Debka reports that Hezbollah is planning missiles for Tel Aviv.
This will bring a next stage into the war.
I wonder what Israel will do then, it is losing the war already and another
big blow will certainly have implications to the proud people of Israel. Or
is this the comet that will run ?
/Michael
.
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| User: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Styrbj=F6rn?=" |
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| Title: Re: Tel Aviv |
28 Jul 2006 01:49:24 PM |
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Michael Cornelissen wrote / skrev:
Debka reports that Hezbollah is planning missiles for Tel Aviv.
This will bring a next stage into the war.
I wonder what Israel will do then, it is losing the war already and another
big blow will certainly have implications to the proud people of Israel. Or
is this the comet that will run ?
/Michael
Losing the war? Who is winning?
.
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| User: "Michael Cornelissen" |
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| Title: Re: Tel Aviv |
28 Jul 2006 04:10:41 PM |
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Hezbollah on points.
/Michael
"Styrbjörn" <tribe@war.soon> schreef in bericht
news:U_syg.10803$E02.3624@newsb.telia.net...
Michael Cornelissen wrote / skrev:
Debka reports that Hezbollah is planning missiles for Tel Aviv.
This will bring a next stage into the war.
I wonder what Israel will do then, it is losing the war already and
another big blow will certainly have implications to the proud people of
Israel. Or is this the comet that will run ?
/Michael
Losing the war? Who is winning?
.
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| User: "The CO" |
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| Title: Re: Tel Aviv |
28 Jul 2006 10:15:48 PM |
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Michael Cornelissen wrote:
Hezbollah on points.
You need to reassess your scoring technique.
Hezbollah cannot defeat a major standing army, at most
they can inflict casualties and delay the Israeli advance.
At most.
They have no CAS, no armour and no significant heavy weapons assets.
This isn't Iraq, Israel isn't there to win hearts and minds and
overthrow a dictatorship - they are there to exterminate Hezbollah and
secure their border from their incursions and attacks and I suggest that
they will continue this operation until that objective is achieved.
The fact that Israel has a major air force with significant CAS assets
is a major advantage - Hezbollah has no air assets, so Israeli defensive
counter air is not necessary - they can be used instead for CAS and
tactical strike.
You need to assess 'points' based on military facts, not your
particular bias towards Hezbollah.
While we're at it, is there something you find admirable in the Islamic
terrorist organisation called Hezbollah?
Could it be you are simply yet another Muslim extremist sympathiser
living in Holland?
The CO
.
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| User: "John Lemke" |
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| Title: Re: Tel Aviv |
28 Jul 2006 10:35:04 PM |
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|
"The CO" <the_xo@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
news:44cad2e4$1_1@news.iprimus.com.au...
While we're at it, is there something you find admirable in the Islamic
terrorist organisation called Hezbollah?
Could it be you are simply yet another Muslim extremist sympathiser living
in Holland?
The CO
Oh, Lord, where's Jean when we really need him?
.
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| User: "eric" |
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| Title: Re: Tel Aviv |
28 Jul 2006 10:54:28 PM |
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Hezbollah is a Liberation movement. They're the ones wearing the white
hats in the current conflict. That's for sure. Israel needs to get
it's nose out of it's neighbours, - ie. end occupation, end of
terrorism, end of problem.
John Lemke wrote:
"The CO" <the_xo@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
news:44cad2e4$1_1@news.iprimus.com.au...
While we're at it, is there something you find admirable in the Islamic
terrorist organisation called Hezbollah?
Could it be you are simply yet another Muslim extremist sympathiser living
in Holland?
The CO
Oh, Lord, where's Jean when we really need him?
.
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| User: "Perseid" |
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| Title: Re: Tel Aviv |
29 Jul 2006 05:00:12 AM |
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"eric" <ericdavis500@gmail.com> Spat the Words
Hezbollah is a Liberation movement. They're the ones wearing the white
hats in the current conflict. That's for sure. Israel needs to get
it's nose out of it's neighbours, - ie. end occupation, end of
terrorism, end of problem.
