This article is interesting:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7264481/
Looks like Europe and US don't wanna sell weapons to China because they
think China WILL use those weapons to attack Taiwan. Well, as far as I
know, TW already has more advanced weapons which US sold to them than
China has.
So, back to the question, since TW already has better weapons, why US
still sell more to them? Don't just explain Chinese commmu governemnt
is evil. I believe US would do the same thing even if Chinese
government is democratic, simply because US doesn't wanna face the real
competition from China in the future, which is understandable.
The war between China and taiwan is just matter of time. How deep will
US be involved? It is very difficult for US not to get attacked in US
mainland unless US wipes out China completely and precisely.
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| User: "tw" |
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| Title: Re: Why US sell weapon to Taiwan? |
23 Mar 2005 03:51:06 AM |
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<ibm_97@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1111524018.892414.289030@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
This article is interesting:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7264481/
Looks like Europe and US don't wanna sell weapons to China because they
think China WILL use those weapons to attack Taiwan. Well, as far as I
know, TW already has more advanced weapons which US sold to them than
China has.
So, back to the question, since TW already has better weapons,
Yep,. my weapon's pretty impressive all right! ;-)
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| User: "Marvin The Paranoid Android" |
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| Title: Re: Why US sell weapon to Taiwan? |
23 Mar 2005 04:59:34 AM |
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tw wrote:
<ibm_97@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1111524018.892414.289030@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
This article is interesting:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7264481/
Looks like Europe and US don't wanna sell weapons to China because they
think China WILL use those weapons to attack Taiwan. Well, as far as I
know, TW already has more advanced weapons which US sold to them than
China has.
So, back to the question, since TW already has better weapons,
Yep,. my weapon's pretty impressive all right! ;-)
<GROAN>
Hehehe ...
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Why US sell weapon to Taiwan? |
24 Mar 2005 05:33:40 AM |
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This article is interesting:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7264481/
Looks like Europe and US don't wanna sell weapons to China because they
think China WILL use those weapons to attack Taiwan. Well, as far as I
know, TW already has more advanced weapons which US sold to them than
China has.
So, back to the question, since TW already has better weapons, why US
still sell more to them? Don't just explain Chinese commmu governemnt
is evil. I believe US would do the same thing even if Chinese
government is democratic, simply because US doesn't wanna face the real
competition from China in the future, which is understandable.
You sound like a member of the Chinese Communist Party.
Tony
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Why US sell weapon to Taiwan? |
24 Mar 2005 11:49:09 AM |
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No, I sound like a reasonable person.
It's you sound like an unreasonable person.
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| User: "Marvin The Paranoid Android" |
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| Title: Re: Why US sell weapon to Taiwan? |
24 Mar 2005 03:44:51 PM |
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wrote:
No, I sound like a reasonable person.
It's you sound like an unreasonable person.
No.
You are both unreasonable.
I am the only the reasonable one.
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| User: "Perseid" |
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| Title: Re: Why US sell weapon to Taiwan? |
23 Mar 2005 12:49:42 AM |
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Spat the Words
This article is interesting:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7264481/
Looks like Europe and US don't wanna sell weapons to China because they
think China WILL use those weapons to attack Taiwan. Well, as far as I
know, TW already has more advanced weapons which US sold to them than
China has.
So, back to the question, since TW already has better weapons, why US
still sell more to them? Don't just explain Chinese commmu governemnt
is evil. I believe US would do the same thing even if Chinese
government is democratic, simply because US doesn't wanna face the real
competition from China in the future, which is understandable.
The war between China and taiwan is just matter of time. How deep will
US be involved?
Good question. I heard the US was running war-games some months
back concerning this. We sent 7 carrier battle groups to the
region for redundancy because it was believed the Chinese might
overwhelm us with a barrage of missiles, taking out some of those
carriers.
It is very difficult for US not to get attacked in US
mainland unless US wipes out China completely and precisely.
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| User: "Charly the Bastard" |
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| Title: Re: Why US sell weapon to Taiwan? |
23 Mar 2005 06:34:36 AM |
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wrote:
This article is interesting:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7264481/
Looks like Europe and US don't wanna sell weapons to China because they
think China WILL use those weapons to attack Taiwan. Well, as far as I
know, TW already has more advanced weapons which US sold to them than
China has.
