Type1&c=Article&cid=1083450009066&call_pageid=970599109774&col=Columnist972859096039
not exactly marching for sharia, but close. It'll come.
In the meantime, the poor, immigrant muslim woman who is not allowed
out
of
the house without an escort is really not going to have any say in
whether
she has a secular court decide the provisions of her divorce (for
example)
or a misogynist bunch of imams.
The article also said both parties had to agree to settling matters this
way. I suppose you DID miss that?'
Nope! You REALLY think the woman I referred to has any say in
anything??? Of course, she will agree to sharia court or get the crap
beaten out of her! And lose her kids, because children always go to
the father after they are weaned.
As for polygamy, the govt turns a blind eye to the polygamist sect of
Mormons in BC...
So how come you aren't scared of those weirdo mormons conquering the
world
and imposing their craziness on us?
They are a tiny sect that are not sanctioned by the larger Mormon
church. Big difference!
Seems you are a little prejudiced..
Not against any race...against Islam, yes.
Jane
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.676 / Virus Database: 438 - Release Date: 5/3/04
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "tw" |
|
| Title: Re: Just For You, tw....Sharia in Canada |
06 May 2004 01:55:15 AM |
|
|
"Jane" <pushlinque@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:a8a04f01.0405051106.a2ecb45@posting.google.com...
"tw" <no@no.com> wrote in message
news:<c7alvc$haa$1@newstree.wise.edt.ericsson.se>...
"Jane" <pushlinque@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:Dz4mc.39984$ZJ5.1216946@news20.bellglobal.com...
"Tom" <parris_k@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:aa5c37da.0405042308.5c11dd10@posting.google.com...
pushlinque@hotmail.com (Jane) wrote in message
news:<a8a04f01.0405041730.589bc0bf@posting.google.com>...
http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/story.jsp?story=516303Canadians
Muslims will get sharia courts to settle disputes
By David Usborne in New York
29 April 2004
Canada is embarking on an unusual judicial experiment that will
allow
members of its Muslim community to submit to the teachings of the
Koran to resolve a variety of civil legal disputes, ranging from
divorces to business conflicts.
So what? This is harldy Taleban style Sharia is it? Why are you
posting this?
It is a beginning.
As is e.g. teaching Creation science in schools without teaching
evolution
too.
I am not in favour of that! I'm not sure where you get the idea that
I am religious...
I don't think you're reliigious, I'm just trying to figure out why you ONLY
see muslim extremism as a threat, when what you claim to be worried about
can be applied to other religions too.
My degree is in biology and I certainly favour the theory of
eveolution over creationism, or the muslim idea that dinosaurs never
existed because they are not mentioned in the Qu'ran (got that one
from the horse's mouth)
So, becuase you heard ONE muslim person say this, you think it's a "muslim
idea"?! Talk about ignorance and generalisation! Plenty of christians don't
believe dinosaurs existed either - does that make it a "christian" idea too?
For now
Hmm.. I can't see the CANADIAN government voting to change its
constitution
to allow stonings, amputations or whatever other horrors you feel are
just
around the corner.
Not yet, as I have said.
How do you think it is going to come about? YOu think that every muslim who
emigrates to Canada is going to be a hardline Shia who well immediately
start agitating for Sharia law? I'm sorry, but that is just ridiculous.
I didn't miss ANY of it! Muslims do not have the numbers in Canada to
have
any *real* political power...yet.
You feel they are just waiting to mob-up and start voting in Sharia law?
Look at a country such as teh UK, where muslim immigration has been a
fact
of life for decades now - the majority of muslim kids (in the UK) eant
the
same things as their non-muslim counterparts. They won't be marching in
the
streets demanding Sharia any time soon.
Here's an article for you from The Toronto Star (a liberal rag, BTW),
entitled "Jihad in London"
http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=thestar/Layout/Artic
le_Type1&c=Article&cid=1083450009066&call_pageid=970599109774&col=Columnist9
72859096039
LOL! So your evidence is ONE extremist congregation in Finsbury Park! NOte
how they weren't marching for anything and that was a tiny, tiny minority of
the Muslims in Finsbury Prak, let alone NOrth London, let alone the UK as a
whole! THta's like reporting on some mad pro-lifers buring an abortion
clinic and using it as evidence of
not exactly marching for sharia, but close.
Nowhere near - just a bunch of extremists with a very particular axe to
grind. THis is a very poor argumnet your making, even by APN standards..
It'll come.
I very much doubt it.