Kick the Israelis out of their own country ? I'd say there are
about 2 chances of that happening... no way, and no how... for
nearly 60 years Israel has proven its determination to occupy
its ancient home-land. If some of the Arabs wanted that land
too, well, that's too bad... the Jews got it, they secured it,
and they built a strong economy and country on top of it.
John Lemke wrote:
"The CO" <the_xo@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
news:44cad2e4$1_1@news.iprimus.com.au...
While we're at it, is there something you find admirable in the
Islamic terrorist organisation called Hezbollah?
Could it be you are simply yet another Muslim extremist sympathiser
living in Holland?
The CO
Oh, Lord, where's Jean when we really need him?
.
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| User: "John Lemke" |
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| Title: Re: Tel Aviv |
29 Jul 2006 05:58:13 AM |
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"eric" <ericdavis500@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1154145268.321440.18360@h48g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
Hezbollah is a Liberation movement. They're the ones wearing the white
hats in the current conflict. That's for sure. Israel needs to get
it's nose out of it's neighbours, - ie. end occupation, end of
terrorism, end of problem.
It's hard for me to put a white hat on someone that initiates the pain we're
now seeing there. When you consider the possibilities that this and Bush's
adventurism in Iraq offer in terms of "remaking the Middle East" one should
shudder at this point. At the same time we're dealing with logical
extensions of oppression, hatred and bad decisions going way back.
But you're right. Palestinian needs have to be met. They're going to fight
until they're met and that's completely understandable.
But do you think that a permanent Isreali withdrawal from the territories
and a free Palestinian State would would end the violence? Is this idea of
Muslim extremism permanently bent on Israel's destruction a myth?
And seeing the CO's eloquence in refering to Muslim extremist sympathisers
made me a tad wistful for Guernon.
John Lemke wrote:
"The CO" <the_xo@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
news:44cad2e4$1_1@news.iprimus.com.au...
While we're at it, is there something you find admirable in the Islamic
terrorist organisation called Hezbollah?
Could it be you are simply yet another Muslim extremist sympathiser
living
in Holland?
The CO
Oh, Lord, where's Jean when we really need him?
.
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| User: "Woodswun" |
|
| Title: Re: Tel Aviv |
29 Jul 2006 07:43:36 AM |
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On Fri, 28 Jul 2006 20:54:28 -0700, eric wrote:
Hezbollah is a Liberation movement. They're the ones wearing the white
hats in the current conflict. That's for sure. Israel needs to get
it's nose out of it's neighbours, - ie. end occupation, end of
terrorism, end of problem.
I disagree. Hezbollah and Israel are both wearing black hats in this
thing. Well, one's a black turban and the other is a black yarmulke, but
the point is that they're both black.
Woods
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| User: "bye" |
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| Title: Re: Tel Aviv |
28 Jul 2006 10:54:48 PM |
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But, remember how Moses parted the Red Sea? Frodo and Sam come to mind.
David pulled a number on Goliath and "Odesius and The One Eyed Giant was
quite a story.
People love stories like this....
"The CO" <the_xo@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
news:44cad2e4$1_1@news.iprimus.com.au...
Michael Cornelissen wrote:
Hezbollah on points.
You need to reassess your scoring technique.
Hezbollah cannot defeat a major standing army, at most
they can inflict casualties and delay the Israeli advance.
At most.
They have no CAS, no armour and no significant heavy weapons assets.
This isn't Iraq, Israel isn't there to win hearts and minds and overthrow
a dictatorship - they are there to exterminate Hezbollah and
secure their border from their incursions and attacks and I suggest that
they will continue this operation until that objective is achieved.
The fact that Israel has a major air force with significant CAS assets is
a major advantage - Hezbollah has no air assets, so Israeli defensive
counter air is not necessary - they can be used instead for CAS and
tactical strike.
You need to assess 'points' based on military facts, not your
particular bias towards Hezbollah.
