Hidden passageway was used by George Washington's nine slaves
PHILADELPHIA - Archaeologists unearthing the remains of George Washington's
presidential home have discovered a hidden passageway used by his nine
slaves, raising questions about whether the ruins should be incorporated
into a new exhibit at the site.
The underground passageway is just steps from the Liberty Bell and
Independence Hall. It was designed so Washington's guests would not see
slaves as they slipped in and out of the main house.
"As you enter the heaven of liberty, you literally have to cross the hell of
slavery," said Michael Coard, a Philadelphia attorney who leads a group that
worked to have slavery recognized at the site. "That's the contrast, that's
the contradiction, that's the hypocrisy. But that's also the truth."
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19100886/
.
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| User: "Docrodile" |
|
| Title: Re: Slave passage found under Washington's home |
10 Jun 2007 06:50:44 PM |
|
|
"mukyuk" <a@b.com> wrote in message news:UeXai.12333$1i1.44@pd7urf3no...
Hidden passageway was used by George Washington's nine slaves
PHILADELPHIA - Archaeologists unearthing the remains of George
Washington's presidential home have discovered a hidden passageway used
by his nine slaves, raising questions about whether the ruins should be
incorporated into a new exhibit at the site.
The underground passageway is just steps from the Liberty Bell and
Independence Hall. It was designed so Washington's guests would not see
slaves as they slipped in and out of the main house.
"As you enter the heaven of liberty, you literally have to cross the
hell of slavery," said Michael Coard, a Philadelphia attorney who leads
a group that worked to have slavery recognized at the site. "That's the
contrast, that's the contradiction, that's the hypocrisy. But that's
also the truth."
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19100886/
In this country, it's the IMAGE that serves us best, mondo. We cultivate
and zealously hide (or blissfully ignore) our closet activities -- which
few want to acknowledge amongst us. And, especially those who fly the flag
with seemingly great pride, who boast about the superiority of our
culture, our system, our god faith, over all others different from us in
the world. That, of course, includes YOUR *inferior* nation, Canada.
You're a bit backward for us, really, not actually up to speed with our
infrastructural and social sophistication, or able to keep pace with our
leading high technologies we daily beat our chests about and joyously
immerse ourselves in. We're the *decider* for the direction of life on
Planet Earth.
Yes, Mondo, America is a "love it or leave it" proposition. You must
ignore its lies, deceptions, greed, violence, paranoia, xenophobia,
religious fanaticism, mentally screwed leadership, immorality, et al, by
proclaiming how lovable we are. It's like a long-term contractual
obligation to shovel the dirt of America under a carpet; it's really much
like a white country club membership. You MUST either love it, or shut the
hell up about it. We MUST lie to each other here, and even to ourselves,
enveloping our precious God-blessed souls in a thick fog of ignorance and
denial...and keep daily boasting how we're the world's last great hope for
salvation and a meaningful, peaceful existence. Gee, if we're its best
hope, then we've downgraded the bar-standard for hope, truth,
intelligence, and peace terribly.
Facts that hurt us, tarnish our image, depress us, make us uncomfortable,
only count if they're slyly, cleverly distorted, spun into euphoric myths,
or just hidden away. Truth is just another increasingly rare commodity in
America, like respect for one's privacy. We give up privacy all too
easily, as we trade truth for soothing lies. Our entire marketplace is
awash in lies to sell products and services, for example. We extend this
deception to the selling of politicians and their platforms, the
proselytization of Christian beliefs, etc.
Ol' George Washington, of course, was a rather cunning, deceptive leader.
He knew that slavery was a nasty, ugly thing, but why advertise it? It's
the IMAGE of freedom and respect for human rights that counts beyond the
TRUTH of it. Patriotic psychos will tell you that the tunnels weren't
meant to hide the slaves, just to provide easy facilitation of their daily
duties...ya know, if the weather was quite horrid, they could keep the
masters' clothes and meals quite dry. Uh huh...that's the reason. LOL! Oh
yeah, that's it. He couldn't tell a lie, and he chopped down the cherry
tree, and blah, blah, blah...
Doc :))~
.
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| User: "Steven Douglas" |
|
| Title: Re: Slave passage found under Washington's home |
10 Jun 2007 07:41:21 PM |
|
|
On Jun 10, 4:50 pm, "Docrodile" <swampth...@hellsbayou.net> wrote:
"mukyuk" <a...@b.com> wrote in messagenews:UeXai.12333$1i1.44@pd7urf3no...
Hidden passageway was used by George Washington's nine slaves
PHILADELPHIA - Archaeologists unearthing the remains of George
Washington's presidential home have discovered a hidden passageway used
by his nine slaves, raising questions about whether the ruins should be
incorporated into a new exhibit at the site.
The underground passageway is just steps from the Liberty Bell and
Independence Hall. It was designed so Washington's guests would not see
slaves as they slipped in and out of the main house.
"As you enter the heaven of liberty, you literally have to cross the
hell of slavery," said Michael Coard, a Philadelphia attorney who leads
a group that worked to have slavery recognized at the site. "That's the
contrast, that's the contradiction, that's the hypocrisy. But that's
also the truth."
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19100886/
In this country, it's the IMAGE that serves us best, mondo. We cultivate
and zealously hide (or blissfully ignore) our closet activities -- which
few want to acknowledge amongst us. And, especially those who fly the flag
with seemingly great pride, who boast about the superiority of our
culture, our system, our god faith, over all others different from us in
the world. That, of course, includes YOUR *inferior* nation, Canada.
You're a bit backward for us, really, not actually up to speed with our
infrastructural and social sophistication, or able to keep pace with our
leading high technologies we daily beat our chests about and joyously
immerse ourselves in. We're the *decider* for the direction of life on
Planet Earth.
Yes, Mondo, America is a "love it or leave it" proposition. You must
ignore its lies, deceptions, greed, violence, paranoia, xenophobia,
religious fanaticism, mentally screwed leadership, immorality, et al, by
proclaiming how lovable we are. It's like a long-term contractual
obligation to shovel the dirt of America under a carpet; it's really much
like a white country club membership. You MUST either love it, or shut the
hell up about it. We MUST lie to each other here, and even to ourselves,
enveloping our precious God-blessed souls in a thick fog of ignorance and
denial...and keep daily boasting how we're the world's last great hope for
salvation and a meaningful, peaceful existence. Gee, if we're its best
hope, then we've downgraded the bar-standard for hope, truth,
intelligence, and peace terribly.
Facts that hurt us, tarnish our image, depress us, make us uncomfortable,
only count if they're slyly, cleverly distorted, spun into euphoric myths,
or just hidden away. Truth is just another increasingly rare commodity in
America, like respect for one's privacy. We give up privacy all too
easily, as we trade truth for soothing lies. Our entire marketplace is
awash in lies to sell products and services, for example. We extend this
deception to the selling of politicians and their platforms, the
proselytization of Christian beliefs, etc.
Ol' George Washington, of course, was a rather cunning, deceptive leader.
He knew that slavery was a nasty, ugly thing, but why advertise it? It's
the IMAGE of freedom and respect for human rights that counts beyond the
TRUTH of it. Patriotic psychos will tell you that the tunnels weren't
meant to hide the slaves, just to provide easy facilitation of their daily
duties...ya know, if the weather was quite horrid, they could keep the
masters' clothes and meals quite dry. Uh huh...that's the reason. LOL! Oh
yeah, that's it. He couldn't tell a lie, and he chopped down the cherry
tree, and blah, blah, blah...
Well, it's clear that your hatred for your country extends well beyond
Bush. Your problem is that you want to compare your country to
perfection, rather than compare it to many other places on planet
earth. For instance, there is STILL slavery going on in parts of the
world, but of course you'd argue that we have no right to judge any
other society as inferior to ours, wouldn't you? And you should also
keep in mind that there are places on this earth where you'd be put in
prison for saying negative things about your own country. Yet there
you sit, feeling perfectly comfortable in saying whatever you please,
and you have no appreciation even for that. Ingrate.
