Teams Try to Recreate Ancient Greek Death Ray
By RON HARRIS, AP
SAN FRANCISCO (Oct. 22) - It wasn't exactly the ancient siege of
Syracuse, but rather a curious quest for scientific validation.
According to sparse historical writings, the Greek mathematician
Archimedes torched a fleet of invading Roman ships by reflecting the
sun's powerful rays with a mirrored device made of glass or bronze.
More than 2,000 years later, researchers from the Massachusetts
Institute of Technology and the University of Arizona set out to
recreate Archimedes' fabled death ray Saturday in an experiment
sponsored by the Discovery Channel program "MythBusters.''
Their attempts to set fire to an 80-year-old fishing boat using their
own versions of the device, however, failed to either prove or dispel
the myth of the solar death ray.
The MIT team's first attempt with their contraption made of 300 square
feet of bronze and glass failed to ignite a fire from 150 feet away. It
produced smoldering on the boat's wooden surface but no open flame. A
second attempt from about 75 feet away lit only a small fire that
burned itself out.
Mike Bushroe of the University of Arizona's Lunar and Planetary
Laboratory tried a mirrored system shaped like flower petals, but it
failed to produce either smoke or flames.
Peter Rees, executive producer of "MythBusters,'' said the experiment
showed Archimedes' death ray was most likely a myth.
"We're not saying it can't be done,'' Rees said. "We're just saying
it's extremely impractical as a weapon of war.''
The experiment showed it may be technically possible, but didn't answer
whether Archimedes used it to destroy enemy ships, MIT professor David
Wallace said.
"Who can say whether Archimedes did it or not?'' he said. "He's one of
the great mathematical minds in history. I wouldn't want to
underestimate his intelligence or ability.''
Historical text describes Archimedes defeating a Roman fleet using the
ray.
In "Epitome ton Istorion,'' John Zonaras wrote: "At last in an
incredible manner he burned up the whole Roman fleet. For by tilting a
kind of mirror toward the sun he concentrated the sun's beam upon it;
and owing to the thickness and smoothness of the mirror he ignited the
air from this beam and kindled a great flame, the whole of which he
directed upon the ships that lay at anchor in the path of the fire,
until he consumed them all.''
"MythBusters'' also tried to recreate the ray last year, and after
failing, declared the story a myth.
"If this weapon had worked, it would have been the equivalent of a
nuclear weapon in the ancient world,'' Rees said.
10/22/05 20:06 EDT
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| User: "The Other Guy" |
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| Title: Re: Teams Try to Recreate Ancient Greek Death Ray |
23 Oct 2005 12:21:09 AM |
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Discovery Channel's "Myth Busters" have missed the mark on more than one occasion due to their
lack of 'appreciation' of the 'technological advancements' of Prehistoric Technologies based
on the 'Modern Day Mis-Conceptualization' of how 'Backward' Prehistoric Technologies were back
then.
- There "Smoking while your car is being 're-fueled' is a perfect example of how 'controlled
environment' testing is in-adequate." (There is 'documented proof' that these "internal
'flame-ups' have actually occurred in real life.) [Not to mention their "Smoking while in an
'Out House'."] - this one I know from 'First-Hand" information.
Scientists spend their whole life trying to disprove what they haven't experienced
(personally), instead of trying to prove that it does have a 'validity' of actually happening.
:-(]
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| User: "The Other Guy" |
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| Title: Re: Teams Try to Recreate Ancient Greek Death Ray |
23 Oct 2005 12:27:34 AM |
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As a side note; their attempt to prove that the POWER of the "Arc Of The Covenant" truly could
exist, based on 'Prehistoric' Egyptian Technology, was more than REAL !!!
:-)
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| User: "Charly the Bastard" |
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| Title: Re: Teams Try to Recreate Ancient Greek Death Ray |
26 Oct 2005 06:27:48 AM |
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The Other Guy wrote:
As a side note; their attempt to prove that the POWER of the "Arc Of The Covenant" truly could
exist, based on 'Prehistoric' Egyptian Technology, was more than REAL !!!