In the meantime, the poor, immigrant muslim woman who is not allowed
out
of
the house without an escort is really not going to have any say in
whether
she has a secular court decide the provisions of her divorce (for
example)
or a misogynist bunch of imams.
The article also said both parties had to agree to settling matters this
way. I suppose you DID miss that?'
Nope! You REALLY think the woman I referred to has any say in
anything???
Yep. I assume Canada treats both sexs the same? She can go to teh police.
Of course, she will agree to sharia court or get the crap
beaten out of her!
She can then go to the police and bring assault charges.
And lose her kids, because children always go to
the father after they are weaned.
Presumably she can go to social services too.
As for polygamy, the govt turns a blind eye to the polygamist sect of
Mormons in BC...
So how come you aren't scared of those weirdo mormons conquering the
world
and imposing their craziness on us?
They are a tiny sect
As was the congregation in North London in your little newspaper report.
that are not sanctioned by the larger Mormon
church.
Are you SURE about that? I'm pretty sure the worldwide establishment of
Sharia isn't sanctioned by teh larger Islamic church. (Yes, there's a lot of
guff about converions by the sword in teh Koran, but pleny of identical guff
in teh bible)
Big difference!
Doesn't seem like it.
Seems you are a little prejudiced..
Not against any race...against Islam, yes.
And that's somehow supposed to be *better*?!
Prejudice is prejudice. Based on ignorance and fear.
I hope you get over it.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Jane" |
|
| Title: Re: Just For You, tw....Sharia in Canada |
06 May 2004 09:05:10 AM |
|
|
"tw" <no@no.com> wrote in message news:<c7cnc9$fko$1@newstree.wise.edt.ericsson.se>...
(Snipped most of it; we are not going to resolve our differences!)
The article also said both parties had to agree to settling matters this
way. I suppose you DID miss that?'
Nope! You REALLY think the woman I referred to has any say in
anything???
Yep. I assume Canada treats both sexs the same? She can go to teh police.
Of course, she will agree to sharia court or get the crap
beaten out of her!
She can then go to the police and bring assault charges.
And lose her kids, because children always go to
the father after they are weaned.
Presumably she can go to social services too.
You show a complete lack of understanding of the life of the woman I
described! She has gone from being the property of her father and/ or
brothers to the property of her husband. Lets say she's a Pakistani
muslim. In her own country, she can be killed if she is seen
associating with a man or should she fall in love with someone her
parents (read: father) haven't chosen for her. (Even in modern muslim
states, like Jordan, honour killings happen and have only recently
begun to be prosecuted and often not too zealously). She's married
off to whomever her family (read: father) has chosen, possibly an old
geezer. She may not meet him until her wedding day. Then she has sex
with him, which likely feels like rape, and hopefully knows enough to
make sure she bleeds. If they are divorced, tribal elders or other
men decide the terms, including who gets the children. (There was a
case of a murdered Pakistani child recently (by father and stepmother)
in Toronto and they delved into the background of her mother's life in
Pakistan...the child was ripped from her mother as an infant because
tribal elders had decided to give the father custody...even though he
had nothing to do with the baby and even said she was a *****. The
articles are likely in the Toronto Star archives,as this is a recent
case. These articles are not my only source; check out the books I
mentioned. They also mentioned that the rate of wife abuse in
Pakistan is 90%) The husband can take multiple wives whether she
likes it or not.
Now, move this woman to a western country and do you honestly think
she will be much better off? He won't get away with murdering her as
easily, but he can keep her confined in her home. It does happen!
The Pakistani I worked with did not let his wife out without himself
or one of his sons. Does she speak the language? Does she know what
resources are available to her? Not bloody likely! She only know
what she has lived and that is enough to want never to cross the men
in her life! I am sure there are women that are even worse off than
the Pakistani woman. The vitamin-D deficient, burka-wearing Afghani,
for example...even with the Taliban gone.
Oh, well, since I assume you are male, it is probably hard for you to
understand. I'm not even particularly a feminist (I like Dr. Laura),
but I just get so angry when I think of these women!
Jane
.
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|
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| User: "Dani" |
|
| Title: Re: Just For You, tw....Sharia in Canada |
06 May 2004 02:22:19 PM |
|
|
On 6 May 2004 07:05:10 -0700, (Jane) wrote:
"tw" <no@no.com> wrote in message news:<c7cnc9$fko$1@newstree.wise.edt.ericsson.se>...
(Snipped most of it; we are not going to resolve our differences!)
The article also said both parties had to agree to settling matters this
way. I suppose you DID miss that?'
Nope! You REALLY think the woman I referred to has any say in
anything???