So, back to the question, since TW already has better weapons, why US
still sell more to them? Don't just explain Chinese commmu governemnt
is evil. I believe US would do the same thing even if Chinese
government is democratic, simply because US doesn't wanna face the real
competition from China in the future, which is understandable.
The war between China and taiwan is just matter of time. How deep will
US be involved? It is very difficult for US not to get attacked in US
mainland unless US wipes out China completely and precisely.
Why? Because the Nationalist Chinese have been our Good Friends since
before WW2. When I went through school, Taiwan was labeled a Sovereign
Nation, and had a seat in the UN. It wasn't until the 70's that the PRC,
after being opened by The Nix, made the move into the UN. (There was a
major controversy at that time over who would get the "China" placemat in
the General Assembly.) If they want guns, all they have to do is call.
We'll be more than happy to put anything they want on the plane. As far as
I'm concerned, Taiwan is Sovereign, has been since 1948 when the Maoists
failed to make the amphibious assault and lost the initiative.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Why US sell weapon to Taiwan? |
23 Mar 2005 12:27:00 PM |
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Why? Because the Nationalist Chinese have been our Good Friends since
before WW2. When I went through school, Taiwan was labeled a
Sovereign
Nation, and had a seat in the UN. It wasn't until the 70's that the
PRC,
after being opened by The Nix, made the move into the UN. (There was
a
major controversy at that time over who would get the "China"
placemat in
the General Assembly.) If they want guns, all they have to do is
call.
We'll be more than happy to put anything they want on the plane. As
far as
I'm concerned, Taiwan is Sovereign, has been since 1948 when the
Maoists
failed to make the amphibious assault and lost the initiative.
So, why US government (even Bu*h admin) still adopts 'one china'
policy, why doesn't US government just give up this policy and let TW
declare independence.
Poor TW, they think they can get weapons from US all the time, but we
all know that they paid tooooo much $ for those so called advanced
weapons.
If there's a war between US and China, it's pretty safe to say all of
us are going to back to stone age, if we can survive.
Cannot wait to see!!!! Let us die together! Destroy the whole world and
mankind!!!!
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| User: "Charly the Bastard" |
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| Title: Re: Why US sell weapon to Taiwan? |
23 Mar 2005 05:40:53 PM |
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wrote:
Why? Because the Nationalist Chinese have been our Good Friends since
before WW2. When I went through school, Taiwan was labeled a
Sovereign
Nation, and had a seat in the UN. It wasn't until the 70's that the
PRC,
after being opened by The Nix, made the move into the UN. (There was
a
major controversy at that time over who would get the "China"
placemat in
the General Assembly.) If they want guns, all they have to do is
call.
We'll be more than happy to put anything they want on the plane. As
far as
I'm concerned, Taiwan is Sovereign, has been since 1948 when the
Maoists
failed to make the amphibious assault and lost the initiative.
So, why US government (even Bu*h admin) still adopts 'one china'
policy, why doesn't US government just give up this policy and let TW
declare independence.
Because there's a buck in it for King George's Corporate masters. Money is
more important than anything. It's the only God that the Corporates know.
All this makes perfect sense, given that the US is Mystery Babylon and
George is the Antichrist. Go reread Revelations and substitute 'The United
States and the New World Order' for every occurance of 'Mystery Babylon',
then watch the evening nooz.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Why US sell weapon to Taiwan? |
24 Mar 2005 05:40:19 AM |
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harley The Bastrad wote:
Because there's a buck in it for King George's Corporate masters. Money is
more important than anything. It's the only God that the Corporates know.
All this makes perfect sense, given that the US is Mystery Babylon and
George is the Antichrist. Go reread Revelations and substitute 'The United
States and the New World Order' for every occurance of 'Mystery Babylon',
then watch the evening nooz.
You've lost it, GW will be out of office in 4 years, then who will you
say the Antichrist is?
Also, I have news for you, go read Revelation 17 and see who destoys
"Mystery Babylon", it is the Beast (Antichirst) who destroys her; so
if the USA is "Mystery Babylon" as you say, then the Antichirst can't
possibly be the President of the USA.