.
|
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| User: "mukyuk" |
|
| Title: Re: Slave passage found under Washington's home |
10 Jun 2007 07:50:45 PM |
|
|
"Steven Douglas" <dsteven@flashmail.com> wrote in message
news:1181522481.277072.249880@x35g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
SICK!!!
.
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| User: "Woodswun" |
|
| Title: Re: Slave passage found under Washington's home |
10 Jun 2007 08:10:09 PM |
|
|
On Sun, 10 Jun 2007 17:41:21 -0700, Steven Douglas wrote:
On Jun 10, 4:50 pm, "Docrodile" <swampth...@hellsbayou.net> wrote:
"mukyuk" <a...@b.com> wrote in messagenews:UeXai.12333$1i1.44@pd7urf3no...
Hidden passageway was used by George Washington's nine slaves
PHILADELPHIA - Archaeologists unearthing the remains of George
Washington's presidential home have discovered a hidden passageway used
by his nine slaves, raising questions about whether the ruins should be
incorporated into a new exhibit at the site.
The underground passageway is just steps from the Liberty Bell and
Independence Hall. It was designed so Washington's guests would not see
slaves as they slipped in and out of the main house.
"As you enter the heaven of liberty, you literally have to cross the
hell of slavery," said Michael Coard, a Philadelphia attorney who leads
a group that worked to have slavery recognized at the site. "That's the
contrast, that's the contradiction, that's the hypocrisy. But that's
also the truth."
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19100886/
In this country, it's the IMAGE that serves us best, mondo. We cultivate
and zealously hide (or blissfully ignore) our closet activities -- which
few want to acknowledge amongst us. And, especially those who fly the flag
with seemingly great pride, who boast about the superiority of our
culture, our system, our god faith, over all others different from us in
the world. That, of course, includes YOUR *inferior* nation, Canada.
You're a bit backward for us, really, not actually up to speed with our
infrastructural and social sophistication, or able to keep pace with our
leading high technologies we daily beat our chests about and joyously
immerse ourselves in. We're the *decider* for the direction of life on
Planet Earth.
Yes, Mondo, America is a "love it or leave it" proposition. You must
ignore its lies, deceptions, greed, violence, paranoia, xenophobia,
religious fanaticism, mentally screwed leadership, immorality, et al, by
proclaiming how lovable we are. It's like a long-term contractual
obligation to shovel the dirt of America under a carpet; it's really much
like a white country club membership. You MUST either love it, or shut the
hell up about it. We MUST lie to each other here, and even to ourselves,
enveloping our precious God-blessed souls in a thick fog of ignorance and
denial...and keep daily boasting how we're the world's last great hope for
salvation and a meaningful, peaceful existence. Gee, if we're its best
hope, then we've downgraded the bar-standard for hope, truth,
intelligence, and peace terribly.
Facts that hurt us, tarnish our image, depress us, make us uncomfortable,
only count if they're slyly, cleverly distorted, spun into euphoric myths,
or just hidden away. Truth is just another increasingly rare commodity in
America, like respect for one's privacy. We give up privacy all too
easily, as we trade truth for soothing lies. Our entire marketplace is
awash in lies to sell products and services, for example. We extend this
deception to the selling of politicians and their platforms, the
proselytization of Christian beliefs, etc.
Ol' George Washington, of course, was a rather cunning, deceptive leader.
He knew that slavery was a nasty, ugly thing, but why advertise it? It's
the IMAGE of freedom and respect for human rights that counts beyond the
TRUTH of it. Patriotic psychos will tell you that the tunnels weren't
meant to hide the slaves, just to provide easy facilitation of their daily
duties...ya know, if the weather was quite horrid, they could keep the
masters' clothes and meals quite dry. Uh huh...that's the reason. LOL! Oh
yeah, that's it. He couldn't tell a lie, and he chopped down the cherry
tree, and blah, blah, blah...
Well, it's clear that your hatred for your country extends well beyond
Bush. Your problem is that you want to compare your country to
perfection, rather than compare it to many other places on planet
earth. For instance, there is STILL slavery going on in parts of the
world, but of course you'd argue that we have no right to judge any
other society as inferior to ours, wouldn't you? And you should also
keep in mind that there are places on this earth where you'd be put in
prison for saying negative things about your own country. Yet there
you sit, feeling perfectly comfortable in saying whatever you please,
and you have no appreciation even for that. Ingrate.
IOW, the bar is as low as your worst neighbor acts, rather than your
own ideals.
Well, that may suffice for you, Steven, but most patriotic Americans want
America to be a shining beacon of freedom, honesty, integrity, and
prosperity - not just a wee bit better than the worst of the world.
Sycophants serve no good purpose for those who strive for an ideal.
Indeed, they are an impediment to progress.
Woods
.
|
|
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| User: "Docrodile" |
|
| Title: Re: Slave passage found under Washington's home |
10 Jun 2007 08:54:12 PM |
|
|
"Woodswun" <woodswun@tepidmail.com> wrote in message
news:pan.2007.06.11.01.10.08.211008@tepidmail.com...
On Sun, 10 Jun 2007 17:41:21 -0700, Steven Douglas wrote:
On Jun 10, 4:50 pm, "Docrodile" <swampth...@hellsbayou.net> wrote:
"mukyuk" <a...@b.com> wrote in
messagenews:UeXai.12333$1i1.44@pd7urf3no...
Hidden passageway was used by George Washington's nine slaves
PHILADELPHIA - Archaeologists unearthing the remains of George
Washington's presidential home have discovered a hidden passageway
used
by his nine slaves, raising questions about whether the ruins should
be
incorporated into a new exhibit at the site.
The underground passageway is just steps from the Liberty Bell and
Independence Hall. It was designed so Washington's guests would not
see
slaves as they slipped in and out of the main house.
"As you enter the heaven of liberty, you literally have to cross the
hell of slavery," said Michael Coard, a Philadelphia attorney who
leads
a group that worked to have slavery recognized at the site. "That's
the
contrast, that's the contradiction, that's the hypocrisy. But that's
also the truth."
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19100886/
In this country, it's the IMAGE that serves us best, mondo. We
cultivate
and zealously hide (or blissfully ignore) our closet activities --
which
few want to acknowledge amongst us. And, especially those who fly the
flag
with seemingly great pride, who boast about the superiority of our
culture, our system, our god faith, over all others different from us
in
the world. That, of course, includes YOUR *inferior* nation, Canada.
You're a bit backward for us, really, not actually up to speed with
our
infrastructural and social sophistication, or able to keep pace with
our
leading high technologies we daily beat our chests about and joyously
immerse ourselves in. We're the *decider* for the direction of life on
Planet Earth.
Yes, Mondo, America is a "love it or leave it" proposition. You must
ignore its lies, deceptions, greed, violence, paranoia, xenophobia,
religious fanaticism, mentally screwed leadership, immorality, et al,
by
proclaiming how lovable we are. It's like a long-term contractual
obligation to shovel the dirt of America under a carpet; it's really
much
like a white country club membership. You MUST either love it, or shut
the
hell up about it. We MUST lie to each other here, and even to
ourselves,
enveloping our precious God-blessed souls in a thick fog of ignorance
and
denial...and keep daily boasting how we're the world's last great hope
for
salvation and a meaningful, peaceful existence. Gee, if we're its best
hope, then we've downgraded the bar-standard for hope, truth,
intelligence, and peace terribly.
Facts that hurt us, tarnish our image, depress us, make us
uncomfortable,
only count if they're slyly, cleverly distorted, spun into euphoric
myths,
or just hidden away. Truth is just another increasingly rare commodity
in
America, like respect for one's privacy. We give up privacy all too
easily, as we trade truth for soothing lies. Our entire marketplace is
awash in lies to sell products and services, for example. We extend
this
deception to the selling of politicians and their platforms, the
proselytization of Christian beliefs, etc.
