On 11 May 2007 wrote:
On May 10, 3:04 pm, wrote:
On May 10, 2:50 pm, David Schwartz <dav...@webmaster.com> wrote:
On May 7, 5:29 pm, "R. O'Connor" <rco...@invalid.com> wrote:
But I often wondered, What becomes of "Who we are" Where does soul go
after death., does it die with the body?
<snips>
I've written at some length about the experience with my father above.
Now his body was dead and his brain was dead. But he was still
talking and thinking and seeing, although in what fashion I don't
know. I was able to converse with him. This is despite the fact I
was making sound waves in air with a real larynx and vocal chords. He
had no vocal chords or larynx, so how were we communicating.
In the (comparatively rare) occurrences where angels greet humans in
the Bible, how did they communicate? The same problem applies. It
applies if someone has a stroke or is brain dead for that matter - the
body might live on, but the brain has, to a greater or lesser extent
lost its ability to oversee the body and think.
Yet if that person dies completely, then I believe their soul lives
on, unencumbered by the loss of brain function in earthly life. They
would, in a sense, come out of a coma.
I believe we have a soul. In fact, I'm sure of it. But where the
boundaries lie between mind and soul, life and death, or what the soul
is, are areas in which I have to plead complete ignorance.- Hide quoted text
To add to my post above - Just yesterday, quite by "coincidence" I
picked up a middle aged bloke in the maxi taxi I drive a couple of
times a week for a bit of extra income. Now I wrote earlier in the
incident about my father that the person who actually physically
informed me my father had died was my uncle, my Mother's brother to be
exact.
Now this is the interesting bit - right in the middle of the debate
with atheists about the soul etc, not only did the bloke I give the
lift happen to go to school with the eldest son of the above uncle,
the very man who told me about my father's death, but he told me he
was one of those "rare people who had come back from the dead." It
turned out he was technically dead for ten minutes, when doctors
severed an artery when he was having his stomach removed. Apparently
he eats now in very small amounts and often, since he no longer has a
stomach. He's in the nursing home because following the operation,
and his technical death, he kept having accidents, yet he's only a few
months older than I am (he's 53).
He told me that during his technical death, he could hear voices eg.
"Better go and get the registrar, and get him to write out the
certificate of death". Then later he heard "the body just shook",
"we'd better try again to see if we can revive him!" etc.
At one stage however, he told me he could see this intense white
light, and something seemed to be lifting him up into the air. Then a
voice seemed to say "Take him back".
As far as I'm concerned the fact that I met him right in the middle of
a debate with atheists, and mentioned it was my uncle who informed me
my father had died, and then I meet a bloke who was technically dead
for a full ten minutes, and who even went to the same school as the
eldest son of the above uncle, is to my mind more than coincidence.
He is, by the way, a Christian, as also turned out. After he told me
about his experience, I then told him about mine involving my father.
Because of his own technical death, he had no problem accepting it.
In addition it turns out we both had alcoholic fathers, and if
anything, his father was more physically cruel than mine was.
As far as I'm concerned it had the hand of divine manipulation on it.
But you won't think that. You'll write off as co-incindence.
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
The famous Swiss psychologist/psychiatrist Carl Jung (1875-1961)
was really interested in synchronicities like you've described
(so was Pauli, et al), as meaningful, purposeful, intelligent,
unquestionably psychic, coincidence. It's a *serious* subject.
Remember the 70s/80s band 'The Police'? They did a song about it
called "Synchronicity". Psychics from all walks of life have to
live with often profound synchronicities every day of the week.
So those who're used to it have no problem believing others who
report even the most astonishing occurrences of synchronicity.
Of course, "unbelievers/fundies" write off everything that they
don't experience themselves--much less comprehend--as "insanity",
"kookery", "clap-trap", "trick of the devil", "demon-possession",
"witchcraft", ad nauseam. And that's as it should be. Those of
us who know better, understand that they're really afraid to go
there, so to speak. They're afraid to step out of their comfort
zone--as well they should be! The spirit world is definitely not
for those who feel uncomfortable with their supernatural powers,
ghosts, the circles of Heaven & Hell, with Satan, and the Devil,
etc., which is why they shut them off, and either deny it, mock
it, or simply mislabel it as "Satanism". They're simply cowards.