While we're at it, is there something you find admirable in the Islamic
terrorist organisation called Hezbollah?
Could it be you are simply yet another Muslim extremist sympathiser living
in Holland?
The CO
.
|
|
|
| User: "The CO" |
|
| Title: Re: Tel Aviv |
29 Jul 2006 08:36:49 AM |
|
|
bye wrote:
But, remember how Moses parted the Red Sea? Frodo and Sam come to mind.
David pulled a number on Goliath and "Odesius and The One Eyed Giant was
quite a story.
People love stories like this....
I think it was Voltaire that said 'God fights on the side of the
heaviest battalions"
The race may not always be to the swift, or the battle to the strong,
but that's the way to bet...
--
The CO
.
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| User: "Michael Cornelissen" |
|
| Title: Re: Tel Aviv |
29 Jul 2006 02:13:51 AM |
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|
My opinion that western civilisation is becoming a travesty does not make me
a muslim nor an extremist.
/Michael Cornelissen
"The CO" <the_xo@yahoo.com.au> schreef in bericht
news:44cad2e4$1_1@news.iprimus.com.au...
Michael Cornelissen wrote:
Hezbollah on points.
You need to reassess your scoring technique.
Hezbollah cannot defeat a major standing army, at most
they can inflict casualties and delay the Israeli advance.
At most.
They have no CAS, no armour and no significant heavy weapons assets.
This isn't Iraq, Israel isn't there to win hearts and minds and overthrow
a dictatorship - they are there to exterminate Hezbollah and
secure their border from their incursions and attacks and I suggest that
they will continue this operation until that objective is achieved.
The fact that Israel has a major air force with significant CAS assets is
a major advantage - Hezbollah has no air assets, so Israeli defensive
counter air is not necessary - they can be used instead for CAS and
tactical strike.
You need to assess 'points' based on military facts, not your
particular bias towards Hezbollah.
While we're at it, is there something you find admirable in the Islamic
terrorist organisation called Hezbollah?
Could it be you are simply yet another Muslim extremist sympathiser living
in Holland?
The CO
.
|
|
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| User: "The CO" |
|
| Title: Re: Tel Aviv |
29 Jul 2006 07:01:04 AM |
|
|
Michael Cornelissen wrote:
My opinion that western civilisation is becoming a travesty
Compared to what?
Using suicide bombers? Deliberately placing their facilities in
civilian areas so they have built in 'human shields'?
Deliberately targeting purely civilian areas with unguided weapons?
Which particular civilisation do you consider civilised these days?
does not make me
a muslim nor an extremist.
Fair enough. So are you?
If you support Hezbollah, I suggest that makes you a terrorist supporter.
--
The CO
.
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| User: "Michael Cornelissen" |
|
| Title: Re: Tel Aviv |
29 Jul 2006 12:33:24 PM |
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|
Nope, I'm dutch.
/Michael Cornelissen
"The CO" <the_xo@yahoo.com.au> schreef in bericht
news:44cb4dfe_1@news.iprimus.com.au...
Michael Cornelissen wrote:
My opinion that western civilisation is becoming a travesty
Compared to what?
Using suicide bombers? Deliberately placing their facilities in civilian
areas so they have built in 'human shields'?
Deliberately targeting purely civilian areas with unguided weapons?
Which particular civilisation do you consider civilised these days?
does not make me a muslim nor an extremist.
Fair enough. So are you?
If you support Hezbollah, I suggest that makes you a terrorist supporter.
--
The CO
.
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| User: "The CO" |
|
| Title: Re: Tel Aviv |
30 Jul 2006 03:37:19 AM |
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|
Michael Cornelissen wrote:
Nope, I'm dutch.
Ok, you're Dutch.
This doesn't answer my question.
Are you also
1) Muslim
2) A supporter of Hezbollah?
3) Both
4) Neither.
--
The CO
.