Ol' George Washington, of course, was a rather cunning, deceptive
leader.
He knew that slavery was a nasty, ugly thing, but why advertise it?
It's
the IMAGE of freedom and respect for human rights that counts beyond
the
TRUTH of it. Patriotic psychos will tell you that the tunnels weren't
meant to hide the slaves, just to provide easy facilitation of their
daily
duties...ya know, if the weather was quite horrid, they could keep the
masters' clothes and meals quite dry. Uh huh...that's the reason. LOL!
Oh
yeah, that's it. He couldn't tell a lie, and he chopped down the
cherry
tree, and blah, blah, blah...
Well, it's clear that your hatred for your country extends well beyond
Bush. Your problem is that you want to compare your country to
perfection, rather than compare it to many other places on planet
earth. For instance, there is STILL slavery going on in parts of the
world, but of course you'd argue that we have no right to judge any
other society as inferior to ours, wouldn't you? And you should also
keep in mind that there are places on this earth where you'd be put in
prison for saying negative things about your own country. Yet there
you sit, feeling perfectly comfortable in saying whatever you please,
and you have no appreciation even for that. Ingrate.
IOW, the bar is as low as your worst neighbor acts, rather than your
own ideals.
Well, that may suffice for you, Steven, but most patriotic Americans
want
America to be a shining beacon of freedom, honesty, integrity, and
prosperity - not just a wee bit better than the worst of the world.
Sycophants serve no good purpose for those who strive for an ideal.
Indeed, they are an impediment to progress.
Woods
The ideal isn't the goal -- it's an illusion. We've effectively cultivated
an illusion of freedom that grinds against the actual experience. One
doesn't have to go to prison for violation of his so-called freedom to
have it choked by "freedom lovers" like Stevie. Criticism of a deceptive
cultural experience that speaks highly of freedom, but has little
tolerance for dissent is a fucking reality we live everyday in America.
Stevie doesn't experience the other side of the *freedom* he talks highly
of because he does what he's told, and believes what authority tells him,
as he did in the miitary, and upholds the illusion he and so many are
proud of. It is an illusion we live when you're threatened with
censorship, or actually have it invoked, or you're discredited personally
for speaking against living a lie here. That is not true freedom.
Stevie lives the lie, promotes it, would seemingly destroy others for
making it an issue. As long as one goes along with the status quo, the
*freedom* seems quite palatable, wonderful. Draw a different picture of
reality, though, and Americans find themselves assailed in various ways by
*freedom lovers* like Stevie who can't even tolerate one man's opposing
opinion without derogatory name calling, and a thinly veiled threat of
imprisonment. Yep. He wishes people like me would get the slammer for
speaking our minds. His repeated boasts of a higher intellect and cool
rationality, while regularly sneering at those he finds not up to the
*high level* he's at, is indicative of a disturbed personality more
interested in conquest and domination than reasoned intelluctual debate.
To emphasize his weak point, he draws reference to those nations that are
ruled by tyrants, commonly evoking a worst-case contrasting example as the
basis for his support of the society he lives in, and a hammer on those
who have a different perspective. Beyond simple intolerance, it is an
arrogant fascistic display of demanding conformity to a reality he wishes
to believe in, as he demands the same in his religious faith. Those who
differ are idiots, threats, vermin...and ingrates. The stench of
pseudo-intelluctualized fascism wafts from his so-called idealism about
freedom.
It is speaking our minds that is the essence of real freedom -- and
without denigration, threat, or censorship. In America, such is not the
common reality. It is, to the contrary, common to be shouted down,
ridiculed, and threatened.
That is not the hallmark of a freedom-loving people, but an intolerant
fascistic society, immature in so many ways, and unable to encompass the
great diversity of opinion and versions of the reality we live in without
harassment -- and Stevie might carefully note those last few words, and
study them.
That is the real ideal we need to work for -- not the perpetuation of an
illusory, surreal state of existence folks like Stevie would gladly kill
for.
Doc :))~
.
|
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| User: "Steven Douglas" |
|
| Title: Re: Slave passage found under Washington's home |
10 Jun 2007 09:04:53 PM |
|
|
On Jun 10, 6:54 pm, "Docrodile" <swampth...@hellsbayou.net> wrote:
"Woodswun" <woods...@tepidmail.com> wrote in message
news:pan.2007.06.11.01.10.08.211008@tepidmail.com...
On Sun, 10 Jun 2007 17:41:21 -0700, Steven Douglas wrote:
On Jun 10, 4:50 pm, "Docrodile" <swampth...@hellsbayou.net> wrote:
"mukyuk" <a...@b.com> wrote in
messagenews:UeXai.12333$1i1.44@pd7urf3no...
Hidden passageway was used by George Washington's nine slaves
PHILADELPHIA - Archaeologists unearthing the remains of George
Washington's presidential home have discovered a hidden passageway
used
by his nine slaves, raising questions about whether the ruins should
be
incorporated into a new exhibit at the site.
The underground passageway is just steps from the Liberty Bell and
Independence Hall. It was designed so Washington's guests would not
see
slaves as they slipped in and out of the main house.
"As you enter the heaven of liberty, you literally have to cross the
hell of slavery," said Michael Coard, a Philadelphia attorney who
leads
a group that worked to have slavery recognized at the site. "That's
the
contrast, that's the contradiction, that's the hypocrisy. But that's
also the truth."
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19100886/
In this country, it's the IMAGE that serves us best, mondo. We
cultivate
and zealously hide (or blissfully ignore) our closet activities --
which
few want to acknowledge amongst us. And, especially those who fly the
flag
with seemingly great pride, who boast about the superiority of our
culture, our system, our god faith, over all others different from us
in
the world. That, of course, includes YOUR *inferior* nation, Canada.
You're a bit backward for us, really, not actually up to speed with
our
infrastructural and social sophistication, or able to keep pace with
our
leading high technologies we daily beat our chests about and joyously
immerse ourselves in. We're the *decider* for the direction of life on
Planet Earth.
Yes, Mondo, America is a "love it or leave it" proposition. You must
ignore its lies, deceptions, greed, violence, paranoia, xenophobia,
religious fanaticism, mentally screwed leadership, immorality, et al,
by
proclaiming how lovable we are. It's like a long-term contractual
obligation to shovel the dirt of America under a carpet; it's really
much
like a white country club membership. You MUST either love it, or shut
the
hell up about it. We MUST lie to each other here, and even to
ourselves,
enveloping our precious God-blessed souls in a thick fog of ignorance
and
denial...and keep daily boasting how we're the world's last great hope
for
salvation and a meaningful, peaceful existence. Gee, if we're its best
hope, then we've downgraded the bar-standard for hope, truth,
intelligence, and peace terribly.
Facts that hurt us, tarnish our image, depress us, make us
uncomfortable,
only count if they're slyly, cleverly distorted, spun into euphoric
myths,
or just hidden away. Truth is just another increasingly rare commodity
in
America, like respect for one's privacy. We give up privacy all too
easily, as we trade truth for soothing lies. Our entire marketplace is
awash in lies to sell products and services, for example. We extend
this
deception to the selling of politicians and their platforms, the
proselytization of Christian beliefs, etc.
Ol' George Washington, of course, was a rather cunning, deceptive
leader.
He knew that slavery was a nasty, ugly thing, but why advertise it?
It's
the IMAGE of freedom and respect for human rights that counts beyond
the
TRUTH of it. Patriotic psychos will tell you that the tunnels weren't
meant to hide the slaves, just to provide easy facilitation of their
daily
duties...ya know, if the weather was quite horrid, they could keep the
masters' clothes and meals quite dry. Uh huh...that's the reason. LOL!