There's no question synchronicity is psychic, spiritual, divine,
universal law, ad infinitum. Souls who experience synchronicity
on a regular basis just call it "another day at the office", or
"that's just life in the big city", etc. It's very commonplace,
(para)normal, and (super)natural, and gets better with practice. :)
Sincerely,
Daniel Joseph Min
http://www.2hot2cool.com/11/danieljosephmin/
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| User: "The_Sage" |
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| Title: Re: Synchronicity (was Re: The soul) |
12 May 2007 10:38:01 PM |
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Reply to article by: Borked Pseudo Mailed <nobody@pseudo.borked.net>
Date written: Sat, 12 May 2007 00:00:28 -0600 (MDT)
MsgID:<011de429b198527a8d00a0e38c331d8c@pseudo.borked.net>
The famous Swiss psychologist/psychiatrist Carl Jung (1875-1961)
was really interested in synchronicities like you've described
(so was Pauli, et al), as meaningful, purposeful, intelligent,
unquestionably psychic, coincidence. It's a *serious* subject.
"To explain 'synchronistic' events, Jung was inclined to refer to a phrase of
the French psychologist Pierre Janet, abaissement du niveau mental, 'lowering
of the mental threshold,' by which Janet meant a certain lowering of the
vital forces -- such as we experience when we are tired or discouraged and
which is the precondition for neurosis. Jung believed that when the mental
threshold is lowered 'the tone of the unconscious is heightened, thereby
creating a gradient for the unconscious to flow towards the conscious.' the
conscious then comes under the influence of what Jung calls the 'archetypes'
or 'primordial images.' These images belong to the 'collective unconscious'
and might be, for example, of a great mother, a hero-god, a devil-figure, or
an image of incarnate wisdom. Jung thought that when the archetype is
activated odd coincidences are likely to happen"
(http://www.dreamscape.com/morgana/naiad2.htm who in turn quotes from Jung's
PSYCHOLOGY OF RELIGION AND SYNCHRONITICY)
"Psychic processes which under ordinary circumstances are functions of the
will, and thus entirely under conscious control, can, in abnormal
circumstances, become instinctive processes when supplied with unconscious
energy. This phenomenon occurs whenever the sphere of consciousness is
restricted by the repression of incompatible contents, or when, as a result
of fatigue, intoxication, or morbid cerebral conditions in general, an
abaissement du niveau mental" (Vol 6, para 765)
"[Jung] suggested that synchronistic phenomena may be more apparent when the
level of consciousness is low (see abaissement du niveau mental). What occurs
may then have therapeutic value in analysis, directing attention to problem
areas which, because unconscious, may as yet be untouched. Keeping
synchronicity in mind protects the analyst from the twin perils of feeling
that everything is due to fate or of falling back on purely causal
explanations which 'serve only to debunk the patient's experience instead of
letting it work towards change' (Williams, 1936b). The synchronistic
experience occurs where two kinds of reality (ie -- inner and outer
intersect" (A CRITICAL DICTIONARY OF JUNGIAN ANALYSIS, Andrew Samuels, pg
146-147).
"Those who keep a lid upon their unconscious world may also become obsessed
with discovering synchronicities in their own lives. It is as if by
externalizing and objectifying their inner turmoil they make it more
acceptable to their over rational minds, bringing the unconscious to the
point where it becomes a puzzle for the logical mind to work upon. Rather
than attempting to experience directly the nature of the patterns they are
being presented with, their synchronicities become devalued and on a par
with an obsessive, yet inherently trivial, interest in all things
paranormal" (Time, Synchronicity and Evolution, by F. David Peat,
(http://www.fdavidpeat.com/bibliography/essays/saur.htm)
The Sage
=============================================================
http://members.cox.net/the.sage/index.htm
"...I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in
one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you
dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why
I dismiss yours" (Stephen F. Roberts)
=============================================================
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| User: "Paul Duca" |
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| Title: Re: Synchronicity (was Re: The soul) |
12 May 2007 05:33:56 PM |
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in article 011de429b198527a8d00a0e38c331d8c@pseudo.borked.net, Borked Pseudo
Mailed at wrote on 5/12/07 2:00 AM:
On 11 May 2007 wrote:
On May 10, 3:04 pm, wrote:
On May 10, 2:50 pm, David Schwartz <dav...@webmaster.com> wrote:
On May 7, 5:29 pm, "R. O'Connor" <rco...@invalid.com> wrote:
But I often wondered, What becomes of "Who we are" Where does soul go
after death., does it die with the body?