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| User: "Michael Cornelissen" |
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| Title: Re: Tel Aviv |
30 Jul 2006 04:33:23 AM |
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Neither
/Michael Cornelissen
"The CO" <the_xo@yahoo.com.au> schreef in bericht
news:44cc6fb8_1@news.iprimus.com.au...
Michael Cornelissen wrote:
Nope, I'm dutch.
Ok, you're Dutch.
This doesn't answer my question.
Are you also
1) Muslim
2) A supporter of Hezbollah?
3) Both
4) Neither.
--
The CO
.
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| User: "The CO" |
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| Title: Re: Tel Aviv |
30 Jul 2006 07:50:24 AM |
|
|
Michael Cornelissen wrote:
Neither
Fine. My apologies for believing otherwise.
Now that we have that straight, can you explain why
you think Israel has no right to take military action
against Hezbollah assets that are being sheltered in Lebanon due to the
refusal, or perhaps inability, of the Lebanese government to disarm them
as it was supposed to do?
Should they simply allow Hezbollah to attack with impunity because they
are hiding behind Lebanese civilians?
What's your solution.
--
The CO
.
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| User: "Michael Cornelissen" |
|
| Title: Re: Tel Aviv |
30 Jul 2006 11:49:34 AM |
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|
I do not have an opinion of who should win.
I merely see Hezbollah as a winner on points.
Israel has put itself in a position where it will not be able to win.
Hezbollah only needs to survive.
/Michael Cornelissen
"The CO" <the_xo@yahoo.com.au> schreef in bericht
news:44ccab08$1_1@news.iprimus.com.au...
Michael Cornelissen wrote:
Neither
Fine. My apologies for believing otherwise.
Now that we have that straight, can you explain why
you think Israel has no right to take military action
against Hezbollah assets that are being sheltered in Lebanon due to the
refusal, or perhaps inability, of the Lebanese government to disarm them
as it was supposed to do?
Should they simply allow Hezbollah to attack with impunity because they
are hiding behind Lebanese civilians?
What's your solution.
--
The CO
.
|
|
|
| User: "Perseid" |
|
| Title: Re: Tel Aviv |
30 Jul 2006 09:04:16 PM |
|
|
"Michael Cornelissen" <root@127.0.0.1> Spat the Words
I do not have an opinion of who should win.
I merely see Hezbollah as a winner on points.
Israel has put itself in a position where it will not be able to win.
Hezbollah only needs to survive.
I think 'winning' to Israel means disarming the militants, destroying
rockets, disassembling all their infrastructure (tunnels, hideouts,
bunkers, any owned property in lebanon). Israel acknowledged at
the outset of this conflict that it did see a place for hezbolla
in Lebanese politics, so I don't believe they're trying to
exterminate hezbolla.
/Michael Cornelissen
"The CO" <the_xo@yahoo.com.au> schreef in bericht
news:44ccab08$1_1@news.iprimus.com.au...
Michael Cornelissen wrote:
Neither
Fine. My apologies for believing otherwise.
Now that we have that straight, can you explain why
you think Israel has no right to take military action
against Hezbollah assets that are being sheltered in Lebanon due to the
refusal, or perhaps inability, of the Lebanese government to disarm
them
as it was supposed to do?
Should they simply allow Hezbollah to attack with impunity because they
are hiding behind Lebanese civilians?
What's your solution.
--
The CO
.
|
|
|
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| User: "The CO" |
|
| Title: Re: Tel Aviv |
31 Jul 2006 10:47:52 AM |
|
|
Michael Cornelissen wrote:
I do not have an opinion of who should win.
Ok.
I merely see Hezbollah as a winner on points.
Which I find difficult to understand.
If you consider that their present position indicates 'winning' I'd hate
to see what you consider 'losing'.
Israel has put itself in a position where it will not be able to win.
That has not been demonstrated. They are controlling the conflict and
inflicting massive damage on Hezbollah and its infrastructure.
Hezbollah is losing. It is losing irreplaceable assets and
infrastructure that took years to accumulate.