Oh
yeah, that's it. He couldn't tell a lie, and he chopped down the
cherry
tree, and blah, blah, blah...
Well, it's clear that your hatred for your country extends well beyond
Bush. Your problem is that you want to compare your country to
perfection, rather than compare it to many other places on planet
earth. For instance, there is STILL slavery going on in parts of the
world, but of course you'd argue that we have no right to judge any
other society as inferior to ours, wouldn't you? And you should also
keep in mind that there are places on this earth where you'd be put in
prison for saying negative things about your own country. Yet there
you sit, feeling perfectly comfortable in saying whatever you please,
and you have no appreciation even for that. Ingrate.
IOW, the bar is as low as your worst neighbor acts, rather than your
own ideals.
Well, that may suffice for you, Steven, but most patriotic Americans
want
America to be a shining beacon of freedom, honesty, integrity, and
prosperity - not just a wee bit better than the worst of the world.
Sycophants serve no good purpose for those who strive for an ideal.
Indeed, they are an impediment to progress.
Woods
The ideal isn't the goal -- it's an illusion. We've effectively cultivated
an illusion of freedom that grinds against the actual experience. One
doesn't have to go to prison for violation of his so-called freedom to
have it choked by "freedom lovers" like Stevie. Criticism of a deceptive
cultural experience that speaks highly of freedom, but has little
tolerance for dissent is a fucking reality we live everyday in America.
Stevie doesn't experience the other side of the *freedom* he talks highly
of because he does what he's told, and believes what authority tells him,
as he did in the miitary, and upholds the illusion he and so many are
proud of. It is an illusion we live when you're threatened with
censorship, or actually have it invoked, or you're discredited personally
for speaking against living a lie here. That is not true freedom.
Stevie lives the lie, promotes it, would seemingly destroy others for
making it an issue.
What? On the contrary, Doc, I would defend your right to free speech.
If anything, it's leftists like you who would like to shut down my
right to free speech.
.
|
|
|
|
|
| User: "Steven Douglas" |
|
| Title: Re: Slave passage found under Washington's home |
10 Jun 2007 08:19:04 PM |
|
|
On Jun 10, 6:10 pm, Woodswun <woods...@tepidmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 10 Jun 2007 17:41:21 -0700, Steven Douglas wrote:
On Jun 10, 4:50 pm, "Docrodile" <swampth...@hellsbayou.net> wrote:
"mukyuk" <a...@b.com> wrote in messagenews:UeXai.12333$1i1.44@pd7urf3no...
Hidden passageway was used by George Washington's nine slaves
PHILADELPHIA - Archaeologists unearthing the remains of George
Washington's presidential home have discovered a hidden passageway used
by his nine slaves, raising questions about whether the ruins should be
incorporated into a new exhibit at the site.
The underground passageway is just steps from the Liberty Bell and
Independence Hall. It was designed so Washington's guests would not see
slaves as they slipped in and out of the main house.
"As you enter the heaven of liberty, you literally have to cross the
hell of slavery," said Michael Coard, a Philadelphia attorney who leads
a group that worked to have slavery recognized at the site. "That's the
contrast, that's the contradiction, that's the hypocrisy. But that's
also the truth."
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19100886/
In this country, it's the IMAGE that serves us best, mondo. We cultivate
and zealously hide (or blissfully ignore) our closet activities -- which
few want to acknowledge amongst us. And, especially those who fly the flag
with seemingly great pride, who boast about the superiority of our
culture, our system, our god faith, over all others different from us in
the world. That, of course, includes YOUR *inferior* nation, Canada.
You're a bit backward for us, really, not actually up to speed with our
infrastructural and social sophistication, or able to keep pace with our
leading high technologies we daily beat our chests about and joyously
immerse ourselves in. We're the *decider* for the direction of life on
Planet Earth.
Yes, Mondo, America is a "love it or leave it" proposition. You must
ignore its lies, deceptions, greed, violence, paranoia, xenophobia,
religious fanaticism, mentally screwed leadership, immorality, et al, by
proclaiming how lovable we are. It's like a long-term contractual
obligation to shovel the dirt of America under a carpet; it's really much
like a white country club membership. You MUST either love it, or shut the
hell up about it. We MUST lie to each other here, and even to ourselves,
enveloping our precious God-blessed souls in a thick fog of ignorance and
denial...and keep daily boasting how we're the world's last great hope for
salvation and a meaningful, peaceful existence. Gee, if we're its best
hope, then we've downgraded the bar-standard for hope, truth,
intelligence, and peace terribly.
Facts that hurt us, tarnish our image, depress us, make us uncomfortable,
only count if they're slyly, cleverly distorted, spun into euphoric myths,
or just hidden away. Truth is just another increasingly rare commodity in
America, like respect for one's privacy. We give up privacy all too
easily, as we trade truth for soothing lies. Our entire marketplace is
awash in lies to sell products and services, for example. We extend this
deception to the selling of politicians and their platforms, the
proselytization of Christian beliefs, etc.
Ol' George Washington, of course, was a rather cunning, deceptive leader.
He knew that slavery was a nasty, ugly thing, but why advertise it? It's
the IMAGE of freedom and respect for human rights that counts beyond the
TRUTH of it. Patriotic psychos will tell you that the tunnels weren't
meant to hide the slaves, just to provide easy facilitation of their daily
duties...ya know, if the weather was quite horrid, they could keep the
masters' clothes and meals quite dry. Uh huh...that's the reason. LOL! Oh
yeah, that's it. He couldn't tell a lie, and he chopped down the cherry
tree, and blah, blah, blah...
Well, it's clear that your hatred for your country extends well beyond
Bush. Your problem is that you want to compare your country to
perfection, rather than compare it to many other places on planet
earth. For instance, there is STILL slavery going on in parts of the
world, but of course you'd argue that we have no right to judge any
other society as inferior to ours, wouldn't you? And you should also
keep in mind that there are places on this earth where you'd be put in
prison for saying negative things about your own country. Yet there
you sit, feeling perfectly comfortable in saying whatever you please,
and you have no appreciation even for that. Ingrate.
IOW, the bar is as low as your worst neighbor acts, rather than your
own ideals.
Well, that may suffice for you, Steven, but most patriotic Americans want
America to be a shining beacon of freedom, honesty, integrity, and
prosperity - not just a wee bit better than the worst of the world.
It's a lot more than "a wee bit better than the worst of the world."
If you actually believe we're only "a wee bit better than the worst of
the world," then you only love your country "a wee bit" more than Doc
does.
Sycophants serve no good purpose for those who strive for an ideal.
Indeed, they are an impediment to progress.
I'm all for striving for an ideal. I work on that everyday. But
whining and complaining about George Washington does nothing to help
us strive for ideals. This country ended slavery 142 years ago, while
it goes on to this day in other parts of the world. Why no crying
about that?
.
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| User: "JTEM" |
|
| Title: Re: Slave passage found under Washington's home |
11 Jun 2007 10:52:05 AM |
|
|
Steven Douglas <dste...@flashmail.com> wrote:
I'm all for striving for an ideal. I work on that everyday.
But whining and complaining about George Washington
does nothing to help us strive for ideals.
Wow. Maybe I was wrong. Maybe we do agree for the
same reasons...
.
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| User: "Steven Douglas" |
|
| Title: Re: Slave passage found under Washington's home |
11 Jun 2007 07:35:55 PM |
|
|
On Jun 11, 8:52 am, JTEM <jte...@gmail.com> wrote:
Steven Douglas <dste...@flashmail.com> wrote:
I'm all for striving for an ideal. I work on that everyday.
But whining and complaining about George Washington
does nothing to help us strive for ideals.
Wow. Maybe I was wrong. Maybe we do agree for the
same reasons...
It seems we do.
.