Yep. I assume Canada treats both sexs the same? She can go to teh police.
Of course, she will agree to sharia court or get the crap
beaten out of her!
She can then go to the police and bring assault charges.
And lose her kids, because children always go to
the father after they are weaned.
Presumably she can go to social services too.
You show a complete lack of understanding of the life of the woman I
described! She has gone from being the property of her father and/ or
brothers to the property of her husband. Lets say she's a Pakistani
muslim. In her own country, she can be killed if she is seen
associating with a man or should she fall in love with someone her
parents (read: father) haven't chosen for her. (Even in modern muslim
states, like Jordan, honour killings happen and have only recently
begun to be prosecuted and often not too zealously). She's married
off to whomever her family (read: father) has chosen, possibly an old
geezer. She may not meet him until her wedding day. Then she has sex
with him, which likely feels like rape, and hopefully knows enough to
make sure she bleeds. If they are divorced, tribal elders or other
men decide the terms, including who gets the children. (There was a
case of a murdered Pakistani child recently (by father and stepmother)
in Toronto and they delved into the background of her mother's life in
Pakistan...the child was ripped from her mother as an infant because
tribal elders had decided to give the father custody...even though he
had nothing to do with the baby and even said she was a *****. The
articles are likely in the Toronto Star archives,as this is a recent
case. These articles are not my only source; check out the books I
mentioned. They also mentioned that the rate of wife abuse in
Pakistan is 90%) The husband can take multiple wives whether she
likes it or not.
Now, move this woman to a western country and do you honestly think
she will be much better off? He won't get away with murdering her as
easily, but he can keep her confined in her home. It does happen!
The Pakistani I worked with did not let his wife out without himself
or one of his sons. Does she speak the language? Does she know what
resources are available to her? Not bloody likely! She only know
what she has lived and that is enough to want never to cross the men
in her life! I am sure there are women that are even worse off than
the Pakistani woman. The vitamin-D deficient, burka-wearing Afghani,
for example...even with the Taliban gone.
Oh, well, since I assume you are male, it is probably hard for you to
understand. I'm not even particularly a feminist (I like Dr. Laura),
but I just get so angry when I think of these women!
That's horrifying. I'd rather die than "live" anything even remotely
to what you describe.
Some birds just can't be caged.. I wonder how these women stay alive?
How their souls don't break?
Dani
.
|
|
|
| User: "Ex" |
|
| Title: Re: Just For You, tw....Sharia in Canada |
06 May 2004 03:22:01 PM |
|
|
"Dani" <dani7200@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:s24l90953ej4plhju56sr4j1ubmi8neh97@4ax.com...
On 6 May 2004 07:05:10 -0700, (Jane) wrote:
"tw" <no@no.com> wrote in message
news:<c7cnc9$fko$1@newstree.wise.edt.ericsson.se>...
(Snipped most of it; we are not going to resolve our differences!)
The article also said both parties had to agree to settling matters
this
way. I suppose you DID miss that?'
Nope! You REALLY think the woman I referred to has any say in
anything???
Yep. I assume Canada treats both sexs the same? She can go to teh
police.
Of course, she will agree to sharia court or get the crap
beaten out of her!
She can then go to the police and bring assault charges.
And lose her kids, because children always go to
the father after they are weaned.
Presumably she can go to social services too.
You show a complete lack of understanding of the life of the woman I
described! She has gone from being the property of her father and/ or
brothers to the property of her husband. Lets say she's a Pakistani
muslim. In her own country, she can be killed if she is seen
associating with a man or should she fall in love with someone her
parents (read: father) haven't chosen for her. (Even in modern muslim
states, like Jordan, honour killings happen and have only recently
begun to be prosecuted and often not too zealously). She's married
off to whomever her family (read: father) has chosen, possibly an old
geezer. She may not meet him until her wedding day. Then she has sex
with him, which likely feels like rape, and hopefully knows enough to
make sure she bleeds. If they are divorced, tribal elders or other
men decide the terms, including who gets the children. (There was a
case of a murdered Pakistani child recently (by father and stepmother)
in Toronto and they delved into the background of her mother's life in
Pakistan...the child was ripped from her mother as an infant because
tribal elders had decided to give the father custody...even though he
had nothing to do with the baby and even said she was a *****. The
articles are likely in the Toronto Star archives,as this is a recent
case. These articles are not my only source; check out the books I
mentioned. They also mentioned that the rate of wife abuse in
Pakistan is 90%) The husband can take multiple wives whether she
likes it or not.