A win for Israel would consist of Hezbollah being no longer able to
mount significant attacks on Israel. That's achievable and it appears
the Israelis have the will and the means to carry it through, over the
outraged howls of the bleeding hearts if necessary.
Hezbollah only needs to survive.
Israel has pretty much indicated that it will continue this operation
until Hezbollah is incapable of launching attacks against Israel.
Whether Hezbollah exists after that is less important, but it will be
seriously bloodied and will need to spend time rebuilding its assets at
a minimum - and Israel may well take the position that it will attack
any assets they do acquire from this point on - even after they finish
this present operation. I suspect any part of Hezbollah that sticks up
above the rubble from this point on is likely to have air strikes
directed against it.
Hezbollah cannot destroy Israel nor can they drive them out of Lebanon.
That they are resolute fighters is not disputed, but they are not in a
position to either control the conflict or inflict more than minor
damage on Israel itself. In a war of attrition, they will wear down
well before Israel which has resources it has not yet used.
Their only hope is that useful idiots will listen to their bleeding
heart stories about the awful Israelis and pressure their governments to
lean on Israel to cool it.
This doesn't seem to be happening and Israel shows every sign of not
caring - they are intent on hosing Hezbollah out of their holes.
I also predict that the head of Hezbollah will stay alive only as long
as the Israelis don't know for sure where he is. He's dead as soon as
they find him.
And good riddance...
--
The CO
.
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|
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| User: "Michael Cornelissen" |
|
| Title: Re: Tel Aviv |
31 Jul 2006 11:41:38 AM |
|
|
OK, hezbollah is losing less than Israel does.
/Michael
"The CO" <the_xo@yahoo.com.au> schreef in bericht
news:44ce2627_1@news.iprimus.com.au...
Michael Cornelissen wrote:
I do not have an opinion of who should win.
Ok.
I merely see Hezbollah as a winner on points.
Which I find difficult to understand.
If you consider that their present position indicates 'winning' I'd hate
to see what you consider 'losing'.
Israel has put itself in a position where it will not be able to win.
That has not been demonstrated. They are controlling the conflict and
inflicting massive damage on Hezbollah and its infrastructure.
Hezbollah is losing. It is losing irreplaceable assets and infrastructure
that took years to accumulate.
A win for Israel would consist of Hezbollah being no longer able to mount
significant attacks on Israel. That's achievable and it appears the
Israelis have the will and the means to carry it through, over the
outraged howls of the bleeding hearts if necessary.
Hezbollah only needs to survive.
Israel has pretty much indicated that it will continue this operation
until Hezbollah is incapable of launching attacks against Israel.
Whether Hezbollah exists after that is less important, but it will be
seriously bloodied and will need to spend time rebuilding its assets at a
minimum - and Israel may well take the position that it will attack any
assets they do acquire from this point on - even after they finish this
present operation. I suspect any part of Hezbollah that sticks up above
the rubble from this point on is likely to have air strikes directed
against it.
Hezbollah cannot destroy Israel nor can they drive them out of Lebanon.
That they are resolute fighters is not disputed, but they are not in a
position to either control the conflict or inflict more than minor damage
on Israel itself. In a war of attrition, they will wear down
well before Israel which has resources it has not yet used.
Their only hope is that useful idiots will listen to their bleeding heart
stories about the awful Israelis and pressure their governments to
lean on Israel to cool it.
This doesn't seem to be happening and Israel shows every sign of not
caring - they are intent on hosing Hezbollah out of their holes.
I also predict that the head of Hezbollah will stay alive only as long as
the Israelis don't know for sure where he is. He's dead as soon as they
find him.
And good riddance...
--
The CO
.
|
|
|
| User: "The CO" |
|
| Title: Re: Tel Aviv |
01 Aug 2006 08:58:57 AM |
|
|
Michael Cornelissen wrote:
OK, hezbollah is losing less than Israel does.
Your original premise, restated, is still wrong.