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| User: "mukyuk" |
|
| Title: Re: Slave passage found under Washington's home |
10 Jun 2007 09:29:59 PM |
|
|
"Steven Douglas" <dsteven@flashmail.com> wrote in message
news:1181524744.382410.124320@x35g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
On Jun 10, 6:10 pm, Woodswun <woods...@tepidmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 10 Jun 2007 17:41:21 -0700, Steven Douglas wrote:
On Jun 10, 4:50 pm, "Docrodile" <swampth...@hellsbayou.net> wrote:
"mukyuk" <a...@b.com> wrote in
messagenews:UeXai.12333$1i1.44@pd7urf3no...
Hidden passageway was used by George Washington's nine slaves
PHILADELPHIA - Archaeologists unearthing the remains of George
Washington's presidential home have discovered a hidden passageway
used
by his nine slaves, raising questions about whether the ruins should
be
incorporated into a new exhibit at the site.
The underground passageway is just steps from the Liberty Bell and
Independence Hall. It was designed so Washington's guests would not
see
slaves as they slipped in and out of the main house.
"As you enter the heaven of liberty, you literally have to cross the
hell of slavery," said Michael Coard, a Philadelphia attorney who
leads
a group that worked to have slavery recognized at the site. "That's
the
contrast, that's the contradiction, that's the hypocrisy. But that's
also the truth."
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19100886/
In this country, it's the IMAGE that serves us best, mondo. We
cultivate
and zealously hide (or blissfully ignore) our closet activities --
which
few want to acknowledge amongst us. And, especially those who fly the
flag
with seemingly great pride, who boast about the superiority of our
culture, our system, our god faith, over all others different from us
in
the world. That, of course, includes YOUR *inferior* nation, Canada.
You're a bit backward for us, really, not actually up to speed with
our
infrastructural and social sophistication, or able to keep pace with
our
leading high technologies we daily beat our chests about and joyously
immerse ourselves in. We're the *decider* for the direction of life on
Planet Earth.
Yes, Mondo, America is a "love it or leave it" proposition. You must
ignore its lies, deceptions, greed, violence, paranoia, xenophobia,
religious fanaticism, mentally screwed leadership, immorality, et al,
by
proclaiming how lovable we are. It's like a long-term contractual
obligation to shovel the dirt of America under a carpet; it's really
much
like a white country club membership. You MUST either love it, or shut
the
hell up about it. We MUST lie to each other here, and even to
ourselves,
enveloping our precious God-blessed souls in a thick fog of ignorance
and
denial...and keep daily boasting how we're the world's last great hope
for
salvation and a meaningful, peaceful existence. Gee, if we're its best
hope, then we've downgraded the bar-standard for hope, truth,
intelligence, and peace terribly.
Facts that hurt us, tarnish our image, depress us, make us
uncomfortable,
only count if they're slyly, cleverly distorted, spun into euphoric
myths,
or just hidden away. Truth is just another increasingly rare commodity
in
America, like respect for one's privacy. We give up privacy all too
easily, as we trade truth for soothing lies. Our entire marketplace is
awash in lies to sell products and services, for example. We extend
this
deception to the selling of politicians and their platforms, the
proselytization of Christian beliefs, etc.
Ol' George Washington, of course, was a rather cunning, deceptive
leader.
He knew that slavery was a nasty, ugly thing, but why advertise it?
It's
the IMAGE of freedom and respect for human rights that counts beyond
the
TRUTH of it. Patriotic psychos will tell you that the tunnels weren't
meant to hide the slaves, just to provide easy facilitation of their
daily
duties...ya know, if the weather was quite horrid, they could keep the
masters' clothes and meals quite dry. Uh huh...that's the reason. LOL!
Oh
yeah, that's it. He couldn't tell a lie, and he chopped down the
cherry
tree, and blah, blah, blah...
Well, it's clear that your hatred for your country extends well beyond
Bush. Your problem is that you want to compare your country to
perfection, rather than compare it to many other places on planet
earth. For instance, there is STILL slavery going on in parts of the
world, but of course you'd argue that we have no right to judge any
other society as inferior to ours, wouldn't you? And you should also
keep in mind that there are places on this earth where you'd be put in
prison for saying negative things about your own country. Yet there
you sit, feeling perfectly comfortable in saying whatever you please,
and you have no appreciation even for that. Ingrate.
IOW, the bar is as low as your worst neighbor acts, rather than your
own ideals.
Well, that may suffice for you, Steven, but most patriotic Americans want
America to be a shining beacon of freedom, honesty, integrity, and
prosperity - not just a wee bit better than the worst of the world.
It's a lot more than "a wee bit better than the worst of the world."
If you actually believe we're only "a wee bit better than the worst of
the world," then you only love your country "a wee bit" more than Doc
does.
Sycophants serve no good purpose for those who strive for an ideal.
Indeed, they are an impediment to progress.
I'm all for striving for an ideal. I work on that everyday. But
whining and complaining about George Washington does nothing to help
us strive for ideals. This country ended slavery 142 years ago, while
it goes on to this day in other parts of the world.
Of course, in the States they don't call it slavery anymore, but it has
been replaced with something as bad under the disguise of 'work'.
Why no crying
about that?
.
|
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| User: "Werewolfy" |
|
| Title: Re: Slave passage found under Washington's home |
10 Jun 2007 08:32:47 PM |
|
|
On Jun 11, 2:19?am, Steven Douglas <dste...@flashmail.com> wrote:
Why no crying about that
Because you are NOT the 'guardian of the World'. Because it has
nothing whatsoever to do with you. Because you should put your own
house in order, rather than to constantly interfere and bully other
Nations.
Because we, the rest of the world, reject your 'American Way', your
life style and your ideals.
Stay where you are playing with Mickey Mouse...You are not welcome.
Werewolfy
.
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| User: "Steven Douglas" |
|
| Title: Re: Slave passage found under Washington's home |
10 Jun 2007 09:25:07 PM |
|
|
On Jun 10, 6:32 pm, Werewolfy <Werewol...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
On Jun 11, 2:19?am, Steven Douglas <dste...@flashmail.com> wrote:
Why no crying about that
Because you are NOT the 'guardian of the World'. Because it has
nothing whatsoever to do with you. Because you should put your own
house in order, rather than to constantly interfere and bully other
Nations.
Because we, the rest of the world, reject your 'American Way', your
life style and your ideals.
Really? Not long ago you were complaining angrily that the United
States did not come immediately to the rescue while under attack from
Hitler.
Stay where you are playing with Mickey Mouse...You are not welcome.
So which is it? Stay home or come to your rescue when you need us?
.
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| User: "Perseid" |
|
| Title: Re: Slave passage found under Washington's home |
10 Jun 2007 10:58:34 PM |
|
|
After Much Chewing of Cud and Cogitation, Steven Douglas
<dsteven@flashmail.com> Spat the Words
On Jun 10, 6:32 pm, Werewolfy <Werewol...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
On Jun 11, 2:19?am, Steven Douglas <dste...@flashmail.com> wrote:
Why no crying about that
Because you are NOT the 'guardian of the World'. Because it has
nothing whatsoever to do with you. Because you should put your own
house in order, rather than to constantly interfere and bully other
Nations.
Because we, the rest of the world, reject your 'American Way', your
life style and your ideals.
Really? Not long ago you were complaining angrily that the United
States did not come immediately to the rescue while under attack from
Hitler.
Stay where you are playing with Mickey Mouse...You are not welcome.
So which is it? Stay home or come to your rescue when you need us?
No, the rest of us Americans are welcome.. it's just you he doesn't
like stevie.
.
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| User: "Werewolfy" |
|
| Title: Re: Slave passage found under Washington's home |
11 Jun 2007 02:07:43 AM |
|
|
On Jun 11, 3:25?am, Steven Douglas <dste...@flashmail.com> wrote:
Really? Not long ago you were complaining angrily that the United
States did not come immediately to the rescue while under attack from Hitler.
