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Topic: Science > Prophecies-Of-Nostradamus
User: "Flyfish"
Date: 15 Jan 2004 01:13:38 PM
Object: the Bush-Nazi connection revealed
From a very liberal website - well worth a read.
http://www.workingforchange.com/printitem.cfm?itemid=15851
Bush 'Nazi' smear unworthy of critics
Joe Conason - The New York Observer
10.22.03 - Liberal invective against George W. Bush has not yet descended
to the depths plumbed by conservatives in their crusade against the
Clintons, but that isn't because nobody's trying. Mr. Bush's most zealous
opponents apparently believe that his faults, and those of his cronies
and his administration, will be insufficient to unseat him next year.
That may be why some Bush critics have been circulating a story about the
financial connections between his paternal grandfather, Prescott Bush
Sr., and a Nazi industrial magnate named Fritz Thyssen.
The sinister cooperation between prominent American businessmen and their
counterparts in Hitler's Germany is an important episode whose details
are still being revealed by historians. It instructs us about the
terrible crimes that can be committed in the pursuit of profit by men
(and they were all men) who regard themselves as a superior race and
class. It implicates such famous names as Ford, Standard Oil, General
Motors and Dupont. In the case of Prescott Bush Sr., this sorry history
shows that even a man who later displayed decent instincts could have
been guilty of awful judgment and worse.
According to archival and declassified material recently published, the
founder of the Bush political dynasty had much to answer for during his
earlier career on Wall Street. Picking up on an investigative story in
the New Hampshire Gazette, last week the Associated Press reported on
Prescott Sr.'s role in the Union Banking Corp., which served as a front
for Thyssen's conglomerate.
Quite reasonably, the U.S. government suspected Union Banking of aiding
the Nazis through Thyssen, who had helped to finance Hitler's rise and
whose coal and steel holdings were integral to the German war machine.
That suspicion led federal officials to seize Union Banking's assets in
October 1942 under the Trading With the Enemy Act. While Prescott Sr.
held only a single share of Union Banking stock, he also served as one of
seven corporate directors whose apparent purpose was to help Thyssen
conceal the bank's real ownership.
What the A.P. story notes -- unlike many of the Internet stories
circulating about the "Bush-Nazi connection" -- is that, by 1938, Fritz
Thyssen had fallen out with the Nazi regime he had helped bring to power,
evidently "over their persecution of Catholics and Jews." After fleeing
to neutral Switzerland, Thyssen was arrested by the Nazis. At the moment
when his U.S. assets were seized, Thyssen was in a Nazi prison, where he
remained until the end of the war.
Those complicating facts don't absolve Thyssen or his American
associates. The involvement of Prescott Sr. and other members of the
American business aristocracy with Nazi-era industry was shameful, and in
some instances illegal -- and they knew it.
Like so many Americans who made deals with fascist interests or lent
political support to them during the 30's, those businessmen got off
rather easily after the war. Most of them, including Bush, were permitted
to keep the money they had made with the Germans.
They're all dead now, however. Prescott Sr. died more than 30 years ago.
Before he went to his final reward, the Bush patriarch was elected from
Connecticut to the U.S. Senate, where he served from 1952 until he
retired 10 years later. He was a liberal Eisenhower Republican who
distinguished himself as an opponent of McCarthyism and an advocate of
public housing.
Henry Ford was a Nazi collaborator. Joseph P. Kennedy Sr. was a Nazi
sympathizer. Unless additional information emerges to indict him,
Prescott Bush Sr. was neither. To misuse such terms for political
advantage against his grandson is to trivialize very grave offenses.
Whatever the President's grandfather did or may have done, how does that
reflect on George W. Bush? In 1942, he hadn't been born yet. If he is
nevertheless accountable for Prescott Sr.'s actions, fairness requires
that a similar standard be applied to other descendants of politicians
and businessmen whose attitude toward Nazism was, at best, ambivalent.
Should anyone named Kennedy, Harriman, Dupont or Fish be arraigned for
the offenses of their dead ancestors? Should everyone boycott Ford
Motors?
The obvious answer is no. In America, the sins of the fathers are not
held against the children, nor should they be. Although the Bushes have
too often lowered themselves into the gutter for political gain, that
doesn't give license to libels against them.
It is ironic that the President would be arraigned on a bum rap at a
moment when his poll numbers are declining, his advisers admit he is
vulnerable, and several books excoriating him have appeared on the best-
seller lists.
There are many unflattering terms that can and should be used to describe
George W. Bush. He is, among other things, a truly bad President. But
neither his offenses, nor the Republican Party's politics of personal
destruction, can justify using such tactics against him. Imputing Nazi
sympathies to the President or his family ought to be beneath his
adversaries.
COPYRIGHT (c) 2003 THE NEW YORK OBSERVER
Flyfish
--
"The difference between Congress and drunken sailors is that drunken
sailors are spending their own money."
-Rep. Tom Feeney (R.-Fla.), August 8, 2003.
.