--
The CO
.
|
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|
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| User: "Michael Cornelissen" |
|
| Title: Re: Tel Aviv |
31 Jul 2006 11:50:08 AM |
|
|
Yep, I agree with your reasoning. But the ante for Hezbollah never was to
win in the first place. They only needed to resist. The true goals of
Hezbollah is beliewved to be an Iraqi style Insurgency.
The outcome of the battle will not be seen on the battleground but in the ME
political landscape. One can resist Israel and more or less shape the
political/media outcome. Its the underdog that gets a heavy beeting but
still stands firm and comes back for seconds. If Hezbollah can pull that
trick, it rises in standing for other ME countries. I think the latter is
the current goal of hezbollah and in my opinion, they are succeeding at the
moment.
/Michael Cornelissen
"The CO" <the_xo@yahoo.com.au> schreef in bericht
news:44ce2627_1@news.iprimus.com.au...
Michael Cornelissen wrote:
I do not have an opinion of who should win.
Ok.
I merely see Hezbollah as a winner on points.
Which I find difficult to understand.
If you consider that their present position indicates 'winning' I'd hate
to see what you consider 'losing'.
Israel has put itself in a position where it will not be able to win.
That has not been demonstrated. They are controlling the conflict and
inflicting massive damage on Hezbollah and its infrastructure.
Hezbollah is losing. It is losing irreplaceable assets and infrastructure
that took years to accumulate.
A win for Israel would consist of Hezbollah being no longer able to mount
significant attacks on Israel. That's achievable and it appears the
Israelis have the will and the means to carry it through, over the
outraged howls of the bleeding hearts if necessary.
Hezbollah only needs to survive.
Israel has pretty much indicated that it will continue this operation
until Hezbollah is incapable of launching attacks against Israel.
Whether Hezbollah exists after that is less important, but it will be
seriously bloodied and will need to spend time rebuilding its assets at a
minimum - and Israel may well take the position that it will attack any
assets they do acquire from this point on - even after they finish this
present operation. I suspect any part of Hezbollah that sticks up above
the rubble from this point on is likely to have air strikes directed
against it.
Hezbollah cannot destroy Israel nor can they drive them out of Lebanon.
That they are resolute fighters is not disputed, but they are not in a
position to either control the conflict or inflict more than minor damage
on Israel itself. In a war of attrition, they will wear down
well before Israel which has resources it has not yet used.
Their only hope is that useful idiots will listen to their bleeding heart
stories about the awful Israelis and pressure their governments to
lean on Israel to cool it.
This doesn't seem to be happening and Israel shows every sign of not
caring - they are intent on hosing Hezbollah out of their holes.
I also predict that the head of Hezbollah will stay alive only as long as
the Israelis don't know for sure where he is. He's dead as soon as they
find him.
And good riddance...
--
The CO
.
|
|
|
| User: "The CO" |
|
| Title: Re: Tel Aviv |
01 Aug 2006 09:06:23 AM |
|
|
Michael Cornelissen wrote:
Yep, I agree with your reasoning. But the ante for Hezbollah never was to
win in the first place. They only needed to resist. The true goals of
Hezbollah is beliewved to be an Iraqi style Insurgency.
With a radical Iranian style Islamic republic as a result.
And you think this is a good thing?
The outcome of the battle will not be seen on the battleground but in the ME
political landscape. One can resist Israel and more or less shape the
political/media outcome.
Which has a zero impact on Israel and largely zero on the USA.
No other country will openly take on Israel in case the US gets
involved, which would almost certainly be the case.
Its the underdog that gets a heavy beeting but
still stands firm
You keep trying to make it sound like a noble cause, when it's
the exact opposite. But I'll go along with your 'heavy beating', Israel
is kicking ***** out of them.
and comes back for seconds.
Well, like all good muslims, they don't care if they die in Jihad.
Fine by me. I'm sure the Israelis will be happy to help them go and
meet Allah.
If Hezbollah can pull that
trick, it rises in standing for other ME countries.
Which really doesn't help it that much to be blunt.