Now, move this woman to a western country and do you honestly think
she will be much better off? He won't get away with murdering her as
easily, but he can keep her confined in her home. It does happen!
The Pakistani I worked with did not let his wife out without himself
or one of his sons. Does she speak the language? Does she know what
resources are available to her? Not bloody likely! She only know
what she has lived and that is enough to want never to cross the men
in her life! I am sure there are women that are even worse off than
the Pakistani woman. The vitamin-D deficient, burka-wearing Afghani,
for example...even with the Taliban gone.
Oh, well, since I assume you are male, it is probably hard for you to
understand. I'm not even particularly a feminist (I like Dr. Laura),
but I just get so angry when I think of these women!
That's horrifying. I'd rather die than "live" anything even remotely
to what you describe.
Then don't move to Quebec ... ;-)
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.676 / Virus Database: 438 - Release Date: 5/3/04
.
|
|
|
| User: "Jean Guernon" |
|
| Title: Re: Just For You, tw....Sharia in Canada |
06 May 2004 11:15:06 PM |
|
|
Ex a écrit:
"Dani" <dani7200@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:s24l90953ej4plhju56sr4j1ubmi8neh97@4ax.com...
On 6 May 2004 07:05:10 -0700, (Jane) wrote:
"tw" <no@no.com> wrote in message
news:<c7cnc9$fko$1@newstree.wise.edt.ericsson.se>...
(Snipped most of it; we are not going to resolve our differences!)
The article also said both parties had to agree to settling matters
this
way. I suppose you DID miss that?'
Nope! You REALLY think the woman I referred to has any say in
anything???
Yep. I assume Canada treats both sexs the same? She can go to teh
police.
Of course, she will agree to sharia court or get the crap
beaten out of her!
She can then go to the police and bring assault charges.
And lose her kids, because children always go to
the father after they are weaned.
Presumably she can go to social services too.
You show a complete lack of understanding of the life of the woman I
described! She has gone from being the property of her father and/ or
brothers to the property of her husband. Lets say she's a Pakistani
muslim. In her own country, she can be killed if she is seen
associating with a man or should she fall in love with someone her
parents (read: father) haven't chosen for her. (Even in modern muslim
states, like Jordan, honour killings happen and have only recently
begun to be prosecuted and often not too zealously). She's married
off to whomever her family (read: father) has chosen, possibly an old
geezer. She may not meet him until her wedding day. Then she has sex
with him, which likely feels like rape, and hopefully knows enough to
make sure she bleeds. If they are divorced, tribal elders or other
men decide the terms, including who gets the children. (There was a
case of a murdered Pakistani child recently (by father and stepmother)
in Toronto and they delved into the background of her mother's life in
Pakistan...the child was ripped from her mother as an infant because
tribal elders had decided to give the father custody...even though he
had nothing to do with the baby and even said she was a *****. The
articles are likely in the Toronto Star archives,as this is a recent
case. These articles are not my only source; check out the books I
mentioned. They also mentioned that the rate of wife abuse in
Pakistan is 90%) The husband can take multiple wives whether she
likes it or not.
Now, move this woman to a western country and do you honestly think
she will be much better off? He won't get away with murdering her as
easily, but he can keep her confined in her home. It does happen!
The Pakistani I worked with did not let his wife out without himself
or one of his sons. Does she speak the language? Does she know what
resources are available to her? Not bloody likely! She only know
what she has lived and that is enough to want never to cross the men
in her life! I am sure there are women that are even worse off than
the Pakistani woman. The vitamin-D deficient, burka-wearing Afghani,
for example...even with the Taliban gone.
Oh, well, since I assume you are male, it is probably hard for you to
understand. I'm not even particularly a feminist (I like Dr. Laura),
but I just get so angry when I think of these women!
That's horrifying. I'd rather die than "live" anything even remotely
to what you describe.
Then don't move to Quebec ... ;-)
What does Quebec has to do with that, stupid racist loser?
J.
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.676 / Virus Database: 438 - Release Date: 5/3/04
.
|
|
|
| User: "Michael Johnathan McDonald" |
|
| Title: Re: Just For You, tw....Sharia in Canada |
07 May 2004 01:21:49 PM |
|
|
Jean Guernon <jguernon@globetrotter.net> wrote in message news:<e3Emc.14922263$Of.2489284@news.easynews.com>...
Ex a écrit:
Then don't move to Quebec ... ;-)
What does Quebec has to do with that, stupid racist loser?
J.
Ex is a racist?