:-)
You betcha. A wood box lined in beaten gold and covered in same... capacitor. Given the dry
conditions, probably about a tenth of a Farad. More than enough to interupt the heartbeat on
contact. Power of God. 'Can I get an Amen?'
Charly
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| User: "Charly the Bastard" |
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| Title: Re: Teams Try to Recreate Ancient Greek Death Ray |
26 Oct 2005 06:22:07 AM |
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Only two factors really matter; the size of the mirror, and the focal
length. Surface smoothness only matters if you're trying to take pictures.
Burnished with beach sand is plenty smooth for generating heat. Considering
the physical size of some of the other Greek war machines of the day, it's
possible. Archimedes had the math to figure out the curve to focus the
mirror.
Elect_One_Two@hotmail.com wrote:
Teams Try to Recreate Ancient Greek Death Ray
By RON HARRIS, AP
SAN FRANCISCO (Oct. 22) - It wasn't exactly the ancient siege of
Syracuse, but rather a curious quest for scientific validation.
According to sparse historical writings, the Greek mathematician
Archimedes torched a fleet of invading Roman ships by reflecting the
sun's powerful rays with a mirrored device made of glass or bronze.
More than 2,000 years later, researchers from the Massachusetts
Institute of Technology and the University of Arizona set out to
recreate Archimedes' fabled death ray Saturday in an experiment
sponsored by the Discovery Channel program "MythBusters.''
Their attempts to set fire to an 80-year-old fishing boat using their
own versions of the device, however, failed to either prove or dispel
the myth of the solar death ray.
The MIT team's first attempt with their contraption made of 300 square
feet of bronze and glass failed to ignite a fire from 150 feet away. It
produced smoldering on the boat's wooden surface but no open flame. A
second attempt from about 75 feet away lit only a small fire that
burned itself out.
Mike Bushroe of the University of Arizona's Lunar and Planetary
Laboratory tried a mirrored system shaped like flower petals, but it
failed to produce either smoke or flames.
Peter Rees, executive producer of "MythBusters,'' said the experiment
showed Archimedes' death ray was most likely a myth.
"We're not saying it can't be done,'' Rees said. "We're just saying
it's extremely impractical as a weapon of war.''
The experiment showed it may be technically possible, but didn't answer
whether Archimedes used it to destroy enemy ships, MIT professor David
Wallace said.
"Who can say whether Archimedes did it or not?'' he said. "He's one of
the great mathematical minds in history. I wouldn't want to
underestimate his intelligence or ability.''
Historical text describes Archimedes defeating a Roman fleet using the
ray.
In "Epitome ton Istorion,'' John Zonaras wrote: "At last in an
incredible manner he burned up the whole Roman fleet. For by tilting a
kind of mirror toward the sun he concentrated the sun's beam upon it;
and owing to the thickness and smoothness of the mirror he ignited the
air from this beam and kindled a great flame, the whole of which he
directed upon the ships that lay at anchor in the path of the fire,
until he consumed them all.''
"MythBusters'' also tried to recreate the ray last year, and after
failing, declared the story a myth.
"If this weapon had worked, it would have been the equivalent of a
nuclear weapon in the ancient world,'' Rees said.
10/22/05 20:06 EDT
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| User: "Half-Mad" |
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| Title: Re: Teams Try to Recreate Ancient Greek Death Ray |
23 Oct 2005 05:08:19 AM |
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The "death ray" is taken wrong by most people. It's not an attempt to
set fire to the ships. It's an attempt to blind the crew of the ship,
so you can get close enough to either board it, or use Greek Fire.
Elect_One_Two@hotmail.com wrote:
Teams Try to Recreate Ancient Greek Death Ray
By RON HARRIS, AP
SAN FRANCISCO (Oct. 22) - It wasn't exactly the ancient siege of
Syracuse, but rather a curious quest for scientific validation.
According to sparse historical writings, the Greek mathematician
Archimedes torched a fleet of invading Roman ships by reflecting the
sun's powerful rays with a mirrored device made of glass or bronze.