I think the latter is
the current goal of hezbollah
You may well be right, but the result will be the same.
and in my opinion, they are succeeding at the moment.
That's far from the case. Resisting doesn't equate to victory, and
Israel have indicated that on this occasion, their goal is the
destruction of Hezbollah, or at least their military capability.
Hezbollah may still be around as a political entity, but Israel is
determined to remove their fangs with HE pincers.
If you wish to consider that a victory for the Hezbollah you are free to
believe that.
--
The CO
.
|
|
|
| User: "Michael Cornelissen" |
|
| Title: Re: Tel Aviv |
01 Aug 2006 04:18:56 PM |
|
|
I get the impression you are not neutral in this.
Where two fight are two wrong. In this case, from a geopolitical
perspective, this is a major goof of any country saying anything about this
war.
/Michael Cornelissen
"The CO" <the_xo@yahoo.com.au> schreef in bericht
news:44cf5fd9_1@news.iprimus.com.au...
Michael Cornelissen wrote:
Yep, I agree with your reasoning. But the ante for Hezbollah never was to
win in the first place. They only needed to resist. The true goals of
Hezbollah is beliewved to be an Iraqi style Insurgency.
With a radical Iranian style Islamic republic as a result.
And you think this is a good thing?
The outcome of the battle will not be seen on the battleground but in the
ME political landscape. One can resist Israel and more or less shape the
political/media outcome.
Which has a zero impact on Israel and largely zero on the USA.
No other country will openly take on Israel in case the US gets involved,
which would almost certainly be the case.
Its the underdog that gets a heavy beeting but still stands firm
You keep trying to make it sound like a noble cause, when it's
the exact opposite. But I'll go along with your 'heavy beating', Israel
is kicking ***** out of them.
and comes back for seconds.
Well, like all good muslims, they don't care if they die in Jihad.
Fine by me. I'm sure the Israelis will be happy to help them go and meet
Allah.
If Hezbollah can pull that trick, it rises in standing for other ME
countries.
Which really doesn't help it that much to be blunt.
I think the latter is the current goal of hezbollah
You may well be right, but the result will be the same.
and in my opinion, they are succeeding at the moment.
That's far from the case. Resisting doesn't equate to victory, and Israel
have indicated that on this occasion, their goal is the destruction of
Hezbollah, or at least their military capability.
Hezbollah may still be around as a political entity, but Israel is
determined to remove their fangs with HE pincers.
If you wish to consider that a victory for the Hezbollah you are free to
believe that.
--
The CO
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| User: "The CO" |
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| Title: Re: Tel Aviv |
02 Aug 2006 10:00:15 AM |
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Michael Cornelissen wrote:
I get the impression you are not neutral in this.
Not entirely. I have no sympathies for Hezbollah. I'll reserve them
for the Lebanese they used as human shields and the Israeli civilians
hit by the Hezbollahs rockets.
Where two fight are two wrong.
Sorry, don't agree. Some threats can only be dealt with by violent
means. Hezbollah is such a threat.
In this case, from a geopolitical perspective, this is a major goof
of any country saying anything about this war.
Did you just say no country should venture an opinion?
Everyone has an opinion.
--
The CO
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| User: "Michael Cornelissen" |
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| Title: Re: Tel Aviv |
29 Jul 2006 12:39:35 PM |
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My general assertion of the western world today is a set of individuals
ruled by closet dictators.
Not communities with balancing and adaptive rulers. Money weighs too much in
everyday life.
/Michael Cornelissen
"Michael Cornelissen" <root@127.0.0.1> schreef in bericht
news:44cb9be6$0$93820$dbd4f001@news.wanadoo.nl...
Nope, I'm dutch.
/Michael Cornelissen
"The CO" <the_xo@yahoo.com.au> schreef in bericht
news:44cb4dfe_1@news.iprimus.com.au...
Michael Cornelissen wrote:
My opinion that western civilisation is becoming a travesty
Compared to what?