User: "Anon Ymous"

Title: Re: the Bush-Nazi connection revealed 16 Jan 2004 07:10:55 PM
Flyfish <Flyfish@google.com> wrote in message news:<Xns947191B81B725Flyfishnotherecom@130.133.1.4>...

From a very liberal website - well worth a read.

http://www.workingforchange.com/printitem.cfm?itemid=15851

Bush 'Nazi' smear unworthy of critics
Joe Conason - The New York Observer

10.22.03

Jeez, until I saw the date, I thought this guy was stealing from me.
S~
.

User: "Michael Johnathan McDonald"

Title: Re: the Bush-Nazi connection revealed 15 Jan 2004 04:20:27 PM
Flyfish <Flyfish@google.com> wrote in message news:<Xns947191B81B725Flyfishnotherecom@130.133.1.4>...

From a very liberal website - well worth a read.

Your title is misleading because the article is against Bush's
opponents to use some far distant steel deal to link Bush to the
genocide of millions of Jews. Most of the extreme leftwing are against
Jews, anyway, and some of the extreme right are too. But, these are
not Americans in the correct sense.
Last Line of article: 'Imputing Nazi
sympathies to the President or his family ought to be beneath his
adversaries. '
In addition, Clinton was more sinister than these men that this
article allegedly alludes too. Clinton sold nuclear weapons
components to a now becoming fascist country &#8211; China.
'It instructs us about the terrible crimes that can be committed in
the pursuit of profit by men [ This is the first thought] (and they
were all men) who regard themselves as a superior race and class.'
first thought has no connection to the second in that huge corporation
care about no race, but only profit. This is on the whole and not the
exception.


http://www.workingforchange.com/printitem.cfm?itemid=15851

Bush 'Nazi' smear unworthy of critics
Joe Conason - The New York Observer

10.22.03 - Liberal invective against George W. Bush has not yet descended
to the depths plumbed by conservatives in their crusade against the
Clintons, but that isn't because nobody's trying. Mr. Bush's most zealous
opponents apparently believe that his faults, and those of his cronies
and his administration, will be insufficient to unseat him next year.

That may be why some Bush critics have been circulating a story about the
financial connections between his paternal grandfather, Prescott Bush
Sr., and a Nazi industrial magnate named Fritz Thyssen.

The sinister cooperation between prominent American businessmen and their
counterparts in Hitler's Germany is an important episode whose details
are still being revealed by historians. It instructs us about the
terrible crimes that can be committed in the pursuit of profit by men
(and they were all men) who regard themselves as a superior race and
class. It implicates such famous names as Ford, Standard Oil, General
Motors and Dupont. In the case of Prescott Bush Sr., this sorry history
shows that even a man who later displayed decent instincts could have
been guilty of awful judgment and worse.

According to archival and declassified material recently published, the
founder of the Bush political dynasty had much to answer for during his
earlier career on Wall Street. Picking up on an investigative story in
the New Hampshire Gazette, last week the Associated Press reported on
Prescott Sr.'s role in the Union Banking Corp., which served as a front
for Thyssen's conglomerate.

Quite reasonably, the U.S. government suspected Union Banking of aiding
the Nazis through Thyssen, who had helped to finance Hitler's rise and
whose coal and steel holdings were integral to the German war machine.
That suspicion led federal officials to seize Union Banking's assets in
October 1942 under the Trading With the Enemy Act. While Prescott Sr.
held only a single share of Union Banking stock, he also served as one of
seven corporate directors whose apparent purpose was to help Thyssen
conceal the bank's real ownership.