<snips>
I've written at some length about the experience with my father above.
Now his body was dead and his brain was dead. But he was still
talking and thinking and seeing, although in what fashion I don't
know. I was able to converse with him. This is despite the fact I
was making sound waves in air with a real larynx and vocal chords. He
had no vocal chords or larynx, so how were we communicating.
In the (comparatively rare) occurrences where angels greet humans in
the Bible, how did they communicate? The same problem applies. It
applies if someone has a stroke or is brain dead for that matter - the
body might live on, but the brain has, to a greater or lesser extent
lost its ability to oversee the body and think.
Yet if that person dies completely, then I believe their soul lives
on, unencumbered by the loss of brain function in earthly life. They
would, in a sense, come out of a coma.
I believe we have a soul. In fact, I'm sure of it. But where the
boundaries lie between mind and soul, life and death, or what the soul
is, are areas in which I have to plead complete ignorance.- Hide quoted text
To add to my post above - Just yesterday, quite by "coincidence" I
picked up a middle aged bloke in the maxi taxi I drive a couple of
times a week for a bit of extra income. Now I wrote earlier in the
incident about my father that the person who actually physically
informed me my father had died was my uncle, my Mother's brother to be
exact.
Now this is the interesting bit - right in the middle of the debate
with atheists about the soul etc, not only did the bloke I give the
lift happen to go to school with the eldest son of the above uncle,
the very man who told me about my father's death, but he told me he
was one of those "rare people who had come back from the dead." It
turned out he was technically dead for ten minutes, when doctors
severed an artery when he was having his stomach removed. Apparently
he eats now in very small amounts and often, since he no longer has a
stomach. He's in the nursing home because following the operation,
and his technical death, he kept having accidents, yet he's only a few
months older than I am (he's 53).
He told me that during his technical death, he could hear voices eg.
"Better go and get the registrar, and get him to write out the
certificate of death". Then later he heard "the body just shook",
"we'd better try again to see if we can revive him!" etc.
At one stage however, he told me he could see this intense white
light, and something seemed to be lifting him up into the air. Then a
voice seemed to say "Take him back".
As far as I'm concerned the fact that I met him right in the middle of
a debate with atheists, and mentioned it was my uncle who informed me
my father had died, and then I meet a bloke who was technically dead
for a full ten minutes, and who even went to the same school as the
eldest son of the above uncle, is to my mind more than coincidence.
He is, by the way, a Christian, as also turned out. After he told me
about his experience, I then told him about mine involving my father.
Because of his own technical death, he had no problem accepting it.
In addition it turns out we both had alcoholic fathers, and if
anything, his father was more physically cruel than mine was.
As far as I'm concerned it had the hand of divine manipulation on it.
But you won't think that. You'll write off as co-incindence.
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
The famous Swiss psychologist/psychiatrist Carl Jung (1875-1961)
was really interested in synchronicities like you've described
(so was Pauli, et al), as meaningful, purposeful, intelligent,
unquestionably psychic, coincidence. It's a *serious* subject.
Remember the 70s/80s band 'The Police'? They did a song about it
called "Synchronicity". Psychics from all walks of life have to
live with often profound synchronicities every day of the week.
So those who're used to it have no problem believing others who
report even the most astonishing occurrences of synchronicity.
Of course, "unbelievers/fundies" write off everything that they
don't experience themselves--much less comprehend--as "insanity",
"kookery", "clap-trap", "trick of the devil", "demon-possession",
"witchcraft", ad nauseam. And that's as it should be. Those of
us who know better, understand that they're really afraid to go
there, so to speak. They're afraid to step out of their comfort
zone--as well they should be! The spirit world is definitely not
for those who feel uncomfortable with their supernatural powers,
Some people don't expect to bow down to ghosties, expecting to get
money in return...
Paul
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