Using suicide bombers? Deliberately placing their facilities in civilian
areas so they have built in 'human shields'?
Deliberately targeting purely civilian areas with unguided weapons?
Which particular civilisation do you consider civilised these days?
does not make me a muslim nor an extremist.
Fair enough. So are you?
If you support Hezbollah, I suggest that makes you a terrorist supporter.
--
The CO
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| User: "The CO" |
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| Title: Re: Tel Aviv |
30 Jul 2006 03:34:34 AM |
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Michael Cornelissen wrote:
My general assertion of the western world today is a set of individuals
ruled by closet dictators.
Oh? Interesting conclusion. Whilst I consider elected governments to
be beyond the control of the electors once they are in office, I find it
hard to conclude that makes them dictatorships.
Could I invite you to expand on that?
Not communities with balancing and adaptive rulers.
I'm not clear on how I should interpret that. Please feel free to
expand on this also, particularly as it applies to parliamentary
democracies that have no single 'ruler'.
Money weighs too much in everyday life.
That much is certain.
--
The CO
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| User: "Michael Cornelissen" |
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| Title: Re: Tel Aviv |
30 Jul 2006 04:40:00 AM |
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By making communities focus on money more and more, they are given less time
to asses their surroundings proprely. Western governments are using the wide
open media market to become less of an item. Since the general population is
flooded by tons of superficial news, movies and other junk, no eye remains
for the basic structure of society. Therefor, governments only need to
manage incidents and have a free hand in the structure of society.
/Michael Cornelissen
"The CO" <the_xo@yahoo.com.au> schreef in bericht
news:44cc6f13$1_1@news.iprimus.com.au...
Michael Cornelissen wrote:
My general assertion of the western world today is a set of individuals
ruled by closet dictators.
Oh? Interesting conclusion. Whilst I consider elected governments to be
beyond the control of the electors once they are in office, I find it hard
to conclude that makes them dictatorships.
Could I invite you to expand on that?
Not communities with balancing and adaptive rulers.
I'm not clear on how I should interpret that. Please feel free to expand
on this also, particularly as it applies to parliamentary democracies that
have no single 'ruler'.
Money weighs too much in everyday life.
That much is certain.
--
The CO
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| User: "The CO" |
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| Title: Re: Tel Aviv |
30 Jul 2006 08:03:34 AM |
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Michael Cornelissen wrote:
By making communities focus on money more and more, they are given
less time to asses their surroundings proprely.
I'm doubtful this is attributable to the actions of government. Greed
is however, a contributing factor.
Western governments are using the wide open media market to become
less of an item.
Uh? I parse that as a suggestion that government is manipulating the
media (well, that part I can agree with) so that they don't tend to
appear in it much? Maybe where you are, certainly not here and I don't
think in the US either.
Since the general population is flooded by tons of
superficial news, movies and other junk,
What determines whether news is 'superficial'? In whose opinion?
What seems trivial to you might well be important to others.
no eye remains for the basic
structure of society.
The structure of society won't change unless the culture changes enough
to elect a government that will make those changes, and even then they
are limited by what their constitutions allow without making amendments
which are non trivial to do usually.
Therefor, governments only need to manage
incidents and have a free hand in the structure of society.
I think you have the cart before the horse. Government certainly
manages 'incidents' - that's what governments are for - if society at
large feels they are not managing them properly they are free to elect a
government that will. Government itself has no real power to change
the structure of society, that requires something rather more radical,
like a revolution.
So what's your solution?
--
The CO
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| User: "Woodswun" |
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| Title: Re: Tel Aviv |
29 Jul 2006 07:40:20 AM |
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On Sat, 29 Jul 2006 12:45:48 +0930, The CO wrote:
Michael Cornelissen wrote:
Hezbollah on points.
You need to reassess your scoring technique.
Hezbollah cannot defeat a major standing army, at most
they can inflict casualties and delay the Israeli advance.
At most.
Isn't that what the Brits thought about the Continental Army during the
Revolution?
Woods
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