What the A.P. story notes -- unlike many of the Internet stories
circulating about the "Bush-Nazi connection" -- is that, by 1938, Fritz
Thyssen had fallen out with the Nazi regime he had helped bring to power,
evidently "over their persecution of Catholics and Jews." After fleeing
to neutral Switzerland, Thyssen was arrested by the Nazis. At the moment
when his U.S. assets were seized, Thyssen was in a Nazi prison, where he
remained until the end of the war.

Those complicating facts don't absolve Thyssen or his American
associates. The involvement of Prescott Sr. and other members of the
American business aristocracy with Nazi-era industry was shameful, and in
some instances illegal -- and they knew it.

Like so many Americans who made deals with fascist interests or lent
political support to them during the 30's, those businessmen got off
rather easily after the war. Most of them, including Bush, were permitted
to keep the money they had made with the Germans.

They're all dead now, however. Prescott Sr. died more than 30 years ago.

Before he went to his final reward, the Bush patriarch was elected from
Connecticut to the U.S. Senate, where he served from 1952 until he
retired 10 years later. He was a liberal Eisenhower Republican who
distinguished himself as an opponent of McCarthyism and an advocate of
public housing.

Henry Ford was a Nazi collaborator. Joseph P. Kennedy Sr. was a Nazi
sympathizer. Unless additional information emerges to indict him,
Prescott Bush Sr. was neither. To misuse such terms for political
advantage against his grandson is to trivialize very grave offenses.

Whatever the President's grandfather did or may have done, how does that
reflect on George W. Bush? In 1942, he hadn't been born yet. If he is
nevertheless accountable for Prescott Sr.'s actions, fairness requires
that a similar standard be applied to other descendants of politicians
and businessmen whose attitude toward Nazism was, at best, ambivalent.
Should anyone named Kennedy, Harriman, Dupont or Fish be arraigned for
the offenses of their dead ancestors? Should everyone boycott Ford
Motors?

The obvious answer is no. In America, the sins of the fathers are not
held against the children, nor should they be. Although the Bushes have
too often lowered themselves into the gutter for political gain, that
doesn't give license to libels against them.

It is ironic that the President would be arraigned on a bum rap at a
moment when his poll numbers are declining, his advisers admit he is
vulnerable, and several books excoriating him have appeared on the best-
seller lists.

There are many unflattering terms that can and should be used to describe
George W. Bush. He is, among other things, a truly bad President. But
neither his offenses, nor the Republican Party's politics of personal
destruction, can justify using such tactics against him. Imputing Nazi
sympathies to the President or his family ought to be beneath his
adversaries.

COPYRIGHT (c) 2003 THE NEW YORK OBSERVER

Flyfish

.

User: "no"

Title: Re: the Bush-Nazi connection revealed 16 Jan 2004 04:45:31 PM
Somewhat informative.
.............................
Flyfish <Flyfish@google.com> wrote in message news:<Xns947191B81B725Flyfishnotherecom@130.133.1.4>...

From a very liberal website - well worth a read.

http://www.workingforchange.com/printitem.cfm?itemid=15851

Bush 'Nazi' smear unworthy of critics
Joe Conason - The New York Observer

10.22.03 - Liberal invective against George W. Bush has not yet descended
to the depths plumbed by conservatives in their crusade against the
Clintons, but that isn't because nobody's trying. Mr. Bush's most zealous
opponents apparently believe that his faults, and those of his cronies
and his administration, will be insufficient to unseat him next year.

That may be why some Bush critics have been circulating a story about the
financial connections between his paternal grandfather, Prescott Bush
Sr., and a Nazi industrial magnate named Fritz Thyssen.

The sinister cooperation between prominent American businessmen and their
counterparts in Hitler's Germany is an important episode whose details
are still being revealed by historians. It instructs us about the
terrible crimes that can be committed in the pursuit of profit by men
(and they were all men) who regard themselves as a superior race and
class. It implicates such famous names as Ford, Standard Oil, General
Motors and Dupont. In the case of Prescott Bush Sr., this sorry history
shows that even a man who later displayed decent instincts could have
been guilty of awful judgment and worse.