Until the 1950's or so, America had a good reputation, a philanthropic
Country with ideals.
You are not that same Nation. Your hero, Bush, and his ilk have seen
to that.
Werewolfy
.
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| User: "Docrodile" |
|
| Title: Re: Slave passage found under Washington's home |
11 Jun 2007 11:43:57 PM |
|
|
"Werewolfy" <Werewolfy1@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:1181545663.120778.251560@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
On Jun 11, 3:25?am, Steven Douglas <dste...@flashmail.com> wrote:
Really? Not long ago you were complaining angrily that the United
States did not come immediately to the rescue while under attack from
Hitler.
Until the 1950's or so, America had a good reputation, a philanthropic
Country with ideals.
You are not that same Nation. Your hero, Bush, and his ilk have seen
to that.
Werewolfy
It might come as a surprise, Wolfy, to the black-and-white world of
morality, and left-and-right realm of politics that Stevie exercises as
daily discourse, that I grew up liking this nation immensely, fervently.
My love affair with it continued until the mid-60s and then rather
abruptly ended.
I'd have to go into a long diatribe to explain the numerous involved
reasons for my marriage to it ending in bitter separation and, later,
divorce, but suffice to say it was the hard realization of the persistent
inherent dark nature of the species. Yes, that is at the basis of my
disillusionment with not only the American way of life, but all other
systems humans have created.
I see right through the lies, the hypocrisy, the fanatical devotion, the
social veneers...yes, RIGHT THROUGH THEM! And what I have as a result, at
the end, is little more than a train-wreck of a species -- which has
enormous potential, undoubtedly, but ruins itself repeatedly with its
ingrained misbehaviour, its dangerous fanatical and fantastical delusions,
subservience to maniacal leadership, et al. And, possibly most of all, its
inability to off-place its self centeredness, and move beyond the
attendant delusion we're the cat's meow of God's universe.
I know we're not. I am sure we're not. We're way back among the swine of
creation, and have a long very difficult evolutionary trek to navigate --
if we survive long enough.
I think you know exactly what I'm talking about, my exact meaning, Wolfy.
But, folks like Stevie are, metaphorically like the boasting fly caught on
the windowsill, buzzing, using up his finite energy, bumping his head
against the glass, trying to get out and go forth into a bigger world.
He's trapped himself, but doesn't have to be trapped, if he could only see
past the window, turn about, and fly another direction to freedom and a
better life.
Perhaps the analogy's a bit strained...? Yet, it seems not.
Doc :))~
.
|
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| User: "mukyuk" |
|
| Title: Re: Slave passage found under Washington's home |
11 Jun 2007 11:51:34 PM |
|
|
"Docrodile" <swampthing@hellsbayou.net> wrote in message
news:466df243_1@newsfeed.slurp.net...
"Werewolfy" <Werewolfy1@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:1181545663.120778.251560@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
On Jun 11, 3:25?am, Steven Douglas <dste...@flashmail.com> wrote:
Really? Not long ago you were complaining angrily that the United
States did not come immediately to the rescue while under attack from
Hitler.
Until the 1950's or so, America had a good reputation, a philanthropic
Country with ideals.
You are not that same Nation. Your hero, Bush, and his ilk have seen
to that.
Werewolfy
It might come as a surprise, Wolfy, to the black-and-white world of
morality, and left-and-right realm of politics that Stevie exercises as
daily discourse, that I grew up liking this nation immensely, fervently.
My love affair with it continued until the mid-60s and then rather
abruptly ended.
I'd have to go into a long diatribe to explain the numerous involved
reasons for my marriage to it ending in bitter separation and, later,
divorce, but suffice to say it was the hard realization of the persistent
inherent dark nature of the species. Yes, that is at the basis of my
disillusionment with not only the American way of life, but all other
systems humans have created.
I see right through the lies, the hypocrisy, the fanatical devotion, the
social veneers...yes, RIGHT THROUGH THEM! And what I have as a result, at
the end, is little more than a train-wreck of a species -- which has
enormous potential, undoubtedly, but ruins itself repeatedly with its
ingrained misbehaviour, its dangerous fanatical and fantastical delusions,
subservience to maniacal leadership, et al. And, possibly most of all, its
inability to off-place its self centeredness, and move beyond the
attendant delusion we're the cat's meow of God's universe.
I know we're not. I am sure we're not. We're way back among the swine of
creation, and have a long very difficult evolutionary trek to navigate --
if we survive long enough.
I think you know exactly what I'm talking about, my exact meaning, Wolfy.
But, folks like Stevie are, metaphorically like the boasting fly caught on
the windowsill, buzzing, using up his finite energy, bumping his head
against the glass, trying to get out and go forth into a bigger world.
He's trapped himself, but doesn't have to be trapped, if he could only see
past the window, turn about, and fly another direction to freedom and a
better life.
Perhaps the analogy's a bit strained...? Yet, it seems not.
Now why can't Steven write something as interesting?
Doc :))~
.
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| User: "Steven Douglas" |
|
| Title: Re: Slave passage found under Washington's home |
12 Jun 2007 09:17:30 AM |
|
|
Docrodile wrote:
I'd have to go into a long diatribe to explain the numerous involved
reasons for my marriage to it ending in bitter separation and, later,
divorce, but suffice to say it was the hard realization of the persistent
inherent dark nature of the species. Yes, that is at the basis of my
disillusionment with not only the American way of life, but all other
systems humans have created.
I understand your disillusionment with the species. I'm disillusioned
too. That's why I'm not looking for perfection on this earth. To do so
would be futile, and would only lead to frustration and .... further
disillusionment. Instead, I'd prefer to put things in perspective, and
look around the world and notice that I was fortunate enough to be
born into a relatively good place to live (as opposed to some of the
other places I might have been born). But if you'd rather be unhappy,
that's your choice.
But, folks like Stevie are, metaphorically like the boasting fly caught on
the windowsill, buzzing, using up his finite energy, bumping his head
against the glass, trying to get out and go forth into a bigger world.
Actually, Doc, that sounds like you. Sounds like more of your standard
projection.
He's trapped himself, but doesn't have to be trapped, if he could only see
past the window, turn about, and fly another direction to freedom and a
better life.
I already have freedom. And I really can't imagine another place in
this world where I might have a better life -- I'm sure there are
places where I could have an equally good life, but not better. Do you
have an example of what you mean by a better life?
.
|
|
|
| User: "mukyuk" |
|
| Title: Re: Slave passage found under Washington's home |
12 Jun 2007 09:42:30 AM |
|
|
"Steven Douglas" <dsteven@flashmail.com> wrote in message
news:1181657850.956819.78350@a26g2000pre.googlegroups.com...
Docrodile wrote:
I'd have to go into a long diatribe to explain the numerous involved
reasons for my marriage to it ending in bitter separation and, later,
divorce, but suffice to say it was the hard realization of the persistent
inherent dark nature of the species. Yes, that is at the basis of my
disillusionment with not only the American way of life, but all other
systems humans have created.
I understand your disillusionment with the species. I'm disillusioned
too. That's why I'm not looking for perfection on this earth. To do so
would be futile, and would only lead to frustration and .... further
disillusionment. Instead, I'd prefer to put things in perspective, and
look around the world and notice that I was fortunate enough to be
born into a relatively good place to live (as opposed to some of the
other places I might have been born). But if you'd rather be unhappy,
that's your choice.
But, folks like Stevie are, metaphorically like the boasting fly caught
on
the windowsill, buzzing, using up his finite energy, bumping his head
against the glass, trying to get out and go forth into a bigger world.
Actually, Doc, that sounds like you. Sounds like more of your standard
projection.
He's trapped himself, but doesn't have to be trapped, if he could only
see
past the window, turn about, and fly another direction to freedom and a
better life.
I already have freedom.
Freedom? Ha!!! Your mind is in a cage!