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.676 / Virus Database: 438 - Release Date: 5/3/04
.
|
|
|
| User: "Ex" |
|
| Title: Re: Just For You, tw....Sharia in Canada |
07 May 2004 04:25:48 PM |
|
|
"Michael Johnathan McDonald" <abookoflife@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:dd3256f0.0405071021.666f76dc@posting.google.com...
Jean Guernon <jguernon@globetrotter.net> wrote in message
news:<e3Emc.14922263$Of.2489284@news.easynews.com>...
Ex a écrit:
Then don't move to Quebec ... ;-)
What does Quebec has to do with that, stupid racist loser?
J.
Ex is a racist?
Hehe ... yeah.
I worked with a practicing Muslim at me old job at Nortel Networks. We both
were equipment techs, maintaining and repairing some very sophisticated
silicon wafer processing equipment ( Applied Materials equipment ... fully
automated with robotic wafer transfer ). He'd do the prayers 5 times a day
( we worked 12 hr shifts ). I had a great time working with him. We'd look
out for each other and help each other whenever needed ... he was a good
guy, great sense of humour too!
I couldn't care less what a person's colour or religious background is ...
as long as it's not hurting me or anyone else. Hell, I even chat up the
Joho's when they come by ... but I've quit taking The WatchTower :-)
-ex
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.676 / Virus Database: 438 - Release Date: 5/3/04
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.676 / Virus Database: 438 - Release Date: 5/3/04
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "Jean Guernon" |
|
| Title: Re: Just For You, tw....Sharia in Canada |
07 May 2004 08:11:33 PM |
|
|
Michael Johnathan McDonald a écrit:
Jean Guernon <jguernon@globetrotter.net> wrote in message news:<e3Emc.14922263$Of.2489284@news.easynews.com>...
Ex a écrit:
Then don't move to Quebec ... ;-)
What does Quebec has to do with that, stupid racist loser?
J.
Ex is a racist?
To be racist is as much despising Quebeckers because they are not like him, than
any other race or nation.
J.
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.676 / Virus Database: 438 - Release Date: 5/3/04
.
|
|
|
| User: "Ex" |
|
| Title: Re: Just For You, tw....Sharia in Canada |
10 May 2004 08:40:17 AM |
|
|
"Jean Guernon" <jguernon@globetrotter.net> wrote in message
news:8tWmc.14975007$Of.2499114@news.easynews.com...
Michael Johnathan McDonald a écrit:
Jean Guernon <jguernon@globetrotter.net> wrote in message
news:<e3Emc.14922263$Of.2489284@news.easynews.com>...
Ex a écrit:
Then don't move to Quebec ... ;-)
What does Quebec has to do with that, stupid racist loser?
J.
Ex is a racist?
To be racist is as much despising Quebeckers because they are not like
him, than
any other race or nation.
It's a repressive society, legalized by their own laws which deny citizens
their rights.
You forgot about Quebec's language laws?
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.676 / Virus Database: 438 - Release Date: 5/3/04
.
|
|
|
| User: "Jean Guernon" |
|
| Title: Re: Just For You, tw....Sharia in Canada |
10 May 2004 04:34:14 PM |
|
|
Ex a écrit:
"Jean Guernon" <jguernon@globetrotter.net> wrote in message
news:8tWmc.14975007$Of.2499114@news.easynews.com...
Michael Johnathan McDonald a écrit:
Jean Guernon <jguernon@globetrotter.net> wrote in message
news:<e3Emc.14922263$Of.2489284@news.easynews.com>...
Ex a écrit:
Then don't move to Quebec ... ;-)
What does Quebec has to do with that, stupid racist loser?
J.
Ex is a racist?
To be racist is as much despising Quebeckers because they are not like
him, than
any other race or nation.
It's a repressive society, legalized by their own laws which deny citizens
their rights.
You forgot about Quebec's language laws?
---
Quebec is a nation protecting its culture. It doesn't deny its citizens their
rights. It makes sure that it survives despite assholes who would not respect
the survival of its language.
Doesn't mean that English speaking can't speak English, just that they can't
drown the French with English signs, for instance.
Anyway, if you don't like the second founding nation of Canada, it is
reciprocal. For those who do, it is reciprocal as well.
KMA
J.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Ex" |
|
| Title: Re: Just For You, tw....Sharia in Canada |
10 May 2004 06:53:51 PM |
|
|
"Jean Guernon" <jguernon@globetrotter.net> wrote in message
news:pzSnc.4233989$iA2.496901@news.easynews.com...
Ex a écrit:
"Jean Guernon" <jguernon@globetrotter.net> wrote in message
news:8tWmc.14975007$Of.2499114@news.easynews.com...
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