According to archival and declassified material recently published, the
founder of the Bush political dynasty had much to answer for during his
earlier career on Wall Street. Picking up on an investigative story in
the New Hampshire Gazette, last week the Associated Press reported on
Prescott Sr.'s role in the Union Banking Corp., which served as a front
for Thyssen's conglomerate.

Quite reasonably, the U.S. government suspected Union Banking of aiding
the Nazis through Thyssen, who had helped to finance Hitler's rise and
whose coal and steel holdings were integral to the German war machine.
That suspicion led federal officials to seize Union Banking's assets in
October 1942 under the Trading With the Enemy Act. While Prescott Sr.
held only a single share of Union Banking stock, he also served as one of
seven corporate directors whose apparent purpose was to help Thyssen
conceal the bank's real ownership.

What the A.P. story notes -- unlike many of the Internet stories
circulating about the "Bush-Nazi connection" -- is that, by 1938, Fritz
Thyssen had fallen out with the Nazi regime he had helped bring to power,
evidently "over their persecution of Catholics and Jews." After fleeing
to neutral Switzerland, Thyssen was arrested by the Nazis. At the moment
when his U.S. assets were seized, Thyssen was in a Nazi prison, where he
remained until the end of the war.

Those complicating facts don't absolve Thyssen or his American
associates. The involvement of Prescott Sr. and other members of the
American business aristocracy with Nazi-era industry was shameful, and in
some instances illegal -- and they knew it.

Like so many Americans who made deals with fascist interests or lent
political support to them during the 30's, those businessmen got off
rather easily after the war. Most of them, including Bush, were permitted
to keep the money they had made with the Germans.

They're all dead now, however. Prescott Sr. died more than 30 years ago.

Before he went to his final reward, the Bush patriarch was elected from
Connecticut to the U.S. Senate, where he served from 1952 until he
retired 10 years later. He was a liberal Eisenhower Republican who
distinguished himself as an opponent of McCarthyism and an advocate of
public housing.

Henry Ford was a Nazi collaborator. Joseph P. Kennedy Sr. was a Nazi
sympathizer. Unless additional information emerges to indict him,
Prescott Bush Sr. was neither. To misuse such terms for political
advantage against his grandson is to trivialize very grave offenses.

Whatever the President's grandfather did or may have done, how does that
reflect on George W. Bush? In 1942, he hadn't been born yet. If he is
nevertheless accountable for Prescott Sr.'s actions, fairness requires
that a similar standard be applied to other descendants of politicians
and businessmen whose attitude toward Nazism was, at best, ambivalent.
Should anyone named Kennedy, Harriman, Dupont or Fish be arraigned for
the offenses of their dead ancestors? Should everyone boycott Ford
Motors?

The obvious answer is no. In America, the sins of the fathers are not
held against the children, nor should they be. Although the Bushes have
too often lowered themselves into the gutter for political gain, that
doesn't give license to libels against them.

It is ironic that the President would be arraigned on a bum rap at a
moment when his poll numbers are declining, his advisers admit he is
vulnerable, and several books excoriating him have appeared on the best-
seller lists.

There are many unflattering terms that can and should be used to describe
George W. Bush. He is, among other things, a truly bad President. But
neither his offenses, nor the Republican Party's politics of personal
destruction, can justify using such tactics against him. Imputing Nazi
sympathies to the President or his family ought to be beneath his
adversaries.

COPYRIGHT (c) 2003 THE NEW YORK OBSERVER

Flyfish

.

User: "Prof Rollerball"

Title: Re: the Bush-Nazi connection revealed 15 Jan 2004 03:30:15 PM
These 'unwise' business connections have occurred throughout history. The
British Labour government bought a batch of heavy rail locomotives from
Ceausescu's Romania in the 70's. "Why?", one asks - to show socialist
solidarity?
Clinton hob-nobbed with Irish republican terrorists. Over a 20 year period
the IRA killed a similar number of British people to the Sept 11 death toll,
while Americans with a romantic view of Irish history wined and dined IRA
sympathisers like Jerry Adams. Most British people felt the same about the
USA's apparently equivocal attitude to the IRA as Americans now feel about
the French over Iraq.
Cheers,RB
"Flyfish" <Flyfish@google.com> wrote in message
news:Xns947191B81B725Flyfishnotherecom@130.133.1.4...