And I really can't imagine another place in
this world where I might have a better life -- I'm sure there are
places where I could have an equally good life, but not better. Do you
have an example of what you mean by a better life?
.
|
|
|
| User: "Docrodile" |
|
| Title: Re: Slave passage found under Washington's home |
12 Jun 2007 01:37:02 PM |
|
|
"mukyuk" <a@b.com> wrote in message
news:qhybi.16699$1i1.15044@pd7urf3no...
"Steven Douglas" <dsteven@flashmail.com> wrote in message
news:1181657850.956819.78350@a26g2000pre.googlegroups.com...
Docrodile wrote:
I'd have to go into a long diatribe to explain the numerous involved
reasons for my marriage to it ending in bitter separation and, later,
divorce, but suffice to say it was the hard realization of the
persistent
inherent dark nature of the species. Yes, that is at the basis of my
disillusionment with not only the American way of life, but all other
systems humans have created.
I understand your disillusionment with the species. I'm disillusioned
too. That's why I'm not looking for perfection on this earth. To do so
would be futile, and would only lead to frustration and .... further
disillusionment. Instead, I'd prefer to put things in perspective, and
look around the world and notice that I was fortunate enough to be
born into a relatively good place to live (as opposed to some of the
other places I might have been born). But if you'd rather be unhappy,
that's your choice.
But, folks like Stevie are, metaphorically like the boasting fly
caught on
the windowsill, buzzing, using up his finite energy, bumping his head
against the glass, trying to get out and go forth into a bigger world.
Actually, Doc, that sounds like you. Sounds like more of your standard
projection.
He's trapped himself, but doesn't have to be trapped, if he could only
see
past the window, turn about, and fly another direction to freedom and
a
better life.
I already have freedom.
Freedom? Ha!!! Your mind is in a cage!
ROFLMFAO !! Yeah, first Stevie says he's disillusioned with the species,
and then he says I'm unhappy (because I choose to be!). Mondo, how does
one have disillusionment with humanity and still be happy? Well, Stevie's
got the answer! He doesn't expect perfection on this earth! (I just told
him I found there is none, and I expect none. And you certainly can't find
it through politics.) So, logically, he's disillusioned because there is
no perfection, but happy because he doesn't attempt to attain or seek
perfection on earth.. Uh huh...LOL! Oh jeez...so what is all this
perfectionistic grinding away at the most minute of details in topics he
argues all about then -- if it isn't seeking perfection in details,
perfection in facts, perfection in historical record, etc? Why, golly,
that looks like a guy obsessed with achieving perfection, doesn't it? Why
keep avoiding that he's a hypocrite, denying he's lied here, played
mischievous games to feather his ego? Looks like a guy who can't face up
to his imperfections, doesn't it? And how does Stevie act when he can't
get that lofty state of perfection (*winning*) in his tiresome, long
debates here? Well, he gets rather irritated, testy, smarty, snide...the
earmarks of a personality DISILLUSIONED with the IMPERFECTION of his
opponent's contribution to the debate, or DISILLUSIONED with his own
failings. What does he do then? A round of name calling, dodging,
distracting, convoluting, rationalizing, irrationalizing, and, his
trademark snideness and snottiness.
Yep, Stevie's partly right about one thing: we choose to be unhappy. But
he misses the fact that others, like the other perfection-seeking Stevie's
of the world, and many of his opponents here, cause him to be unhappy with
their, uh, unsatisfactory less-than-perfect behaviour, their disappointing
emotional attitudes, lack of verifiable facts, lack of comparable
intellect, etc.
See, in real life in America, garnered especially through much life
experience, I found that folks like Stevie want to believe, have FAITH, is
an illusion they so desperately want to be reality. It's an attempt to
fill a gap in their souls. If the reality creates disillusionment, they
recreate it by exercising a strong, fanatical belief in an ideology...and
then often proceed to force that ideology onto others in various direct
and subtle ways. Those who refuse to accept their idealism, their dreams,
their illusions, get the hell beat outta' him...they're ridiculed,
persecuted, threatened, ostracized.
The big difference between the America Stevie wants and can't have, and is
disillusioned with because he can't have it on earth, and my version of
reality in America that I'd like to see, is that I fully understand the
psychic damage ideological bullying does to humanity. Stevie doesn't see
this because he is an ideological bully himself who supports other
idiological tyrants ...and, to be sure, they're not going to get the
America they long for either, and they'll end up dead some day, still
disillusioned with nothing to show for their brow-beating, ideological
fantasizing, perfectionistic nitpicking than I'll have for not taking
their course in life. A lot of folks will be hurt, and killed, and
tortured, though in their wake.
As I've said here before, I cannot understand the Christian mindset that
expects a new kind of human being after the Apocalpse, under the spiritual
guidance of a returned perfect Jesus, and for a millenium to come, and
that all will be swept away for this virtual utopia of peace and love, and
yet the faithful get so very concerned about who the next political leader
will be, a new law they want passed, materialism they crave, a war they
fervently support, property they want to acquire and defend at all costs,
social movements they get obsessed with, trivial crapola that funnels
through the news media they get upset or scared about...if one believes,
as Steve says he does, that perfection only comes after one dies, in
another world, why be so demanding of himself and others in this world,
then?
He's seriously mentally ill like so many religious hypocrites and
political fanatics are, and just doesn't have a clue as to the extent of
his mental problems -- which he should be getting a clue about when he
feels...disillusioned but still allegedly happy, yet driving for
perfection in his interactions with others here. A total contradiction of
a man...a disturbed personality...and, let's face it, many end up in
religious and political movements, totally immersed in illusions. That is,
their illusions are their reality, and our differing version of a reality,
is just an illusion to them.
heeheeheehee...I'm happy, though, that I understand humanity better than
the Stevies and Bush's and Cheneys of the world. That much, I am rather
pleased with...I don't choose to be unhappy -- the reality I see makes me
unhappy for I know the suffering and insanity of this species and the
horrific damage it has done, and continues to do. We can only reduce it,
but can't end it. Is that reality something to be happy about? I am
trapped in this violent, lying, greedy world until I die, as we all are.
Being trapped in my version of reality is being unhappy. There is nothing
I can do about getting rid of the horrid behaviour of the species, nor
expect a miracle will change it, or a politician will change it. Nor will
faith in a supernatural being and ideals change humanity's behaviour. I
suspect that being trapped in Stevie's reality is equally an unhappy
experience, but for different reasons.
My suggestion to the cleric, librarian, moralizer and straggling neocon
that is the essence of Stevie, is that if he were really smart he'd know
there's no getting out of disillusionment when he immerses himself over
his head in it via politics. Disillusionment is a main feature of
politics, and a persistent outcome in religious ideology. He chose to be
obsessed with these two bottomless pits of the human experience. So, he
has chosen to be more disillusioned, and to be disillusioned, is to be,
ultimately, unhappy with the state of human existence.
So, don't lecture to me that I've chosen unhappiness, you blithering
hypocrite, when you've definitely chosen to supremely deluded areas of the
human experience to wallow around in, and don't lecture me that you aren't
unhappy because you have attained some greater realization of the
inability of humans to attain perfection...as if I hadn't understood this
simple-minded fact long ago. I've stated it over and over here that I
don't expect perfection in humans nor seek it in myself. I'm not the one
waiting to die to go to a perfect place, you *****. I don't think there
is any place to go to, perfect or imperfect. We make our reality here, for
better or worse, and that is all any of us know for sure.
Now, get back to nitpicking at people tediously as you have now revealed
you don't seek perfection on this earth, you hypocritical smug *****.
LOL!
Many don't choose to be unhappy, you saphead...they experience things in
life that make them that way, and some forever to the end. Obviously,
you've lived a fortunate, privileged, self-deluded life. Anyone who would
make that remark hasn't been forced into a number of situations that have
produced extreme hardship, depression, futility, long suffering pain, or
been abused by the brutality of others. You goddamned piece of smirking,
disillusioned *****. Go support your leader some more and his killing
field, and see our much satisfaction that'll bring ya, you fascist
arrogant pig.