More than 2,000 years later, researchers from the Massachusetts
Institute of Technology and the University of Arizona set out to
recreate Archimedes' fabled death ray Saturday in an experiment
sponsored by the Discovery Channel program "MythBusters.''
Their attempts to set fire to an 80-year-old fishing boat using their
own versions of the device, however, failed to either prove or dispel
the myth of the solar death ray.
The MIT team's first attempt with their contraption made of 300 square
feet of bronze and glass failed to ignite a fire from 150 feet away. It
produced smoldering on the boat's wooden surface but no open flame. A
second attempt from about 75 feet away lit only a small fire that
burned itself out.
Mike Bushroe of the University of Arizona's Lunar and Planetary
Laboratory tried a mirrored system shaped like flower petals, but it
failed to produce either smoke or flames.
Peter Rees, executive producer of "MythBusters,'' said the experiment
showed Archimedes' death ray was most likely a myth.
"We're not saying it can't be done,'' Rees said. "We're just saying
it's extremely impractical as a weapon of war.''
The experiment showed it may be technically possible, but didn't answer
whether Archimedes used it to destroy enemy ships, MIT professor David
Wallace said.
"Who can say whether Archimedes did it or not?'' he said. "He's one of
the great mathematical minds in history. I wouldn't want to
underestimate his intelligence or ability.''
Historical text describes Archimedes defeating a Roman fleet using the
ray.
In "Epitome ton Istorion,'' John Zonaras wrote: "At last in an
incredible manner he burned up the whole Roman fleet. For by tilting a
kind of mirror toward the sun he concentrated the sun's beam upon it;
and owing to the thickness and smoothness of the mirror he ignited the
air from this beam and kindled a great flame, the whole of which he
directed upon the ships that lay at anchor in the path of the fire,
until he consumed them all.''
"MythBusters'' also tried to recreate the ray last year, and after
failing, declared the story a myth.
"If this weapon had worked, it would have been the equivalent of a
nuclear weapon in the ancient world,'' Rees said.
10/22/05 20:06 EDT
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| User: "goozlefotz" |
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| Title: Re: Teams Try to Recreate Ancient Greek Death Ray |
23 Oct 2005 11:48:35 AM |
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Half-Mad wrote:
The "death ray" is taken wrong by most people. It's not an attempt to
set fire to the ships. It's an attempt to blind the crew of the ship,
so you can get close enough to either board it, or use Greek Fire.
That is more likely to be true.
ps: How come I get chastised for top posting and you can get away with
it?
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| User: "Half-Mad" |
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| Title: Re: Teams Try to Recreate Ancient Greek Death Ray |
23 Oct 2005 11:21:20 PM |
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goozlefotz wrote:
Half-Mad wrote:
The "death ray" is taken wrong by most people. It's not an attempt to
set fire to the ships. It's an attempt to blind the crew of the ship,
so you can get close enough to either board it, or use Greek Fire.
That is more likely to be true.
ps: How come I get chastised for top posting and you can get away with
it?
I gave out free prostitutes, beer, and pizza to all who asked last month.
I usually switch from top to bottom. If the message I'm replying to is
long, I will likely reply at the top. If short, then the bottom is
fine. Or the top. Or whatever. Besides, I don't really care what
other people think about where I should put my text. If people start to
complain to much, I will start mixing it with the text that I'm replying to.
If people don't want to read my messages, because I put my text above
the quoted text, fine, they don't have to read it.
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| User: "Woodswun" |
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| Title: Re: Teams Try to Recreate Ancient Greek Death Ray |
23 Oct 2005 02:45:16 PM |
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Half-Mad wrote:
The "death ray" is taken wrong by most people. It's not an attempt to
set fire to the ships. It's an attempt to blind the crew of the ship,
so you can get close enough to either board it, or use Greek Fire.
Greek Fire was the first thing that popped into my mind. The use of a
mirror to temporarily blind, or distract, the crews of the ship(s)
attacked makes sense, as you don't necessarily want to give them an
opportunity to see the incoming and make preparations (either by moving
the ship, jumping ship, or grabbing something to smother the flames with).
Woods
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