From a very liberal website - well worth a read.

http://www.workingforchange.com/printitem.cfm?itemid=15851

Bush 'Nazi' smear unworthy of critics
Joe Conason - The New York Observer

10.22.03 - Liberal invective against George W. Bush has not yet descended
to the depths plumbed by conservatives in their crusade against the
Clintons, but that isn't because nobody's trying. Mr. Bush's most zealous
opponents apparently believe that his faults, and those of his cronies
and his administration, will be insufficient to unseat him next year.

That may be why some Bush critics have been circulating a story about the
financial connections between his paternal grandfather, Prescott Bush
Sr., and a Nazi industrial magnate named Fritz Thyssen.

The sinister cooperation between prominent American businessmen and their
counterparts in Hitler's Germany is an important episode whose details
are still being revealed by historians. It instructs us about the
terrible crimes that can be committed in the pursuit of profit by men
(and they were all men) who regard themselves as a superior race and
class. It implicates such famous names as Ford, Standard Oil, General
Motors and Dupont. In the case of Prescott Bush Sr., this sorry history
shows that even a man who later displayed decent instincts could have
been guilty of awful judgment and worse.

According to archival and declassified material recently published, the
founder of the Bush political dynasty had much to answer for during his
earlier career on Wall Street. Picking up on an investigative story in
the New Hampshire Gazette, last week the Associated Press reported on
Prescott Sr.'s role in the Union Banking Corp., which served as a front
for Thyssen's conglomerate.

Quite reasonably, the U.S. government suspected Union Banking of aiding
the Nazis through Thyssen, who had helped to finance Hitler's rise and
whose coal and steel holdings were integral to the German war machine.
That suspicion led federal officials to seize Union Banking's assets in
October 1942 under the Trading With the Enemy Act. While Prescott Sr.
held only a single share of Union Banking stock, he also served as one of
seven corporate directors whose apparent purpose was to help Thyssen
conceal the bank's real ownership.

What the A.P. story notes -- unlike many of the Internet stories
circulating about the "Bush-Nazi connection" -- is that, by 1938, Fritz
Thyssen had fallen out with the Nazi regime he had helped bring to power,
evidently "over their persecution of Catholics and Jews." After fleeing
to neutral Switzerland, Thyssen was arrested by the Nazis. At the moment
when his U.S. assets were seized, Thyssen was in a Nazi prison, where he
remained until the end of the war.

Those complicating facts don't absolve Thyssen or his American
associates. The involvement of Prescott Sr. and other members of the
American business aristocracy with Nazi-era industry was shameful, and in
some instances illegal -- and they knew it.

Like so many Americans who made deals with fascist interests or lent
political support to them during the 30's, those businessmen got off
rather easily after the war. Most of them, including Bush, were permitted
to keep the money they had made with the Germans.

They're all dead now, however. Prescott Sr. died more than 30 years ago.

Before he went to his final reward, the Bush patriarch was elected from
Connecticut to the U.S. Senate, where he served from 1952 until he
retired 10 years later. He was a liberal Eisenhower Republican who
distinguished himself as an opponent of McCarthyism and an advocate of
public housing.

Henry Ford was a Nazi collaborator. Joseph P. Kennedy Sr. was a Nazi
sympathizer. Unless additional information emerges to indict him,
Prescott Bush Sr. was neither. To misuse such terms for political
advantage against his grandson is to trivialize very grave offenses.

Whatever the President's grandfather did or may have done, how does that
reflect on George W. Bush? In 1942, he hadn't been born yet. If he is
nevertheless accountable for Prescott Sr.'s actions, fairness requires
that a similar standard be applied to other descendants of politicians
and businessmen whose attitude toward Nazism was, at best, ambivalent.
Should anyone named Kennedy, Harriman, Dupont or Fish be arraigned for
the offenses of their dead ancestors? Should everyone boycott Ford
Motors?