Doc :))~
And I really can't imagine another place in
this world where I might have a better life -- I'm sure there are
places where I could have an equally good life, but not better. Do you
have an example of what you mean by a better life?
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| User: "mukyuk" |
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| Title: Re: Slave passage found under Washington's home |
12 Jun 2007 03:46:33 PM |
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For obvious reasons, suffering and unhappiness are the price one pays for
wisdom. I equate wisdom with happiness. One could be suffering and happy,
both at the same time.
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| User: "Steven Douglas" |
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| Title: Re: Slave passage found under Washington's home |
12 Jun 2007 10:59:10 PM |
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On Jun 12, 11:37 am, "Docrodile" <swampth...@hellsbayou.net> wrote:
Yeah, first Stevie says he's disillusioned with the species,
and then he says I'm unhappy (because I choose to be!). Mondo, how does
one have disillusionment with humanity and still be happy?
I'm impressed with the answer he gave you. I believe his wisdom
exceeds yours.
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| User: "Steven Douglas" |
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| Title: Re: Slave passage found under Washington's home |
11 Jun 2007 07:38:09 AM |
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On Jun 11, 12:07 am, Werewolfy <Werewol...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
On Jun 11, 3:25?am, Steven Douglas <dste...@flashmail.com> wrote:
Really? Not long ago you were complaining angrily that the United
States did not come immediately to the rescue while under attack from Hitler.
Until the 1950's or so, America had a good reputation, a philanthropic
Country with ideals.
You are not that same Nation. Your hero, Bush, and his ilk have seen
to that.
I figured you'd find a way to blame Bush for things that happened in
the 1950s. Very fair of you.
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| User: "JTEM" |
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| Title: Re: Slave passage found under Washington's home |
11 Jun 2007 10:54:34 AM |
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Werewolfy <Werewol...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
Because you are NOT the 'guardian of the World'.
Because it has nothing whatsoever to do with
you. Because you should put your own house in
order, rather than to constantly interfere and bully
other Nations.
The British empire raped a quarter of the globe, and
the woofy sockpuppets claims to be british....
Seems your own house of cards is in rather feeble
condition there, psycho breath.
And I'm not just talking about ancient history. The
British are still occupying Ireland, last I heard.
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| User: "scally" |
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| Title: Re: Slave passage found under Washington's home |
11 Jun 2007 11:58:10 AM |
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On 11 Jun, 16:54, JTEM <jte...@gmail.com> wrote:
Werewolfy <Werewol...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
Because you are NOT the 'guardian of the World'.
Because it has nothing whatsoever to do with
you. Because you should put your own house in
order, rather than to constantly interfere and bully
other Nations.
TheBritish empireraped a quarter of the globe, and
the woofy sockpuppets claims to be british....
Seems your own house of cards is in rather feeble
condition there, psycho breath.
And I'm not just talking about ancient history. The
British are still occupying Ireland, last I heard.
I think you will find the majority in Northern Ireland are pro
unionists who want to remain a part of the UK. The Ulster Scots have
been there since the early 17th Century and their descendents can
hardly be described as illegally occupying Northern Ireland.
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| User: "JTEM" |
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| Title: Re: Slave passage found under Washington's home |
11 Jun 2007 11:58:58 PM |
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scally <scally1...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
I think you will find the majority in Northern Ireland
are pro unionists who want to remain a part of the
UK.
There are plenty of neighborhoods in London which
would choose to be part of, say, Pakistan if given
the chance the vote.
The only reasonable course of action for people in
Ireland who want to live under British rule is to
move away from Ireland. Throwing a fence around
part of Ireland and pretending that it was somehow
detached is not a reasonable option.
Any sane person could understand this.
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| User: "scally" |
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| Title: Re: Slave passage found under Washington's home |
12 Jun 2007 03:32:56 AM |
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On 12 Jun, 05:58, JTEM <jte...@gmail.com> wrote:
scally <scally1...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
I think you will find the majority in Northern Ireland
are pro unionists who want to remain a part of the
UK.
There are plenty of neighborhoods in London which
would choose to be part of, say, Pakistan if given
the chance the vote.
The only reasonable course of action for people in
Ireland who want to live under British rule is to
move away from Ireland. Throwing a fence around
part of Ireland and pretending that it was somehow
detached is not a reasonable option.
Any sane person could understand this.
No, we live in a democracy and it is up to the people of Northern
Ireland to decide their own future. The Good Friday Agreement provides
for a referendum on this should they so wish.
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| User: "JTEM" |
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| Title: Re: Slave passage found under Washington's home |
12 Jun 2007 10:55:53 AM |
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scally <scally1...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
No, we live in a democracy and it is up to the
people of Northern Ireland to decide their own
future.
Wrong. It's Ireland. It's part of Ireland. The only
reasonable option for a British citizen that doesn't
want to live under the Irish government is to leave.
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| User: "scally" |
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| Title: Re: Slave passage found under Washington's home |
12 Jun 2007 11:44:55 AM |
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On 12 Jun, 16:55, JTEM <jte...@gmail.com> wrote:
scally <scally1...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
No, we live in a democracy and it is up to the
people of Northern Ireland to decide their own
future.
Wrong. It's Ireland. It's part of Ireland. The only
reasonable option for a British citizen that doesn't
want to live under the Irish government is to leave.
You are rather na=EFve, the British Government couldn't stop the
Orangemen from marching let alone get them to leave their homeland.
What you are suggesting is basically a civil war in Ireland. There
will be a United Ireland but this can only come about through a
democratic process. In a few decades the Republicans will out number
the Loyalists and then they will win a referendum. My only hope is
that when his happens the Loyalists accept the result with dignity
rather than taking up arms. However only time will tell.
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| User: "JTEM" |
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| Title: Re: Slave passage found under Washington's home |
12 Jun 2007 12:44:17 PM |
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scally <scally1...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
You are rather na=EFve, the British Government
couldn't stop the Orangemen from marching
let alone get them to leave their homeland.
Exactly the opposite. Not only is it NOT their
"homeland," but if the British government had
washed their hands of Ireland at any time in
the past the British Disneyland would no longer
exist. The Irish government would have declared
the British partition null & void. There would have
been NOTHING the British occupiers of Ireland
could have done about it.
That's the point, you psycho. The partition was
EXTERNAL. It was imposed from without, not
within. Without British military might behind it,
it never would have lasted more than a few days.
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| User: "scally" |
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| Title: Re: Slave passage found under Washington's home |
12 Jun 2007 02:47:56 PM |
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On 12 Jun, 18:44, JTEM <jte...@gmail.com> wrote:
scally <scally1...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
You are rather na=EFve, the British Government
couldn't stop the Orangemen from marching
let alone get them to leave their homeland.
Exactly the opposite. Not only is it NOT their
"homeland," but if the British government had
washed their hands of Ireland at any time in
the past the British Disneyland would no longer
exist. The Irish government would have declared
the British partition null & void. There would have
been NOTHING the British occupiers of Ireland
could have done about it.
That's the point, you psycho. The partition was
EXTERNAL. It was imposed from without, not
within. Without British military might behind it,
it never would have lasted more than a few days.
You mean there would have been a civil war in Ireland in the 1920's
rather than the situation we have today. I am an English Nationalist
and look forward to the day when we have an independent England,
Scotland, Wales and a United Ireland. However the dissolution of the
UK needs to be done in a sensible and democratic way as bombs and
bullets will achieve nothing but heartache. It will not happen over
night but it will happen in my lifetime. Patience my friend, patience.
BTW - '41% Britons favour united Ireland; Only 26% want Ulster in UK'
http://www.guardian.co.uk/Northern_Ireland/Story/0,2763,540092,00.html
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