Tony
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| User: "Charly the Bastard" |
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| Title: Re: Why US sell weapon to Taiwan? |
24 Mar 2005 11:33:35 AM |
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wrote:
harley The Bastrad wote:
Because there's a buck in it for King George's Corporate masters. Money is
more important than anything. It's the only God that the Corporates know.
All this makes perfect sense, given that the US is Mystery Babylon and
George is the Antichrist. Go reread Revelations and substitute 'The United
States and the New World Order' for every occurance of 'Mystery Babylon',
then watch the evening nooz.
You've lost it, GW will be out of office in 4 years, then who will you
say the Antichrist is?
We can but hope, but alot can happen in four years.
Also, I have news for you, go read Revelation 17 and see who destoys
"Mystery Babylon", it is the Beast (Antichirst) who destroys her; so
if the USA is "Mystery Babylon" as you say, then the Antichirst can't
possibly be the President of the USA.
The Beast is a machine. The Antichrist is a person. They are not the same. Hide
and watch.
Tony
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Why US sell weapon to Taiwan? |
25 Mar 2005 07:48:43 AM |
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itwill@happen.com wrote:
harley The Bastrad wote:
Because there's a buck in it for King George's Corporate masters. Money is
more important than anything. It's the only God that the Corporates know.
All this makes perfect sense, given that the US is Mystery Babylon and
George is the Antichrist. Go reread Revelations and substitute 'The United
States and the New World Order' for every occurance of 'Mystery Babylon',
then watch the evening nooz.
You've lost it, GW will be out of office in 4 years, then who will you
say the Antichrist is?
We can but hope, but alot can happen in four years.
Yeah, but you can't change the place of where the AC will rise to
power.
Also, I have news for you, go read Revelation 17 and see who destoys
"Mystery Babylon", it is the Beast (Antichirst) who destroys her; so
if the USA is "Mystery Babylon" as you say, then the Antichirst can't
possibly be the President of the USA.
The Beast is a machine. The Antichrist is a person. They are not the same. Hide
and watch.
Nope, the Beast is described as being a man.
Tony
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Why US sell weapon to Taiwan? |
23 Mar 2005 02:32:02 AM |
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On 22 Mar 2005 12:40:18 -0800, wrote:
This article is interesting:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7264481/
Looks like Europe and US don't wanna sell weapons to China because they
think China WILL use those weapons to attack Taiwan. Well, as far as I
know, TW already has more advanced weapons which US sold to them than
China has.
So, back to the question, since TW already has better weapons, why US
still sell more to them? Don't just explain Chinese commmu governemnt
is evil. I believe US would do the same thing even if Chinese
government is democratic, simply because US doesn't wanna face the real
competition from China in the future, which is understandable.
The war between China and taiwan is just matter of time. How deep will
US be involved? It is very difficult for US not to get attacked in US
mainland unless US wipes out China completely and precisely.
Hahahah, The US dosen't stand a chance against China. They have over
100 million in their army alone. But you dumb Americans love war so I
expect Bush will ***** them off enough to bring down the mighty red
hoarde upon America.
"Opinions are like assholes, everybody has one,some bigger than others"
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| User: "The CO" |
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| Title: Re: Why US sell weapon to Taiwan? |
24 Mar 2005 08:38:31 AM |
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wrote:
On 22 Mar 2005 12:40:18 -0800, wrote:
Hahahah, The US dosen't stand a chance against China. They have over
100 million in their army alone.
Which is about their only real military asset. I seriously doubt the US
would contemplate invading China, which apart from the home ground
advantage, is the only scenario that would let them use that human sea
of soldiers effectively.
Unfortunately for China, they are not terribly good at what is called
force projection, ie the ability to place military power at points
distant from their homeland. The problem with that 100 million strong
army is that even to attack something relatively close like Taiwan in
onverwhelming strength requires loading them in ships and landing craft
to get them there, probably fending off missile attacks and air strikes
the entire way, likely with help from a US CBG or two. Then making a
(heavily) opposed landing on a hostile shore, estabilishing a beachhead,
and holding on and resupping long enough to be able to consolidate their
position then break out and move to sieze territory. The last parts
will be very difficult due to the USAF and USN interdicting the lines of
supply and communication and the troops have a real good chance of being
stranded on a hostile shore and running out of everything. Short of
virtually destroying the entire island with missile strikes, which sort
of defeats the purpose - China is hot to get Taiwan into the Red Fold
for the same reasons it wanted Hong Kong and Macau back at the end of
the leases - because their capitalist enclaves pour hard currency into
the Red Chinese economy and destroying Taiwan in order to save it for
communism (hmm, I've heard a similar line from the US during Vietnam)
would be not only a wasted effort (maybe some internal propaganda value)
but the rest of the world would denounce it as mass murder on a
gargantuan scale, it would make Iraq look like a playground scuffle.