The obvious answer is no. In America, the sins of the fathers are not
held against the children, nor should they be. Although the Bushes have
too often lowered themselves into the gutter for political gain, that
doesn't give license to libels against them.

It is ironic that the President would be arraigned on a bum rap at a
moment when his poll numbers are declining, his advisers admit he is
vulnerable, and several books excoriating him have appeared on the best-
seller lists.

There are many unflattering terms that can and should be used to describe
George W. Bush. He is, among other things, a truly bad President. But
neither his offenses, nor the Republican Party's politics of personal
destruction, can justify using such tactics against him. Imputing Nazi
sympathies to the President or his family ought to be beneath his
adversaries.

COPYRIGHT (c) 2003 THE NEW YORK OBSERVER

Flyfish

--
"The difference between Congress and drunken sailors is that drunken
sailors are spending their own money."
-Rep. Tom Feeney (R.-Fla.), August 8, 2003.

.
User: "tw"

Title: Re: the Bush-Nazi connection revealed 16 Jan 2004 03:23:08 AM
"Prof Rollerball" <roller@miller-williams.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in message
news:bu70p2$pc7$1@news8.svr.pol.co.uk...

These 'unwise' business connections have occurred throughout history. The
British Labour government bought a batch of heavy rail locomotives from
Ceausescu's Romania in the 70's. "Why?", one asks - to show socialist
solidarity?
Clinton hob-nobbed with Irish republican terrorists.

He did, but at least he actually kicked off a peace process that has
improved that particular situation..

Over a 20 year period
the IRA killed a similar number of British people to the Sept 11 death

toll,
They murdered a great deal more than that actually.

while Americans with a romantic view of Irish history wined and dined IRA
sympathisers like Jerry Adams.

That's "Gerry" and he was rather more than a sympathiser. He was an active
member of the IRA, resonsible for ordering such murders.

Most British people felt the same about the
USA's apparently equivocal attitude to the IRA as Americans now feel

about

the French over Iraq.

A closer comparision would be how the US feels about the Taliban. People who
were giving aid and comnfort to terrorists who murdered their compatriots
and British citizens
.

User: "Absolute Zero"

Title: Re: the Bush-Nazi connection revealed 16 Jan 2004 12:37:42 PM
"Prof Rollerball" <roller@miller-williams.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in message news:bu70p2$pc7$1@news8.svr.pol.co.uk...

These 'unwise' business connections have occurred throughout history. The
British Labour government bought a batch of heavy rail locomotives from
Ceausescu's Romania in the 70's. "Why?", one asks - to show socialist
solidarity?
Clinton hob-nobbed with Irish republican terrorists.


So what? Did he do it just to annoy you?
He helped greatly to achieve the desired result. PBUH.

Over a 20 year period
the IRA killed a similar number of British people to the Sept 11 death toll,
while Americans with a romantic view of Irish history wined and dined IRA
sympathisers like Jerry Adams.


Sympathiser? Gerry is the loudest mouth in the IRA's Army council,
let's not pretend otherwise (even if he does). However, that voice has
been the main force behind the change from what was to what is. You
seem to sound as though you'd rather not besmirch your lily-white
self-righteousness by compromising with a terrorist org? You'd prefer
instead to continue counting the corpses, conscience unsullied? The
bigger picture is six of one and half a dozen of the other... British
historical karma and related mad Irish nationalism, a potent brew.
Stir in a tribe of miserable fundy-nut Protestants shipped out of
Scotland (Boer like), bake for almost a thousand years on a high
heat... and there you have it. Guaranteed indigestion.

Or is it just a cheap shot at the septics, from a listerene?

BTW, the single biggest incident of murder and mayhem of the
"troubles" was instigated by UK Military intelligence in Dublin in the
early 70's. The evidence is rather persuasive. Before your time maybe.

Most British people felt the same about the
USA's apparently equivocal attitude to the IRA as Americans now feel about
the French over Iraq.


Well yes... but you're rather late in the day to be making that point.

Don't assume too much from the .ie in my (now defunct and misleading)
email address.

-A
[...]
.



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