Bear in mind also that China has very few blue water naval units and
would be no match for the USN in any showdown. I seriously doubt their
ability to defeat multiple CBGs with their naval forces and they lack
the platforms to launch a mass SSM strike in numbers big enough to
overload the Aegis defensive system. The much vaunted Sunburn supersonic
anti ship missile is carried by only two shiny new Sovremenny class
destroyers, which likely means they would become shiny new shipwrecks at
the bottom of the South China Sea courtesy of US hunter/killer subs and
/or carrier borne air strikes shortly after the shooting started.
The Peoples Liberation Army Air Force is mostly old and even obsolete
types that in any attack against a CBG or three would lead to a repeat
of the Marianas Turkey Shoot. The quality of the PLAAF pilots is
variable, they have some good ones, but the majority are average or
worse. They might get some limited success with overwhelming numbers
but I doubt they have the pilots to do it. An Aegis screened CBG would
eat them alive. Some of the types are so old as to be museum pieces.
Their is a patrol squadron that is tasked to watch for an attack from
Taiwan (seriously) that uses 60 year old giant biplanes. They have
literally hundreds of medium sized IL-28 'Beagle' bombers that are
literally a product of the 1950s and wouldn't last 30 seconds in a
hostile anti air environment.
Remember this is the same air farce that Wong Wei (unfortunate name) was
a member of. He screwed up a 'thump' pass on an EP3 and wore the prop
blades. (Those props are about 25ft in diameter - we are talking a big
aircraft here - the engines need to be 7,500 shaft horsepower gas
turbines just to turn them.) The Chinese were so horrified at the loss
of 'face' through the incident they tried to spin it into a case of the
slow moving, heavy, and ponderous EP3 'ramming' the fast, highly agile
fighter. Yeah, right.
But you dumb Americans love war so I
expect Bush will ***** them off enough to bring down the mighty red
hoarde upon America.
Several authors of speculative fiction have written about a Chinese
invasion of America, but none of them are able to present a sensible
scenario of how they would get that vast army into the US without it
getting chewed up and spat out on the way. This is why Hitler never
invaded Britain during WW2. Had he been able to get his troops over the
channel, he would likely have been able to succeed in taking over the
island. But he couldn't do that without first establishing air
superiority and ideally air supremacy. Despite Goerings promises, it
proved to be impossible (at least in the time Hitler was prepared to
allow for it to succeed) and he turned his attention to Russia as any
attempt to invade England while the RAF owned the skies over the Channel
and the invasion beaches would have seen his troops massacred on the way
or shortly after getting there. The situation facing China over Taiwan
is not that different, at any sign of an impending invasion, the US
would move the equivalent of the entire air forces of several smaller
nations on mobile bases into position to command air superiority over
Taiwan and the western approaches to it. China wouldn't want to play in
that sandpit....
I'd rate the chances of such an invasion even being attempted as
somewhere between poor and non existent. They are better off being
patient and I suspect that if they do wait, Taiwan will eventually slip
quietly back into China, probably under a similar deal to Hong Kong and
Macau, ie keeping their capitalist system and a certain amount of local
autonomy.
The only way China could achieve even a temporary military advantage
would be by letting the (nuclear) genie out of the bottle, which would
ultimately be disastrous. In a nuclear exchange with the US, the US
would get hurt, perhaps badly, but China would almost certainly cease to
exist as an organised and controlled nation with a functional
government. The Chinese are *not* stupid (just politically challenged)
and they know their limitations as well as the US know theirs. The
present kafuffle over Taiwan is just more sabre rattling, largely so the
Peoples Daily can have some propaganda about how they are standing up to
the big bad US over their 'rebel province'.
The CO
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